That's the one thing that I can't wrap my head around. With time, you can only improve, regardless of what job you are performing, and what level of management you are in. Truly appalling that he wasn't able to improve over time.
Club Ownership | INEOS responsible for the football side
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That's the one thing that I can't wrap my head around. With time, you can only improve, regardless of what job you are performing, and what level of management you are in. Truly appalling that he wasn't able to improve over time.
Woodward is a banker and he did very well in commercial side of the club. The problem was he thought he knows football and wanted full control of the club. He appointed his pal Arnold and a yes man Murtough to assist him. The rest is history.
We have been stating the obvious for more than a decade. We need football people to run football side of the club. Strange that there were many posters here even defended to death Murtough was the right DOF!
Oof. Let him do some of it. I’d worry about all of it, though the Apple campus and Beijing Airport are large scale and pretty I guess.
Depends who’s really holding the pen. Foster (and team) have done their best work in large adornments in recent memory.
It would be nice to have a stadium that’s designed for Fan service instead of a monument to capitalism. Bragas stadium is stunning. The Birds Nest is incredible. The London Olympics aquatics centre is dreamy. Big cavernous communal spaces that aren’t rammed full of ways to empty fans pockets.
I’d love a new stadium that lets you leave really quickly, but has adjacent areas that make you want to stay.
With that said… Spurs have laid the blueprint. It’s an incredible match day experience in your seat, maximised avenues to emptying your wallet, and abysmal public transport so people stay out of necessity. We will 100% do that too I bet.
Shout out to the small stadium in Baku that is probably the hottest looking modern stadium on the planet. (Braga being the best of any era).
Manchester United revealed as the second best run club in England
https://www.joe.co.uk/sport/manchester-united-revealed-as-the-second-best-run-club-in-england-454836Hmm.. the best run club should be:
1) City (I know, forget about the 115 for a sec)
2) Arsenal
3) Liverpool
4) Brighton
5) Villa
6) Newcastle
7) Spurs
8) Man Utd
I just wanted to make a point of how INEOS seem to be doing business.
Since Ferguson and Gill left, as we all know, the running of the club went drastically down hill. The main evidence of that is obviously through the drop of quality on the pitch and how United have been doing their signings. The first red flag was Fellaini. All summer long Woodward was chasing Fabregas, put all their efforts into trying to sign him and end up panic buying Fellaini. No disrespect to Fellaini but he's no Fabregas.
Fast forward to this summer, the entire management of the football club is transformed. But just a note not to expect too much too soon. They SEEM to have made the right type of signings. It looks like they are more shrewd in signing players and business, thankfully, was done early and it doesn't look like they are finished. They managed to sell quite a few players and from what I seen, they generated 66m on sales and spent 164m which is 98m of spending. Also, the best thing the new structure has done is they have back up plans - selling clubs know this - and if their player wants to leave and they offer a fair price - it's easier to give in because they now know the club isn't desperate.
INEOS seem to be more disciplined and sensible when negotiating and that's eveident with the signings. How much would United have paid for De Ligt and Mazaouri last summer? I bet it would have been A LOT more than what was paid.
Perhaps United have overpaid a little bit but we are talking a few million - not an extra 10m - 20m. The days of ''It's Manchester United, we can milk them'' are likely gone. I think United are a club again that players want to go to be a part of a winning team, rather than just collecting a bigger pay cheque.
Since Ferguson and Gill left, as we all know, the running of the club went drastically down hill. The main evidence of that is obviously through the drop of quality on the pitch and how United have been doing their signings. The first red flag was Fellaini. All summer long Woodward was chasing Fabregas, put all their efforts into trying to sign him and end up panic buying Fellaini. No disrespect to Fellaini but he's no Fabregas.
Fast forward to this summer, the entire management of the football club is transformed. But just a note not to expect too much too soon. They SEEM to have made the right type of signings. It looks like they are more shrewd in signing players and business, thankfully, was done early and it doesn't look like they are finished. They managed to sell quite a few players and from what I seen, they generated 66m on sales and spent 164m which is 98m of spending. Also, the best thing the new structure has done is they have back up plans - selling clubs know this - and if their player wants to leave and they offer a fair price - it's easier to give in because they now know the club isn't desperate.
INEOS seem to be more disciplined and sensible when negotiating and that's eveident with the signings. How much would United have paid for De Ligt and Mazaouri last summer? I bet it would have been A LOT more than what was paid.
Perhaps United have overpaid a little bit but we are talking a few million - not an extra 10m - 20m. The days of ''It's Manchester United, we can milk them'' are likely gone. I think United are a club again that players want to go to be a part of a winning team, rather than just collecting a bigger pay cheque.
Champions League places, baby.
It all feels a bit premature, to be honest. Let's see how everything pans out. If results suck and we're mid-table the end of November, who's going to cite as a crumb of comfort just how wonderfully well run we are, according to a survey I'm sure absolutely nobody before now has ever heard of?
It feels like hurbis. It's very easy for a club to make the right noises. Not even the worst owners come in and immediately give the impression of incompetence - at least most of the time. Don't get me wrong, I'm optimisitc. But evidence will be seen in what happens over the next few years. Let's see how well these signings pan out, let's see if that stadium gets built, if we turn the corner, many seem to think we've turned already.
A restructuring of the suits? Bound to be worth three points on Saturday.
I dunno, I feel maybe a bit of caution is required.
It feels like hurbis. It's very easy for a club to make the right noises. Not even the worst owners come in and immediately give the impression of incompetence - at least most of the time. Don't get me wrong, I'm optimisitc. But evidence will be seen in what happens over the next few years. Let's see how well these signings pan out, let's see if that stadium gets built, if we turn the corner, many seem to think we've turned already.
A restructuring of the suits? Bound to be worth three points on Saturday.
I dunno, I feel maybe a bit of caution is required.
I’d have Brighton above Liverpool and maybe Arsenal. They replace players and managers so good. Liverpool barely spend as we’ve seen this summer, got a new manager but haven’t backed him yet.
I feel they dithered on one of the most important decisions and we'll regret this, i.e., getting rid of EtH.
I hope am wrong on this.
I hope am wrong on this.
You’re not going to be wrong mate. They bowed to supporter pressure and majority fecked up in keeping him.
This was always going to be a transition season either way. Top 4 is surely the aim. We are going to lose some tough away games. Yes if we are aiming to win the league then we need to be at the least scraping past the Brighton's of this world but… it’s a process. We have how many new players and coaches? New owners. Everything is still in flux. It’s going to take time to settle down unless we get really lucky
How can you forget about the 115 charges? It's the exact thing that makes them a not well run club.
Lucy Letby was the bestest most dedicated neonatal nurse, if you forget about the...
In football side their football structure is excellent. The best run club in PL. On the financial side of the 115 charges, I'm not sure and they could be even clear of all charges like they won against UEFA?
Ineos Team took a few weeks for end of season review of manager position and concluded that ETH is the best candidate. Hope they will be proven right, time will tell.
By the look of it now the future looks bleak. Our style of play is too slow and lack of intensity for PL. ETH still can't coach fluid attacking system, midfield is non-existent and defending is poor.
By the look of it now the future looks bleak. Our style of play is too slow and lack of intensity for PL. ETH still can't coach fluid attacking system, midfield is non-existent and defending is poor.
They need to start sending emissaries to Nagelsmann.
My second choice for manager behind Alonso, no I don't give a stuff about his scouse connection
I remember a few years ago after a derby game Pep was talking up our side saying we have some very talented players, and he basically named the entire side apart from McTominay and Aaron Wan-Bissaka.
Ineos come in and get rid of them at the first opportunity. Interesting
Ineos come in and get rid of them at the first opportunity. Interesting
They really fecked up by not sacking ETH.
3 of the old survivors gone- AwB, Mctominay, Martial (was leaving anyway but still). I would imagine Lindelof is being phased out with the last year of his contract, Maguire, Rashford and Shaw must be on final final chances this season. Dalot and Bruno staying on merit.
Some signs of progress.
Some signs of progress.
Their one big feck up so far. I'm relatively happy with everything else they've done up to now though.
I also have faith in them to bin Ten Hag by Christmas if it continues to be this bad whereas Arnold and the Glazers would wait until top 4 is mathematically done.
I'm really curious what the behind the scenes of keeping him was. I do believe they would have sacked him if he didn't win the FA Cup which is a supremely unprofessional reason if that's true.
As with most of their decisions their choice to keep him on was a good one.
Agreed!
Could also be a lack of stand out candidates that made INEOS stick with EtH
I don’t think they did, I think they just decided to give him a last chance. I am hopeful that the likes of Ten Hag and Rashford are both on their last chances and the way they are operating suggests that they will swiftly move on from staff and players that prove to not be good enough.
As I watch our rivals win comfortably, I suppose any kind of comforting feeling I can get from that is those teams haven’t really had the squad turnover and board turnover that we’ve had the past few months. We’ve had a right load of junk at the club thanks to Glazer incompetence and seeing a load of them leave feels liberating. Williams and Martial are still without clubs and we were paying them a combined sum of just over £300k a week recently. Arnold and Murtough axed and then the footballing executive team essentially trebled in size with not only much more suitable people, but people with impressive CVs.
Our front line options are young and inexperienced, with the most experienced attacker in Rashford being extremely flaky this past 18 months. The second most experienced attacker in Sancho clearly not wanting to be here and us not wanting him here.
Our midfield is still imbalanced. We need more players who can actually sit in midfield and try to enforce control and less attacking midfielders.
I don’t get the feeling INEOS are particularly besotted with ETH, and think they will dump him if we start looking like last season again by November time.
On the plus side, I think our first team defensive options are looking much better with the players bought as well as the youth players who aren’t far away from reaching the first team. Maguire and Lindelof will more than likely be gone this time next year which will free up another £300k a week or so. I like the youth transfers we’ve been making as well. God knows whether they’ll be good enough for our aspired level but hopefully we can manage them with the right loans and career movements in a way that if they weren’t good enough, we ultimately haven’t exposed them too much and we can sell them for a good price to help future recruitment. Under Glazer management, it felt like any youth player who can just about hang in there in the first team for a few games got an £80k a week 5 year contract from Woodward and then we’re stuck with them because the honeymoon period was over and that player actually wasn’t that good.
Our front line options are young and inexperienced, with the most experienced attacker in Rashford being extremely flaky this past 18 months. The second most experienced attacker in Sancho clearly not wanting to be here and us not wanting him here.
Our midfield is still imbalanced. We need more players who can actually sit in midfield and try to enforce control and less attacking midfielders.
I don’t get the feeling INEOS are particularly besotted with ETH, and think they will dump him if we start looking like last season again by November time.
On the plus side, I think our first team defensive options are looking much better with the players bought as well as the youth players who aren’t far away from reaching the first team. Maguire and Lindelof will more than likely be gone this time next year which will free up another £300k a week or so. I like the youth transfers we’ve been making as well. God knows whether they’ll be good enough for our aspired level but hopefully we can manage them with the right loans and career movements in a way that if they weren’t good enough, we ultimately haven’t exposed them too much and we can sell them for a good price to help future recruitment. Under Glazer management, it felt like any youth player who can just about hang in there in the first team for a few games got an £80k a week 5 year contract from Woodward and then we’re stuck with them because the honeymoon period was over and that player actually wasn’t that good.
I'm still confident in the Ineos project.
Starting with the backroom staff. Major changes. Changes which will take a good 6-12months to be up and running proper.
They didn't fully commit to Ten Hag. Shows that his job is in the air, so very much make or break for him. Also gives the boadroom time to make their choice.
Good signings so far. Players that should do well no matter the new manager. Zirkzee being the one questionable player as we don't know his best position, and it doesn't seem a conventional one, but looks very comfortable on the ball.
We finished 8th last year and had some absolute wasters in the squad. They're being moved on, moreso than under any Glazer summer.
Ineos will need a good 2 full seasons of transfer windows to turn it all around, but it's been positive so far.
On the pitch, I don't think much has changed as of yet, but thats Ten Hag's job to sort, and he needs to do it quickly
Starting with the backroom staff. Major changes. Changes which will take a good 6-12months to be up and running proper.
They didn't fully commit to Ten Hag. Shows that his job is in the air, so very much make or break for him. Also gives the boadroom time to make their choice.
Good signings so far. Players that should do well no matter the new manager. Zirkzee being the one questionable player as we don't know his best position, and it doesn't seem a conventional one, but looks very comfortable on the ball.
We finished 8th last year and had some absolute wasters in the squad. They're being moved on, moreso than under any Glazer summer.
Ineos will need a good 2 full seasons of transfer windows to turn it all around, but it's been positive so far.
On the pitch, I don't think much has changed as of yet, but thats Ten Hag's job to sort, and he needs to do it quickly
Every clubs except Man Utd seems to be able to change manager with ease and straight away able to implement their style of play.
Liverpool, Spurs, Brighton and etc.
Liverpool, Spurs, Brighton and etc.
Bit dramatic
Really? Did the other clubs needs 3 years and 600mil?
Mainly because Klopp had a style of play implemented at Liverpool and they've chosen managers who play with not too dissimilar philosophy. Same with Brighton really.
Spurs have done well getting Ange in, he's turned their style upside down.
I think it’s something deeper than the football side. It has to be at this point.
Sadly the Caf thinks everything in life is exactly the same when actually each situation can be different for a variety of reasons.
I mentioned in another thread that it’s not unreasonable to think a 23 year old Ugarte can still develop as a player and was met with ‘Marcus Rashford’ - literally no explanation just that.
Believing everything in life is identical is a strange way to approach things which can be far more complex.
All I can say is I admire your optimism. Cheers!
Have to remember City were not cleared of all the UEFA charges. It was just those charges were time-barred. Very different from being cleared.
I mean if you can’t be optimistic about your club what’s the point?
INEOS have given us plenty to get started with given they haven’t even been here a year. People just need to temper their expectations. We’ve had Joel Glazer and his merry men running the football side of things for a decade. It’s not going to change in a few months.
The new team off pitch only officially started a month ago.
Just to be clear, Ineos team has done excellent job so far. No doubts. The part we feel not optimistic is the manager.
Defence was still shocking, midfield we revert back to basketball tactics 2nd half vs Brighton, attacking was blunt. We also move the ball too slowly and too many sideway and back passes. Onana took forever to play a simple pass.
Again, like Rashford, I would say EtH is on his last chance to deliver.
I think that approach is correct seeing as the new team has come in and likely wants to assess what direction they are going in and how best to achieve.
I for one would prefer that approach as opposed to a merry go round like Chelsea. The club needs some stability off the pitch and then a full decision on certain individuals on it.
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