Antony under investigation by Brazilian authorities for domestic abuse | Inquiries ended | Back in the squad

lsd said:
By releasing edited messages that tell us nothing at all?

He would really be better not doing this publically
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By showing that she has lied about what happened.

The club's handling of Greenwood has shown that public opinion matters as much as truth or due process and Antony had already been assumed guilty. I'd guess we'll see a few more accusations in the coming weeks and months.
 
Chesterlestreet said:
Back to Columbo mode.

* I'm not sure when the meeting between the banker (Ingrid) and Antony in Manchester took place.

* The screenshots (see above) are impossible to interpret in any way without further context (at least in translation). Yes, it seems they were not in a business relationship at the time (of the exchange), but was this before or after the alleged incident, and what's the specific timeline?

* There's also something there about images/screenshots she has apparently saved - which he doesn't seem happy about. None of that makes any sense without further clarification.

* As a general point (I repeat): if she's lying (she wasn't going to Manchester on business alone), did she really not factor in that he might be able to catch her in an obvious lie by simply not deleting their WhatsApp exchanges? Did she forget what she said to him in those exchanges? If so, she's an idiot (or possibly suffering from dementia).

* Can someone explain what the nature of their business relationship was? She claims to have gone to Manchester on business. What sort of business? What was she doing there (according to herself)?
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Maybe she meant business trip with pleasure on the side.
TrustInJanuzaj said:
What’s your point though? That’s how it should be because abusing men and lying about it is just as serious an offence. Sounds like you’re making excuses for her even though she deserves everything she’s gotten since the trial.
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Follow the conversation. I'd appreciate it if you wanna at least accuse me of something.

It's literally in sequence.

Seriously. Dont just butt in without any clue and start throwing insults.
 
Chesterlestreet said:
Back to Columbo mode.

* I'm not sure when the meeting between the banker (Ingrid) and Antony in Manchester took place.

* The screenshots (see above) are impossible to interpret in any way without further context (at least in translation). Yes, it seems they were not in a business relationship at the time (of the exchange), but was this before or after the alleged incident, and what's the specific timeline?
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My understanding is that she has said the meeting was in October 2022. The screenshots appear to be dated from mid/late September.
 
lsd said:
By releasing edited messages that tell us nothing at all?

He would really be better not doing this publically
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It already is public, the initial accusation made by the woman in question was done via the media months ago. The alternative is to let her side of the story dominate and shape the narrative. Why would that be in Antony's interests if his side is completely different to hers?
 
Hal9000 said:
I'm not agreeing with the original post.

However huge amounts of men also suffer from domestic abuse, but as it's seen as a gendered crime they are often not believed or there is a stigma attached to it.
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Yes they do, but I can't remember a case where a man said it happened to him and his own allegation was weaponised against him or his gender.
 
moses said:
Some great detective work going on here folks. We should send a link to the cops.
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Someone has to step up, mate.

Look at the other case, the one involving some kind of party in "North London" - it's dragged on for ages.
 
lsd said:
By releasing edited messages that tell us nothing at all?

He would really be better not doing this publically
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He's already under trial by social media with her evidence, may aswell carry on the trial with his counter evidence. Not releasing evidence like this will just let everyone run with her narrative till a lengthy investigation is complete. He already said he's willing to share unedited transcripts with the relevant authorities but he's quite rightly not going to share his and her nudes and probably the more explicit messages with the public.
 
Chesterlestreet said:
Right.

But what is her connection to Antony?

What sort of business did she expect to conduct with him in Manchester?

Has she provided any details regarding why this meeting took place?
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In his statement, he said she came to Portugal for her cousins birthday and asked to come to Manchester just to meet him. No context on how they got in contact in the first place.
 
moses said:
You should all solve that one too. Maybe start some sort of agency?
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I have been thinking about it.

I don't like the agency idea, though. I don't trust other people - and certainly not people on here. They could be *****. Or *****. Or possibly even woke.
 
Cassidy said:
Not sure what makes you think its uncommon
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If you want to you can replace "uncommonly" with "very". The point remains the same.

It is very stupid to assume that someone you have exchanged "romantic" messages with on WhatsApp didn't save those messages (or rather, did not delete them).
 
well done for him for putting it up in social media in retaliation. Waiting 2 years for the legal course to take its time will kill his career. They go public. He go public.
 
Chesterlestreet said:
If you want to you can replace "uncommonly" with "very". The point remains the same.

It is very stupid to assume that someone you have exchanged "romantic" messages with on WhatsApp didn't save those messages (or rather, did not delete them).
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Lots of very stupid people in this world unfortunately
 
I've been away for a week and am greeted with CSI: Redcafe

I can completely empathise with those who take the view that - if you're a public figure and believe you're wrongly accused, it's a valid option to be transparent with your side of the story. Sunlight is the best disinfectant.
 
sullydnl said:
Thinking about this issue more broadly, should there be stronger guidance for PL clubs to follow when their players get accused of something like this?

It seems like it's very much left up to the clubs to make things up as they go along on a case by case basis, with the likes of the EFA/Premier League being very hands-off. Which in a lot of ways is very unhelpful, as the clubs aren't independent when it comes to the alleged crimes of their assets and also aren't experts in dealing with these issues.

Whereas in some other sports the league themselves (or another body) would be able to intervene and suspend players, with rules in place that they have to been informed when such allegations are made about a player.

And as an article in The Athletic a few weeks ago pointed out, in the last 18 months six of the 20 Premier League clubs have employed players at different stages of criminal investigations into alleged sexual offences. So it's quite a present, ongoing issue within the league generally and not just for us.

Maybe it would be better if the decision to suspend a player when they're accused of something like this was removed from the club's hands.
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There absolutely should be a guidance for PL clubs and also for championship and lower league clubs.
I find it incredibly weird that the North London club has neither/barely taken a reputation loss nor a financial loss for 1 year and counting. The player has been playing week in week out.
While we even if we suspend the player/try to sell/loan/decide mutual leave are constantly in the media for it, the player(s) don’t play for us while we are still paying their wages all the time and then you still have expectations from some that if we get any money from a potential Greenwood sale we should donate it. What about United and their losses? Legally charges were dropped so we have to fulfil our financial obligations towards the player(s). I could go on and on.
There should be guidance if the clubs should suspend players once they are accused or “only” when they have been charged or “only” when they have been found guilty.
 
Chesterlestreet said:
Yes, which is why the question has to be, again: is she uncommonly stupid?
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If she wanted media attention she isn’t being stupid. She’s made an allegation that isn’t going to be criminally investigated or likely litigated against. He wanted to kiss her, she stopped him, he pushed her and there were no injuries. Based on this allegation she has got to go on National TV to give her opinion on the character of Antony in the biggest story in Brazil at the moment.

Here’s an article from April about her allegedly trying to work with another man to get a fake story of them being together in the press - he wanted to make his ex jealous (a famous singer I think?) and her for notoriety. It also states she claimed to the journalist that she is an ex of Antony and wanted to be referred to as that in the story. This article also references another media publication which revealed she was an ex lover of Antony. At the time Antony was in a relationship with the person from allegation one - I don’t think he’s the one going around telling the papers she’s his lover. I’d imagine that will also be why he was annoyed about the screenshots - he’s cheating and it can be used as evidence of that fact.

https://www.metropoles.com/colunas/...isa-tentou-criar-romance-com-amante-de-antony

She also has nearly a million followers on Instagram. I’m not convinced she’s just your ordinary bank manager at the local Barclays branch. None of this means Antony wasn’t aggressive to her at some point or in any way detracts from the serious allegations from his Ex that are being investigated - but I don’t think it is fair to lump the second allegation (which is different in nature) and this third one (which seems slightly dubious based on what we know and will likely ever know) in with the first as being indicative of a pattern.
 
Needham said:
If the accusation is proven false it stands to reason club transfer policy shats. For years the board board has MRI though Pallister's hope took a pounding it's all City's fault. Also teeth to the back sick of
of the media pussrap before don't even attempt to let Ince bully you, not withstanding all the next day deliveries of yum yum sloppy. And why weren't we Garth Crooksed when Hope Solo did me real good? Wind your necks in.
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Couldn't agree more to be honest
 
AdamColeBebe said:
Jesus wept. What an idiot.
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He's going to social media to defend himself because she started by attacking him through social media and trying to kill his reputation (where she's already gotten him suspended). The whole thing is a mess and extremely he said she said, but if you're an athlete who has been accused and if you say nothing, you will just be assumed to be guilty even you are found not guilty or if you never get charged. It's the unfortunate part of social media. People will make their minds up in 2 minutes, and you better have some good proof that you never did it (and even then, many will still 100% believe the accuser).
 
bosnian_red said:
He's going to social media to defend himself because she started by attacking him through social media and trying to kill his reputation (where she's already gotten him suspended). The whole thing is a mess and extremely he said she said, but if you're an athlete who has been accused and if you say nothing, you will just be assumed to be guilty even you are found not guilty or if you never get charged. It's the unfortunate part of social media. People will make their minds up in 2 minutes, and you better have some good proof that you never did it (and even then, many will still 100% believe the accuser).
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If you have evidence etc leave it to the people whose job it is to use it properly
 
Idxomer said:
Agree about that 1st accusation.

I don't think there's anywhere else for that banker/lawyer accusation to be played. The police aren't even investigating it and he has to somehow defend himself.
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I do understand that's the only way it comes out, but I mean the accusation missed out some pretty key information about their relationship - this sort of things just hurts everyone's credibility for now and future cases.
 
He has had no choice but to go public , he can't sit around for 12 months or even more before authorities decide if there is anything to these accusations.

There is no smoking gun like the Greenwood situation , it is all very much he said / she said.

He has every right to be assumed innocent right now.
 
crossy1686 said:
Well Greenwood's kind of was?
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Quite.

Cassidy said:
On the contrary. I think it says more about society today and the people involved than it does about said institutions.
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I don't disagree. I won't veer too far off topic, though, but from a more philosophical standpoint, I don't think the instutions have value beyond what society at large places in them. Either way, I think we agree that it's not a good thing that these cases are being tried in the public eye through social platforms and more traditional media, instead of the proper instutitions.
 
moses said:
Apart from the 1.7 million female victims of domestic abuse last year.
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I’m referring to high profile cases.

if you still refute that assertion, explain to me why the accusations are made in the first instance on social media and not straight to the authorities.
 
Ingrid: OK Antony.

Ingrid: Thanks for the trust, I came from far away to see you, you still won't trust me.

Ingrid: Not going to answer?

Ingrid: Antony I deleted it.

Ingrid: Are you going to be mad at me?

Ingrid: I just need to remove it from the cloud, but don't know how.

Ingrid: Talk to me baby.

Ingrid: I can't keep your picture so it makes me wet over here [this message is missing something at the very end].

Ingrid: Good morning love.

Ingrid: Talk to me my prince *rs*.

Antony: Good morning babe, everything alright?

Ingrid: Excellent.

Ingrid: I changed my hair

More on Tribuna.com:
https://tribuna.com/en/news/manutd-...atsapp-chat-with-his-accuser/?utm_source=copy

So can someone more tech-literate and modern than me, explain this screenshot thing? Did she take a screenshot of his knob or something and he asked for her to delete it? And her excuse was that it made her wet? She then kept messaging him, seemingly panicked he was going to ghost her because she wanted to keep seeing him?
 
Mickeza said:
If she wanted media attention she isn’t being stupid. She’s made an allegation that isn’t going to be criminally investigated or likely litigated against.
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Well, if the part in bold is true, then I suppose it makes (some) sense. That is, it makes sense if her motive is simply to get attention. It makes her utterly despicable, but it does make sense.

Do you know if she has elaborated in any way about the nature of the supposedly "strictly business" meeting she (according to her) was having with Antony? I mean, from an outside perspective, this stands out: if people are supposed to buy her version, surely there must be a reasonable explanation for why she was there - in a sheer business capacity - in the first place?
 
AdamColeBebe said:
If you have evidence etc leave it to the people whose job it is to use it properly
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I generally agree. Both parties should go to the police and nothing else. If their first instinct is the media, my first instinct is to not believe them unfortunately. The girl first and foremost went to the media. She has tried to ruin him publically. She's been asking why haven't United suspended him etc etc. I don't know who is telling the truth, if either are, but I'm pretty confident that they're both idiots.

And in Antony's defence, there is no right answer for a professional athlete. If they are accused, it's probably better to just dump all the evidence you have in the public eye right away to counter any allegation. If you let it sit, people will make their minds up about you, and in this age that is enough to ruin your life and reputation. It's the wrong thing to do legally, but legally it's unlikely that you'll be found guilty unless the accuser has a ton of very hard evidence on you. So it's about saving your reputation more than anything.
 
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