Israel - Palestine Discussion | Post Respectfully | Discuss more, tweet less

berbatrick said:
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What a fecking monster you have to be to make "funny" videos of something like this when innocent children are literally starving to death.

Beyond me how anyone can defend the Israeli and the shit they are doing...
 
Pintu said:
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Sir Alex has a famous quote on this: Typical Germans.

I appreciate the reckoning by some Germans, but they don’t know how to be on the right side of things. It’s okay to support Israel, but they should have a red line, just like Biden should too.
 
ManUtd1999 said:
It means a country of 10 million people is mocking the world, including the United States of America!

This is not the first video showing that. There was another video of another Israeli soldier the other day mocking the U.S.

Ungrateful people!
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I gathered that much, was just wondering what the implication was.


2mufc0 said:
Mimicking flour preparation, some places they sift before using get rid of larger clumps or other debris.

There's nothing genuine about these videos other than psychological torture of their victims and a middle finger to the UN in this instance.
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Thanks. Making light of starvation, can’t say I’m surprised.
 
They've retrieved 70 decomposed bodies so far in Jabalia, the same happened in other places after the IOF withdrew.

That's for anyone wondering about one of the reasons why so many of the murdered Palestinians remain unidentified.
 
Biden: some in the Israeli government don’t want the war to end. Releasing the hostages is not a priority for them.
 
"The conditions are no longer ripe for welcoming Israeli companies to the French show, at a time when the French president [Emmanuel Macron] is calling for an end to Israeli operations in Rafah," an official from the French armed forces ministry told POLITICO in a statement.
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VorZakone said:
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Hamas should probably accept this if it’s sincere, but it’s useless in the long run without a clear political vision for the future and a strong commitment to a clear plan to get there.
 
2cents said:
Hamas should probably accept this if it’s sincere, but it’s useless in the long run without a clear political vision for the future and a strong commitment to a clear plan to get there.
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I think the sticking point is that Hamas want a permanent removal of Israeli troops from Gaza and the Israelis are still committed to completely dismantling Hamas in Gaza. If neither side are willing to compromise, then a deal is going to remain unlikely.
 
Raoul said:
I think the sticking point is that Hamas want a permanent removal of Israeli troops from Gaza and the Israelis are still committed to completely dismantling Hamas in Gaza. If neither side are willing to compromise, then a deal is going to remain unlikely.
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Didn’t Biden just say they’ve inflicted enough defeat on Hamas?

Back in October you guys were saying this would take 3 to 6 months… I remeber some posters saying it will be done by Chrismats.

The real objective doesn’t seem to be related to Hamas at all. It looks to me Netanyahu needs to achieve a much more important goal that he announced earlier. A substantial ethnic cleansing of at least Northern Gaza. Reducing the population of the North significantly is the only way he can say he won the war.

And I still believe Netanyahu would only allow a sustained truce in Gaza if he gets an American green light to invade Lebanon, only a full scale war in Lebanon (even at a much higher cost to the IDF, given HA is considered much stronger than the besieged Hamas) can guarantee him permanent state of war and keep the elections away until his pollings are good again.
 
Pintu said:
Didn’t Biden just say they’ve inflicted enough defeat on Hamas?

Back in October you guys were saying this would take 3 to 6 months… I remeber some posters saying it will be done by Chrismats.

The real objective doesn’t seem to be related to Hamas at all. It looks to me Netanyahu needs to achieve a much more important goal that he announced earlier. A substantial ethnic cleansing of at least Northern Gaza. Reducing the population of the North significantly is the only way he can say he won the war.

And I still believe Netanyahu would only allow a sustained truce in Gaza if he gets an American green light to invade Lebanon, only a full scale war in Lebanon (even at a much higher cost to the IDF, given HA is considered much stronger than the besieged Hamas) can guarantee him permanent state of war and keep the elections away until his pollings are good again.
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I'm sure Biden has, but ultimately its up to the Israelis to decide, which itself is tied to domestic considerations related to Netanyahu wanting to remain in power and other issues.
 
Raoul said:
I'm sure Biden has, but ultimately its up to the Israelis to decide, which itself is tied to domestic considerations related to Netanyahu wanting to remain in power and other issues.
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Biden should make the decision to end the war, not Netanyahu. He has the power to do it. Whatever the extremists in the Israeli government want shouldn’t dictate world affairs.

Also, Hamas should accept this deal. Enough with the attacks on Israel, and enough with the death in Gaza. The two sides should go ahead with this deal.
 
Does this deal include a pathway to Palestinian statehood? If not, why not?

This deal is short term but will save lives. Long term it does not help Palestinians
 
ManUtd1999 said:
Biden should make the decision to end the war, not Netanyahu. He has the power to do it. Whatever the extremists in the Israeli government want shouldn’t dictate world affairs.

Also, Hamas should accept this deal. Enough with the attacks on Israel, and enough with the death in Gaza. The two sides should go ahead with this deal.
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He doesn't have the power to do it because of substate American politics and his own reelection, just as Netanyahu would struggle to do it because of substate Israeli politics where his coalition would fall apart and he would again be legally exposed to the various charges he was up against pre-October 7th, not to mention the intelligence failure of Oct 7th itself. This latest 3 point plan by Biden seems like him trying to assuage domestic concerns he's not doing anything, while at the same time putting the ball in Netanyahu's court to act. Will he act ? Highly unlikely given that anything short of the removal of Hamas from Gaza would be framed domestically, as a loss among Israelis.
 
Raoul said:
He doesn't have the power to do it because of substate American politics and his own reelection, just as Netanyahu would struggle to do it because of substate Israeli politics where his coalition would fall apart and he would again be legally exposed to the various charges he was up against pre-October 7th, not to mention the intelligence failure of Oct 7th itself. This latest 3 point plan by Biden seems like him trying to assuage domestic concerns he's not doing anything, while at the same time putting the ball in Netanyahu's court to act. Will he act ? Highly unlikely given that anything short of the removal of Hamas from Gaza would be framed domestically, as a loss.
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He has the power, he just chooses not to use it for the reason that you highlight here (and possibly other reasons). But, he can say to Israel ENOUGH. And in my view, he should. He gave Israel enough time to get Hamas, but the result is more and more deaths.

A U.S. president, particularly a Democrat, shouldn’t care about the political calculus of an Israeli prime minister.
 
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ManUtd1999 said:
He has the power, he just chooses not to use it for the reason that you highlight here (and possibly other reasons). But, he can say to Israel ENOUGH. And in my view, he should. He gave Israel enough time to get Hamas, but the result is more and more deaths.
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He's politically constrained, which means he doesn't have the power since all American politicians are first and foremost driven by political self-preservation.
 
Raoul said:
He's politically constrained, which means he doesn't have the power since all American politicians are first and foremost driven by political self-preservation.
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Political self reservation doesn’t mean you don’t have the power.
 
He would not post qll that without israel being on board. Seems that the madness finally will end

Biden will be able to recover some voters. Israel will spin it as a job done and is somewhat what US wants

And the most important, deaths will stop
 
Frosty said:
Then the US is absolutely fecked.
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Do you have any information I don't?

VorZakone said:
Why wouldn't Biden let it happen?
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It seems to me to be absurd and completely out of place to officially invite a pariah with an ICC warrant hanging above his head amidst the domestic protests and the international outcry, whilst the US are completely isolated on the international scene on this matter. It's like doubling down on failure and give it domestic legitimacy.

I personally see it as a political suicide, on both domestic and international level. There's a limit on how much daftness one is allowed. No single western country would dare to pull this kind of move at the moment.
 
Why would Palestinian side, whoever represents them, accept anything that doesn't lead to their state?

Any sort of ceasfire not leading to the Palestinian state means the end of Palestine as the idea.
 
That_Bloke said:
Do you have any information I don't?


It seems to me to be absurd and completely out of place to officially invite a pariah with an ICC warrant hanging above his head amidst the domestic protests and the international outcry, whilst the US are completely isolated on the international scene on this matter. It's like doubling down on failure and give it domestic legitimacy.

I personally see it as a political suicide, on both domestic and international level. There's a limit on how much daftness one is allowed. No single western country would dare to pull this kind of move at the moment.
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Why would these Congressional leaders invite him though?
 
That_Bloke said:
Do you have any information I don't?


It seems to me to be absurd and completely out of place to officially invite a pariah with an ICC warrant hanging above his head amidst the domestic protests and the international outcry, whilst the US are completely isolated on the international scene on this matter. It's like doubling down on failure and give it domestic legitimacy.

I personally see it as a political suicide, on both domestic and international level. There's a limit on how much daftness one is allowed. No single western country would dare to pull this kind of move at the moment.
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No information, no. I just don't have your positivity. Considering the US is not a party to the ICC, and it is an election year... I think Biden will use it as a photo-op.
 
Bosnian_fan said:
Why would Palestinian side, whoever represents them, accept anything that doesn't lead to their state?

Any sort of ceasfire not leading to the Palestinian state means the end of Palestine as the idea.
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If Israel continues its current offensive, there will be no Palestine… and no Palestinians in Gaza. This round of war should stop. We can figure out the rest later.
 
ManUtd1999 said:
If Israel continues its current offensive, there will be no Palestine… and no Palestinians in Gaza. This round of war should stop. We can figure out the rest later.
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That is happening since the beginning of this thing. And it will keep happening in the future. Palestine state will not be possible if Israel goes back into the international fold as a reliable partner, without showing clear willingness to recognize and accept the existance of Palestinian state.
 
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