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2023-24 Performances


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4.6 Season Average Rating
Appearances
38
Goals
3
Assists
2
Yellow cards
6
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F2IVlY7WoAAw2i0


As a counterpoint to the criticism, this is quite a valuable quality.
Good for him. That's what keeps his head above the water. Time will tell if that is enough to keep starting him.

Sancho isn't anything special at this but interesting how does Amad play the game. He seems quite alright in keeping the ball under pressure but doesn't seem like much of a carrier?
 
You’re seriously arguing Antony is a better finisher than Mahrez? Are you serious? He literally has one type of finish (curl with his left foot) his technique is severly limited. Lets not even talk about his weaker foot.

I am not arguing that. Maybe you should read it a few times.

(The type of finishing reflects the type of chances he gets. I agree he should finish less often.)
 
I am not arguing that. Maybe you should read it a few times.

(The type of finishing reflects the type of chances he gets. I agree he should finish less often.)
No even when he should take it on his right, he goes with his left.
His finishing technique is miles behind Mahrez
 
As for our team, it really shouldn't need explanation why the ability to carry the ball up the pitch under pressure while not giving it away is a key skill given how much our team as a whole has struggled to do exactly that. But if you've missed it you could re-watch our games and pay attention to the amount of times we used Antony as an outball to drag us up the pitch.

It was commented numerous times last season that Antony actually kills Utd's counter-attacks, because although he carries the ball up the pitch when there's open space in front of him, he does not do so particularly quickly, and then as soon as he reaches an opponent he either stops to turn back around or plays a poor final ball.

It shows he gives us a functioning right side. He has a lot to improve on but those are two key qualities we have lacked for years. I'll let him off the lack of end product because he didn't have anybody to link up with last season, all our attackers were the same.

He is a competent right winger, which Utd didn't have for a while, so obviously having someone there is better than nothing, but he's not yet at the standard Utd need to compete for top honours. Him not having anybody to link up with doesn't work as an excuse, as there were so many occasions last season when he either messed up what should have been a fairly simple final pass, or he fluffed good opportunities to score himself.

And let's see what Saka does this season now the focus is on him.

It's hardly as if Saka was an unknown quantity prior to last season - in 21/22 he had 11 goals 7 assists already, then last season he managed to up it to 14 goals 11 assists.
He'll be excellent again this season. He had Shaw on toast last week.

For now, I'd say his ceiling should be around Saka's current level. That's when he improves his decision making, right foot and keeps that hunger and confidence.

Antony would literally have to double his rate of goals + assists to even reach Saka's current level. I don't see that happening. Saka is a much more dynamic player.
 
He was scoring goals with ease with Antony Martial right at the start - him having a striker that can hold on to the ball and take spaces really helped - so Hojlund should bring the best out of Antony.
 
Well we’d all love to be on that side, with every player, always - however, the reality is that our players are not always good enough. And when they are not, I want them out, not because I am not a proper fan, but because I romantically wish for no flaws at all and would prefer that player is quickly replaced by someone good enough.

Of course, nothing personal against Antony, and yea - he’s a United player, but so would the hypothetical more useful right winger I want to replace him be. I’m not wishing Mo Salah scores more goals for Liverpool due to my frustrations. We can say what we want, but the fact is, the one we have is not as useful as Salah, Saka, Silva etc, so I don’t see the point of defending the position of our less good player when the idea should be to improve upon him.

Of course, if you think he’s simply good enough and happy with what he’s producing then fair enough, I agree to disagree. But if you don’t, I see no point in any sort of spin. We all support the club the same, and in fact, I see the championing of below standard players as being less supportive of the club than wanting them out anyway. It may appear to prove fan loyalty, but it doesn’t serve us that our player isn’t as good as Saka, Salah, Silva.

In general I agree with what you are writing here. Specifically, it often bothers me that Igo into a match thread or a player thread and read hundreds of assesments like ‘he’s shait’, ‘useless’ and ‘get him out’ for more or less any player. On balance, I find tens of ‘had a good game’, ‘needs to play more often’ or ‘as good as Mahrez (or someone) at his best’. Even when we win a game, it’s like this. So my generalization from that is that when someone writing ‘Antony needs to go’ I easily suspect it’s 10% reasonable critique for the best of the club, and 90% egotistical need to express one’s feelings unfiltered, wanting to ‘set some other fan group right’, or yearning to be left free from the strain of having to think nuancedly about something. Mind you, this is a generalization, so it might not fit your specific instances. To generalize about you, from memory, I find most of your posts to be nuanced enough even when we see thongs differently.

On Antony, my opinion is that he had a 6/10 season last year, but that he still was 7/10 useful for us. His so called ‘end product’ is less than we need to aim for in a first choice player. However, he brings important things to the team when he plays, offensively allows us to retain the ball better both in established play and in counterattacks, which balances out Bruno and Rashford risk-taking. We transition better with him than with Sancho, Rashford, Bruno, Pellistri or Amad on that side. In addition, his tenacity allows us to win back the ball more often, high and low, an important part of Ten Hag’s play. I don’t compare this to the sum we bought him far, as it’s bygones, but to tje alternative options we have and the sum we’d lose if we were to sell him now to finnce someone with the same strengths and higher end product. My conclusion is that we should keep him, try to develop alternatives, and improve out balance in retention and pressing so as to have less need for his qualities there in the future.
 
Hope he kicks on this season
 
He’ll have to improve his decision making and finishing in order to become good player for us. Still had a better first season in PL than Sancho though.
 
People prefer to go into their vault and present some numbers that they would like to stand behind, despite - I imagine, being generally underwhelmed like the rest of us. He’s a circus act with extremely little substance, certainly thus far anyway.

Didn’t you like/praise him last year?
 
Well we’d all love to be on that side, with every player, always - however, the reality is that our players are not always good enough. And when they are not, I want them out, not because I am not a proper fan, but because I romantically wish for no flaws at all and would prefer that player is quickly replaced by someone good enough.

Of course, nothing personal against Antony, and yea - he’s a United player, but so would the hypothetical more useful right winger I want to replace him be. I’m not wishing Mo Salah scores more goals for Liverpool due to my frustrations. We can say what we want, but the fact is, the one we have is not as useful as Salah, Saka, Silva etc, so I don’t see the point of defending the position of our less good player when the idea should be to improve upon him.

Of course, if you think he’s simply good enough and happy with what he’s producing then fair enough, I agree to disagree. But if you don’t, I see no point in any sort of spin. We all support the club the same, and in fact, I see the championing of below standard players as being less supportive of the club than wanting them out anyway. It may appear to prove fan loyalty, but it doesn’t serve us that our player isn’t as good as Saka, Salah, Silva.

I agree with all of the above. Just happen to not think we're there yet with Antony, especially after only one season. I've seen plenty to think he's got the tools to step up and become a really valuable part of our first team. But of course that's the subjective part so as I said, I'll agree to disagree at this point.
 
In general I agree with what you are writing here. Specifically, it often bothers me that Igo into a match thread or a player thread and read hundreds of assesments like ‘he’s shait’, ‘useless’ and ‘get him out’ for more or less any player. On balance, I find tens of ‘had a good game’, ‘needs to play more often’ or ‘as good as Mahrez (or someone) at his best’. Even when we win a game, it’s like this. So my generalization from that is that when someone writing ‘Antony needs to go’ I easily suspect it’s 10% reasonable critique for the best of the club, and 90% egotistical need to express one’s feelings unfiltered, wanting to ‘set some other fan group right’, or yearning to be left free from the strain of having to think nuancedly about something. Mind you, this is a generalization, so it might not fit your specific instances. To generalize about you, from memory, I find most of your posts to be nuanced enough even when we see thongs differently.

On Antony, my opinion is that he had a 6/10 season last year, but that he still was 7/10 useful for us. His so called ‘end product’ is less than we need to aim for in a first choice player. However, he brings important things to the team when he plays, offensively allows us to retain the ball better both in established play and in counterattacks, which balances out Bruno and Rashford risk-taking. We transition better with him than with Sancho, Rashford, Bruno, Pellistri or Amad on that side. In addition, his tenacity allows us to win back the ball more often, high and low, an important part of Ten Hag’s play. I don’t compare this to the sum we bought him far, as it’s bygones, but to tje alternative options we have and the sum we’d lose if we were to sell him now to finnce someone with the same strengths and higher end product. My conclusion is that we should keep him, try to develop alternatives, and improve out balance in retention and pressing so as to have less need for his qualities there in the future.
I honestly think people really don't get Anthony's role in the team. And his output last season wasn't bad at all, he just missed a lot of chances. To me, that's a good sign, because he got himself in those chances in the first place.
 
He was scoring goals with ease with Antony Martial right at the start - him having a striker that can hold on to the ball and take spaces really helped - so Hojlund should bring the best out of Antony.
Pretty sure it was because the keepers hadn't done their homework, like Ramsdale diving the wrong way. Next season they and the defenders will watch out for that cutback, and just show him onto his right foot.
 
F2IVlY7WoAAw2i0


As a counterpoint to the criticism, this is quite a valuable quality.
Not surprised by that. He’s excellent in this regard. Still, needs to up his attacking game this season. He really needs to spend loads of time on passing and crossing in the final third not to mention shooting with efficiency.
 
F2IVlY7WoAAw2i0


As a counterpoint to the criticism, this is quite a valuable quality.
Didn't know he was as press resistant as Mahrez (or even more). Every time Mahrez gets the ball I just give up. No way we're getting the ball off him.
 
Sometimes you can sense the hatred seeping through the posts for certain players.
Care to point out the posts? I see criticism, which is totally fair. "Hate" and "hatred" are, more often than not, used as thought-terminating cliches on the Caf to shut down any criticism (legitimate or not).
 
he’s a very dislikable character

That take surprises me. I love his tenancity and will to work.

He can obviously improve, and I'm sure he will but I always think the team plays better with him in it. He brings a balance to the right side that we lack when he doesn't play.
 
That take surprises me. I love his tenancity and will to work.

He can obviously improve, and I'm sure he will but I always think the team plays better with him in it. He brings a balance to the right side that we lack when he doesn't play.
Doesn't surprise me. On the pitch he seems like an absolute cnut, sometimes even to our own (Bruno).
 
That take surprises me. I love his tenancity and will to work.

He can obviously improve, and I'm sure he will but I always think the team plays better with him in it. He brings a balance to the right side that we lack when he doesn't play.
Ignore that poster, he's clutching at straws. We need more shithouses who will won't take nonsense from oppo players.
 
Ignore that poster, he's clutching at straws. We need more shithouses who will won't take nonsense from oppo players.
When the shithouse causes the opposition team to get back into a European knockout game because hes too busy trying to score points on a 1 on 1 duel. Or when he starts some trouble that causes his team mate to get sent off. I think his shithouse behaviour is not what we need.

He needs to be more Bruno than himself
 
When the shithouse causes the opposition team to get back into a European knockout game because hes too busy trying to score points on a 1 on 1 duel. Or when he starts some trouble that causes his team mate to get sent off. I think his shithouse behaviour is not what we need.

He needs to be more Bruno than himself
Nonsense, it's those players that win you trophies. Their drive and determination is why they are shithouses. Keane, Scholes, Hughes, Cantona etc all had a mean streak and we won everything with them.
 
I love how tough they are (the likes of Martinez, Ant, Case etc) you can tell they've grown up rough and had to fight for everything. They do the same on the pitch, I couldn't care less if people think he's a cnut. He loves playing for his and he knows what it means and what a privliaged position he has. I love that he won't be bullied by anyone, that's the kind of mentality we used to have under fergie. You're not going to see these boys getting carried off the pitch by the likes of mark fecking noble that's for sure. I'll take a team of Anthony's/Martinez any day.
 
I’m on board with Antony’s character, but what drives me nuts is that he does the same thing over and over and over.

He really should study old films of great wingers of previous eras who to the right and to the left as they please.
 
When the shithouse causes the opposition team to get back into a European knockout game because hes too busy trying to score points on a 1 on 1 duel. Or when he starts some trouble that causes his team mate to get sent off. I think his shithouse behaviour is not what we need.

He needs to be more Bruno than himself

That's just focusing on one negative thing though, sometimes it will backfire but I'd rather have that character in my team than not. Bruno oversteps the mark, Martintez does. Keane, Cantona, Rooney, Scholes and the like did. You take the rough with the smooth.

Everything is so black and white on this forum. Where the nuance?!
 
He obviously has a lot to improve on and maybe lacks that yard of electric pace, but he has the tenacity and tools to be a very good player. Whether its the fee or nationality or modern world demanding instant success.....think the criticism of him has been harsh and a lot of it wrong.

Personally, I think he is going to surprise a lot of the doom merchants and haters of him this season. He is good presssing, press resistant, has good viosion (that he failed to use so well last season), a good left foot, links up well.

See some posts saying "no striker" isnt an excuse for his performances he often played the wrong pass. Though I think that was the case, I think having a proper link up , pacey striker....will improve him.

My big criticism of him last season was that he tried to entertain (not a bad thing) rather than doing the fundamentals and simple things, a bit like an early Ronaldo. Not saying he will be a Ronaldo before people jump on the comment.....but I expect a good season from him this year and he needs its as there is competition now
 
People complaining about his character now ffs. Would they rather Dan James? Someone much more meek and mild? It's Latin Heat you ingrates.
 
Nonsense, it's those players that win you trophies. Their drive and determination is why they are shithouses. Keane, Scholes, Hughes, Cantona etc all had a mean streak and we won everything with them.
Not Antony because he doesn't know how to be a shithouse hes just a hot head. Bruno is a different story
 
That's just focusing on one negative thing though, sometimes it will backfire but I'd rather have that character in my team than not. Bruno oversteps the mark, Martintez does. Keane, Cantona, Rooney, Scholes and the like did. You take the rough with the smooth.

Everything is so black and white on this forum. Where the nuance?!
All the players you mentioned know when they need to turn it down. Antony does not. ETH had to sub him multiple times last season because of it. He needs to learn
 
As a counterpoint to the criticism, this is quite a valuable quality.

Antony's stats would be impressive if he was running into the box, or running in field, or creating chances at the end of his dribbles. He does none of those things and he can't pass so in game this isn't useful at all really. Its like when a midfielder has a high pass success rate but they never pass the ball forward
 
I’m not giving up on Antony but he has to be worried of Amad and potentially Greenwood on his tail.

I don’t mind having City level of squad depth especially in our front line, but players should hopefully show their uses. This is including players like Sancho.
 
I honestly think people really don't get Anthony's role in the team. And his output last season wasn't bad at all, he just missed a lot of chances. To me, that's a good sign, because he got himself in those chances in the first place.
We wont see the best of Anthony till we get a overlapping righback. But it will help him that hojilund can work down the right channel amd right half space.
 
I honestly think people really don't get Anthony's role in the team. And his output last season wasn't bad at all, he just missed a lot of chances. To me, that's a good sign, because he got himself in those chances in the first place.

4 goals & 2 assists in the PL is absolutely tragic. He had more yellow cards (5) then goals or assists.
 
4 goals & 2 assists in the PL is absolutely tragic. He had more yellow cards (5) then goals or assists.
His output is seriously poor but I can see what he offers to the team, he needs a huge improvement and quickly because Amad, Sancho and maybe A.n other if he returns will put serious pressure on him, if he doesn’t start well he’ll be sitting on the bench, he needs 10/15 PL goals and 5/10 assists this season, all of the United front options need to improve their stats even Rashford should be looking at 20-24 PL goals this season and Bruno 15-20 as pen taker.
 
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