Andreas Pereira to Valencia? | It happened

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Obiorahking_ said:
Andreas doesn't need to have more experience nce but he needs to PROVE that he that he can perform a better job than Mata.....
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There in lies the crux of the problem. You have incorrectly assumed that Pereira being identified as a better natural option than Mata for a right winger role, means anyone wants him to play their currently ahead of Mata or that perhaps they think him the superior player. No one does. The whole point of highlighting it was to show United has ample room for him in the squad. Just like we do for Lingard.
 
Should be back up for Mata & Mkhi IMO.

Couldn't possibly be worse than those two when they're on bad day
 
Obiorahking_ said:
This is based on what exactly? I am not a fan of this hyping up of young raw talents over seasoned professionals. Andreas Peirera has rarely ever (if not ever) played on the right, and he only contributed 3 assists playing on the left for Granada last season.
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It's based on that seasoned professional offering nothing when playing on the right. Peirera played on the right in pre-season and did very well there. He needs to be given a channce before being discarded, whatever little he provides will be more than Mata is bringing to the table.
 
The fact he might be played in the second line of attack of our current 4-2-3-1, along with the awkward fact we only have 6 players for those 4 positions, tells us why he should definitely stay.
 
ghagua said:
It's based on that seasoned professional offering nothing when playing on the right.
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In 3607 minutes played on right in the league(roughly 40 full games), Mata he has been directly involved in 20 goals. Its nothing special but its decent. Mata has his limitations but we know what we are getting when we play him there: An intelligent midfielder who makes multiple intelligent runs and can pick out someone in the final third. What has Peirera got to show for himself?

ghagua said:
Peirera played on the right in pre-season and did very well there.
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This right here is troubling in multiple ways. Peirera didn't play anywhere on the right during pre season. He played almost all his games as CM/DM and did well for the most part. Nevertheless, even if he played most of his games during pre season on the right, it means didly squat because he played against mostly substandard opposition in competitions that didn't mean a damn thing. Mata has proven that he is a more than okay option playing on the right in games that actually matter at the elite stage.
 
Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber said:
There in lies the crux of the problem. You have incorrectly assumed that Pereira being identified as a better natural option than Mata for a right winger role, means anyone wants him to play their currently ahead of Mata or that perhaps they think him the superior player. No one does. The whole point of highlighting it was to show United has ample room for him in the squad. Just like we do for Lingard.
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My mistake for inferring that you meant that Peirera should be playing over Mata. Nevertheless, I still believe that the opportunity will arise for him to play through the middle rather than outwide. I think that Pereira is a viable Pogba backup as the their playing styles are quite similiar. His playing time on the right is going to be quite small to be frank. Mata, Mkhi, and Lingard are higher on the pecking order.
 
I said this last week in another thread.

If Jose is going to play 2 in midfield against the smaller teams, barring an injury crisis, pereira isn't going to get very many minutes as a starter at all this season. Id prefer he was loaned out again than perpetually on our bench. He needs plenty of games to show he's as good as other talents his own age or he'll certainly get left behind. A season is long time in football these days! I think we could may well end up losing him if we loan him again (if he won't sign a new deal) a loan to a lower English club could make him look poor enough which could also end his time here. Valencia is also a pretty big risk as they have signed players and are in transition. he would be great cover but he needs way more games than he is going to get here. Maybe a sale with a buy back clause would be for the best. I doubt he's worth very much at this moment in time if we were to sell him. He needs patience and a platform to keep playing and getting experience, even if he's inconsistent.
 
Obiorahking_ said:
My mistake for inferring that you meant that Peirera should be playing over Mata. Nevertheless, I still believe that the opportunity will arise for him to play through the middle rather than outwide. I think that Pereira is a viable Pogba backup as the their playing styles are quite similiar. His playing time on the right is going to be quite small to be frank. Mata, Mkhi, and Lingard are higher on the pecking order.
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We are in agreement on that. For me we have room for him as a squad regular in center midfield. Because I'm not convinced players like Herrera, Carrick and Martial are going to be allowed to sit on the bench for too long a stretch. So ala Fletcher back in 2007/2008, I believe the likes of Pereira and Lingard will benefit in terms of game time from the extra quality numbers in the squad.
 
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Ramshock said:
If we are loaning this lad why isnt it to someone in england? Surely that makes better sense for us.
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By the look of it, Valencia inquired, and it's not us offering him for loan move. West Ham can inquire about Rashford & Martial, doesn't mean the players & our club keen on that.
 
Nick7 said:
Best part of that post is "but we've decided again to loan him" despite everyone saying Mourinho doesn't want to loan him. Top post.
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I've watched every Granada match, every pre season game of United and even his matches before. He has something that the others from United doesn't have and I think he's years ahead of Pogba when he was at that age. Just look at Real, Barca, Bayern. All those clubs are keeping their players that are like him and playing them from the bench or even starting them now and then. He has to get a chance this year, otherwise I can't understand the words by Jose told after pre season as he told he expects him to play and expects big things.
 
serxyo said:
I've watched every Granada match, every pre season game of United and even his matches before. He has something that the others from United doesn't have and I think he's years ahead of Pogba when he was at that age. Just look at Real, Barca, Bayern. All those clubs are keeping their players that are like him and playing them from the bench or even starting them now and then. He has to get a chance this year, otherwise I can't understand the words by Jose told after pre season as he told he expects him to play and expects big things.
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You quoted the wrong post.
 
Andreas is more than decent but hey, he can't improve if he's not playing. Going to Valencia is his best option for continuing his development.(and not to a team in the efing championship, you can't call that football these days)
 
According to me, given that this is his last year here, he cannot be loaned. He will get to play a few matches and Mourinho will have to make up his mind whether he wants him in his future plans based on these performances alone. He might even get more than few matches if Mourinho has something specific in mind. This year, Andreas will have to be with the first team and hope for some first team action. This has to be the year when we start integrating him with the first team, if we are interested in involving him in our future plans.
 
I want him to stay, but I want him to get game time too and if both these two boxes can't be ticked I'd prefer the latter.

If Jose sees him ahead of Carrick and mayybe Lingard, he will get some games. I hope he does, because Carrick is on his final legs and Lingard's level is unlikely to improve. So it's definitely worth trying Pereira ahead of them in my opinion and there's little risk he'll be worse than either and a good chance he'll be better.

If Jose sees him behind Carrick and Lingard then he will only get a handful of games in the cups and a handful of sub appearances in the league. Which I'm not sure is gonna help him much. He will be under a lot of pressure to impress too.
 
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Obiorahking_ said:
In 3607 minutes played on right in the league(roughly 40 full games), Mata he has been directly involved in 20 goals. Its nothing special but its decent. Mata has his limitations but we know what we are getting when we play him there: An intelligent midfielder who makes multiple intelligent runs and can pick out someone in the final third. What has Peirera got to show for himself?


This right here is troubling in multiple ways. Peirera didn't play anywhere on the right during pre season. He played almost all his games as CM/DM and did well for the most part. Nevertheless, even if he played most of his games during pre season on the right, it means didly squat because he played against mostly substandard opposition in competitions that didn't mean a damn thing. Mata has proven that he is a more than okay option playing on the right in games that actually matter at the elite stage.
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How is he going to prove his worth when he has not been given a chance? What has Mata shown in the 2 games he has played in this season? The team played much much better after he was taken off. That may be due to tired legs from the opposition, but the flow of the game was much better when he went off.

Anyway, I'm not here to argue with you on my point of opinion. You continue watching Mata, I'll keep hoping that Peirera is given a chance to contribute something to the team when he is on the pitch.
 
Dunno but one of our training pics in which he's high 5ing Mata seems like a "goodbye" to me. Or I'm just a lunatic.
 
serxyo said:
I've watched every Granada match, every pre season game of United and even his matches before. He has something that the others from United doesn't have and I think he's years ahead of Pogba when he was at that age. Just look at Real, Barca, Bayern. All those clubs are keeping their players that are like him and playing them from the bench or even starting them now and then. He has to get a chance this year, otherwise I can't understand the words by Jose told after pre season as he told he expects him to play and expects big things.
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Definitely agree with the bold part. We can't continue to buy 'proven' players and ignore our up & coming youth. With the market going as it is, it will just be too damn expensive to reload. Players like Pereira, TFM, and Axel need to be integrated into the first team or at least given a full-blooded chance to make it. I realize the competition at the top of the PL makes it very difficult to do so, but we need another way to replenish our team beside shelling pounds out.

I worry that Pereira will eventually take Pogba's route and not re-up, and then prove himself on another team. A loan won't help us keep him, unless we extend again (I believe someone noted we have an option thru 2019, but still). If he doesn't play enough this season, I wonder if we're just better off selling and inserting a buy-back clause. At least he'd get the PT to develop further, without having to worry about his future. He'll know he's going to stay with the team he's sold to instead of going to another loan and the uncertainties that come with it, while also knowing that if he does really well, he'll be back at OT.

I'm almost envious how Chelsea can continue to keep young talent on their payroll despite the constant loaning out, but then again, most really won't make it with their first team. Just seems that it would really be a shame to see Pereira not make it here.
 
serxyo said:
I've watched every Granada match, every pre season game of United and even his matches before. He has something that the others from United doesn't have and I think he's years ahead of Pogba when he was at that age. Just look at Real, Barca, Bayern. All those clubs are keeping their players that are like him and playing them from the bench or even starting them now and then. He has to get a chance this year, otherwise I can't understand the words by Jose told after pre season as he told he expects him to play and expects big things.
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Pereira is 21, 4 months short from being 22. Pogba was a star at Juventus when he was 20 and got transfered for a world record fee at 23.
 
Think he'll do a fine job in a 4-3-3 along Matic and Pogs in midfield. A big plus is his range of passing, he has some Scholsey in him, that's for sure. However, it's a harsh one for him and most prbbly will go on loan. Decent playing time will be hard to find this season for the youngsters, especially from the midfield up. In defense, it's alright, Jose will rotate, Axel will get games, maybe even Mitchell on the left in the cups, but from midfield up it's pretty harsh as we have more senior players there.

The kid has two options, go on loan to Valencia or stay and fight his @SS off for a spot in the first team but that might burn him out rather quickly. Personally, I think he's better off with a buyback or on loan for another year.
 
ghagua said:
What has Mata shown in the 2 games he has played in this season? The team played much much better after he was taken off. That may be due to tired legs from the opposition, but the flow of the game was much better when he went off.
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So we are basing Mata's effectiveness on the right on 1 game this early in the season? It good that you arn't here to argue your 'opinion.
 
Obiorahking_ said:
So we are basing Mata's effectiveness on the right on 1 game this early in the season? It good that you arn't here to argue your 'opinion.
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He played and produced nothing in 2 games, whereas Peirera has not been given a chance and you're writing him off. Like I said before, not here t argue with you. You enjoy watching Mata, I am hoping Peirera gets a chance ahead of Mata.
 
ghagua said:
He played and produced nothing in 2 games, whereas Peirera has not been given a chance and you're writing him off. Like I said before, not here t argue with you. You enjoy watching Mata, I am hoping Peirera gets a chance ahead of Mata.
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Ozil produced nothing in 2 games.. Should Arsenal fans stop playing him to give Iowbi a chance? hm?
Kevin De Bruyne produced nothing in 2 game.. Should Manchester City fans stop playing him and give Phil Foden a chance?
 
Obiorahking_ said:
Ozil produced nothing in 2 games.. Should Arsenal fans stop playing him to give Iowbi a chance? hm?
Kevin De Bruyne produced nothing in 2 game.. Should Manchester City fans stop playing him and give Phil Foden a chance?
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Difficult to compare, Ozil showed in the past that he's a very important player for Arsenal and KDB is one of City's key players. Mata has always been in and out of the team, so his status is certainly different
 
Sky1981 said:
Lingard too won't be the main star. If jose got perisic who you'd think he'd bench?

No offence to lingard, some position (striker, playmaker, winger) are very important more so than defender. You could get by with players like oshea covering the back line, darmian playing fullback, but for striker or attacking midfielder there aren't too much room for error. Over the years saf has given time for newbies on the wing but he didn't even trust pogba to play in midfield.
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Well quite, and now he's back and we're £90million down. Maybe it would be sensible to give Pereira a little go?
 
Obiorahking_ said:
Ozil produced nothing in 2 games.. Should Arsenal fans stop playing him to give Iowbi a chance? hm?
Kevin De Bruyne produced nothing in 2 game.. Should Manchester City fans stop playing him and give Phil Foden a chance?
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I said I do not want to argue with you. Is that too difficult for you to understand? You are not going to change my mind, I'm not trying to change yours either.
 
Also glad to know we also have a year option on him. I hope he starts our first EFL match and starts getting some sub appearances.
 
Sarni said:
Pereira is 21, 4 months short from being 22. Pogba was a star at Juventus when he was 20 and got transfered for a world record fee at 23.
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Exactly

Pogba at the same age was being lauded by Pirlo and Buffon for his fantastic performances for Juve. Pereira not even close to the Potential Pogba was showing at the same age.
 
Could see it happen if Mourinho got his winger till the end of the month, not before.
 
I'm a huge fan of Andreas Pereira... but he needs to learn from Mhiki. I think he's best as a no. 10 and anything else would be wasting a talent.
 
Escobar said:
Difficult to compare, Ozil showed in the past that he's a very important player for Arsenal and KDB is one of City's key players. Mata has always been in and out of the team, so his status is certainly different
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That's my point, but as previously stated Mata has proven to be a decent player for us on the right and two games to kick off the season shouldn't be a representation of that.
 
Remember when we used to give youth a chance and let them flourish?

Now we have a Pereira on our hands, who clearly has potential and has been out on loan previously. 1 year left on his contract with an option for another and the bulk of people here seem to want to let him go with a "buy back" option or another loan than having him around the squad.

I agree, we've started well and competition is hard for places. But losing Pereira without giving him a chance makes us idiots, complete idiots. We should expose him to some first team action, judge him then and give him cup games.

We've got Carrick and Fellaini in our midfield rotation, we could do with Pereira being an option as Carricks legs have gone and Fellaini's not exactly top drawer (although he will put a shift in)

Sending him on another loan at his age makes no sense to me, we'll be in the market next summer for a young midfield talent I'd suspect, instead of playing what we got already
 
Craig Ward said:
Remember when we used to give youth a chance and let them flourish?

Now we have a Pereira on our hands, who clearly has potential and has been out on loan previously. 1 year left on his contract with an option for another and the bulk of people here seem to want to let him go with a "buy back" option or another loan than having him around the squad.

I agree, we've started well and competition is hard for places. But losing Pereira without giving him a chance makes us idiots, complete idiots. We should expose him to some first team action, judge him then and give him cup games.

We've got Carrick and Fellaini in our midfield rotation, we could do with Pereira being an option as Carricks legs have gone and Fellaini's not exactly top drawer (although he will put a shift in)

Sending him on another loan at his age makes no sense to me, we'll be in the market next summer for a young midfield talent I'd suspect, instead of playing what we got already
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+1. I'd give him lingards games at the very least!
 
Craig Ward said:
Remember when we used to give youth a chance and let them flourish?

Now we have a Pereira on our hands, who clearly has potential and has been out on loan previously. 1 year left on his contract with an option for another and the bulk of people here seem to want to let him go with a "buy back" option or another loan than having him around the squad.

I agree, we've started well and competition is hard for places. But losing Pereira without giving him a chance makes us idiots, complete idiots. We should expose him to some first team action, judge him then and give him cup games.

We've got Carrick and Fellaini in our midfield rotation, we could do with Pereira being an option as Carricks legs have gone and Fellaini's not exactly top drawer (although he will put a shift in)

Sending him on another loan at his age makes no sense to me, we'll be in the market next summer for a young midfield talent I'd suspect, instead of playing what we got already
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We're three games into the season.
 
Obiorahking_ said:
That's my point, but as previously stated Mata has proven to be a decent player for us on the right and two games to kick off the season shouldn't be a representation of that.
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I dont think Pereira would be at his best in Mata's position. He needs to play somewhere in midfield and I hope Jose gives him plenty of minutes
 
What are the very latest rumours about him? Is he indeed going to Valencia on loan or staying put with us?
 
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