Erik ten Hag | 2022/23 & 2023/24

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The fact he started to play Scott McTominay regularly ahead of his own signing Mount proves he's in survival mode.

You have an agenda. You always have. You spout nonsense, get proved wrong and then disappear for a few days so you don't have to accept it.
 
I wish it was but the reports are that due to injuries they’re just working on conditioning and all the technical stuff will be fixed later when players come back from injury. An example is the fact we’re going man to man marking in the midfield during games because Ten Hag thinks there’s too many other issues to coach a proper midfield zonal marking system that benefits a high press. This is one of the reasons our midfield are so easy to bypass.
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“You are mistaken. The Liverpool 7-0 match displayed the same tactics we’ve seen before. These are the ‘duels’ that ETH (likely referring to a coach or manager) mentioned from the very beginning. There’s nothing new here; people just didn’t notice until Gary Neville pointed it out. Throughout last season, some of us were pointing out that the system has a structural problem that requires adjustments to work effectively in England. This is also why I’ve consistently argued that our main issue coming into the summer was in the midfield, not a striker. Unfortunately, we ended up acquiring Mount instead of a combative box-to-box player.

I’ve also emphasized the need for playmaker-type wide players and how our lack of goals is primarily due to this deficiency. This also contributes to the problem of the midfield being too open, and constant recovery efforts. However, this high-intensity style is only sustainable for about 20 minutes. The coach can condition the players and drill them extensively, but the team seems to conform to his expectations only for the initial 20 minutes, after which everyone resorts to freestyling. There are limits to what the players can physically sustain.”
 
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You have an agenda. You always have. You spout nonsense, get proved wrong and then disappear for a few days so you don't have to accept it.

He's never recovered from his idol Jose being sacked. Truth is, he's probably gonna hate every single manager we get.
 
Yeah Ten Hag needs to buy an entire new squad before we can judge him. That means 23 players and 2 billions at least spent. Then we can start judging him properly. Poor guy.

Don't need the patronizing.

I meant players over the years have had so much power that they have collectively decided the fate of managers. This has nothing to do with what players ETH or Jose or Ole bought.
 
Don't need the patronizing.

I meant players over the years have had so much power that they have collectively decided the fate of managers. This has nothing to do with what players ETH or Jose or Ole bought.

It seems like patronising is the lowest form of sarcasm. Real low.
 
The players are far from blameless, but the manager clearly isn’t doing a great job either. Both sides can be guilty, because they are.

It's a whole multitude of reasons. Some get upset when they're pointed out as they feel it's exonorating ETH.
 
Your wording 'Ajaxifying' sums this up pretty well. Somehow people fear that the club would lose its identity if it changed the system. But why is that? Was Bayern "Ajaxified" by van Gaal? City "Barcafied" by Pep?
No, but then Ten Hag didn't play a typical Ajax style at Ajax either. His football was already much more vertical and direct. So you have to wonder what he means here exactly. Probably another level up from his directness at Ajax? At Ajax he played a kind hybrid of Guardiola's and Klopp's style, so maybe he intends to go more towards the latter, then?

I think this quote is interpreted far too binary (black and white). He's not saying United would play nothing like his Ajax team, and anyone thinking they know exactly what he means are just making it up - me too when suggesting he might want to play more like Klopp. (Klopp from a few years ago anyway; not sure how Liverpool play right now.)
 
It's a whole multitude of reasons. Some get upset when they're pointed out as they feel it's exonorating ETH.
If you don’t clearly state your opinion you’ve got a bunch of buffoons on either side of the debate ready to go bonkers at you. Exhausting. I’m massively disappointed by Ten Hag this season, but christ the way a large number of players have performed has been shameful.
 
If you don’t clearly state your opinion you’ve got a bunch of buffoons on either side of the debate ready to go bonkers at you. Exhausting. I’m massively disappointed by Ten Hag this season, but christ the way a large number of players have performed has been shameful.

We're at that point where you're all in or all out, unfortunately.
 
If you don’t clearly state your opinion you’ve got a bunch of buffoons on either side of the debate ready to go bonkers at you. Exhausting. I’m massively disappointed by Ten Hag this season, but christ the way a large number of players have performed has been shameful.

Would be lovely if we saw a bit of a refreshment of the squad in January. A bunch of talented young players in their early to mid 20s who showed a bit of hunger and desire to succeed and are physically up to the standards of the Premier League. It would make such a huge impact.
 
I don't see how that makes sense. As a coach you usually have to prove yourself before a top club even considers you. And Ten Hag proved himself at Ajax, coaching a certain playing style. You signed him because of his successes there but for some reason, he felt the need to abandon (some of) the concepts that made him successful at Ajax and brought him on the radar of United to begin with. Which means he is unproven at what he currently tries to implement.
s.
First of all, he didn't play a single style at Ajax. The team that got to the semi final of the CL and his last iteration, were very different, You're not recruited for a specific style, you're recruited for the capacity to be the manager for a massive club.

Second of all, listen to the podcast or read the actual quotes before going on a rant that has nothing to do with what the guy is saying. Every word he comes out with is being twisted in every single way, some of it understandably so, but in this instance, there's nothing strange about what he said - unless you've decided beforehand that everything he says means a certain thing, and that you should be negative about it (I'm not saying you specifically, it's a general "you").
 
The feck? Have you ever worked in a big company where there is uncertainty? A toxic atmosphere? All that shit spills down to EVERYONE. The squad isn't on an island away from the company that is Manchester United. It's not just executives. Staff members of any level don't know if they'll be in a job for various reasons. Having a drawn out sale process will inevitably have a huge impact on every aspect of the organization.

The players always live with the uncertainty of their careers being tied to athletic performance. But it's the mood. The mood at every corner. The mental image everything sets to the players. The motivation and drive and admiration and togetherness. That atmosphere spreads to the team, and it has an impact. When you have that much negative publicity as we've had this year, add in injuries which in turn leads to questionable decisions by the manager and him now making some mistakes, things can quickly slip. If the rest is a mess, it makes the actual club morale a very fragile thing. If it's strong behind the scenes, set, secure, leading the way and striving to be the best... Then you are much better positioned to deal with any set back. As it is, United the club just give a hopeless feel to all fans, staff, and players.

If course, I have. It is never good when people may potentially lose jobs. But that is in the real world where people are scared to lose a job because they have bills to pay and may be concerned about getting a new job.

But these are footballers on multi-year contracts, with millions in the bank. They are not going anywhere if United are taken over.

You have fans saying, "these players are happy to throw the manager under the bus because they know they will outlast him".
Yet you're saying they are not performing because they fear for their futures.

You cant have it both ways.

And if they really feared for their futures, play better.
 
People are only hyping up Maddison because he's having a good season with Spurs. Hardly anybody wanted him in the summer, he wasn't deemed 'good enough' by the majority on here, but now he's the flavour of the month. There's no guarantees he'd have did much here, based on current midfield signings.

I think most would have said he was a better prospect for us than Mount, especially for 20mil less.

Mount had not performed for Chelsea since 2021. Maddison was excellent for LCFC, despite their relegation.
 
We have the 4th easiest run of fixtures in the next 5 games according to Opta, if we don't take a great points haul from that list, it would be a really grim implication that it is getting unsalvageable.
premier-league-fixture-difficulty-next-five-games-1024x973.jpg


I am firmly ETH in, players and culture is the bigger issue and he needs to be given time to stamp himself properly on the club.
 
If course, I have. It is never good when people may potentially lose jobs. But that is in the real world where people are scared to lose a job because they have bills to pay and may be concerned about getting a new job.

But these are footballers on multi-year contracts, with millions in the bank. They are not going anywhere if United are taken over.

You have fans saying, "these players are happy to throw the manager under the bus because they know they will outlast him".
Yet you're saying they are not performing because they fear for their futures.

You cant have it both ways.

And if they really feared for their futures, play better.

Being a Manchester United player is incredibly lucrative. Most of the players set to be shipped out will feel a significant financial impact when they leave.They won't get this sort of payday anywhere else - mostly because they aren't good enough to be Real Madrid players.
 
If this is true, he's gone. These arent staff from the local Sainsburys. They're millionaire footballers. If they have a problem with you, then that's talking to them one on one is a terrible idea.
I’m curious. What then should he do to mend his relationship with these entitled and mediocre players?
 
Because he is a driven, determined manager who did a brilliant job last season. He took us from nowhere to 3rd and a trophy as well as another final. He is clearly a perfectionist who is obsessed with being the best, even though our performances are far from that right now.
A big stretch to say he took us from "nowhere". It's the equivalent of Ten Hag being sacked now and the saying the next manager is starting from nowhere.
 
Being a Manchester United player is incredibly lucrative. Most of the players set to be shipped out will feel a significant financial impact when they leave.They won't get this sort of payday anywhere else - mostly because they aren't good enough to be Real Madrid players.

Who is getting shipped out?

We have seen that it is near impossible to get rid of even McTominay and Maguire. The latter wanted his West Ham salary topped up by MUFC, for leaving his more lucrative United contact early.

Only ones that need to be concerned are the ones who's contact run out at the end of the year. I think that is Martial, Lindelof and AWB. Apart from Martial, who is a crock, any other player who leaves United on a free will join a club on a nice salary and a fat signing bonus.

Players will always be fine.
 
I’m curious. What then should he do to mend his relationship with these entitled and mediocre players?

Based on the premise you state, he probably obviously can't do anything.

It would take an actual genius to get the absolute best out of players that are both entitled and mediocre.

And ETH probably obviously ain't a genius (I don't doubt that he may be a good coach, but I very much doubt he's a genius).

ETA In my opinion entitled and mediocre players should be dealt with mercilessly at a club like United. But it shouldn't be the responsibility of the "manager" (head coach) to do this.

ETH, ideally, should be coaching players who are neither (overly) entitled nor (decidedly) mediocre. If they are (overly) entitled and mediocre (relatively speaking, of course), that really isn't his problem - but the problem of someone above him in the structure, who should have done a better recruitment job.

(Yes, I know this isn't how it works at United - but that's kinda the point.)
 
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I’m curious. What then should he do to mend his relationship with these entitled and mediocre players?
These players that got to 2 finals and finished 3rd in the league last season? What about the multiple Champions League winners also? I bet everyone wishes they were that mediocre.
 
We have seen that it is near impossible to get rid of even McTominay and Maguire. The latter wanted his West Ham salary topped up by MUFC, for leaving his more lucrative United contact early.

Maguire played 1600 minutes last season and 550 this one. McTominay played 1700 last season and 450 this one. Those are good minutes. Why leave?

Wanna get rid of a player? Drop those numbers down to 50-400 minutes per season.
 
Honestly speaking, is ETH the right man? He has been playing 433 ever since he is here. He doesn't tweak the system against team. Every team has figure out United and will always have a chance against United. Even with all th FB put, he rather play Lindeloft and Amrabat put of position. Both of these is too slow against wingers, isn't it obvious? We are leaking from left and right wing and yet Rashford hardly support defence. ETH is the problem right now, if the player is not following instructions then you have to drop him. If the players are following your instructions then your tactics are wrong. From 3rd in the table to free falling without fight is really bad. I would sack him immediately as it clearly isn't working.
 
Maguire played 1600 minutes last season and 550 this one. McTominay played 1700 last season and 450 this one. Those are good minutes. Why leave?

Wanna get rid of a player? Drop those numbers down to 50-400 minutes per season.

1600 mins is 17 games.

We played 62 games last season in all comps.

He should have left and if United had paid the cash to cover his lower West Ham salary, he would have.
 
If course, I have. It is never good when people may potentially lose jobs. But that is in the real world where people are scared to lose a job because they have bills to pay and may be concerned about getting a new job.

But these are footballers on multi-year contracts, with millions in the bank. They are not going anywhere if United are taken over.

You have fans saying, "these players are happy to throw the manager under the bus because they know they will outlast him".
Yet you're saying they are not performing because they fear for their futures.

You cant have it both ways.

And if they really feared for their futures, play better.
I'm not saying they are fearing for their futures. Their situation is normal. But they interact with staff at the club every day. And these people are regular people with regular paychecks. And there is uncertainty all around. It's a toxic work environment all around and it's felt at every level and eventually that will spill onto the pitch. It's been brewing for ages.
 
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