Problem for Bruno is, that moment has not just eluded him, he's stood out negatively in big games.
Will Bruno achieve legend status at utd?
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It’s not hard to see why some fan bases regard Man Utd fans as a joke.
Firstly, it always amuses me how he is always referred to as “Bruno”. It seems that only some players garner this distinction. It’s so weird.
The guy is nowhere near a legend and never will be. He is totally unreliable. His attitude is pathetic. He is physically crap and his technical ability is nowhere near good enough to make up for that. His dribbling is horrendous. For every good shot or pass that he picks out, he pings twenty more out of play akin to something out of a Harry McGuire YouTube compilation. The sooner this muppet, McGuire, Rashford, Martial, McTomminay, Shaw, Onana, and all the other substandard dross are out, the better. What a dismal era. Zero light at the end of the tunnel as it stands. Man Utd has never been so far off the mark. It is in its most weak state, after spending a king’s ransom. You can only laugh. It’s a shame the sheikh withdrew.
Firstly, it always amuses me how he is always referred to as “Bruno”. It seems that only some players garner this distinction. It’s so weird.
The guy is nowhere near a legend and never will be. He is totally unreliable. His attitude is pathetic. He is physically crap and his technical ability is nowhere near good enough to make up for that. His dribbling is horrendous. For every good shot or pass that he picks out, he pings twenty more out of play akin to something out of a Harry McGuire YouTube compilation. The sooner this muppet, McGuire, Rashford, Martial, McTomminay, Shaw, Onana, and all the other substandard dross are out, the better. What a dismal era. Zero light at the end of the tunnel as it stands. Man Utd has never been so far off the mark. It is in its most weak state, after spending a king’s ransom. You can only laugh. It’s a shame the sheikh withdrew.
Yeah they were so furious at the guy for captaining United to a 7-0 mauling at Anfield.
And playing in the 5-0 and 4-0 maulings the season before.
He absolutely terrorises them.
They can when they're top players who contribute to elevating the players around them and lifting the mood generally.
Yes yes.. he terrifies them, yes thats exactly what i said.Yeah they were so furious at the guy for captaining United to a 7-0 mauling at Anfield.
And playing in the 5-0 and 4-0 maulings the season before.
He absolutely terrorises them.
They can when they're top players who contribute to elevating the players around them and lifting the mood generally. If they dont offer that then of course they need trophies to compensate
And in that area Lingard has done more to be considered a United legend with his FA cup final goal than Bruno.
Correct. The ones with the long surnames. See also Rio.
Next weeks lesson. Why people often type “CM” instead of “central midfielder”…
It’s not true just because you wrote it.
If someone were to say he’s been the most available player, the one who has played most often, that would be true.
Saying he’s been our best player the entire time he’s been here bar a few months from Rashford is utter bollocks.
Justify it.
You’re arguing with someone who genuinely believes Bruno’s been “abysmal all season”. That’s the level of ignorance you’re dealing with. Do yourself a favour and put them on ignore. I did it ages ago. One of my best decisions ever made on the caf.
These threads are so pointless. Quantify legend first.
Who's better, Ronaldo or an M4 Sherman mk II?
Who's better, Ronaldo or an M4 Sherman mk II?
DDG was our last club legend and I do t see anyone in the current set up get close to joining the at club anytime soon. Way to early to start citing future legends amongst the youngsters.
Bruno has been a top player for us but his form is way too patchy and his captaincy will be tarnished by an under performing team and the most dislikeable trait of his moaning and gesticulating, rather than getting on with the job of leading.
Not even close to a club legend for me.
Bruno has been a top player for us but his form is way too patchy and his captaincy will be tarnished by an under performing team and the most dislikeable trait of his moaning and gesticulating, rather than getting on with the job of leading.
Not even close to a club legend for me.
Not arguing your general point re: Beckham, but he had zero assists in the CL final. Giggs and Sheringham were the last players to play the ball prior to the two goals.
Also, people have already mentioned some big games were Bruno played well and influenced a positive result for us, so not sure why that point keeps being brought up.
Fictional assists aside, Beckham didn’t have a good game in the CL final. Bayern kicked our arses for almost the entirety of that match. One of the most one sided games we played in that whole campaign, primarily because our rejigged central midfield was nowhere near good enough on the night. Is that being brought up as the sort of performance Bruno should be aspiring to produce?
Herrera like player for me. I’ve got a lot of time for him whilst he’s here, but I’ll probably almost entirely forget about him as soon as he’s gone.
Rasmus as well. I ain't learning his last name.
True that. Although for some weird reason I don't remember many of us calling our Polish keeper Tomasz. We really should have.
Similarly, I guess Kvaratskhelia's first name didn't catch on because it's also a ball ache to spell.
I certainly hope so because it would mean he’d have captained us to a league title or CL.
Bruno (and Rasmus) are both fun to say as well. Way more so than Fernandes and Hoijlandsson or whatever the feck it is.
Yup. See also Ruuuuuuud.
I find it funny how Bruno supporters seem puzzled as to why Bruno has so many critics and don’t view him as world class or close to world class like they do. It’s almost as if they can’t fathom the thought that he just isn’t as good as you think he is.
Why would fans of a team deliberately underrate a player of ours? If Bruno was this amazing player you think he is, the criticism of him would be minimal or nonexistent.
Last season when Rashford was playing at an unreal level, his praise was unanimous, it was similar with DDG from 2014-2018. Even Bruno had this in his first calendar year here.
Why would fans of the club target Bruno as one to intentionally criticise, why would there be an agenda against him? That hasn’t happened with any player before him and doesn’t happen with players of other teams. There are just too many critics of Bruno both fans and ex players.
Bruno in a sense reminds me of Berbatov in 2010/11. He had good stats, was top scorer even and was consistent but when it came down to it in the business end of the season SAF trusted more reliable players and despite being our top scorer wasn’t on the bench for the CL final. Berbatov that season was pretty much loading his goals against the smaller teams but even he managed to get his iconic moment with the hat trick vs Liverpool.
Bruno supporters look for every excuse in the book for why he doesn’t have any memorable performances. How can you be a Manchester United legend or rated highly when you go missing in big moments consistently? There’s several examples of him carrying us against fodder but not even once can he do it in a big game. He’s pretty much the Lukaku of midfielders and that was another player who played for us and a large section of the fan base didn’t rate even after his first season where he score 27 goals. It’s funny because I recall @Pogue Mahone defending Lukaku then too when he was being criticised for being a small game player.
Why would fans of a team deliberately underrate a player of ours? If Bruno was this amazing player you think he is, the criticism of him would be minimal or nonexistent.
Last season when Rashford was playing at an unreal level, his praise was unanimous, it was similar with DDG from 2014-2018. Even Bruno had this in his first calendar year here.
Why would fans of the club target Bruno as one to intentionally criticise, why would there be an agenda against him? That hasn’t happened with any player before him and doesn’t happen with players of other teams. There are just too many critics of Bruno both fans and ex players.
Bruno in a sense reminds me of Berbatov in 2010/11. He had good stats, was top scorer even and was consistent but when it came down to it in the business end of the season SAF trusted more reliable players and despite being our top scorer wasn’t on the bench for the CL final. Berbatov that season was pretty much loading his goals against the smaller teams but even he managed to get his iconic moment with the hat trick vs Liverpool.
Bruno supporters look for every excuse in the book for why he doesn’t have any memorable performances. How can you be a Manchester United legend or rated highly when you go missing in big moments consistently? There’s several examples of him carrying us against fodder but not even once can he do it in a big game. He’s pretty much the Lukaku of midfielders and that was another player who played for us and a large section of the fan base didn’t rate even after his first season where he score 27 goals. It’s funny because I recall @Pogue Mahone defending Lukaku then too when he was being criticised for being a small game player.
To be fair, that mostly shows the insanity of going 'this player has X assists so must be class'.
Beckham played two good corners in which really created the chances - with Bruno those two corners are more likely to go into the first man or create a chance for another team. (well certainly the winner)
Even in the games where we get smashed or upset by little teams, it's 'Bruno created 5 chances' and then when you watch they are spammed through balls when we're under the cosh and actually having the ability to control the game would be better. I honestly think that in a lot of games he gives more chances to the other team than he creates for us.
Under Bruno's captaincy, we've had one of the worst records ever against good teams - look at the statistics about our away form to top 8 sides in the last season and a bit.
I’m not sure if any of the current crop are on track for legend status.
Probably because they never hear or see anything close to the level of RedCafe criticism out in the real world. This forum is toxic as hell when it comes to rating its own players and managers so Bruno is far from alone in this. It's just more shocking when it comes to him because he's actually a good footballer.
We laugh at Facebook and Twitter comments, but at least their toxicity is immediately apparent from the emojis and slurs, so you don't get fooled to engage to begin with.
Two things:
1. You don't need to be world class to be a club legend. There are plenty of examples that prove this.
2. "World class" is yet another subjective term that people never can agree on. Going by Fergie's definition, Bruno is nowhere near world class. Going by the most common definition (best or second best in a given position), Bruno is at the very least in the conversation. And if you're in the conversation you have to be a very good player. There's no way around it.
It still amazes me how people act surprised that the fan base is negative when the club has pretty much been in a state of negativity since SAF left. If we were winning or at least could consistently play and conduct ourselves like a top club the atmosphere within the fan base would be a lot less toxic. Liverpool, Madrid, Bayern, Barcelona fans etc would be exactly like us in the same situation.
Limiting this to a redcafe issue also doesn’t make sense and is far from true. It’s far more toxic on twitter and even other fan channels. I see stuff here that I see anywhere else. Roy Keane, Paul Scholes and Gary Neville have been on TV every week having a go at the club too but I guess the truth is toxic to you.
Keane and Neville also have no time for Bruno and probably dislike him a lot more than most posters here do. They know what it is to be a Manutd player and captain and can’t stand the sight of him. Maybe they’ve been reading too much on Redcafe?
The second part of your post is another example of you engaging in strawman arguments and ignoring the main point of the post. Nowhere did I say you had to be world class too be a legend.
I think Bruno will be a cult hero, akin to Gordon Hill of the 1970s or Norman Whiteside of the 1980s. Won’t hit the legendary heights of Robbo or Eric
Depends what he's supposed to be remembered for an impactful player who was present in a period of the clubs recent history being inconsistent competitively. It's hard to triangulate where he has merit in such a discussion.
I’ve seen one game against City described as outstanding….he played well but certainly was t outstanding and one game against Liverpool in the cup where he scored a free kick. That’s literally it?
It keeps getting brought up because it’s a factor for any big player at the club, nevermind legend.
What a weird post
He will not achieve legend status. First, because he's not good enough. Second, because he played for us during a stretch when we were terrible, and third, he would never be considered a legend in a club where CR7 isn't. The latter point has been argued extensively in other threads so no need to derail this one.
Bruno will have cult hero status with some and that's still pretty decent. You can't have a United legend who never won the league, even before you debate ability, antics etc.
You've compiled a list for a supposedly highly-skilled attacking midfielder where half of the attributes have so much overlap they're often used interchangeably and the other half has asterisks/caveats.
You were polite enough to answer my questions and express your opinions in a cordial manner, so I’ll just agree to disagree on the “highly-skilled” and “legend” stuff.
I think he’s a good player - who will be remembered fondly by many, but ultimately just a good player.
Yup he’s had some good performances against big teams, I mean he’d have to he’s probably played in over 30 since being here. Last season at home to City, Barcelona and Arsenal were good games from him.
The thing is these don’t happen enough and while a good game is nice, the really top players can produce great moments and games much more consistently. I also don’t think he’s ever not been terrible away from home in big matches.
Everything Neville said here is the opposite of what Bruno is
There is so much wrong with this post!
Poster putting himself in a position where he states Bruno has SO MANY CRITICS, there is an AGENDA against him and he JUST ISN'T AS GOOD AS YOU THINK HE IS.
@El Jefe How many fans, or what percentage of utd's fanbase are you speaking for?
That's fair enough.
I also don't think that Bruno will be widely considered a legend unless he wins a big trophy for us. Time is not on his side, but if Robson could win his first at age 36 then maybe there's still time. That is at least one thing we all can hope for!
Bruno has all credentials? Would really like to know why you think so.
Here are my arguments why he would never be United legend:
- He won nothing.
- Wasteful with questionable decision making in key situations.
- Not suited to lead team aiming to play dominant, possession based game and win trophies.
- Lot of running but average in defending or pressing.
- Whinny and obnoxious.
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You said:
But as you've just acknowledged, they have.
We could certainly add a few more too, but it would probably get very 'what have the Roman's ever done for us...' with you.
He hasn't accomplished anywhere near enough to even think about being labelled a legend, but there's definitely a middle ground between that and your opinion, which seems like it's bordering hatred.
The top players who produce great moments in big matches usually play in top teams themselves. We haven't been a patch on City or Liverpool in recent years, so to expect consistent, game-winning performances from any of our players against the likes of that is a very tall order. We've managed to beat them on occasion during that time, and yes, Bruno has been a part of that.
It takes a monumental player like Robson to drag a mediocre team across the line regularly. I don't think anyone is putting Bruno besides Robbo.
Fictional assists aside, Beckham didn’t have a good game in the CL final. Bayern kicked our arses for almost the entirety of that match. One of the most one sided games we played in that whole campaign, primarily because our rejigged central midfield was nowhere near good enough on the night. Is that being brought up as the sort of performance Bruno should be aspiring to produce?
Sorry if I’m a little aggressive today but you’ve forced me into the loft, as the internet doesn’t really cover very well the CL final of 99.
However it’s really quite funny that the guy who claims Beckham didn’t have a good game against Bayern, primarily (ie Beckham was to blame) because of the midfield… went into meltdown in Bruno’s performance thread after the 7-0 defeat to Liverpool making 58 (5-8) (FIFTY EIGHT) posts in two days defending Bruno’s performance in that game. One of your posts being this….
‘It was a rhetorical question. I assumed you would understand the point I was making. We've been dominated a lot in big games in recent years. Hence it's been very hard for any player’
So if you’re Bruno and play like actual shite in a 7-0 defeat at Anfield then according to 58Posts Mahone you can’t be blamed…‘it’s so very hard’ (apparently so when it comes to Bruno).
Whereas when David Beckham plays out of position in a CL Final WIN, gives us a foothold in the game for 90 mins despite the rejigged midfield, dominating possession, more attempts at and on goal, A higher XG (come on we know you have a boner for this when it comes to certain players) more corners, plays a huge role in us winning the corner for 1-1 and has a huge role in both goals (if not assists) Our best player and for me the best player on the pitch all things considered in that game, leading to us winning the premier league, the fa cup, the European cup…EVERYTHING OUR HEARTS DESIRED. It gets labelled by @58Posts as laughable that Bruno should aspire to this? Ok.
Maybe Becks should have aspired to Bruno’s decent at best performance v Luton at Old Trafford, huge game, big moments 1-0 win v the mighty Hatters, described by @58Posts here:-
“I don’t think it was an excellent performance but it was definitely a good performance. Generally used the ball well and put some excellent crosses into the box. Plus all the usual workrate and defensive effort.
Particularly enjoyed a sliding tackle to win the ball back immediately after Garnacho had broken down an attack with a poor decision. The crowd enjoyed that moment too and it kicked off a few minutes where the stadium got noisy, we pinned them back and eventually won the corner from which we scored. He’s a long way short of the likes of Keane and Robson as a captain but that was a proper captain’s moment.”
Inspirational stuff!
Anyway I like to back up anything I say, I’ll always justify a point I make where necessary unlike 58Posts. So I’ve been in the attic and dug out my newspapers from 27th May 1999…
And just for good measure here is some of the footage of both player’s performances
Beckham’s laughably poor performance in the Nou Camp.
Bruno’s harsh to judge him in the opinion of @58Posts Mahone v Liverpool 7-0 (SEVEN NIL)
The Last clip…imagine Bryan Robson or Becks doing that
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My opinion is that he was sensational when he first came…you can go back to his performances threads to see, funnily there’s a few here that the fanboys don’t like, that were actually massive fans when he first came in.
My opinion since is that he’s been largely poor and is a big part of the reason we struggle to dominate games. When people throw out random sentences with no justification I’ll ask for it to be backed up.
Ok so let’s say Bruno played well to reasonably well in 3 big ish games. That’s just downright piss poor at this stage of his United career.
Sensational post.
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Thank you….Opinions are fine but should be backed up in my opinion.
No. He is a very good player but not a legend.