De Ligt | €45+5m agreement reached pending medical | Signed!

Status
Not open for further replies.
croadyman said:
Oh just close this thread it's full of people who have wrote him off completely at 24. I'm convinced no one in here will be happy with whoever is signed anymore
Click to expand...

For us to be happy they have to be:

Not Dutch
Never played in the Eredivise
Never played for Ten Hag
Under 23
Relatively Fast
Have a roundish shaped head
Above 6ft
Under £150k a week
Less than a £40m fee
No desire to play for Real Madrid in the not so distant future
Knows all the words to Glory Glory Man United

We don’t want much
 
croadyman said:
Oh just close this thread it's full of people who have wrote him off completely at 24. I'm convinced no one in here will be happy with whoever is signed anymore
Click to expand...

If that's referred to me mate it would be a bit unfair as this is the first player linked to us this season that I have shown concern for. I would love to see us sign Ugarte, Jarrad and Zirkzee.
 
Remember the geese said:
According to a large majority of Bayern fans, De Ligt has been their best centre back for the last two years.
Click to expand...

In a similar vein, if they’re interested we’ve got probably one of the best and most underrated midfielders in the whole entire world available for the cut-price fee of squintity bajillion pounds.

Would hate to see Donny van de Beek go, to be honest, but why clip an eagle’s wings when they were built to soar?
 
devilish said:
If that's referred to me mate it would be a bit unfair as this is the first player linked to us this season that I have shown concern for. I would love to see us sign Ugarte, Jarrad and Zirkzee.
Click to expand...

Believe me it's multiple people, however good to here some positivity about those players. Because have seen Ugarte described as new Fred with little ability on ball, Branthwaite as another English rip off and Zirkzee as someone who doesn't score enough goals.

Anyway getting it back on topic my only concerns with De Ligt is the perceived lack of pace and to an extent his injury record but feel that gets overstated
 
No chance we are signing players this summer without the blessing of Berrada, Wilcox, Ashworth, regardless of whether they are in officially or not. If we are going for De Ligt its likely because INEOS also believe he's the right defender to bring in. Which makes sense, he can play and has played EtH's style in the biggest competition against top teams and players. Has done well at big teams. Should be available for a decent price comparative to a defender of his stature. A no brainer if available.
 
devilish said:
A- ETH has a veto on transfers inserted in his contract. That contract still stands to this very day
B- We made the world know that we wanted to replace ETH
C- We failed and INEOS had to personally go to Ibiza and beg him to stay
D- We're trying to sign every person with Eredivisie experience there is which is in line to everything we've done prior to INEOS arrival and since ETH joined

Some common sense please!
Click to expand...

You speak of common sense, but display little of it yourself.

Nobody went to Ibiza to beg Ten Hag to stay. They went and met him after coming within a whisker of firing him, to offer him a last chance to turn things around, and to discuss how things would need to be different moving forwards.

Having come so close to losing his job, how strongly do you think Ten Hag is imposing his veto?

“Guys I refuse to accept that player and I insist on signing this player instead”.

“Yeah that’s grand Eric, but you finished 8th mate, so how about you worry about coaching the team or we’ll find somebody else instead.”

The words won’t be said out loud, but the implication will be hanging in the air in capital letters.
 
diarm said:
You speak of common sense, but display little of it yourself.

Nobody went to Ibiza to beg Ten Hag to stay. They went and met him after coming within a whisker of firing him, to offer him a last chance to turn things around, and to discuss how things would need to be different moving forwards.

Having come so close to losing his job, how strongly do you think Ten Hag is imposing his veto?

“Guys I refuse to accept that player and I insist on signing this player instead”.

“Yeah that’s grand Eric, but you finished 8th mate, so how about you worry about coaching the team or we’ll find somebody else instead.”

The words won’t be said out loud, but the implication will be hanging in the air in capital letters.
Click to expand...

Maybe begging is a bit too much but it does sound desperate enough to me. Regarding the rest, well, RVN is Dutch, Heke is Dutch, De Ligt is dutch, Zirkzee is Dutch and Jarrad played in the Eredivisie under Ruud. Does that sound familiar to you? However I do concede that maybe the Dutch bug that seem to have infected United since ETH joined might have infected INEOS as well
 
croadyman said:
Oh just close this thread it's full of people who have wrote him off completely at 24. I'm convinced no one in here will be happy with whoever is signed anymore
Click to expand...
Woodzy said:
For us to be happy they have to be:

Not Dutch
Never played in the Eredivise
Never played for Ten Hag
Under 23
Relatively Fast
Have a roundish shaped head
Above 6ft
Under £150k a week
Less than a £40m fee
No desire to play for Real Madrid in the not so distant future
Knows all the words to Glory Glory Man United

We don’t want much
Click to expand...

Bang on.
 
Regardless whether de Ligt is ETH ex player or whether he is Dutch player or eredivise player, it wouldn’t matter as long as the player fits the profile of how the club’s direction is heading.

We’re talking about a leader who is still 24 years old but also highly experienced playing in top level club’s expectations like Juventus and Bayern, has very good number of progressive passes, physically compliments Martinez, and has played/coached in the style of where the team wants to play high line

It depends on the fees and his wages, he could be a very good signing.

Honestly, I think the only players from ETH ex player who are good enough for top team level would be de Ligt, Timber, FDJ, Onana, and Martinez.
 
devilish said:
Its the same Athletic who hyped Murtough in 2022 and then wrote an absolute hit piece on him a year later mere 5 months before he was shown the door. For god sake who do you think feeds the Athletic information? Why are they so reliable? Its the club. 'Sticking to ETH's principles because all our decision makers are on gardening leave' is hardly something INEOS would want the Athletic to say


A- ETH has a veto on transfers inserted in his contract. That contract still stands to this very day
B- We made the world know that we wanted to replace ETH
C- We failed and INEOS had to personally go to Ibiza and beg him to stay
D- We're trying to sign every person with Eredivisie experience there is which is in line to everything we've done prior to INEOS arrival and since ETH joined

Some common sense please!

Does it make sense to stick to the current system up until they start working at the club? Sort off. I trust ETH more then I trust bicycle man but I'd expect Wilcox to at least highlight the very evident issues surrounding De Ligt. Will such a thing probably change in the future? I believe so. Berrada and Ashworth will join the club eventually and they won't stand to a cheer leading role. But its very rare that something that moves, swims and quack like a duck turned out to be an F16
Click to expand...
Mate it's no use, we could sign the entire adult population of the Netherlands (a small country that's been practically an irrelevance in football this century) and there would still be some in here writing essays about how it's all a coincidence and how the club actually has a master plan in place this time.
 
croadyman said:
Believe me it's multiple people, however good to here some positivity about those players. Because have seen Ugarte described as new Fred with little ability on ball, Branthwaite as another English rip off and Zirkzee as someone who doesn't score enough goals.

Anyway getting it back on topic my only concerns with De Ligt is the perceived lack of pace and to an extent his injury record but feel that gets overstated
Click to expand...

Usually people have concerns about one player and rate others. In the past few weeks I was defending Ugarte, Jarrad (were I was accused of suddenly becoming a good boy. The travesty of that!) and Zirkzee deal. However I do have concerns about De Ligt.

I also believe that arguments tend to get too polarized as well. One can show concern about a certain player while not being completely against him as well. For example I would do a 180 degrees if we sign De Ligt on a loan with an option to buy.
 
devilish said:
Maybe begging is a bit too much but it does sound desperate enough to me. Regarding the rest, well, RVN is Dutch, Heke is Dutch, De Ligt is dutch, Zirkzee is Dutch and Jarrad played in the Eredivisie under Ruud. Does that sound familiar to you? However I do concede that maybe the Dutch bug that seem to have infected United since ETH joined might have infected INEOS as well
Click to expand...

My point was only concerning this talk of the veto. On the nationality thing - I do think if I was Ten Hag, I’d want to look elsewhere because why invite the pressure another Ajax signing is going to bring on him?

But if they truly believe De Ligt is the answer, then I guess it would be stupid to not go for him for that reason also.

I have my doubts about his pace and getting done on the turn, along with his injury record, but he has a lot of good attributes that I like too. Himself and Martinez would be a properly imposing and proactive partnership.

On the coaches - Ruud is coming as much because he’s a United legend as the fact he’s Dutch. Hiring two guys who would be in demand for managers roles, to come in as coaches should be seen as a coup, not a negative.

There are plenty of successful managers who surround themselves with coaches from their own country and background.

If we signed Branthwaite this summer, it would be on the back of what he did in the Prem last year. Not what he did in Holland on loan. To suggest otherwise is just being silly.
 
It's really the injuries which bug majority of the fans. We don't want to buy a sicknote. If he has totally gotten over them, yes please get him.
 
Woodzy said:
For us to be happy they have to be:

Not Dutch
Never played in the Eredivise
Never played for Ten Hag
Under 23
Relatively Fast
Have a roundish shaped head
Above 6ft
Under £150k a week
Less than a £40m fee
No desire to play for Real Madrid in the not so distant future
Knows all the words to Glory Glory Man United

We don’t want much
Click to expand...
Spot on.
 
Woodzy said:
For us to be happy they have to be:

Not Dutch
Never played in the Eredivise
Never played for Ten Hag
Under 23
Relatively Fast
Have a roundish shaped head
Above 6ft
Under £150k a week
Less than a £40m fee
No desire to play for Real Madrid in the not so distant future
Knows all the words to Glory Glory Man United

We don’t want much
Click to expand...
Good post. I mostly enjoy the posts that are so much against buying players from certain leagues, nationalities and clubs. As if the root of United‘s issues wasn’t years of brutal mismanagement, a lack of football know how, bad scouting and a generally bad football management, that fails to identify the right players at the right moment.
No. It’s the league United buys players from. Or the club. Or the nationality. That must be it. :lol:
 
diarm said:
My point was only concerning this talk of the veto. On the nationality thing - I do think if I was Ten Hag, I’d want to look elsewhere because why invite the pressure another Ajax signing is going to bring on him?

But if they truly believe De Ligt is the answer, then I guess it would be stupid to not go for him for that reason also.

I have my doubts about his pace and getting done on the turn, along with his injury record, but he has a lot of good attributes that I like too. Himself and Martinez would be a properly imposing and proactive partnership.

On the coaches - Ruud is coming as much because he’s a United legend as the fact he’s Dutch. Hiring two guys who would be in demand for managers roles, to come in as coaches should be seen as a coup, not a negative.

There are plenty of successful managers who surround themselves with coaches from their own country and background.

If we signed Branthwaite this summer, it would be on the back of what he did in the Prem last year. Not what he did in Holland on loan. To suggest otherwise is just being silly.
Click to expand...

I think it makes perfect sense really

Its evident last season that ETH was close to losing the dressing room. He had issues with Ronaldo a year before, there were issues with Casemiro, Varane, Sancho and Rashford. Those are the one we heard about which is usually the very tip of an iceberg when compared to the reality. Rooney himself argued that our record injury list felt almost unnatural, almost like as if players didn't bother to go past the pain barrier to lend a hand. I do agree with him on that regard.

That lead to ETH near sack followed by the clumsiest vote of confidence in football history.That might look highly unusual fro a serious club but is quite in line to what Brailsford did when he was left as one of the main decision makers at Nice. Back then Favre was thrown in an interview with Barkley despite having zero knowledge how old the player was and were does he play exactly. That's something INEOS learnt at Nice (they hired a top CEO and DOF there) and they tried to avoid at United (by signing Berrada and Ashworth) but got stuck with gardening leave.

I believe that the manager feels he's in an awkward position. On one hand he knows that the club thought that last season was crap and on the other hand he also know that they can't fire him now and are desperate to keep him there for the immediate future. Else they would have pulled the trigger. After what happened to him I don't think he fully trust the present system as it is either considering the mess they created with his 'firing/confirmation'

In such circumstances its only fair for ETH to take ownership on everything again and make every minute count. That's done by strengthening his position at United, bring as many people in to aid him and as many players he or his people know that would fight till the very end no matter what. Hence why we're being linked to another flood of Eredivisie/Dutch people whether they are coaches or players (De Ligt, Zirkzee, Jarrad). I am expecting a flood out of players on the way out as well, most of whom we know had issues with ETH. We'll also probably going to have 3 assistants with decent managerial experience something not even SAF in his prime had. In few word nothing is left for chance.

I understand and support what ETH is doing. Someone has to fill that void in power and ETH > Brailsford/Blanc. I believe INEOS support that stance as well given the circumstances (Berrada and Ashworth are still on gardening leave).

However

a- while I do understand why ETH wants De Ligt (he know TenHaggy ball, he fits his system, he's an ETH's loyalist etc) there are very valid concerns about this transfer that INEOS should take in account.
b- Let's not pretend that all these Dutch/ players with Eredivisie experience coming in is a mere co-incidence. That's insult people's intelligence.
 
Woodzy said:
For us to be happy they have to be:

Not Dutch
Never played in the Eredivise
Never played for Ten Hag
Under 23
Relatively Fast
Have a roundish shaped head
Above 6ft
Under £150k a week
Less than a £40m fee
No desire to play for Real Madrid in the not so distant future
Knows all the words to Glory Glory Man United

We don’t want much
Click to expand...

Forgot to mention that they can't have any close relatives that may be slightly overweight
 
I was a huge fan of DeLigt when he was at Ajax. I wanted him to join United. Thought that he would have been perfect for the PL. I’d still take him but not as a sole signing. Him & another. I do have concerns about his injuries, especially those reoccurring ligament types. If the aim is to get Lindelof and Maguire out the door and we signed him then we’d have DeLigt, Martinez, Evans, Big K
The first 2 I mistrust their bodies until proven otherwise, the 3rd is an old guy, and the 4th is relatively unproven. So we need another with DeLigt.

I’d also pay little attention to how he has done in Germany considering our record of transfers from there
 
golden_blunder said:
I was a huge fan of DeLigt when he was at Ajax. I wanted him to join United. Thought that he would have been perfect for the PL. I’d still take him but not as a sole signing. Him & another. I do have concerns about his injuries, especially those reoccurring ligament types. If the aim is to get Lindelof and Maguire out the door and we signed him then we’d have DeLigt, Martinez, Evans, Big K
The first 2 I mistrust their bodies until proven otherwise, the 3rd is an old guy, and the 4th is relatively unproven. So we need another with DeLigt.

I’d also pay little attention to how he has done in Germany considering our record of transfers from there
Click to expand...
We definitely need another CB, if we sign De Ligt, as he was out with frequent small injuries in a much less intense league. Kind of annoys me that Chelsea seems to be getting Anselmino.
 
devilish said:
Maybe begging is a bit too much but it does sound desperate enough to me. Regarding the rest, well, RVN is Dutch, Heke is Dutch, De Ligt is dutch, Zirkzee is Dutch and Jarrad played in the Eredivisie under Ruud. Does that sound familiar to you? However I do concede that maybe the Dutch bug that seem to have infected United since ETH joined might have infected INEOS as well
Click to expand...
United have been linked with a host of Dutch players since Ten Hag joined, and signed the grand total of one. One of those new Dutch coaches, if they indeed come in, might also be replacing an existing Dutch coach. So maybe wait a little until drawing all these giant conclusions based on early transfer rumors (which you of course only interpret one way).

I mean, I know it's tempting to draw conclusions and see patterns, but since your conclusion is obviously upsetting you, why not hold off on the misery until you have actual facts to work with? Doesn't that sound nicer?
 
Cheimoon said:
United have been linked with a host of Dutch players since Ten Hag joined, and signed the grand total of one. One of those new Dutch coaches, if they indeed come in, might also be replacing an existing Dutch coach. So maybe wait a little until drawing all these giant conclusions based on early transfer rumors (which you of course only interpret one way).

I mean, I know it's tempting to draw conclusions and see patterns, but since your conclusion is obviously upsetting you, why not hold off on the misery until you have actual facts to work with? Doesn't that sound nicer?
Click to expand...

Onana, Eriksen, Antony and Martinez played for Ajax, Amrabat and Malacia for Feyenoord, Weghorst for AZ and Mount played for Vitesse. Hojlund shares the same agency with ETH. Its the same agency were ETH's son works. There is a pattern whether you want to admit to it or not

We haven't signed anyone just yet however we're linked to many people from the Dutch League again. I am not referring to links coming from ITKs from twitter but reliable journalists like Ornstein and Romano. The same pattern seem to occur once again.

Its interesting to have actual proof of where I am being miserable about it at all.
 
HTG said:
Good post. I mostly enjoy the posts that are so much against buying players from certain leagues, nationalities and clubs. As if the root of United‘s issues wasn’t years of brutal mismanagement, a lack of football know how, bad scouting and a generally bad football management, that fails to identify the right players at the right moment.
No. It’s the league United buys players from. Or the club. Or the nationality. That must be it. :lol:
Click to expand...
Spot on

Our issue has been signing players over the years that haven't been the most compatible with how the game has evolved in England over the last 10 years. And I'm someone that has for many years been someone that has put forward the argument about pace, physicality and athleticism as being important in the team in the backline and DM position. But the fundamental requirement for any footballer is their technical ability on the ball and that fundamental requirement is even more important in the first line in the present day because opponent's are proactively defending from the front, hunting for the ball in packs and hence closing off the space quickly to create high turnovers. So having the poise and composure on the ball in the first line (backline) is very important. Of course the injuries would be a concern with de Ligt, but we've got people at the club who have been brought in to do the due diligence when it comes stuff like this and for a football supporter (imo) it's better to focus on how we can develop ourselves as a team moving forward and from all the players we've been linked to by credible sources, de Ligt would actually move the needle as far as helping us develop a strong in-possession game.

I think as a teenager he made the wrong move going to Juventus because his profile as a player didn't suit the type of football that had developed at the Serie A club. I remember Thierry Henry joining Juventus and he was deemed a disappointment by many Serie A observers. But Arsene Wenger signs him at Arsenal and knows the player well from his time in France and the player that has been utilised as a winger at Juventus is then transformed into one of the best strikers in Europe and the best in England imo.
 
Rolaholic said:
Click to expand...

As mentioned several times on here i really like De Ligt and hope he stays, but that stat is pretty misleading.

De Ligts passing isnt really good and he almost always just plays the easiest ball to the fullback or DM.
 
If I didn't know we changed higher management, I'd have thought we still have the old people in charge. We will never learn it seems.
 
golden_blunder said:
I was a huge fan of DeLigt when he was at Ajax. I wanted him to join United. Thought that he would have been perfect for the PL. I’d still take him but not as a sole signing. Him & another. I do have concerns about his injuries, especially those reoccurring ligament types. If the aim is to get Lindelof and Maguire out the door and we signed him then we’d have DeLigt, Martinez, Evans, Big K
The first 2 I mistrust their bodies until proven otherwise, the 3rd is an old guy, and the 4th is relatively unproven. So we need another with DeLigt.

I’d also pay little attention to how he has done in Germany considering our record of transfers from there
Click to expand...

Who else would you like to see signed at CB, only happens if we manage to sell Maguire/Lindelof
 
In theory great but I'm very wary of a club like Bayern parting.with him. If they're happy to sell my first thought would be there's an issue.
 
Adnan said:
Spot on

Our issue has been signing players over the years that haven't been the most compatible with how the game has evolved in England over the last 10 years. And I'm someone that has for many years been someone that has put forward the argument about pace, physicality and athleticism as being important in the team in the backline and DM position. But the fundamental requirement for any footballer is their technical ability on the ball and that fundamental requirement is even more important in the first line in the present day because opponent's are proactively defending from the front, hunting for the ball in packs and hence closing off the space quickly to create high turnovers. So having the poise and composure on the ball in the first line (backline) is very important. Of course the injuries would be a concern with de Ligt, but we've got people at the club who have been brought in to do the due diligence when it comes stuff like this and for a football supporter (imo) it's better to focus on how we can develop ourselves as a team moving forward and from all the players we've been linked to by credible sources, de Ligt would actually move the needle as far as helping us develop a strong in-possession game.

I think as a teenager he made the wrong move going to Juventus because his profile as a player didn't suit the type of football that had developed at the Serie A club. I remember Thierry Henry joining Juventus and he was deemed a disappointment by many Serie A observers. But Arsene Wenger signs him at Arsenal and knows the player well from his time in France and the player that has been utilised as a winger at Juventus is then transformed into one of the best strikers in Europe and the best in England imo.
Click to expand...

In my opinion De Ligt moved too early for his own good. Ajax were always going to ask for silly money for him, Mino would have asked huge money in terms of salary and at age 19 he wasn't ready for either of them. That was going to be a problem everywhere he went. Players on an 11m a year must deliver as WC players and De Ligt was still too young and raw to do so.

Years later and things are even in a worst state. He had an injury ridden season and he's on around 14m a year. On those terms De Ligt must be constantly available and constantly dishing 7/10 performances something he's not doing. Hence why he's constantly being replaced by players who can do the job extremely well but on half the salary (Bremer is on 8m a year, Tah will probably be on similar terms if he moves to Bayern)
 
https://www.telegraaf.nl/sport/1333...rik-ten-hag-al-in-gesprek-met-bayern-munchen/

"The defender of the orange" :devil:
Manchester United has made a five-season contract proposal to Matthijs de Ligt (24). The management of the defender of the Orange, who is preparing for the eighth final of the European Championship against Romania, negotiates with Erik ten Hag's club. It is expected that it may reach an agreement in the short term, sources around the English club report.
De Ligt is then awaiting agreement between the two clubs. Manchester United and Bayern Munich are already having talks about the international's transfer fee, which is fixed in Germany until the summer of 2027. Ten Hag, who worked with De Ligt at Ajax and reached the Champions League semi-finals with the central defender in 2019, has made the Dutchman a top priority and has already had several conversations by telephone.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
How discouraging

Would have been a muppet signing before he went to Juventus (when we were supposedly trying to sign him. 2018?) but now it looks like a very poor one. Phil Jones Ligt
 


Watching his highlights from last season he looks to be about as fast as Lindelof, but maybe a bit more flexible. Honestly he seems like a bigger, more aggressive version of Lindelof with better movement. I don't think he's necessarily the answer to our problems but I think he'll help us get closer. I think his potential is what intrigues is more than anything. If we can get home for 35-45M I'm okay with it. He's young, has played in big games, and seems to have leadership qualities.

I still think we buy 1 more CB who's going to be quick, but I think it'll be more of a surprise.
 
sleepehead said:


Watching his highlights from last season he looks to be about as fast as Lindelof, but maybe a bit more flexible. Honestly he seems like a bigger, more aggressive version of Lindelof with better movement. I don't think he's necessarily the answer to our problems but I think he'll help us get closer. I think his potential is what intrigues is more than anything. If we can get home for 35-45M I'm okay with it. He's young, has played in big games, and seems to have leadership qualities.

I still think we buy 1 more CB who's going to be quick, but I think it'll be more of a surprise.
Click to expand...

So he’s nothing like Lindelof then :)
 
groovyalbert said:
In theory great but I'm very wary of a club like Bayern parting.with him. If they're happy to sell my first thought would be there's an issue.
Click to expand...
Bayern have recently sacked one of the best managers in the world then brought Eric Dier and finished the season in 3rd without winning any trophies.

Their recent decision making has been terrible.
 
devilish said:
Signings done during ETH's period were mostly from or had Eredivisie experience. One of the exceptions to the rule was Hojlund who is from the same agency as ETH. De Ligt is in line to that (his former captain at Ajax). Meanwhile we're set to add 2 Dutch assistants one of whom was ETH's no 2

This is a power move mate. Its evident that ETH is consolidating power at OT
Click to expand...

Casemiro does not meet the (mostly from or had Eredivisie experience) criteria, Eriksen, even though played in Ajax, he is very well known as he played for Spurs far more than he played for Ajax and also went to Inter, and Mount only had 1 season in Eredivisie, he played in the PL for far longer, granted, 3 players he signed permanently played under him (Martinez, Antony & Onana), Amrabat is a loan and most likely will not be signed, and Malacia came from Eredivisie, so basically 4 players, I know he had quite the power pre-INEOS, but I do not think this will be case going forward, otherwise, it is pointless to bring in Ashworth and Wilcox if they would simply sign players because EtH wants them, and it is far from the truth about EtH consolidating power at OT, he wasn't even sure he had the job 2 weeks ago and now he is in contract negotiations with INEOS, he knows he is kept in the job simply because there are no better options out there and if the team does not meet certain performance levels he'll be out the door, and his veto power will be stripped from him but obviously he will be consulted when a player is being considered, hiring more Dutch assistants won't mean more power to him.

Btw, I am not arguing that the signings not linked to EtH or not from Dutch league are good or bad, I am just saying that these players (Casemiro, Eriksen, Mount & Hojlund) are not linked to EtH directly, he most likely wanted them to be brought in, but not necessarily because he worked them or knew them personally, I mean 3 of them are known entities in Europe and one is up and coming talent.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.