With Jose still in charge - I am NOT looking forward to next season

[Water Melon]

The fecker is still in charge and is toxic as ever. You can lose to Pool but there is no need to go into 30%-like thoughts. It is like saying "more than 70% of my today's squad are crap". It serves no purpose. We are not winning anything big with him. Kissing goodbye to the league before Christmas and finishing 2nd is achievement, while Klopp is a bottler for losing a CL final while beating City along the way. I am ready to bet that Jose will not reach a CL final with us, nor challenge for the title properly yet again.

 

[K2K]

Moyes was SAF's chosen one. LVG was the godfather of football the man who tutored the likes of Pep and Mou. Mou's track record in the EPL is undisputed

I am not saying that they didn't committed their share of mistakes but there's a pattern here. The club failed to bring Moyes the top players he needed, LVG ended up signing a horde of sub standard players with the occasional big name (ADM) and we seem to have issues in buying decent talent now. I am now wondering if the value strategy was really a SAF thing after all. I mean who would settle for the likes of Young, Valencia and a knackered Micheal Owen unless he cant really bring anyone better?

The managers aren't exactly blameless but tbh we are a club with an incoherent strategy with seemingly little forward planning.

Going from a Moyes to an LVG then to a Mourinho shows that. Completely different managers

 

[ash_86]

He's effectively forced Woodward into a corner trying to sell on the 4th most expensive player the club has ever signed & whose best years are quite obviously still ahead of him in Martial. A sale of this magnitude will not and should not happen quickly and without careful thought and also requires a replacement signing given how short the club are in attacking players.

Martial even now has a perfectly good contract offer from United. He could literally sign this instant and commit himself to the club and Jose couldn't do a thing. If he's not signing , what options does the club have when hew will be in the last year of the contract and will go for peanuts?

 

[devilish]

Erm, he's asked for and received a £30m defender each of the last two seasons, now he wants a third who could cost £60-70m before he's even played the first two together for more than two games. He could've partnered them the entire run-in last season, but for his bizarre excuse that he wasn't playing a fit Eric Bailly because he wasn't going to the World Cup. Beyond that he's got Smalling, Jones, and Rojo -- all of whom he's seemed to select as first choice for extended periods during his time in charge.

He's signed Mkhitaryan for £30m and dumped him in 18 months.

He's signed Pogba for £89m and constantly slates him in the press and has him wanting out (if rumors are to be believed).

He's effectively forced Woodward into a corner trying to sell on the 4th most expensive player the club has ever signed & whose best years are quite obviously still ahead of him in Martial. A sale of this magnitude will not and should not happen quickly and without careful thought and also requires a replacement signing given how short the club are in attacking players.

My overall point is that he's given Woodward and the board cause to question his decision making in the transfer market and also added significant amounts of work that must be done before other signings can be made. He's made the bed and now he doesn't want to lie in it. That said, our new scattergun approach to transfers where we negotiate with multiple players at a time and then pull out of whichever deal seems to be dragging the most (as with Morata/Lukaku this year & seemingly Alderweireld/Maguire this year) is an embarrassment.

As said Mou has his shares of mistakes. However, lets face it, things hasn't been managed correctly for a long long time. For example which big club would rather squeeze the last drop of talent from 36 year olds rather then add some fresh top quality talent? Which big club would replace the likes of Giggs, Scholes and Ronaldo with Young, Valencia and Cleverley? Which club keeps the likes of Anderson for 8 years and Shaw for 3 years?Scholes himself once said that something is wrong in a club when their best CMs are 36 year old+ and he's hardly Mou's no 1 fan.

We are slow to act, we spend ridiculous amount of money (both in terms of fees and salaries) on tripe and maybe we do so because we struggle to get the real stuff. Moyes complained about that. LVG only got 1 top player (ADM). FFS we're thinking of spending 70m+ on a glorified Steve Bruce. How crazy is that? Also why the feck we've got such an match intensive preseason just after the WC? Who organise these sort of preseasons? Does he understand football?

SAF got on with it because he knew the EPL inside out but you can't expect everyone to be SAF.

 

[Hamadovich86]

Mourinho wont deliver attractive football at United, that brilliant Real Madrid team of his was a one of and relied on the brilliance of his forwards rather than his own. For me, his brand of defensive football is outdated and it can no longer win trophies in today's game especially in the PL.

So if he cant bring trophies whats the point of keeping Mourinho?

 

[devilish]

The managers aren't exactly blameless but tbh we are a club with an incoherent strategy with seemingly little forward planning.

Going from a Moyes to an LVG then to a Mourinho shows that. Completely different managers

I agree on your first sentence. The only consistent pattern is how the club tend to be all over the place in terms of transfers. We struggle to attract the top talent we need, we overspend on tripe (fees and/or salaries) which then lead in our inability of getting rid off it when reality hits home. The only way we seem able to get a player is to ridiculously overspend. Which explain why we have a disappointing transfer market window when we don't

 

[Edea]

Mourinho wont deliver attractive football at United, that brilliant Real Madrid team of his was a one of and relied on the brilliance of his forwards rather than his own. For me, his brand of defensive football is outdated and it can no longer win trophies in today's game especially in the PL.

So if he cant bring trophies whats the point of keeping Mourinho?

I agree with you.

For the fans, United identity is always likable.
And Jose in football, for me, is persona non grata.

 

[tclark2323]

Hard to say for sure, but if the pattern holds, players have reached their limit with him and no longer listen.

In his last stint at Chelsea, the decline actually began in the midst of their title-winning season. The football after January was mostly a tumescent parade of 1-0 wins with major lockdown at the back after scoring a goal.

The following preseason tour in the U.S. was horrible, with players out of shape, etc. We lost to the NY Redbulls u-21s. Then the 3rd Mourinho season started with a dumpster fire of results, the abuse of the head physio, and I think you probably know the rest.

“Palpable discord,” the club said after sacking him.

In a normal league, without Pep’s City, last season was your season for hardware. This is the Mourinho meltdown season when everyone else is to blame.

He’s not been the same man since leaving Madrid. I don’t hate him and don’t mind practical football. But I do believe the world is leaving him behind - mostly in his inability to relate to young people. His was a world of blood and mud warriors like John Terry. Not so much Eden Hazard and Paul Pogba.

Good luck to you in the Red half of Manchester and all other points on the interwebs.

 

[iKeano]

He's a spent force and is totally toxic. He's never looked happy at Utd and surely that filters through to the players who constantly get thrown under José's bus.
He alienates the fans & players regularly. The writing is on the wall, he won't see out this season thankfully. Just hope he doesn't do the squad more damage than good before he leaves.
Cannot stand the man.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

I agree on your first sentence. The only consistent pattern is how the club tend to be all over the place in terms of transfers. We struggle to attract the top talent we need, we overspend on tripe (fees and/or salaries) which then lead in our inability of getting rid off it when reality hits home. The only way we seem able to get a player is to ridiculously overspend. Which explain why we have a disappointing transfer market window when we don't

Indeed. We seem particularly poor at both finding players on the cusp of making it big, and lifting the performance levels of whoever we do sign. It's one continuous loop of unintelligent expensive buys followed by a struggle to get the most of them.

 

[RedCoffee]

Mourinhos pre season attitude is abysmal. We’ve got no chance of success with such negativity and a poor start to the season is now inevitable. There’s nothing to look forward to knowing that our first 11 are still on holiday with 10 days to go.

 

[DomesticTadpole]

Mourinhos pre season attitude is abysmal. We’ve got no chance of success with such negativity and a poor start to the season is now inevitable. There’s nothing to look forward to knowing that our first 11 are still on holiday with 10 days to go.

That is the problem I am starting to have as well. Most teams are short of players, but he has moaned from day one. You just have to get on with it. What effect must all this moaning be having on the confidence of the players he has taken?

 

[Nikelesh Reddy]

That is the problem I am starting to have as well. Most teams are short of players, but he has moaned from day one. You just have to get on with it. What effect must all this moaning be having on the confidence of the players he has taken?

Agree with this,his attitude has been poor and it’s hard to see any logical reason how such a negative,grumpy demeanour can have any kind of a positive impact on the squad.But pre-season results mean nothing,the first 3 games of the league season will set the tempo for the season.If we manage to grind out 7-9 points in the first 3 games,then we”ll be fine....But if we get off to a poor start,then things could get toxic pretty soon.Our first 3-5 Premierleague are huge this season...

 

[DomesticTadpole]

Agree with this,his attitude has been poor and it’s hard to see any logical reason how such a negative,grumpy demeanour can have any kind of a positive impact on the squad.But pre-season results mean nothing,the first 3 games of the league season will set the tempo for the season.If we manage to grind out 7-9 points in the first 3 games,then we”ll be fine....But if we get off to a poor start,then things could get toxic pretty soon.Our first 3-5 Premierleague are huge this season...

He is moaning about the transfers not coming in, when the players he likely wants would still not be with the squad as the likes of Maguire/Perisic were in the World Cup.

 

[kouroux]

Mourinhos pre season attitude is abysmal. We’ve got no chance of success with such negativity and a poor start to the season is now inevitable. There’s nothing to look forward to knowing that our first 11 are still on holiday with 10 days to go.

His first interview set the tone. Completely full of negativity indeed. The main reason I don't watch his interview but rather read them.

 

[vanderpants]

i wonder how the players are feeling, i wonder if all the moaning and bitching gets back to them

 

[kouroux]

i wonder how the players are feeling, i wonder if all the moaning and bitching gets back to them

Of course it does. We're talking about players who have all public social media accounts. Everything gets back to them somehow, someway

 

[Nikelesh Reddy]

He is moaning about the transfers not coming in, when the players he likely wants would still not be with the squad as the likes of Maguire/Perisic were in the World Cup.

If Woodward has made it clear that he needs to get rid of some players before he can sign the players that he wants,then he’s probably justified in being angry.United should be able to sign 4 first team players every summer...

 

[The United]

Mourinho wont deliver attractive football at United, that brilliant Real Madrid team of his was a one of and relied on the brilliance of his forwards rather than his own. For me, his brand of defensive football is outdated and it can no longer win trophies in today's game especially in the PL.

So if he cant bring trophies whats the point of keeping Mourinho?

Was it exactly that brilliant? Since I didn't and can't imagine many of united fans watched all Real Madrid games in that season. I mean they got possible 2nd GOAT player and Ozil at their peaks. Maybe some Real fans could tell us.

Also, most of that league champions around those years scored more than 100s and some did 110s. I am not saying it was shit. It is just that some people kept bringing that season out to defend his style which is like abnormal for him or hope for something that has a very slim chance to happen for us.

 

[ijc]

I dont buy this "players still on holiday" talk. Every big team including City have had their top players missing or have just returned but their team performanced have been much better.

Good managers make the most of what they have. It's like Mourinho doesnt care about this pre season because he doesnt have Matic and Lukaku with him. He's sounding so negative and he's killing any life and motivation every player and fan would have for the new season.

Unfortunately, I am not enthusiastic for this upcoming season and predict a very long and hard season if he stays in charge, which is highly unlikely.

 

[DomesticTadpole]

If Woodward has made it clear that he needs to get rid of some players before he can sign the players that he wants,then he’s probably justified in being angry.United should be able to sign 4 first team players every summer...

Can't they do both things at once? Darmian is desperate to go, he just hasn't settled. If it is Rojo, there must surely be someone who will take him. We have usually just gone out and got who we wanted and sold players when needed. Not sure they have ever said we need to sell first. Should I be worried about that?

 

[Judas]

I suppose behind the scenes he must be saying differently to the players, otherwise how the feck do we go into the season with any feeling that we can actually achieve anything? It's bonkers.

As much as the Woody memes are funny, and he can pull off the odd very expensive worldie, not sure he's in the right position at the club.

 

[Random Task]

Mourinhos pre season attitude is abysmal. We’ve got no chance of success with such negativity and a poor start to the season is now inevitable. There’s nothing to look forward to knowing that our first 11 are still on holiday with 10 days to go.

But we'll avoid relegation right?

 

[The United]

If Woodward has made it clear that he needs to get rid of some players before he can sign the players that he wants,then he’s probably justified in being angry.United should be able to sign 4 first team players every summer...

There is something called wage structure and any responsible owners should watch it for long term. Also, didn't Jose say he likes to work with small size of squad anyway?

 

[DomesticTadpole]

Was it exactly that brilliant? Since I don't or can't imagine many of us watched all Real Madrid games in that season. I mean they got possible 2nd GOAT player and Ozil at their peaks. Maybe some Real fans could tell us.

Also, most of that league champions around those years scored more than 100s and some did 110s. I am not saying it was shit. It is just that some people kept bringing that season out to defend his style which is like abnormal for him or hope for something that has a very slim chance to happen for us.

That is what Jose relies on, someone who can produce a moment of absolute genius. Ronaldo is his own man and does what he likes. Our players I suspect need encouraging and that is the last thing he appears to be doing. We now have to hope Sanchez is his genius. Pogba could be, but instead of making him feel great and building him up after being in a World Cup winning side, he has put the blame on Pogba entirely for his United performances. It is never Jose that just might be even a little bit culpable.

 

[The United]

I suppose behind he scenes he must be saying differently to the players, otherwise how the feck do we go into the season with any feeling that we can actually achieve anything? It's bonkers.

As much as the Woody memes are funny, and he can pull off the odd very expensive worldie, not sure he's in the right position at the club.

I don't know about this pre season. But, it seems like he didn't say or act differently with players last season. Some of players's behaviors and what they had to say during the summer kind of pointed to that direction.

 

[DomesticTadpole]

There is something called wage structure and any responsible owners should watch it for long term. Also, didn't Jose say he likes to work with small size of squad anyway?

He may like to work with a small squad, but in that case he has to make sure it is just about perfect in every department and it isn't. He also isn't addressing the departments where the flaws are.

 

[Nikelesh Reddy]

Can't they do both things at once? Darmian is desperate to go, he just hasn't settled. If it is Rojo, there must surely be someone who will take him. We have usually just gone out and got who we wanted and sold players when needed. Not sure they have ever said we need to sell first. Should I be worried about that?

I think the problem is that Mourinho probably wants to add another top class attacking player,and in January Mourinho publicly said that he “wasn’t going to sign any attacking players” in the summer.Sanchez was supposed to complete the set...But maybe Jose went to Woodward and told him that he needs another top class winger,and Woodward’s probably told him to get rid of Martial first...

So I think the friction is about selling Martial to sign a new attacking player.I expect us to sign Maguire,and I think we”ll sign him even if we don’t sell Rojo.But we may not be able to sign another winger if we can’t get rid of Martial...

 

[Judas]

I think the problem is that Mourinho probably wants to add another top class attacking player,and in January Mourinho publicly said that he “wasn’t going to sign any attacking players” in the summer.Sanchez was supposed to complete the set...But maybe Jose went to Woodward and told him that he needs another top class winger,and Woodward’s probably told him to get rid of Martial first...

So I think the friction is about selling Martial to sign a new attacking player.I expect us to sign Maguire,and I think we”ll sign him even if we don’t sell Rojo.But we may not be able to sign another winger if we can’t get rid of Martial...

Seems like a shit ton of guesswork in this post, seeing as every media outlet is going with the direction Woody wants us to keep Martial as we've invested so much in him and he's got potential to be worth even more.

 

[Pavl3n]

I wasn't looking forward when he was appointed in first place. Anyhow... We've been watching this crap show for two years now.
Mind, we've played some really good football at times, but mostly against Middlesbrough, Stoke or other teams at the bottom of the table. Both last seasons, we started flying, scoring goals, being exciting to watch. Come November, Jose probably thinks he's fooled the crowd and he could switch back to his pragmatic "we go for the 1:0 lads" style.

There are exactly 5 games that stand out from last season - the wins against Arsenal (A), Liverpool (H), Chelsea (H), City (A) and Spurs (FA). Everything else is either barely covering the standards or playing below - Sevilla games.

Honestly, I might be wrong, but I really believe Jose includes in his talks something like "If we don't concede, only 1 goal is enough". Where coaches of other big teams (Real, Bayern, Juve, Psg, Barca, Porto, etc.) probably say stuff like "we're going for the win, we will attack them, try to outscore them".

I really hope he fails this season. As much as I would love to see us win, I doubt he's capable of winning the league. Finishing top 4 shouldn't cut it for him. If whatever battle is there for the league and we are out if it by March/early April (God forbid before that) then Mourinho should be given a cardboard box and ordered to pack his crap from the manager's office.

 

[Gandalf Greyhame]

He's starting off like Conte this season. Completely disgruntled by the board and their failure to get him the targets he wants. Full of negativity and disappointment, and spreading it around the squad and the place right now. It does not look good. Forget the friendly results - our first XI did not have a good pre-season, we haven't addressed our weak points from last season, rivals have strengthened, and some players just don't seem to be happy at United.

 

[ivaldo]

I was wondering why I apparently couldn't see what everyone was reacting to on the previous page. @ivaldo should be on everyone's ignore list. Fecking horrible poster.

Run along now.

 

[Nikelesh Reddy]

There is something called wage structure and any responsible owners should watch it for long term. Also, didn't Jose say he likes to work with small size of squad anyway?

Exactly,Jose would definitely want to sell Rojo and Martial.But it’s not his job to sell them,he can’t find another club for them...Woodward has to get rid of them,so Jose’s probably upset that he will miss out on new signings because Woodward failed to find another club for Rojo and Martial...

 

[DomesticTadpole]

I don't know about this pre season. But, it seems like he didn't say or act differently with players last season. Some of players's behaviors and what they had to say during the summer kind of pointed to that direction.

Trouble is Jose is p*ssing off the players who could make us title challengers if he could get the best out of them, the ones who are eternally grateful to him and he has praised to the hilt in the past could make us a Top 6 challenger instead. Not sure what to make of his Sanchez comments from last night either. He praised him and deservedly so but slagged off the rest in the process. You have to be careful and not create divisions.

 

[The United]

He may like to work with a small squad, but in that case he has to make sure it is just about perfect in every department and it isn't. He also isn't addressing the departments where the flaws are.

well, he tried to fix some. But, then he broke it down anyway with this negative shit.

People like to talk about how we need to sign more. At least half of his signings were big names with big prices and almost half of all his signings have not lived up to their name or raise the level for us like we/he hoped they do. So obviously, you can't keep signing like 20 players just to be able to get half of them right then proceed to play a bit of shit football anyway. Can't blame if the board has similar feelings about it and instead want him to deal with his own shit first.

 

[DomesticTadpole]

I think the problem is that Mourinho probably wants to add another top class attacking player,and in January Mourinho publicly said that he “wasn’t going to sign any attacking players” in the summer.Sanchez was supposed to complete the set...But maybe Jose went to Woodward and told him that he needs another top class winger,and Woodward’s probably told him to get rid of Martial first...

So I think the friction is about selling Martial to sign a new attacking player.I expect us to sign Maguire,and I think we”ll sign him even if we don’t sell Rojo.But we may not be able to sign another winger if we can’t get rid of Martial...

I agree about the Martial situation. We have known he is unhappy and wanted to go, but then he has had to used him due to World Cup holidays. Yet maybe we should have just concentrated on getting rid of him as he really hasn't made much difference to our performances on tour anyway. You can just see Ed and Jose on a collision course here.

 

[DomesticTadpole]

well, he tried to fix some. But, then he broke it down anyway with this negative shit.

People like to talk about how we need to sign more. At least half of his signings were big names with big prices and almost half of all his signings have not lived up to their name or raise the level for us like we/he hoped they do. So obviously, you can't keep signing like 20 players just to be able to get half of them right then proceed to play a bit of shit football anyway. Can't blame if the board has similar feelings about it and instead want him to deal with his own shit first.

I was hoping with bringing Carrick/McKenna in his tactics might change. Somehow I doubt he is listening. They are just new bodies on his coaching staff.

 

[Adisa]

I wish the world cup never ended.

 

[The United]

Exactly,Jose would definitely want to sell Rojo and Martial.But it’s not his job to sell them,he can’t find another club for them...Woodward has to get rid of them,so Jose’s probably upset that he will miss out on new signings because Woodward failed to find another club for Rojo and Martial...

I thought Rojo is going soon?

About Martial, well it is a bit complicated, I agree and the board probably don't agree with him and they have the right to do so. And, the board let him sign a top class attacking player as you said last window. Maybe they expected him to do a bit better with it first. TBH, seeing him trying that 3 5 2 thing, I was kind of thinking that Croatian guy that he likes will come soon.

 

[Nikelesh Reddy]

Seems like a shit ton of guesswork in this post, seeing as every media outlet is going with the direction Woody wants us to keep Martial as we've invested so much in him and he's got potential to be worth even more.

But the player wants to leave and the manager wants to sign another winger(Perisic,Rebic,Willian)... So if he wants to sign a new winger,then he clearly doesn’t fancy Martial.The signing of Sanchez in itself was a vote of no confidence against Martial...Woodward’s probably told Jose that he needs to offload atleast 1 high profile attacking player if he wants to add another...