The only thing we have had the chance to accept or reject was Brexit and we have already voted against that.
Brexited | the worst threads live the longest
- Thread starter Silva
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The only thing we have had the chance to accept or reject was Brexit and we have already voted against that.
Everyone has a price. The Benn Act is a godsend to the DUP as it just made the price higher.
With Boris the ends justify the means, so if he is less than economical with the truth, deals in smoke and mirrors, says one thing then does another, none of it matters as long as it comes out right in the end.
If this Boris deal goes through then GB (if not all of the UK) are out of the EU. NI voted (had a majority) to remain in the EU and will now get their collective wish, well almost their wish and should under the terms envisage get a massive boost (economic boost) with the gateway to the rest of the UK being via the Irish Sea. Effectively the Government in London will have a lessening influence in NI till eventually there will be, if not in name, then in economic terms a United Ireland (Confederation type arrangements maybe?) with the DUP able to play any trump card it wishes down the line and most of the economic problems landing one way or another on Dublin's doorstep, as NI will now effectively be inside the 'big tent' as far as the economics on the Island of Ireland are concerned.
The term Great Britain will then be used more often and more widely once again; however this would be paving the way for constitutional changes (maybe even a written one!) with probably Scotland gaining independence, but voting to remain within GB constitutionally (stranger things have happened) because that's the side their bread will be buttered. It would be a gamble for Scotland because hard line SNP voters may decide to join the queue to regain access as a Sovereign Nation to the EU. However it seems strange that having just gained independence they would want to subjugate themselves once again to a political super state, they would still get a cosier deal as an independent entity within a constitutionally revamped GB.
Boris can see his majority at the next GE building steadily, the Brexit party almost extinct, Lib Dem's fox has been shot, Labours in-fighting gets worse and with Scotland in particular, happy to accept Independence within a constitutionally revamped GB (the Welsh too maybe?) its plain sailing. Almost as Dominic predicted!
If this Boris deal goes through then GB (if not all of the UK) are out of the EU. NI voted (had a majority) to remain in the EU and will now get their collective wish, well almost their wish and should under the terms envisage get a massive boost (economic boost) with the gateway to the rest of the UK being via the Irish Sea. Effectively the Government in London will have a lessening influence in NI till eventually there will be, if not in name, then in economic terms a United Ireland (Confederation type arrangements maybe?) with the DUP able to play any trump card it wishes down the line and most of the economic problems landing one way or another on Dublin's doorstep, as NI will now effectively be inside the 'big tent' as far as the economics on the Island of Ireland are concerned.
The term Great Britain will then be used more often and more widely once again; however this would be paving the way for constitutional changes (maybe even a written one!) with probably Scotland gaining independence, but voting to remain within GB constitutionally (stranger things have happened) because that's the side their bread will be buttered. It would be a gamble for Scotland because hard line SNP voters may decide to join the queue to regain access as a Sovereign Nation to the EU. However it seems strange that having just gained independence they would want to subjugate themselves once again to a political super state, they would still get a cosier deal as an independent entity within a constitutionally revamped GB.
Boris can see his majority at the next GE building steadily, the Brexit party almost extinct, Lib Dem's fox has been shot, Labours in-fighting gets worse and with Scotland in particular, happy to accept Independence within a constitutionally revamped GB (the Welsh too maybe?) its plain sailing. Almost as Dominic predicted!
This is very unusual for the DUP, they are normally water tight with whatever the party line is on a particular issue.
Dodds is the real power in the DUP - whatever he say's goes generally. Arlene is just the mouthpiece so if Dodd's is against it it's hard to see them going for it.
Barclay in the committee mentioned something about compensation to less prosperous areas. That's an odd way to describe a bribe to the DUP but i suppose he has to spin it somehow 
You'd think such direct bribery of MPs votes wouldn't be allowed.
You'd think such direct bribery of MPs votes wouldn't be allowed.
Suspect there is a lot of jostling for position being done for when Foster inevitably stands down in the coming weeks/months. Presumably Dodds and Donaldson are behind these briefings.
Well there we are then....
Edit: Well actually
Edit: Well actually
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The future of the UK and its economic prosperity in the hands of the DUP. How did it come to this?
'Taking the power back!'
Wonder how many millions or billions this is costing the Government to get the DUP onside
meh - make the most of it after the election it could be farrage who holds the balance of power... fyring pan / fire
Battle of the briefings!I can't tell you how much I hate that the DUP are getting a platform from which to appear relevant in all of this. The idea of them getting paid off is abhorrent to me as well.
Surely there is a rock somewhere in the ocean between NI and Scotland we could cast them to and let them call it the New Northern Ireland?
Surely there is a rock somewhere in the ocean between NI and Scotland we could cast them to and let them call it the New Northern Ireland?
Weird Science was good, tbf.
I honestly wouldn't mind if the DUP died somehow.
Is that allowed? Can I say that?
If not then I retract it.
Is that allowed? Can I say that?
If not then I retract it.
We could just send them all to the Isle of Mann?
Arlene could be on the bank notes of the Isle of Man.
The government are clearly telling the EU that the DUP will fall into line.
This is all massive waste of time and energy as there is zero chance parliament will agree to anything that the fat oaf brings back.
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Which he well knows and will then pit himself against big bad parliament in a GE.
Am not sure how many will fall for that beyond leave no deal zealots
doubt that includes One Nation Tory voters who are the majority of the Tory vote bank
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possibly - but I presume anything he brings back will be amendable - and they might agree and amendment?
And it will work because of the total intransigence of the opposition.
Obsessed with stopping no deal it won't be a good look if they are offered one and then vote it down.
They are best off backing the deal then fighting a GE on a domestic agenda.
Yeah that's fine. As long as you've made peace with it yourself. Which it seems you have.
Yes and as you outlined yesterday.
I'd be happy if that amendment was public verification via a 2nd referendum.
What would be on the ballot paper?
And as I've said yesterday, personally I dont see it happening as this is a deal no one would want, hence why Corbyn wants a GE so he can negotiate his own deal. This deal would fail Labours tests, so accepting it on the basis of a referendum where they hope remain wins would be risky, especially if the public said take it.
A general election will happen, if Torys win, itll be no deal or Boris's deal. If Labour win itll be a ref on their deal or remain and if Dems win its revoke.
If they have a referendum on this deal, one that not many MPs want, then if it gets through theyd be screwed. Unless they ignore the vote again and block it. It makes no sense as it's mainly Labour and Dems/Independents that want a referendum, so why put a bad deal that fails their tests to a vote??
Plus putting "another deal" on the ballot would be a nightmare, as it doesn't break the deadlock and means more voting down In parliament resulting in a 3rd ref demands
Even with the DUP, do they have the numbers?
Yes but that doesn't discuss what the questions would be on the second referendum. I am assuming that one possibility is an amendment would be voted on stating that if the deal was passed it would be put to a public vote.
If that amendment got through and the deal was passed what would be on the public vote ballot paper?
BJ's deal (as now passed by the house) or ???
I think they could scrape it with the ERG, DUP, some of the whipless tories and the 19 Labour signatories to the letter.
If tagged on to the boris deal I suspect it would be
the boris deal (whatever name it has) vs remain ... and I suspect that would be agreed with the electoral commission tasked with testing the exact wording of the question
Even in a party thats full to the brim with cnuts Sammy Wilson still stands out. Quite the achievement.
Gregory Campbell is the only one that gives him a real run for his money in that regard.