Pretty big hypothetical.
MP's who haven't announced any policy of their own either, yet.
Brexited | the worst threads live the longest
- Thread starter Silva
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Pretty big hypothetical.
MP's who haven't announced any policy of their own either, yet.
Indeed, I agree that there are different voices amongst the European political leaders.
Their still counting the money they are getting from tory donors.
Bit premature to start crediting Corbyn with keeping the Labour party together isn't it? That remains to be seen....
*cough* Rupert Murdoch *cough*
This too, I believe, played no small part in the 'patriotic' drive behind Brexit:
https://ec.europa.eu/taxation_customs/node/1033_en
https://ec.europa.eu/taxation_customs/node/1033_en
But surely that’s beside the point of how Corbyn is keeping the party together and merely a diversion in answering the questions wrt Corbyn’s leadership.
The Tories started with 317 MPs in 2017, lost 3 who quit since and are down to 314. Meanwhile Labour started with 262 and is down to 245. Lost 17 MPs who either joined TIG or went independent. And Labour aren’t even under the pressure of delivering Brexit like the Tories are.
But most damning of all is that at this time he should be gaining on the Tories in popularity and polls yet the opposite is happening. And apparently he deserves praise for the party not falling apart... yet. I mean how low can expectations get?
Thats a real possibility mate, i still suspect that the DUP wouldn't be averse to a Hard border in Ireland despite what they may say in public.
It was this question at the end of my post I was interested in hearing your thought on mate.
There is no actual answer to that question, you will get vague sentences put together.
Ffs, give them time to finish the auction to set their policy.
I haven't said anything about him keeping the party together, that was inferred in the tweet, not in any of my posts.
Apart from the 8 MP's who recently left, the other MP's left because they deem him to be too far left, which is neither here nor there considering he's survived 2 leadership contests - and at the time was popular with the majority of labour voters (if that's still true, remains to be seen)
I was simply asking for thoughts on his actions (or inaction) when it comes to his stance on Brexit. i.e as the opposition party leader, any definitive position he takes on Brexit will likely have an impact in future GE's. No matter what happens with Brexit, there are going to be large factions of Pro-EU or Pro-Brexit in Labour & other marginal constituencies, and as things stand it doesn't look like either faction will be satisfied with the end result.
So with all that in mind, what's the best Brexit strategy for a party leader who aspires to be PM?
I don't know the answer, but I thought it would be interesting to see what others thought.
Yeah I suspect that will be the case mate.
Because it's a classic case of using past performance to indicate future success. All that tells you is that Corbyn pulled it out of the bag in 2017 (well, relatively speaking), it can't tell you that he's currently doing a good job in keeping the party together, or that people who voted Labour (at both ends of the Remain/Leave spectrum) would continue to do so right now. They may do, but it's not a conclusion you can draw from that data.
So let's say we leave without a deal on the 12th April. I'm in Paris and flying to Iceland the next day, then fly to Canada a few days later.
Am I going to have problems travelling with my EU passport?
Am I going to have problems travelling with my EU passport?
I think the only conclusion you can draw is it's a fecked situation for Labour which everyone should already know. When a 'broad' party is forced to reflect on a single divisive issue you can't please all voters.
If it becomes a GE with Labours position tied to a referendum it'll lose those seats and then the question is will Tory remainers vote Corbyn? I don't think they will. Two new leaders please
no, Canada and USA have open skys agreement and as long as you have 6 months then you'll be fine getting to Iceland
But what else can they use? Until we have another election those constituencies are still represented by Labour MP's.
Also I don't think they're using it to indicate any future success, they haven't implied that Corbyn is going to win the next election, just showing the broad spectrum of Labour voters that he has to appease.
Well that's what polls are for. They've definitely been grimmer for Corbyn (e.g. before 2017) but they're not pretty either.
And let's be real that's exactly what he's doing. His tweet claims that this is proof of Corbyn's success in keeping the party together. And, even if it didn't, he's one of the Novaro Media weirdos that would defend Corbyn from literally anything.
No one's denying that Corbyn has been dealt a difficult hand. He also just hasn't played it that well.
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You are screwed mate sorry.
I would have blue passport done in your place while in Europe.
If you're just asking for opinions then mine is that the minimum I expect of the leader of the Labour party is to be honest about their own views. Corbyn, and McDonnell, are lifelong Brexiters from the Benn/Foot school. They first lied when they supposedly backed Remain in the referendum, although they then kept a very low profile of course. Since the referendum they have said they back Brexit, but only because that was the referendum result. Yeah, right. I watched the Labour party conference, with demonstration after demonstration calling for a people's vote, completely ignored by the leaders until the last minute when they reluctantly included 'we don't rule one out'. Well they wouldn't want a people's vote would they, it might be for Remain?
probably fine the only issue would be if any planes that were due to pick you up are delayed due to it being a Uk carrier that had intended to fly EU to EU prior as that might not be allowed though I suspect most airlines have planned for that as much as they can... the mention of the USA does bring an additional bit of admin as you need the ESTA as well but you need this now anyway so that does not change
Incidentally travellers, Radio 5, moneybox I think, said if you want bargain flights look at this weekend. Apparently sales were very low as people thought it was Brexit weekend so were frightened to book, hence lots of cheap seats about.
I'm otherwise engaged, or I'd be doing a bit of googling.
I'm otherwise engaged, or I'd be doing a bit of googling.
I could really write an essay on this, but I don't want to derail the thread. I'll write something relatively short instead, but obviously that's entirely my opinion and there's no proof things would be any better this way. Here goes...
My opinion is that he should have gone for the angle that access to the Single Market is quite important to the nation's financial prosperity and peace (wrt Irish Border). Therefore he would get behind a soft Brexit which also respects the referendum result and in the event of no Parliamentary majority, a 2nd referendum to solve the impasse. And for the (rightly) disillusioned Labour Brexit supporters who are mostly of poor areas, his message should be that the EU enables wealth generation and what is skewed in this country is wealth distribution, which was already a problem even before austerity. And which is not solved by hurting wealth generation in general, on the contrary. That the anger towards the EU is misplaced and it's become an instrument of convenience for absolving consecutive governments of their failures.
The reason he's sitting on the fence is because Unions in general (who are his strong backers) are anti-EU. Because they feel that an open labour market, as operated by the EU, hurts them. The argument being that when an employer can pick any worker from the whole EU, why employ a local unionised worker. With diverse, flexible work forces unions are losing negotiating power, which means they lose memberships. And the ideology among the radical left in the Labour party is that should unions lose power the worker becomes worse off.
I personally feel that the above is merely a case of vested interests as happens with other politicians and their backers. And the angle politicians like Corbyn (and Sanders in the US) have is that they are supposed to stand for more integrity and the little guy instead of vested interests. Yet he's obviously failing to do so, in my opinion.
Tenous at the very least to attribute that distribution to Labour. More likely the constituencies have the same demographics that indicate Labour support.
Precisely. Correlation not causation is entirely feasible here given the demographic bases and Labour tending to dominate in poorer and more deprived areas.
My point was that because of the restraints on the EU via its own treaty's etc. it could not come to the table and negotiate a WA, and a future trade deal at the same time. Hence it was pointless the UK Government getting embroiled in the WA only, because that was the only indeterminate element that gave the Government leverage in the A50 process itself and on negotiating trade issues.
Hence the only way the Government could have respected the Referendum result was to go for the 'no deal' option, from day one, but instead it tried to pitch its approach somewhere in the middle, stating "nothings agreed until everything's agreed" which was patently untrue and which led to all sorts of complications, the border issue in Ireland being just one. If you are truly going to negotiate there should be no pre-conditions, from either side otherwise its not a negotiation. If you ignore this maxim, you will lose, and that is what has happened to the Government, its options are now limited it can either go for a 'No deal' for which it would seem the EU is more prepared for than us, or it can choke on revoking A50 and accept the political consequences... which in the longer term, the effects are likely to be more serious than a 'No Deal'.
May looks fecking awful i don't know why she's hanging on.
Decent to meh speech from Corbyn in response. If parliament votes against indicative votes again I'm going to cry
Decent to meh speech from Corbyn in response. If parliament votes against indicative votes again I'm going to cry
You didn't answer the question.
I thought I had, but you'd better repeat it then!
She is hinting at a longer extension and UK taking part in the EU elections here....
How a no deal plan can be compatible with the GFA?
Isn't this cheating? Surely it's not supposed to be a vote where the dice is loaded in her favour?
We don't apply any hard border in Ireland!
I have answered this previously, we don't want a hard border, the Irish (north and south) don't either and the EU says it doesn't... so who will implement it?
MPs shouldn't bother with this farce of the PM not actually answering simple questions. Just walk out or shout her down until she answers, stop the fecking formalities
Okay, so you don't intend to have any custom checks at all and obviously no trade deals?
As far as the first part is concerned, not at the present, because the same trading laws/regulations/tariffs currently apply in the north and south. If there are changes in the future then customs checks may become necessary, however by then we are told reliably that the new customs technology advances we hear about should be operating everywhere.
Trade deals will change as an when required, at the moment its hard to see how things would change rapidly as it would not be in the interests of either side for that to happen, neither side , as I understand it, actually wants to stop trading with each other, certainly not on the Island of Ireland.