Erik ten Hag | 2022/23 & 2023/24

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wining after just 1 season, plastic fans.
Having supported United through since the mid 60s, i can't believe the way some fans carry on, ETH has been here 1 year and this is his second summer transfer window you can't consider January as United did nothing of value. Pep had 4 windows before winning his first trophy, Kliperty Klopp took 4 years before he won a trophy, Sir Alex took 6 years some of the numpties on here would have had him sacked after a year. SAF's first 2 seasons where dire mid-table efforts.

ETH started from a dire position with just 1 or 2 fit to ware the shirt and no mater what BS the media tell you It will take another 2-3 good windows before we get close to challenging for trophies consistently, fans need to get off ETH's back and give him our full support, if the weak links in the squad see the rubbish printed in some forums they won't move they will just wait for the next sacking, the blame for United's problems started with Woodward who bought poorly, and the Glaziers pretty much bankrupted the club, ETH is a great manager, give him time he will prove it.

In ETH we trust.
 
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Caellum said:
Not madness, united a pretty much out of cash, and he has to talk up what he has to play with in the hope the sale goes through and he gets some upgrades in January.
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What he has to play with is a load of dross. Martial can't be accounted for. Antony brings little in terms of goals. Rashford is no centre forward. We are desperately short.
 
Seriously, how did y'all become this toxic in the span of two games? I swear the toxicity levels were rock bottom end of the summer, through the summer. It was all sunshine and rainbows here.
 
He’s making some questionable decisions tactically, but I really feel for him. It’s blatantly obvious what we need squad wise before the window closes and yet it’s very unlikely that it’s going to happen.

Without the squad additions I can see him being sacked by Christmas. Then we start the whole fecking process all over again.
 
Yagami said:
People are too reluctant to criticise because, for many, he's the last hope. After countless managers failing, we finally hired one that was considered a modern, progressive coach, and, if he fails, what then?

It's understandable. Especially when he's shown promising signs. The stuff he's being criticised for is warranted, though. The worrying part is that pretty much all of it is his own doing.
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Or he's had 1 season at Utd and achieved the maximum (probably more) that any realistic fan could have hoped for despite some uniquely tough circumstances.

I reckon it is more that and some people just not panicking as much as others when keeping that in mind.
 
Appreciate it has been brought up before,however still amazed he never gave Ralf the time of day. You only need to look at those players he suggested we should sign to see he clearly knows a player. Yeah he wasn't a good manager but when it came to spotting talent he was elite.
 
croadyman said:
Appreciate it has been brought up before,however still amazed he never gave Ralf the time of day. You only need to look at those players he suggested we should sign to see he clearly knows a player. Yeah he wasn't a good manager but when it came to spotting talent he was elite.
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Ralf could of been a big help.
 
el3mel said:
United is playing shit football with zero cohesion and strategy behind. We're signing awful players that we have no clue how to use.
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I agree we are playing bad football but you're wrong about the lack of strategy. It's pretty clear he's got an objective in mind. It's being hampered by our very poor forward play and lack of cohesion in a new and slightly too old midfield. These are problems that need fixing before he can be judged a failure. The last two matches were crap and I expect the next two might be as well, but I think he knows what he is doing and I support it.
 
Teja said:
Seriously, how did y'all become this toxic in the span of two games? I swear the toxicity levels were rock bottom end of the summer, through the summer. It was all sunshine and rainbows here.
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It's exclusive to RedCafe and Twitter. Our fanbase are pretty reasonable away from them two platforms. (I agree with you 100%)

People on here will call for ETH's lovely bald head but who do we replace him with? The rot starts from the top. We can't keep changing manager. We get rid of ETH and then he'll go to Newcastle and win everything.
 
crossy1686 said:
Ten Hag is a good manager but you can't say he's infallible and we have to trust him no matter what, he is rightly being questioned for some of the choices he is making and that's just the life at a massive football club. Blindly following a manager is how we keep getting ourselves into situations that take years to unwind. Saying you don't need to look for positives because you 'trust' the manager is a dangerous mindset.
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This "blindly following the manager" is nonsense. Your evidence is what, that we haven't bought players the manager specifically doesn't want? Who else should be directing these decisions, DoF advised by the scouts? Because the scouts are so great? The idea that we'd be better off handing the reins to these people is ludicrous.

Anyone with eyes could see that we had to replace most of the first team to change the playing style. Further evidence was provided last season when EtH had to modified Ole-ball because most of the squad wasn't up to the switch. Changing the style requires bringing in players who 1) have experience playing the style and/or 2) have the right skills to perform in the new style. Who else would we bring in if that's our goal?

You're all upset about two transfers in particular, Antony and Mount. The Mount hate is based on nothing but transfer muppetry, idiot fans not only incorrectly assuming the squad needs another holding midfielder, but zeroing in on by far the most expensive option in Caicedo. Antony has had a poor first season creating goals but is decent at retaining possession and very good off the ball. So what? Lots of players take until their mid-20's before they become adept at goal creation. Chelsea had a few players like that who Mourinho fecked off, and they happened to become the two best players in the league for our two biggest rivals. Even Antony doesn't become a huge goal threat, it's not even a major indictment of United's transfer strategy. Most big clubs have spaffed a bunch of money on at least one left footed right winger who ended up being disappointing. Barca had Dembele and Raphinha, City had Sane, Arsenal has Pepe, Real had Bale.

People just need to calm the feck down and stop expecting everything to look perfect immediately. Arsenal and Liverpool both took more than 2 seasons to start looking like contenders for the league title. Arsenal could have fired Arteta and brought in some double DM wanker for a manager and everyone would have thought it was a great idea, but they'd have been back to square 1 with their rebuild and off the top 4 last year.
 
amolbhatia50k said:
Doubt it’s what he wants. There are financial constraints.
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I genuinely think IF Juve hadn't been hit so hard with an FFP punishment we wouldn't be so wary about staying within it. Yes I appreciate we got a small fine but don't think it was big enough to pull back on any money transfers
 
TMDaines said:
I do not agree with this assessment:

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It's bullshit obviously.

Untested prospect. Permanent sicknote. And Rashford is feckless and useless up front.

Martial conned ETH last summer but he's not deluded enough to fall for it again, the guy hasnt kicked a fecking ball all pre season.
 
TMDaines said:
I do not agree with this assessment:

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I'm sure he'd love to strengthen in attack.

But buys are clearly dependent on sales, so he'll have to make do in some positions again this year. And while Martial and Sancho have limited value as actual members of our attack, they do take up two nominal places and approx 600k per week in wages between them.

Martial's contract will expire at the end of the summer and unless Sancho improves a lot this season you'd think he'd be available for anyone interested next summer too. So it'll probably be a case of strengthening further at that point when we'll have hopefully cleared significant wages and squad space in our attack.
 
Thank god he’s called out the forwards. Mainly Rashford, his work rate was a disgrace at Spurs.
 
croadyman said:
Appreciate it has been brought up before,however still amazed he never gave Ralf the time of day. You only need to look at those players he suggested we should sign to see he clearly knows a player. Yeah he wasn't a good manager but when it came to spotting talent he was elite.
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Who did he suggest?
 
TMDaines said:
I do not agree with this assessment:

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He would sign better forwards if he had an unlimited pot of cash. But he hasn't, and he must make do. He has more class than a bellend like Klopp so he'll not publicly moan about it like a spoilt child
 
sullydnl said:


"Attack" seems a bit strong. It's not exactly Mourinhoesque.
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The question is why are they ignoring instructions? Too thick to remember them? Rebelling against the manager? Seems like a pretty serious issue to keep ignoring your boss and I'd expect to see players being dropped for it
 
Garethw said:
He’s making some questionable decisions tactically, but I really feel for him. It’s blatantly obvious what we need squad wise before the window closes and yet it’s very unlikely that it’s going to happen.

Without the squad additions I can see him being sacked by Christmas. Then we start the whole fecking process all over again.
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More like decisions have consequences and who knew? The margin for error, in the transfer market and under the Glazers within the FFP context, is slim and he looks like he has made two big ones. The £140m wasted on Antony and Mount could and should have brought in cheaper but more effective players leaving us with enough to buy him his Casemiro insurance policy.

The fact that we can't strengthen any further is on him because he boxed the club in for these signings, he wasn't flexible and if they were delivering on the pitch he wouldn't be in trouble right now. And in trouble he is because we, the United fans, are like a lion that has tasted human flesh, if he can't arrest the slide he is gone. He is not getting any more reinforcements so he has to think outside the box. People want to blame the owners, yes they are to blame to an extent but not on funding the first team.
 
AndySmith1990 said:
The question is why are they ignoring instructions? Too thick to remember them? Rebelling against the manager? Seems like a pretty serious issue to keep ignoring your boss and I'd expect to see players being dropped for it
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Probably a lack of drive to be successful, they've already won at life.

You can't manufacture a mentality. It's been lacking at this club for 10 years.
 
RedOrange said:
This "blindly following the manager" is nonsense. Your evidence is what, that we haven't bought players the manager specifically doesn't want? Who else should be directing these decisions, DoF advised by the scouts? Because the scouts are so great? The idea that we'd be better off handing the reins to these people is ludicrous.

Anyone with eyes could see that we had to replace most of the first team to change the playing style. Further evidence was provided last season when EtH had to modified Ole-ball because most of the squad wasn't up to the switch. Changing the style requires bringing in players who 1) have experience playing the style and/or 2) have the right skills to perform in the new style. Who else would we bring in if that's our goal?

You're all upset about two transfers in particular, Antony and Mount. The Mount hate is based on nothing but transfer muppetry, idiot fans not only incorrectly assuming the squad needs another holding midfielder, but zeroing in on by far the most expensive option in Caicedo. Antony has had a poor first season creating goals but is decent at retaining possession and very good off the ball. So what? Lots of players take until their mid-20's before they become adept at goal creation. Chelsea had a few players like that who Mourinho fecked off, and they happened to become the two best players in the league for our two biggest rivals. Even Antony doesn't become a huge goal threat, it's not even a major indictment of United's transfer strategy. Most big clubs have spaffed a bunch of money on at least one left footed right winger who ended up being disappointing. Barca had Dembele and Raphinha, City had Sane, Arsenal has Pepe, Real had Bale.

People just need to calm the feck down and stop expecting everything to look perfect immediately. Arsenal and Liverpool both took more than 2 seasons to start looking like contenders for the league title. Arsenal could have fired Arteta and brought in some double DM wanker for a manager and everyone would have thought it was a great idea, but they'd have been back to square 1 with their rebuild and off the top 4 last year.
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Then why is there people in here who cannot take people rightfully asking questions about what's going on? The poster I was replying to said that he didn't need to see any positives because he had total faith in Ten Hag to win the league. Surely you understand how dangerous that line of thinking is? We all obviously want that to happen but when we're yet again looking to sign players from the Dutch league or we're playing shite football, people are rightly going to ask what the feck is going on.

Most modern football clubs have a structure that allows the coach to work in unison with the scouting team and DOF. We have a profile of player we want to bring into the team that fits the way we want to play, that also fits the managers philosophy, who was hired because his philosophy fits the way we want to play, you see the connection there right? I'm not disputing that the squad needs about half a billion spent on it to be anywhere near ready for challenging for titles, but my concern is the players he's brought in since last summer haven't improved, and it's a massive red flag that he only seems to want to bring in players he's managed before or seen play against him in Holland.

People are upset about Mount because he's done absolutely nothing for 2 seasons and even when he plays it's hard to see what he actually does. It's got nothing to do with wanting a more expensive signing, it's got everything to do with wanting a player that can impact a game past the point of running around a bit and making defenders pass the ball quicker. I don't even need to go into detail as to how he's performed in the games he's played, his stats are out there to see, and his brother is already jumping on socials to defend him, which means they're already concerned. And on the Caicedo point, the best players generally go for the highest fees. I'm not saying he's worth it, but you won't get the best midfielders in the league or the world at £50m, meanwhile our rivals who are spending that kind of money will get the best players, so whatever progress we think we're making our rivals are making bigger steps than we are which leaves us stagnant.

I'm presuming you watched the Tottenham game? Casemiro got pulled all over the place by Maddison and couldn't get near him to stop the attacks. Casemiro has no competition for his place, and he either turned up to the start of the season massively out of shape or his legs are gone, time will tell which one it is but do you not think the funds we spent on Mount would have been better suited to finding competition for him instead of buying a player that plays in the same space as Bruno?

In all his time managing, Jose has sacked many players and people keep coming up with this line that Salah and KDB prove he has no idea what he's doing. In fact, it was because of them we ended up keeping Pogba and Martial when he rightly called them out and wanted them sold. The reality is, maybe Salah and KDB became the players they became because they suffered setbacks and were booted out? Maybe they just weren't ready for the PL? Jose always had very competitive teams and there's no shame in a young Salah or KDB not being able to get into those first team squads. Despite all that, I feel extremely confident that Antony will end up in Turkey or Saudi by the end of his contract. He isn't going to be one that got away, after watching many young wingers at United over the years, I think we know a good winger when we see one, and I'd swap him for any of those names you mentioned, except for Pepe who's probably set the path for where Antony's career will go.

No one's looking for perfection, people are looking for joined up thinking, a clear style of play, players improving etc. All signs of progression, not a repeat of everything that's been before under different managers. There's no value in saying "Arsenal gave Arteta time so we should also give Ten Hag 5 seasons", we could have said the same with Ole, no? Where would we be now? Probably have JWP, Rice and Maddison in the midfield, and I'm not saying we shouldn't give Ten Hag time but if we could realistically have a bunch of players from the Dutch league in our squad by 2025 and the next manager will have to clear them all out again.

This notion that he can't be criticised needs to stop. It's just a conversation, no one here has the ability to remove him from his post because they ask questions.
 
If no one else comes in, we're really going to see what he's made of and how good he is. It's going to be interesting, to put it kindly, to see if we can match last seasons achievements, hard to think about doing better right now.
 
AndySmith1990 said:
The question is why are they ignoring instructions? Too thick to remember them? Rebelling against the manager? Seems like a pretty serious issue to keep ignoring your boss and I'd expect to see players being dropped for it
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Disharmony in the squad? It's usually a case of "He's not running when he's supposed to so what's the point in me doing it?"

He said they're ignoring instructions, which implies they know what they have to do but they're choosing not to. So that would mean they don't see the value in it, don’t believe it works or don't trust the managers methods I guess?
 
Judas said:
If no one else comes in, we're really going to see what he's made of and how good he is. It's going to be interesting, to put it kindly, to see if we can match last seasons achievements, hard to think about doing better right now.
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I don't think it's really fair to judge him based on what he can do with a midfield that will mostly consist of McTomminay this season. I'd like to see another £500m spent and see if he can push for a title challenge, then we'll know if he's good enough. However, with the caveat that he isn't actually allowed to spend it and we outsource the money to Brighton's scouting department to make the signings for us.
 
crossy1686 said:
For Martial? It's more likely he's going to get moved out on the left. Garnacho and Antony probably need dropping more than Rashford.
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Rashford's attitude in the first 2 games has been appalling. Martial is a far better CF and Sancho deserves a start.
 
Leftback99 said:
Rashford's attitude in the first 2 games has been appalling. Martial is a far better CF and Sancho deserves a start.
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Definitely, his "I can't be arsed running" hands in the air stuff is not good enough. I can't see Martial playing the whole 90 minutes though. Maybe it's time to try a false 9 formation with no striker?
 
Judas said:
If no one else comes in, we're really going to see what he's made of and how good he is. It's going to be interesting, to put it kindly, to see if we can match last seasons achievements, hard to think about doing better right now.
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He is going to have to do something really drastic but I fear he doesn't have it in him to do an LVG and pull a diamond from the dust. The team is unbalanced and lacks cover in crucial areas but it's not all lost, especially if he makes a drastic decision and chooses not to ever revert to the McTominays and the Maguires, just go with the you to supplement a talented but unbalanced first team.

I am not saying it will work and chances are it won't because some of the players are still kids but I would go for something wild like having Dalot/Alvaro Fernandez in CM or playing Hannibal in there. Just do something to add technique and physicality and avoid reverting to players who have had five years to fail here.
 
I have faith we'll get a result today but god help us if we don't, this thread will turn into chaos.
 
crossy1686 said:
Definitely, his "I can't be arsed running" hands in the air stuff is not good enough. I can't see Martial playing the whole 90 minutes though. Maybe it's time to try a false 9 formation with no striker?
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Maybe. No point playing Sancho there pre season if he won't even try it in a home game vs Forest.
 
As much as I feel for him, he chose to sign the players he did, the ones here now and the ones already gone. He’s the one who can change tactics, work with what he’s got.

I still back him fully, but the way the squad currently looks has plenty to do with his decisions too.

I’ll tell you what will annoy me, if he doesn’t use the kids. Even if it doesn’t work, give me that instead of him doing things randomly like Sancho at left back as a wild made up example.
 
Leftback99 said:
Maybe. No point playing Sancho there pre season if he won't even try it in a home game vs Forest.
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Yeah I don't get the Sancho thing to be honest. Played him as a false 9 all preseason, looked decent by Sancho standards, played a bunch of minutes and then gets dropped for Antony and Garnacho. If he doesn't start today he should really force a move away if he has any ambition.
 
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