Whataboutism at its finest and one of the dumbest ones. Think Pep has shown enough so far to be shown a bit more patience no?
Would you sack or keep Ole? (Poll reopened)
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Whataboutism at its finest and one of the dumbest ones. Think Pep has shown enough so far to be shown a bit more patience no?
You literally said it's part of the manager's job to this:
"I expect Greenwood and Rashford to be in contention of BdO in a few years, but I can't expect Solskjaer to make them perform as if these are mature players, especially Mason, whose decision making is a bit off. "
And my counter was how is it manager's job to make a 19 year old with maturity of a 27 year old?
You may not like it, but this side is still very young, still growing and there are going to be bumps along the way before we make it big
The problem with saying today was a point gained is that for me personally, City are the club most likely to drop out of the top 4 after Mourinho gets Spuds back there.
We're essentially competing with them for 4th and so I wouldn't have accepted this performance against Leicester last season, so why should I accept it against a mediocre City side?
We're essentially competing with them for 4th and so I wouldn't have accepted this performance against Leicester last season, so why should I accept it against a mediocre City side?
This.
You had teams that wanted the win. Not a City team that didn't risk a thing themselves. We can't take away any glory from that today
LVG got 4th in his first season with 70 points, more than Ole's 66 points last season as well.
Semi finals mean absolutely nothing. Honestly I found mentioning those semis much more embarrassing than even talking about 3rd. Since when reaching semi final of league cup or Fa Cup anything worthy to be mentioned ? No one even remembers who was in the semi final of such competitions from several years ago. I can't even remember most teams who reached Champions League semi finals of the previous decade.
The truth is the result in itself isn't bad but there are concerns on whether the approach and the performance are really reflective of a team and a manager on its way to contending for titles. The CL campaign flop validated concerns on whether it actually makes sense to continue sweeping questionable showings under the rug. Before that everyone just sort of acted like we could turn it up whenever we needed to. Some of us also want to win the league before Jose can show us up
Some proper counters we played there in the second half...
What does that all mean? We won feck all after reaching the semi's and got dumped out of the Champions League at the first time of asking meaning third place last season meant feck all. We may as well have finished 7th. Winning an actual trophy is what should matter.
You are wrong. Im not a VG fan but surely winning a trophy is better than being in 3 semis we bottled and finishing 3rd only to bottle a group we should have qualified from after 2 games. Are we improving now? We were the back end of last season for a few games. We have stalled from that form. Where is the form of Greenwood Rashford Martial and Bruno gone?
And so you are my friend
I think its got feck all to do with him thinking of future fixtures by the way. It's got feck all to do with the midweek result too. We were within ourselves against Tottenham (at home), Chelsea (at home) and Arsenal (at home) before today's game. None of those games had anything to do with our European results, or next sets of fixtures. If anything you'd expect us to take the game to Chelsea after PSG or take the game to Arsenal after 5-0 to Leipzig. But it never happened. Because the issue is bigger than just building confidence from a bad exit in Europe.
For me, I don't believe taking Pogba out for VDB or McTominay out for VDB would actually have been a huge risk resulting in us losing the game. But it could have potentially won us the game, as VDB picks up clever pockets and can give the team added energy. If Ole doesn't want to take a minor risk like that, then it's a problem. It's a derby and not just a generic game where you look forward to the next set of fixtures. If you're going to act like this away from home at Ethiad then its more palatable - but at OT? It's a problem. If it's the 4th shit game at OT then it's an even bigger problem. In the return legs at Stamford Bridge, Ethiad, White Hart Lane and Emirates, what will we say? We should be cautious because we're away - right? Well that's not going to set us up for big points either.
Basically the manager not shit, the player aren't shit, we should be winning all these matches no matter what, it's so easy.
City are f##king trunks
Some people cant be for real, please be bunch of trolls
Certainly feels that way, hard to believe people are actually satisfied with where we are and our place in one of the most wide open league seasons and title races since Leicester won it all.
We beat a much better City side twice home and away just last season yet we're supposed to be happy with a non-threatening draw now against Peps weakest City team yet?
It means nothing I agree but it show progress don't you think? And reaching semi in 3 comps mean more to me than winning a fa cup. I guess I have different expectations about what progress means. Maybe I'm wrong. Also points tally is a moot point. If we reach 3rd in a weaker league and 4th when fecking Leicester won the league is that justified? I'm not Ole in all the time elmel and sometimes the reasons given by you lot make a lot of sense but sometimes its just reactionary hyperboles. Anyway today I expected us to win and that's saying something against arguably one of the best PL Sides of all times (according to the same bunch who are claiming we should have battered them)
The moaning is justified by performances like this and Leipzig.Is it not the same thing?
Perhaps its Ole Carrick Phelan and McKenna defending themselves
As I said performance today attacking wise was poor and there is no other way about it. But I am not going to say this was a bad point. Whether Ole has that thinking of getting a point from this and getting 6 from the next 2 is a guess. But if it is like that then it's not a bad way of doing things. As I already chelsea are pretty mich doing the same.
As for home/away well so far without fans home games have been more challenging so I am not going too read too much into home away. I for one thing find it strange that we have played against the top sides home and will have to travel when fans will be allowed. Bit of a bad luck if anything.
We reached 4 cup finals in 5 and half years before Ole was hired and won 3 of them. Progressing in cup competitions have never been a problem for us post SAF really. It's the lack of any solid title challenge in the Premier League is what has been crap since Fergie retired.
We are in a title challenging position in december. All good for now. Why would anyone want Ole out?
So if we end 12th and win the league cup you are happy ? We were never going to win the C.L - it was all about the money and being more attractive in the transfer market (a chance we failed to take by not getting Sancho). But with your reasoning, you should be happy - we are far more likely to win Europa League
Bottling three semi finals means more to you than actually winning a trophy?
Until Solskjær actually wins something he hasn’t achieved anything greater that LVG or Mourinho.
Appointing Ole on a full time contract has to go down as one of the stupidest decisions in recent club memory.
But trophies don't happen in silo. It's the trajectory that matters surely?
The same form which had these 3 being one of the most productive in Europe? Also please don't talk about Bruno. He can be shite for a day considering what he's done for us.
Maybe brother. Maybe I am.
What does that have to do with anything I said?
Ultimately a draw against City is good. But the outers have an easy thing to moan about because that performance, particularly second half, justifies that moaning.
Ole bringing about his own downfall, irrelevant to a good result or not due to tactics and performances.
This is the problem - people are caught up solely by looking at results when judging the manager. Ole is meant to be a long term manager who is responsible for building the squad and team and the way we play.
I would have been happy with a point before the game kicked off. My gripe is how it played out, how passive we were as the game progressed and how Ole didn't make a change that can point to him trying to pip it in the last 20 minutes. Heck, even Jose did this for us.
If you solely look at results you can even vindicate Jose for United, but truth is you need to look at more and the way City couldn't be fecked and still had us chasing shadows from 70mins to 90mins shows that there is concern for Ole in these games at home.
This is false. At home to Liverpool, Lampard set Chelsea out to match Klopp blow for blow and both teams looked equally threatening until the red card.
one positive way to look at the current period (and not really what i think but no more ridiculous than some of the ultra negative narratives)
Ole has lifted the teams floor
We have had spells where we have been excellent under ole, sometimes months at a time, this isn't one of them
We have had spells where we have been very poor under ole - this is one of them, judging on performances - but we seem to have an ability to get results even when playing very poorly this season. We haven't got a result every game that we have been bad, but our performances are very similar to the first half of last season but we are several points better off. If we can find a pocket of confidence and form for the second half of the season as we have done in the previous two seasons we might place well
Ole has lifted the teams floor
We have had spells where we have been excellent under ole, sometimes months at a time, this isn't one of them
We have had spells where we have been very poor under ole - this is one of them, judging on performances - but we seem to have an ability to get results even when playing very poorly this season. We haven't got a result every game that we have been bad, but our performances are very similar to the first half of last season but we are several points better off. If we can find a pocket of confidence and form for the second half of the season as we have done in the previous two seasons we might place well
No I meant It shows more about where the team is going than finishing outside the top 4 and winning an inconsequential cup.
Lampard hardly did anything against us or Liverpool or spurs. We will just agree to disagree. Having watched the chelsea spurs game I can tell both teams played for draw which both managers even after the game confirmed that both teams didn't want to take any risk. This is not the first 0-0 you have seen and neither it will be the last.
As for Ole well I already said today's performance wasn't great and my post is not defending him but for me 0-0 is not the end of the world. I am more interested in seeing us get 6 points from the next 2 games. If not I will be frustrated.
We won the "Scored most points after Liverpool since June" trophy.
It's over
Mental times mate,
4 wins and a draw against 2nd best side in league regardless of league positions is seem as manager sacked times
How come we are still in 8th place still and we were 3rd at the end of the season?
Never knew 8th position is title challenging.
I made it clear that the approach we have against big teams at home is not consistent with others. Your Chelsea examples were during empty stadiums too, so I'm not buying it being worse for us and better for others.
Lampard faced Liverpool at home and had them exchange blow for blow until the red card. They were not set out to play cautious. I suggest you rewatch the game up to the red card if you're not familiar, Fabinho saved a couple of Werner's breaking runs through to the Liverpool defence. Of course that stupidity from Christensen ruined the game.
Lampard faced Spurs with the lions share of possession (61%) and probably would have won had Abraham put away any one of the sitters that Reece James had placed on his head.
We played City today and created nothing outside a couple headers from a corner, and didn't even dictate the game, we had around 47% possession.
It's clear that other teams do not adopt the same cautious approach. Even Arteta who is the most cautious of all managers went at Spurs to attack them and most the game took place in Spurs' own half.
They may have settled for a draw but Chelsea created far more than we did today, and Chelsea also had dominated possession.
Yeah I don't have an issue with this - that's my view before a ball was kicked today. I'd have taken a point. But the way this game panned out, it's just poor as a performance.
If you followed my posts here you'll see I'm not counting good or bad results under Ole but I'm counting good or bad performances from us under him. In his 2nd full season at the club I expect more consistent performances. That's why I was pissed when we won 3-2 vs Brighton and happy at half time when we were 2-0 down to Southampton. And today, although we got a result I'd have taken before kick off, the problem is, our performance was lacking. There are chronic issues with our attack in the lack of familiar attacking patterns, the wastefulness of our strikers and the lack of press from the team. Look at how DCL, Richarldson, and Iwobi are hunting down Chelsea from the goalkeeper's short pass every single time. I havent' seen us do that once this season. It's the performances that are a concern today, not just how many results we muster.
Neville was right today in saying we are with the title pack but it feels off because the performances are a problem and you can't skim through games like that all too often. Ole needs to build on good performances not just good results, and he's not doing it. I praised him from Istanbul, praised him at HT at Southampton (because I just knew we'd win the game the way we played), and praised him against PSG even when we lost. But my count lasted at 3 before he plummeted against at West Ham. That shit isn't good enough. You can't be this inconsistent. He's terribly lucky that Chelsea and Arsenal took punts on novice managers too, as it helps his cause. But a club like Manchester United who have been in abyss for 8 years need to take less risks and get someone proven if this inconsistency continues.
27 games played?
Aston Villa in 10th spot are also 6 points only away from the top. I guess you can also say they're now in a title challenge ?
Ignoring the fact that we were 2 points off the league leaders if we won the game in hand? Agenda much?
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