Ruben Amorim - Manchester United Head Coach

[FortunaUtd]

If we get a proper striker it could actually propel us into league contention next year. By proper I mean Osimhen or Gyokeres. Bottom line, we need a striker who can bag about 25 or more goals next season as that would take a lot of pressure off the other attackers to carry the water for our misfiring #9.

A proper striker will massively transform our chances of success, absolutely, but we also need another top creative player behind the striker. If Mount could be available that would help a lot too but we can't really expect that can we.

 

[Solius]

A proper striker will massively transform our chances of success, absolutely, but we also need another top creative player behind the striker. If Mount could be available that would help a lot too but we can't really expect that can we.

Don’t think we can rely on Mount for that even if fit. I do think we need another potentially elite creator even if they aren’t there yet. We say it about most positions but we are always one Bruno injury away from basically having zero chance creation.

 

[mav_9me]

But we were playing an 18 year old CB before Heaven started getting games.

I think he's done really well at blending the youth in.

Yoro? That doesn't count as he is a 50m signing who happens to be young.

 

[Marwood]

Yoro? That doesn't count as he is a 50m signing who happens to be young.

Yeah Yoro. He's still 18 years old whatever his fee.

Which other big clubs are signing and playing 18 year olds at CB. Never mind two of them.

 

[DJ_21]

He needs to make a big decision when Amad comes back. Play him right AM or RWB. Garnacho is improving on the right side further forward though. That side will be exciting if Amad moves back to RWB with Garnacho further forward. The left sides also improving with Dorgu and Zirkzee.

 

[romufc]

He needs to make a big decision when Amad comes back. Play him right AM or RWB. Garnacho is improving on the right side further forward though. That side will be exciting if Amad moves back to RWB with Garnacho further forward. The left sides also improving with Dorgu and Zirkzee.

I think this is his long term goal, having an attacking option at RWB. The issue is at the moment, the team isn't there yet for him to be able to do that.

For him to implement that full time, the 10's need to know their job and have to be very good athletes. Then our CM's need to be very good athletes too as they need to cover.

Its not as simple as just play Amad RWB because then you need a mobile fast RCB, not De Ligt or Maguire.

In his final form, Amad will probably be a RWB.

 

[Cassidy]

I think this is his long term goal, having an attacking option at RWB. The issue is at the moment, the team isn't there yet for him to be able to do that.

For him to implement that full time, the 10's need to know their job and have to be very good athletes. Then our CM's need to be very good athletes too as they need to cover.

Its not as simple as just play Amad RWB because then you need a mobile fast RCB, not De Ligt or Maguire.

In his final form, Amad will probably be a RWB.

Should play Yoro RCB or Maz

 

[dubplate warrior]

A proper striker will massively transform our chances of success, absolutely, but we also need another top creative player behind the striker. If Mount could be available that would help a lot too but we can't really expect that can we.

We need to correct the midfield with a progressive passer and a player who can keep things ticking over.

 

[DJ_21]

Took him 2 years to completely transform sporting. Id say we’re a bigger mess though although sporting hadn’t won the league for a lot longer than we haven’t. A proper ST that can hit 20-25 goals a season would turn us into a top 4 team. We need the AMs to be creative, technical and someone who can also chip in with goals aswell as another CM and then we come closer to the title.

 

[DJ_21]

We need to correct the midfield with a progressive passer and a player who can keep things ticking over.

Which 2 for? Ugarte is the defensive type of midfielder we’re using. If we sign another CM then will Bruno be put into one of the AMs? I don’t see Bruno as a AM in this system as you need to be technical and able to drift out wide if needed. I really like that goncalves from sporting.

 

[romufc]

Which 2 for? Ugarte is the defensive type of midfielder we’re using. If we sign another CM then will Bruno be put into one of the AMs? I don’t see Bruno as a AM in this system as you need to be technical and able to drift out wide if needed. I really like that goncalves from sporting.

This is the thing, I dont think Amorim sees him as a AM either, his game doesn't suit it.

Bruno is better at CM because his deep runs are not tracked and can start attacks from deeper.

 

[dubplate warrior]

Which 2 for? Ugarte is the defensive type of midfielder we’re using. If we sign another CM then will Bruno be put into one of the AMs? I don’t see Bruno as a AM in this system as you need to be technical and able to drift out wide if needed. I really like that goncalves from sporting.

I think Ugarte isn't the guy when playing weaker teams, he's not good enough on the ball. I think what Casemiro has shown in the last few games has highlighted how much we're missing progressive passing from the middle.

I still think we are way too chaotic in possession.

 

[mav_9me]

Yeah Yoro. He's still 18 years old whatever his fee.

Which other big clubs are signing and playing 18 year olds at CB. Never mind two of them.

You have a valid point. But at the same time it's easier to trust him cuz he is just that good. Also I think he would have played a lot for Madrid too.

In any case, we can agree giving Heaven game time is not the same as Yoro. Hopefully he can continue to integrate more youngsters

 

[NLunited]

I think Ugarte isn't the guy when playing weaker teams, he's not good enough on the ball. I think what Casemiro has shown in the last few games has highlighted how much we're missing progressive passing from the middle.

I still think we are way too chaotic in possession.

You bring up an interesting point.

Ugarte isn‘t the guy to put people through one on one, but he can link up the play well. Progressive passing can also come from cb’s stepping up (Martinez excels at this).

As for weaker teams? There aren‘t any, Ugarte‘s defensive work is always needed unless we are playing Barnley.

Chaos: a bit of chaos is ok. I envisage more controlled performances in general, but we can unleash the chaos when the game or opponent call for it. It is not one thing or the other.

For that kind of control and decision making to materialize, the players need to be better drilled. As long as they are misplacing passes over 6 yards because they aren‘t doing the basics right, we will not see control.

If we can keep the ball and evade the press easily, we will have control and can prevent the other team from getting a foothold. It won‘t happen unless we tidy up our passing and decision making.

 

[dubplate warrior]

You bring up an interesting point.

Ugarte isn‘t the guy to put people through one on one, but he can link up the play well. Progressive passing can also come from cb’s stepping up (Martinez excels at this).

As for weaker teams? There aren‘t any, Ugarte‘s defensive work is always needed unless we are playing Barnley.

Chaos: a bit of chaos is ok. I envisage more controlled performances in general, but we can unleash the chaos when the game or opponent call for it. It is not one thing or the other.

For that kind of control and decision making to materialize, the players need to be better drilled. As long as they are misplacing passes over 6 yards because they aren‘t doing the basics right, we will not see control.

If we can keep the ball and evade the press easily, we will have control and can prevent the other team from getting a foothold. It won‘t happen unless we tidy up our passing and decision making.

We're not going to become better in possession without better players on the ball.

Martinez is also a weak link who I'd like to see slowly phased out and allowed to leave. He's simply a liability defending wide areas.

It cannot just be defenders progressing the ball, your midfielders also need to be able to pick up the ball and play line breaking passes.

Ugarte is a runner, but you'll never play vertical, liquid football with him in the team. He's great when we're playing a team who we will struggle to control the game against, but there's no use for him if we're playing someone like Southampton.

 

[Red00012]

We sound very RAWKish: beating a woeful Sociedad and then soon to be relegated Leicester, and people are saying the revolution is here. I think we would have been hard pressed to lose either of those, such were the state of our opposition.

We will be brought back down to earth soon enough.

Our next 4 fixtures are
Forest away
City home
Lyon away
Wolves home

I think the international break came at a bad time

 

[Juri M]

We're not going to become better in possession without better players on the ball.

Martinez is also a weak link who I'd like to see slowly phased out and allowed to leave. He's simply a liability defending wide areas.

It cannot just be defenders progressing the ball, your midfielders also need to be able to pick up the ball and play line breaking passes.

Ugarte is a runner, but you'll never play vertical, liquid football with him in the team. He's great when we're playing a team who we will struggle to control the game against, but there's no use for him if we're playing someone like Southampton.

Because we have been lacking Left footed Center Backs or those Center Backs who just feel comfortable being on the left, he is used there mostly, but he is a really good passer and can step into midfield, so he should be used more in the Center role within the back 3. So more agile and faster Center backs can play out wide, like Yoro and Heaven?

 

[NLunited]

We're not going to become better in possession without better players on the ball.

Martinez is also a weak link who I'd like to see slowly phased out and allowed to leave. He's simply a liability defending wide areas.

It cannot just be defenders progressing the ball, your midfielders also need to be able to pick up the ball and play line breaking passes.

Ugarte is a runner, but you'll never play vertical, liquid football with him in the team. He's great when we're playing a team who we will struggle to control the game against, but there's no use for him if we're playing someone like Southampton.

Not every player needs to be De Bruijne good in passing progressively, so I disagree. Ugarte has high ball retention.

These types of players are underrated, like Marten De Roon at Atalanta.

 

[dubplate warrior]

Not every player needs to be De Bruijne good in passing progressively, so I disagree. Ugarte has high ball retention.

These types of players are underrated, like Marten De Roon at Atalanta.

But we don't have a midfielder who can pass progressively. Ball retention doesn't mean anything if its just side to side.

 

[romufc]

But we don't have a midfielder who can pass progressively. Ball retention doesn't mean anything if its just side to side.

Its interesting that the people who moan about Bruno's ball retention will also be moaning about Sancho's lack of threat.... You can't criticise both... its either you want a player to play backwards sideways and have 90% ball retention or you actually understand that playing forward = risk means ball retention will be 80% but the team will create chances.

 

[DJ_21]

I think Ugarte isn't the guy when playing weaker teams, he's not good enough on the ball. I think what Casemiro has shown in the last few games has highlighted how much we're missing progressive passing from the middle.

I still think we are way too chaotic in possession.

Casemiro is part of the reason we’re chaotic in possession. Yes he does great passes throughout the game but he also miss places or gives away possession a lot with his first time passes.

 

[always_hoping]

Last time Man United won consecutive games by a three goal margin?

 

[tomaldinho1]

Last time Man United won consecutive games by a three goal margin?

Earlier this season with ETH surely? That barnsley 7-0 game and the soton game

 

[romufc]

Casemiro is part of the reason we’re chaotic in possession. Yes he does great passes throughout the game but he also miss places or gives away possession a lot with his first time passes.

We need to stop the Casemiro revisionism everytime he has a okay to good game.

There is no way we can play games with Casemiro and Bruno in midfield, they both commit too early.

Casemiro should be used how he is, a backup option to Ugarte.

 

[JediSith]

I completely agree with you. I posted this response to Cathy Ferguson on February 13th:


"Patterns of play. Positioning. Moving without having to think first. Pressing as units. CBs stepping into voids. etc etc. A lot of what RA wants us to do is slowly starting to happen. The problem is two-fold, in my opinion. First, our players are lacking in decision making, physicality, and playing at fast tempo. Second, our players lack the tenacity and determination required to recycle possession regularly in the current era of premier league football."

Likewise. Below wasn’t to anyone in particular, although there have been some post I’ve replied that people questioning what I saw in Amorim. Similar to your post below.

In 2 months I’ve seen more progress under Amorim than I did under 7 months of Moyes, 2 seasons of LVG, 2 of Jose, 3 of Ole, and 2 of ETH.

I’m genuinely looking forward to that this guy will do with a preseason (hopefully) £150m plus whatever we get from sales.

 

[DJ_21]

We need to stop the Casemiro revisionism everytime he has a okay to good game.

There is no way we can play games with Casemiro and Bruno in midfield, they both commit too early.

Casemiro should be used how he is, a backup option to Ugarte.

Ye exactly. I’m with you. That’s what I meant by he’s part of the reason we give up possession.

 

[Galactic]

Our next 4 fixtures are
Forest away
City home
Lyon away
Wolves home

I think the international break came at a bad time

We had international breaks coming at “perfect” time so many times before.

 

[romufc]

We had international breaks coming at “perfect” time so many times before.

We clearly needed this international break though. You could see our players are struggling. The amount of injuries, minutes in certain players, there was only so many minutes they can all play.

Luckily, alot of our players are not on international duty, the likes of Garnacho, Zirkzee, Mount, Yoro, Mainoo, Casemiro, Maguire and others I am not sure if they got the call up or not.

This gives rest / recovery for injured returning players.

 

[dubplate warrior]

Casemiro is part of the reason we’re chaotic in possession. Yes he does great passes throughout the game but he also miss places or gives away possession a lot with his first time passes.

So we need an upgrade on him then, him being inconsistent doesn't change the fact that we need someone whose willing to pass forward and break lines. @romufc calling it revisionism is missing the point, we need a midfielder to progress play.

Its interesting that the people who moan about Bruno's ball retention will also be moaning about Sancho's lack of threat.... You can't criticise both... its either you want a player to play backwards sideways and have 90% ball retention or you actually understand that playing forward = risk means ball retention will be 80% but the team will create chances.

That's a really poor comparison. One is an inside forward who was meant to be one of Europe's most productive players, one plays in midfield and whilst he is a match winner in his day, can cause major issues with us trying to keep the ball.

Different positions need to offer different things in order for it to be a functioning..... team?

 

[Wing Attack Plan R]

Our next 4 fixtures are
Forest away
City home
Lyon away
Wolves home

I think the international break came at a bad time

Bookmark this thread and check back after we lose 3 in a row and draw with Wolves.

 

[Solius]

Bookmark this thread and check back after we lose 3 in a row and draw with Wolves.

Every time I see you post these days it's very negative. About all subjects.

 

[Wing Attack Plan R]

Every time I see you post these days it's very negative. About all subjects.

Point taken.

 

[tomaldinho1]

Bookmark this thread and check back after we lose 3 in a row and draw with Wolves.

A point you say!
Reckon we'll win in Europa, not sure about the others

 

[romufc]

So we need an upgrade on him then, him being inconsistent doesn't change the fact that we need someone whose willing to pass forward and break lines. @romufc calling it revisionism is missing the point, we need a midfielder to progress play.

That's a really poor comparison. One is an inside forward who was meant to be one of Europe's most productive players, one plays in midfield and whilst he is a match winner in his day, can cause major issues with us trying to keep the ball.

Different positions need to offer different things in order for it to be a functioning..... team?

I am not missing the point, I know what we need in our team but Bruno as Amorim has mentioned can progress play. Don’t get me wrong, I see the logic in this. Having someone like Casemiro is crucial, we saw this against Arsenal where he played those first time balls over the top, we need someone who can do that.

How is it a poor comparison, like you said one is an inside forward and one is a CAM. An Attacking midfielder who is there to create. Let me ask you, what do you expect from a central attacking midfielder? Ball retention or creative play?
Funnily enough, you have also mentioned that you want the 6 to progress play, so you must understand you cannot expect a player to progress play and have 90% ball retention…

 

[dubplate warrior]

I am not missing the point, I know what we need in our team but Bruno as Amorim has mentioned can progress play. Don’t get me wrong, I see the logic in this. Having someone like Casemiro is crucial, we saw this against Arsenal where he played those first time balls over the top, we need someone who can do that.

How is it a poor comparison, like you said one is an inside forward and one is a CAM. An Attacking midfielder who is there to create. Let me ask you, what do you expect from a central attacking midfielder? Ball retention or creative play?
Funnily enough, you have also mentioned that you want the 6 to progress play, so you must understand you cannot expect a player to progress play and have 90% ball retention…

Bruno is not playing as an CAM in this system though, he did initially and was very quickly found out because he struggles to dribble and play on the half turn.

If Manchester United want to return to the glory days and dominate teams then we need to control games in the middle of the park. That means controlling the ball, playing through the press and progressing play, whether it be from the first or second phase of play. It's a tricky scenario because as much as I criticise him we really do depend on Bruno and he's our most important player, however I still believe that our midfield needs to be revamped, and that this may not include Bruno in the medium term.

 

[romufc]

Bruno is not playing as an CAM in this system though, he did initially and was very quickly found out because he struggles to dribble and play on the half turn.

If Manchester United want to return to the glory days and dominate teams then we need to control games in the middle of the park. That means controlling the ball, playing through the press and progressing play, whether it be from the first or second phase of play. It's a tricky scenario because as much as I criticise him we really do depend on Bruno and he's our most important player, however I still believe that our midfield needs to be revamped, and that this may not include Bruno in the medium term.

Okay, so you think Bruno cannot keep the ball in the middle of the park but in the last 2 games, Arsenal and Leicester his passing accuracy has been 85% and 86% whilst creating chances.

We play a midfield 2, so you saying may/may not include Bruno, why dont you stop being on the fence and say how you feel that you dont want Bruno in the team.

 

[Zumbi]

I am not missing the point, I know what we need in our team but Bruno as Amorim has mentioned can progress play. Don’t get me wrong, I see the logic in this. Having someone like Casemiro is crucial, we saw this against Arsenal where he played those first time balls over the top, we need someone who can do that.

How is it a poor comparison, like you said one is an inside forward and one is a CAM. An Attacking midfielder who is there to create. Let me ask you, what do you expect from a central attacking midfielder? Ball retention or creative play?
Funnily enough, you have also mentioned that you want the 6 to progress play, so you must understand you cannot expect a player to progress play and have 90% ball retention…

I don’t think this is as black and white as you make out - there’s a really large middle ground between the two. Intelligent players with excellent passing ability can have high ball retention and progress play because they know when to keep it simple and keep things ticking over, and when to pick a riskier pass. Carrick and Scholes were both stand out examples of that. And that’s what we’ve been missing for a long time. Of course, players like that are hard to find.

 

[dubplate warrior]

Okay, so you think Bruno cannot keep the ball in the middle of the park but in the last 2 games, Arsenal and Leicester his passing accuracy has been 85% and 86% whilst creating chances.

We play a midfield 2, so you saying may/may not include Bruno, why dont you stop being on the fence and say how you feel that you dont want Bruno in the team.

Not really sitting on the fence, I think it's a tricky situation. The team needs a better midfield, but our most productive player is Bruno. However in the long run there are deficiencies to Bruno's game that shouldn't be ignored, especially given what we need a our midfield to do.

We need a player in the mould Carrick, desperately and we also need someone who can run with the ball and play forward. I don't see Bruno being able to do either of those things.

Now as for the bolded part, cherry picking stats is no way to make a case, it's also completely missing the point. Passing forward is not just about creativity. We need someone to know when to keep things ticking over, play it short, play the right pass, spread play etc. We also need someone who can run with the ball, beat a man and play quickly into our forwards. None of our midfielders can do this. I get the feeling you want to make this a debate about Bruno specifically for whatever reason, whereas I think this is an issue about our midfield and the team.

 

[romufc]

I don’t think this is as black and white as you make out - there’s a really large middle ground between the two. Intelligent players with excellent passing ability can have high ball retention and progress play because they know when to keep it simple and keep things ticking over, and when to pick a riskier pass. Carrick and Scholes were both stand out examples of that. And that’s what we’ve been missing for a long time. Of course, players like that are hard to find.

Whilst its not black and white, comparing players from 15 years ago to now, is also not really fair.

Teams play completely differently now, where they press alot more.

 

[dubplate warrior]

Whilst its not black and white, comparing players from 15 years ago to now, is also not really fair.

Teams play completely differently now, where they press alot more.

Exactly, so you now need to an even greater extent players who are press resistant and play the right pass. These kind of players still exist and one of them just won the ballon 'dor