Yohan Cabaye

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Who would you say are the better options that United have a realistic chance of signing then?

10 years ago, it was fine, we were the big club and could do what we liked now there are so many more options for players. There are so many more enticing options for players whether that be in terms of money or leagues etc. Now you have City and Chelsea big money and a good chance of success. Real Madrid and Barca (nothing really needs to be said does it). Bayern Munich and to an extent Dortmund now are big players in the market. Then you have the money pouring into PSG and Monaco etc. Italy has also started to get back on the map and is on the up compared to a few years where the game went to shit in Italy.

Then you have United have had a massive change both on and off the pitch. A lot of people will have their doubts on our success in the coming years. For these European players, it pains me to say it but I think a lot of them see other clubs as a more exciting challenge and prospect than United.

Now I am not saying that is true or that we shouldn't target the very best in the world, of course not, that has to be the aim for Manchester United, I just think if you were looking from the outside in, I think there are far more enticing options for the best players than a United team in transition.
 
Eric'sCollar said:
Who would you say are the better options that United have a realistic chance of signing then?

10 years ago, it was fine, we were the big club and could do what we liked now there are so many more options for players. There are so many more enticing options for players whether that be in terms of money or leagues etc. Now you have City and Chelsea big money and a good chance of success. Real Madrid and Barca (nothing really needs to be said does it). Bayern Munich and to an extent Dortmund now are big players in the market. Then you have the money pouring into PSG and Monaco etc.

The you have United have had a massive change both on and off the pitch. A lot of people will have their doubts on our success in the coming years. For these European players, it pains me to say it but I think a lot of them see other clubs as a more exciting challenge than United.

Now I am not saying that is true or that we shouldn't target the very best in the world, of course not, that has to be the aim for Manchester United, I just think if you were looking from the outside in, I think there are far more enticing options than a United in transition.
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Who knows who's realistic? I wouldn't have thought RvP was a realistic target a few months before we were linked with him. There should certainly be better players than Cabaye available to us though, or at least players with more potential. After all, we've managed to bring in top class players in every other position, haven't we?

I'm not saying that we're necessarily the most enticing option in the world, in fact what you're saying strengthens my actual point. We have no divine right to attract quality players or to remain a top club. We have to be willing to try competing with other top clubs financially if we want to compete with them on the pitch. As it is even clubs like Arsenal and Tottenham (both of whom we're bigger and more attractive than) are buying players for fees approaching or above our record fee. How can we expect to challenge the likes of Real, Bayern and Barca if we're allowing smaller clubs to catch up with us?

Just to be clear, I'm not saying we should spend money just for the sake of it. If we can get a quality player for cheap then great and if Cabaye is that player then that's fantastic. All I'm saying is that there's a big difference in ambition between "Cabaye is what we want and he's cheap too so let's sign him" and "we want better players than Cabaye but he's cheap so let's get him". If, at the point we're at now, we're still not willing to show that ambition then we really are in trouble.
 
Point taken. Although, my point regarding that I would welcome Cabaye had nothing to do with him being a bargain, it was to bring in quality. Ok, he isn't in the top bracket of midfielders but that doesn't mean he wouldn't fit the United midfield.

I think the ambition is there, ok it didn't go to plan this window. We have had so many good transfer windows in the past, we shouldn't be happy with what went on this summer but at the end of the day we do have to take the good with the bad.As you said, just last season we went and signed the best striker in the league.

Regarding your point on Arsenal and Spurs catching up to us in the transfer market, Arsenal I can accept but I don't think we can accurately judge where Tottenham are at in terms of spending for players, if it wasn't for Bale, they wouldn't have spent, so lets see if they go and spend again next season like they just did. I highly doubt they will.
 
What 'worries' me (and I use that word loosely) is that I've seen nothing linking us to him, just fan discussion. I think he'd be the ideal January addition.
 
It's true that the Bale deal inflated their spending power this year but I suspect that quite a few teams have spent more than us quite regularly over the last few years. Liverpool jump to mind, for one. They really shouldn't have more spending power than we do, and it's not like we couldn't do with the strengthening. Don't forget, we had our own equivalent of the Bale transfer yet refused to use it. Whatever happened to that Ronaldo money?

Wanting Cabaye is fine, we shouldn't too concerned about the transfer fee though. We certainly shouldn't let the way we got burned by the Fellaini deal stop us from spending big money on a better player if one is available.
 
It's not about him being cheap (we don't even know that he will be). I couldn't give a shit tbh. He would be a good addition full stop. Regardless of price.
 
LR7 said:
What 'worries' me (and I use that word loosely) is that I've seen nothing linking us to him, just fan discussion. I think he'd be the ideal January addition.
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I think we are all old enough to look past who is linked with who. It means nothing, sure it would be nice to hear something concrete regarding certain transfers but just because there is no news doesn't mean something isn't cooking in the background.

I know you said you use the word loosely so it's not aimed at you but yeh, to all the muppets out there, don't worry.
 
Eric'sCollar said:
I think we are all old enough to look past who is linked with who. It means nothing, sure it would be nice to hear something concrete regarding certain transfers but just because there is no news doesn't mean something isn't cooking in the background.

I know you said you use the word loosely so it's not aimed at you but yeh, to all the muppets out there, don't worry.
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Well the fact of the matter is we tend to be linked in some way to our targets. Especially going from the way we conducted ourselves in the summer just gone. There are usually murmurings but obviously links don't confirm or exclude anything.
 
sullydnl said:
It's true that the Bale deal inflated their spending power this year but I suspect that quite a few teams have spent more than us quite regularly over the last few years. Liverpool jump to mind, for one. They really shouldn't have more spending power than we do, and it's not like we couldn't do with the strengthening. Don't forget, we had our own equivalent of the Bale transfer yet refused to use it. Whatever happened to that Ronaldo money?

Wanting Cabaye is fine, we shouldn't too concerned about the transfer fee though. We certainly shouldn't let the way we got burned by the Fellaini deal stop us from spending big money on a better player if one is available.
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While Liverpool have spent more than us, they don't spend well compared to us. Just because they spend more than us doesn't mean they get better players.

In terms of the Ronaldo money. There are other areas of the clubs besides the transfer kitty. The Ronaldo deal would have been sprinkled over a few areas I would imagine.

I agree that we have to look past the Fellaini deal and approach each deal on it's own. In saying that, we can't forget the fact that we did spend a big amount already this season on one player.
 
Bestie07 said:
Us signing him will be like Arsenal signing Arteta.
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Pretty much. Extremely underwhelming but would do an ok job for awhile. We should really be aiming so much higher than Cabaye though. He is on a good run of form but he really is terribly average.
 
Robbie Boy said:
He is on a good run of form but he really is terribly average.
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I'm not saying he is a top class midfielder but I think 'terribly average' is very harsh. He is quality footballer and would be a good addition especially when we are probably going to lose one or two midfielders at the end of the season.
 
Eric'sCollar said:
I'm not saying he is a top class midfielder but I think 'terribly average' is very harsh. He is quality footballer and would be a good addition especially when we are probably going to lose one or two midfielders at the end of the season.
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It really isn't harsh at all. The sudden overrating of Cabaye on here is indicative of our desperate situation in midfield. And anyway, it's almost like some people believe that we will actually get him relatively cheap. Arsenal were the ones that bid for him, not us, and they were knocked back as their bid was too low. So (1) what's to say we are even interested? and (2) he would cost a fair whack, probably north of £15m. No thanks.
 
"Sudden overrating"

letranger0 said:
The Cabaye transfer is still unconfirmed as far as I can tell, but if it is true then it's an amazing coup by Newcastle and my hat is off to whoever does the transfers over there, though I cannot understand why Cabaye would want to go there when he could do so much better. He would fit in quite nicely into our midfield, for example.
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Dozens of people since then have said they'd like us to make a move for him before this season. Many of them are the ones saying we should sign him in this thread right now. Just because you don't agree with it doesn't mean it's some ill-informed, knee-jerk opinion.

I reckon it's just as likely that you are now underrating Cabaye because of an underwhelming last season. You, like everyone else, found him impressive in his first season here but because of that dip in form last season you decided he was "terribly overrated". That's a little strange given his form in his first season was a continuation of his form at Lille for the past 4/5 seasons whereas his form last season was quite clearly a blip rather than the norm. Now he's back to being in that same form he was in prior to last season, yet somehow you have spun that into 'he's suddenly overrated because he's in [unusually] good form.'
 
Robbie Boy said:
It really isn't harsh at all. The sudden overrating of Cabaye on here is indicative of our desperate situation in midfield. And anyway, it's almost like some people believe that we will actually get him relatively cheap. Arsenal were the ones that bid for him, not us, and they were knocked back as their bid was too low. So (1) what's to say we are even interested? and (2) he would cost a fair whack, probably north of £15m. No thanks.
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To answer number 1) I am not saying we are interested, I'm talking about the player possibly being a good fit for United. It's all hypothetical. and 2) I have said that the cost is an issue and I wouldn't want the club spending that on Cabaye in January.

I don't think it's overrating, he is a good footballer. We get used to seeing these Barca, Bayern and Dortmund etc players on the TV each week and quickly get tunnel vision when it comes to rating and appreciating players. It's either world class or a poor player for a lot of people. The guy plays for France, has done well for Newcastle in the Premier League, did well for Lille both in France and in Europe. So for me, he isn't a terribly average footballer. He is a bloody good one. Ok, he isn't 'world class' but not a lot of players are. Some of our greats were never world class, that never made me think anything less of them as a footballer.
 
Eric'sCollar said:
Did you miss the part where I said I would worry about the price?

It's what doesn't make it straight forward, I don't know what type of fee he would go for, so I said I don't know if it is realistic, in January, I can't see us spending over 15m on a player and after the Fellaini signing, that's probably right.
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No the price is irrelevant to a large degree, if Fellaini proved to be a vital cog in us retaining the title them the fee is repaid, with Fellaini that just won't happen you must suspect,
The actual quality of the player is more vital to us at this given time, in the case of Baines, if Everton want £20m then we should probably pay despite him not being worth it because we are desperately short over in LB. Cabaye would no doubt be expensive and is about as much use as anything we currently have, Moyes said it and he's right, we need World class talent at the club and Cabaye isn't that.
 
So we should just have a piss-poor midfield until a world-class midfielder comes along? What then? We bid £10m below the asking price, then increase the bid by increments of 50p until the window shuts?

You're seriously deluded if you think Cabaye is no better than Cleverley/Anderson/Fellaini.
 
Goooose said:
So we should just have a piss-poor midfield until a world-class midfielder comes along? What then? We bid £10m below the asking price, then increase the bid by increments of 50p until the window shuts?

You're seriously deluded if you think Cabaye is no better than Cleverley/Anderson/Fellaini.
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This is exactly what people are failing to understand, I'm not sure why.
 
gasmanc said:
No the price is irrelevant to a large degree, if Fellaini proved to be a vital cog in us retaining the title them the fee is repaid, with Fellaini that just won't happen you must suspect,
The actual quality of the player is more vital to us at this given time, in the case of Baines, if Everton want £20m then we should probably pay despite him not being worth it because we are desperately short over in LB. Cabaye would no doubt be expensive and is about as much use as anything we currently have, Moyes said it and he's right, we need World class talent at the club and Cabaye isn't that.
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You can only value the amount of money at the time of handing the cheque over. At the end of the season or contract, yes you can look back and say if it has been repaid or not but at the time of the signing, you have to do what feels right at the time.

Can you please tell me how Cabaye would be less useful then lets say Ryan Giggs. Now I am a big fan of Giggs and was one of the few defenders of him at the start of the season and glad he has done well but useful is not just about now, it's about preparing for such things as players leaving like Giggs, most likely Anderson and possibly Fletcher. So in the next two seasons we could possibly lose 3 central midfielders, plus have an older Carrick in an already thin midfield.

I agree that we need to look at top quality, no doubt but we also have to consider options. Was Michael Carrick a world class signing when we picked him up? was Vidic? etc. I'm not saying Cabaye is a must signing, I was against it at the start of the season but I am coming around to the idea and think that it could prove a good signing given our current situation.

We need to get rid of the idea, we need to bring in world class quality and kick every other player to the curb, it's not realistic, it's not Manchester United. It's about finding the right players for the team.
 
Eric'sCollar said:
You can only value the amount of money at the time of handing the cheque over. At the end of the season or contract, yes you can look back and say if it has been repaid or not but at the time of the signing, you have to do what feels right at the time.

Can you please tell me how Cabaye would be less useful then lets say Ryan Giggs. Now I am a big fan of Giggs and was one of the few defenders of him at the start of the season and glad he has done well but useful is not just about now, it's about preparing for such things as players leaving like Giggs, most likely Anderson and possibly Fletcher. So in the next two seasons we could possibly lose 3 central midfielders, plus have an older Carrick in an already thin midfield.

I agree that we need to look at top quality, no doubt but we also have to consider options. Was Michael Carrick a world class signing when we picked him up? was Vidic? etc. I'm not saying Cabaye is a must signing, I was against it at the start of the season but I am coming around to the idea and think that it could prove a good signing given our current situation.

We need to get rid of the idea, we need to bring in world class quality and kick every other player to the curb, it's not realistic, it's not Manchester United. It's about finding the right players for the team.
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Your a sensible poster mate more so than me at least but when your talking about replacing the likes of Giggs with Yohan Cabaye I do wonder if the earlier season threads about us lowering expectations actually have some substance. We need to look at bringing in quality like Giggs was not an equal to what he is now with a younger engine. That said I do feel that Giggs still ha more to offer today, his experience is invaluable and his engines still great, it just can't be used as often, he has more quality in that left foot than most players will ever posses.
Occasionally we will stumble upon a diamond like Vidic it's the law of averages but as for Carrick I remember we paid a lot if money for him 16m back then I think.
United has built itself on giving youth a chance but also big name signings to bolster what we bring through and the occasional surprise packages ie Hernadez etc, what we need right now is quality in midfield, we have been waiting too long to replace Scholesy and now Giggsy and the diamond hasn't unearthed itself. It's a matter of urgency and clubs and agents know it so we either settle on the Cabayes and watch Europes elite and even domestic clubs drift upwards and away from us or we make at least one epic midfield signing.
 
Goooose said:
There's not going to be one epic midfield signing though.
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Exactly. Cabaye is possibly the best midfielder from outside the top clubs in the league. He would improve us. He plays in a midfield 2 already, and will slot right in to our system. It's almost too obvious a move.
 
Goooose said:
There's not going to be one epic midfield signing though.
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There really needs to be and just as a point in case we are replacing Paul Scholes here not Cleverley nor Anderson, those two have so far failed to get close to the level we need.
All this said I would happily stand by the signing of Cabaye should we get him in and wouldn't argue against him being better than either of the afore mentioned, all I am saying is he is a level below what a top top club requires,
 
Discussions like this are so bloody pointless...

Cleverley has not progressed as we had hoped and he offers us very, very little!

Fellani will not time to adjust but the early signs are not good.

Fletcher is goosed.

Jones (who I'm aware is not considered a midfielder) is dynamite imo

Carrick is our best midfielder and the reason we won the league last year.

Giggs, while still class, can not go on forever.

Anderson has not done it.

Why must the need for a new CM be discussed from every possible angle? We need more than one midfielder and this lad is better than most of what we have got. This improves us and with such, he would be a very good signing. Its not fecking rocket science.
 
gasmanc said:
There really needs to be and just as a point in case we are replacing Paul Scholes here not Cleverley nor Anderson, those two have so far failed to get close to the level we need.
All this said I would happily stand by the signing of Cabaye should we get him in and wouldn't argue against him being better than either of the afore mentioned, all I am saying is he is a level below what a top top club requires,
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Who do we sign so? Who is actually available that would be considered the exceptional level? In your opinion of course
 
Goooose post: 14593986 said:
Of course we need a world class midfielder, but we should still buy others in the meantime.
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Whether or not It is regarded as fact, young continental footballers will see your Madrids, Barca, Munichs, Chelsea and Citys as a much more desirable location than us right now.

Bayern have Pep.
Real have the wow factor for them.
Barca are Barca.
Chelsea have Jose.
City have a plan (*Cough - money and a star studded squad! )

You can even look at PSG and Monaco. Warm climate and buckets of cash.

United, at this moment in time, have history and a new manager. We are positively in need of a squad overhaul and sitting in transition. We ignored Ozil for some bizarre reason and have let the likes of Dembele and Modric go before.

We are firnly to blame for the scenario we face right now and anybody who questions that...I dunno
 
Eric'sCollar said:
You can only value the amount of money at the time of handing the cheque over. At the end of the season or contract, yes you can look back and say if it has been repaid or not but at the time of the signing, you have to do what feels right at the time.

Can you please tell me how Cabaye would be less useful then lets say Ryan Giggs. Now I am a big fan of Giggs and was one of the few defenders of him at the start of the season and glad he has done well but useful is not just about now, it's about preparing for such things as players leaving like Giggs, most likely Anderson and possibly Fletcher. So in the next two seasons we could possibly lose 3 central midfielders, plus have an older Carrick in an already thin midfield.

I agree that we need to look at top quality, no doubt but we also have to consider options. Was Michael Carrick a world class signing when we picked him up? was Vidic? etc. I'm not saying Cabaye is a must signing, I was against it at the start of the season but I am coming around to the idea and think that it could prove a good signing given our current situation.

We need to get rid of the idea, we need to bring in world class quality and kick every other player to the curb, it's not realistic, it's not Manchester United. It's about finding the right players for the team.
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Good post. I like how you looked ahead and thought of the fact that players like Giggs, Carrick, Anderson and Fletcher aren't exactly going to be in the squad or at the top level in the near future. It's really about picking the right player for the team and having him embed himself as Utd player. There's no doubt in my mind that a player of Cabaye's quality will be useful for Utd. It's not about buying the Fabregas or Ozil type players all the time, it's about making a player feel like he can be a huge part of a team and a system going forward.
 
Gaeilge said:
Whether or not It is regarded as fact, young continental footballers will see your Madrids, Barca, Munichs, Chelsea and Citys as a much more desirable location than us right now.

Bayern have Pep.
Real have the wow factor for them.
Barca are Barca.
Chelsea have Jose.
City have a plan (*Cough - money and a star studded squad! )

You can even look at PSG and Monaco. Warm climate and buckets of cash.

United, at this moment in time, have history and a new manager. We are positively in need of a squad overhaul and sitting in transition. We ignored Ozil for some bizarre reason and have let the likes of Dembele and Modric go before.

We are firnly to blame for the scenario we face right now and anybody who questions that...I dunno
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It's all in cycles. With the arrival of the money teams in the league and Europe, it was always going to be hard for clubs like Utd to eventually compete for top players and as a result take longer to transition themselves. You were very fortunate to have a great manager (and motivator) in Fergie but going forward, it was always going to be difficult for Moyes to manage this transition period.
 
Gaeilge said:
Who do we sign so? Who is actually available that would be considered the exceptional level? In your opinion of course
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Available is a financially based subject with regards to top footballers, they're all "available".
That Kroos feller looks decent, my perfect fit is actually Fabregas but that's more based on his time in England than anything else,
 
Kroos would be mad to leave Bayern, and Fabregas has made it clear that he has no desire to play for United.

Don't mean to piss on your chips, but I think you need to lower your standards a bit.
 
Close the what would it take to make united the best team in the World thread. It's over.

Huge players go to lesser standing clubs for the right money, that's just a fact. It's won City and Chelsea league titles, put PSG back on the map but United signing World class talent no no feck that well have Cabaye instead.
Looks like I will have to start lowering standards and expectations in the future.
 
What do you want? I'm not in charge of transfers. It's blatantly obvious that United are not willing to shell out the kind of money needed to buy these superstar players. So yeah, get used to it.
 
gasmanc said:
Close the what would it take to make united the best team in the World thread. It's over.

Huge players go to lesser standing clubs for the right money, that's just a fact. It's won City and Chelsea league titles, put PSG back on the map but United signing World class talent no no feck that well have Cabaye instead.
Looks like I will have to start lowering standards and expectations in the future.
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Yup, because all of our success has come with the world's best players in every position. Dortmund also only signed the world's best players last season. Arsenal have a very good midfield, with two of the best players in the world in Arteta and Flamini playing important roles.

On the other side of things you have the likes of Madrid and City, where signing the world's best players has won them little compared to their expenditure. Signing world class players in no guarantee of anything.
 
gasmanc said:
Close the what would it take to make united the best team in the World thread. It's over.

Huge players go to lesser standing clubs for the right money, that's just a fact. It's won City and Chelsea league titles, put PSG back on the map but United signing World class talent no no feck that well have Cabaye instead.
Looks like I will have to start lowering standards and expectations in the future.
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Well you can't blame the posters. Mention a name like Kroos and you get laughed at. Sometimes i wonder of I've entered an Aston Villa forum.
 
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