We took our time rising from 1967 to 1993 though...
What will it take to sack moyes?
- Thread starter bosnian_red
- Start date
We took our time rising from 1967 to 1993 though...
Moyes is the fire.
Not going to happen.
FFS.
We do need a massive overhaul of players though man. Its whether we'll be any better with these new upgrades coming in.
I do love the players that Moyes seems to be targeting though. Its how he'll use them that's bothering us... and goin on what we've seen already - its doesnt bode well for next season!
This whole situation reminds me of Trappatoni with Ireland & Steve "The Gaffaaaaaaa" Staunton. Feckin deja vu x2 all friggin over again...
Fixed.
Which bloody talented players would want to work under him?
If it weren't for the 300k to shut him up, why the feck don't fecking rooney confused about signing a cluless manager? what about the club ambitions and shit?
As mentioned in another quote, I was highlighting that I believe the league position is pretty much where I see the 1st 11 ability - based on the defence and midfield ability. The position of 5th/6th/7th are all pretty much where we are at and where I see the team at now. I think there are 4 better teams than us in the league and I said at the start of the season that I thought we would do well to finish 4th, based on age of squad and lack of purchases to improve the first team.
If you guys don't think the same then so be it. I felt we were quite fortunate in many games last season and were spared by some moments of brilliance from RVP. We haven't had such fortune this term but have played much like we did last season for many games. I don't see why my thoughts are getting shot down so heavily. The league position would suggest I may be on the right lines though.
No. Sorry. I disagree. No matter how you put it, no matter how much you want to praise SAF (just to defend Moyes basically, because then you trash the same SAF for his player selection), it does not compute. There is no way a team that was 1 point away from winning 4 consecutive league titles (ended up with two, and two runner-up position) is so bad that it needs a "massive overhaul".
It's just an excuse that we inherited from people who were always trying to belittle our squad, and were proven wrong year after year after year. Nothing changed.
Also, there is no way Moyes is going to attract much better quality than the one we already have now.
I would say the squad we had from last year, + 2 expensive additions + 1 very good and talented addition from the youth squad, should provide enough fresh blood for the team to continue it's run for the title, not only top 4 finish.
Ok buy a left back, and a midfielder and that should be enough for us to compete again for the title. I know you'd also want a center back, or another midfielder, but this is not FM we're playing here. No team is perfect, the squad we had last season + 5 new good/great players should be more than enough for us to compete for the title again... Under a proper manager.
This is insanity, pure and simple. Moyes must be a wizard, considering how many people he has managed to convince that he's actually performing up to par with the squad that finished 11 points ahead of second last season.
What I would like to know is why, if you're so sure Moyes is doing about as well as expected, your last "status update" on your profile, from January, reads "tick, tock, Moyes!" We're not doing any better now than we did in the first half of the season. If anything we're doing worse.
Actually, a quick look at your post history makes me even more confused. This is all from a single page in your post history.
What was it that suddenly convinced you that Moyes wasn't to blame after all? Are you just on a WUM? You said this in September!
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Moral champions or actual champions?
Bizarre comment. There's always one on here that has to act like a gobshite & jump to braindead & incorrect accusations about other posters. Hopefully you slept it off...
No point talkin to folk like you. You're right & thats the end of it..
Consistency tend to run low in this forum.
In the past everything made by SAF was considered divine. Anyone highlighting that the squad's quality is diluting, that its not ok to replace Scholes with Cleverley, Giggs with Young and Ronaldo with Valencia and that this will one day come and haunt us was laughed at. Moyes has inherited a side that is far from perfect. Chelsea and City has a stronger side than ours and a transition period would mean that we would possibly lose the third place
However FFS we aren't a 7th place team. There's no feckin excuse that Spurs and Everton are ahead of us and Moyes needs to be accountable to that
In the past everything made by SAF was considered divine. Anyone highlighting that the squad's quality is diluting, that its not ok to replace Scholes with Cleverley, Giggs with Young and Ronaldo with Valencia and that this will one day come and haunt us was laughed at. Moyes has inherited a side that is far from perfect. Chelsea and City has a stronger side than ours and a transition period would mean that we would possibly lose the third place
However FFS we aren't a 7th place team. There's no feckin excuse that Spurs and Everton are ahead of us and Moyes needs to be accountable to that
If Chelsea can challenge for the title in their first season with a new manager, with no striker, a CB that most thought was finished last season alongside a centre back no-one thought was good enough, and regularly playing an ageing midfielder that is a shadow of his former self... of course we can compete for the title with a couple of additions. Hell, Liverpool are the best proof right on our doorstep of how much "coaching" can raise the performances of a squad.
I think if we are Gerd Mullered by Bayern and he isn't dismissed, then he'll get the money and next season. I'm no longer convinced of the wisdom of this.
---------DDG------------------
Rafael Evans Jones New LB
New CM Fellani/Carrick
Januzaj Mata/Kagawa Wellbeck/Nani
--------Rooney--------------
Not too shabby, n'est ce pas? Where's the need for the complete overhaul?
It's actually spot on. The same people praise SAF when to comes to selections (when they're talking about selecting Moyes, and how we should trust him because of it) but then blame SAF for the same thing (when they're talking about selecting the players of the squad we have now).
And amazingly you left our best player out of that line-up, more proof that a complete overhaul is not required.
Right-RvP I assume. On the fence there--do you think it's insane to consider selling him and use the proceeds to restock the squad after Hernandez, Anderson, Vidic and Ferdinand all go? Figure 1-2 on-loan/youth players will add to the squad-but maybe get in some depth?
I don't think we'd get anywhere near enough money for a player of his talent and how much would his sale really help us to "restock" the squad? If we were talking about a 50m fee then "maybe", but we'd be lucky to get 20m. I personally wouldn't sell our best player for the fee we'd get.
http://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2014/mar/26/paul-scholes-manchester-united
Mutiny. Players in mutiny will. I reckon that behind the scenes moves are afoot to force him out and that some players, past and present, are conspiring to have this happen. Shearer, as much as I dislike the cnut, was the first to allude to a collective downing of tools. Flabbergasting rumours abound.
Mutiny. Players in mutiny will. I reckon that behind the scenes moves are afoot to force him out and that some players, past and present, are conspiring to have this happen. Shearer, as much as I dislike the cnut, was the first to allude to a collective downing of tools. Flabbergasting rumours abound.
What was it that suddenly convinced you that Moyes wasn't to blame after all? Are you just on a WUM? You said this in September![/quote]
I've got better things to do that take time just to WUM on here. I've explained why I think the squad would struggle to get top 4 in previous posts. If you actually took time to read all my posts you would have noted that I admitted having an anti moyes wobble after a couple of results (whick you kindly pointed out) but now I accept he is here for a while so may as well get behind him and see how it goes.
I didn't really want him and wouldn't be over concerned if he was sacked tomorrow, but as long as he is in the seat, he now has my support.
Me pointing out my views on the squad doesn't mean I'm saying this is or isn't moyes fault. Don't know why you seem so keen to point out my previous points on Moyes.
You highlighting my previous posts whilst not reading them all , or understanding them, has just highlighted you can't read.
I've got better things to do that take time just to WUM on here. I've explained why I think the squad would struggle to get top 4 in previous posts. If you actually took time to read all my posts you would have noted that I admitted having an anti moyes wobble after a couple of results (whick you kindly pointed out) but now I accept he is here for a while so may as well get behind him and see how it goes.
I didn't really want him and wouldn't be over concerned if he was sacked tomorrow, but as long as he is in the seat, he now has my support.
Me pointing out my views on the squad doesn't mean I'm saying this is or isn't moyes fault. Don't know why you seem so keen to point out my previous points on Moyes.
You highlighting my previous posts whilst not reading them all , or understanding them, has just highlighted you can't read.
I was figuring RvP would bring in around £20M as well. Potential problem I see is that I see Rooney best suited as striker with Mata/Kagawa as #10. RvP could also be striker of course-but I think strikers are best when they get a run of games. So we may not get the best with Rooney or RvP by rotating them at striker.
Therefore, I'm thinking Wellbeck rotates with Rooney at striker-and we use RvP sale proceeds to sign a replacement for Hernandez-maybe a veteran on the other side of his prime who's OK with a limited role-sort of like the thinking behind signing Owen a few years ago.
But-I agree: £20M isn't that much of an addition, and maybe it's better to keep RvP and figure out a system where someone contributes even playing out of position.
was bit drunk when i posted that
You seriously believe that someone would buy RVP for £20m?
Yes: +/- a couple of million.
http://www.transfermarkt.com/en/robin-van-persie/profil/spieler_4380.html?from=direktErgebnis
If Moyes fails to deliver again next season then I think it would be time for the board to consider a new manager, but until that point Moyes should be given the opportunity to prove himself.
Bastian gets it
I'm not so sure, the Championship is a tough league to win
mata tho
Can we make him player-manager?
I just don't see how we could get anyone to take RVP, 31 £250k per week and injury prone not to mention we will be looking to recoup some of the £25m we spent on him if we were to sell.
He is here for the duration of his contract most likely.
You may be right. If that's the case it'll be difficult to keep RvP and Rooney in form at striker, where I think Rooney is best with Mata at 10.
Maybe he does not know that Fergie left behind a crippled squad which poor Moyes has got the best out of!
No doubt Mata definitely is better in the hole, and he and Rooney would work well together with Rooney up top i think, when we signed Mata i was convinced Rooney was on his way, but when he signed that contract it surprised me, makes me wonder what the plan is for RVP Mata Rooney Kagawa long term
Just can't see a system that would allow us to get the best out of all 4, Mata is a top player but i think there is a very real possibility that he was a P.R./panic buy to appease the fans.
I agree. Mata's signing reminds me of when I buy a tchotchke on vacation. I bring it home and think, what the heck will I do with this thing now? Rooney and RvP seemed to play well together last year-but a lot of things worked last year that don't seem to work this year. That's why I think RvP should be sold-and Rooney kept as the first-choice striker. Maybe we won't get £20M-but I just don't see a system where he and Rooney are accommodated and kept happy with regard to playing time.
I kinda feel like Mata was bought without a plan to use him. The fact he's played a few games wide(ish) left and right, a couple of games inside left and right and a couple as a No. 10 suggests Moyes is still trying to find a way to incorporate him.
If I was feeling impish I'd suggest that RvP is going to leave this summer and Mata was bought as part of planning for his succession, with Rooney up top and Mata behind. But who knows.
Yeah Mata felt like a strange signing and still does to me, but perhaps in hindsight moyes could have saved himself a lot of flak by spending the Mata money on a midfielder or two in january, had he done so i think we could have had a real go at the top 4.
Thats a decision that could in the end cause him to lose his job, only time will tell.
Man, amen to that. When we played Olympiakos in midfield, and Giggs had that great game, it really showed what a decent midfielder can do to your team.
Quite why he felt Cabaye was too average to go for I have no idea.
Indeed that match was a real eye opener regardless of the poor opposition, if he does go this summer and i have a gut feeling he will, those summer and january windows will haunt him for the rest of his life i feel, dithered about too much and didnt spend to address our immediate problems.
He had a reputation amongst everton fans as 'Dithering Dave' for dithering about until late in transfer windows, he has brought that here with Fellaini and Mata both signed late in the windows.Supposedly he extensively scouts players but if that were the case why does he seem so indecisive when it comes to actually signing them?
We could have used him. We could have used any midfielder on his level, actually. But the problem is that he could have easily cost us a Fellaini-ish amount of money. And if Moyes intends to spend really big on a world beater come summer - well, it sort of makes sense not to go for a "lesser" player (for a hefty amount) in January.
I agree 100% that buying Mata OVER a central midfielder doesn't make any sense. And until Moyes demonstrates that he knows what the hell he's doing here, the Mata purchase will look like a pointless luxury signing.
I actually agreed with not signing a cabaye or similar instead of a really top midfielder in the summer, but then i have the luxury of always thinking long term as i know ill always be a united fan.
But you have to think no matter how safe he thought/thinks his job is , from Moyes point of view surely a bit of a panic buy of a midfielder who would improve us should have been the way to go for him if not united.
I think it will be a decision he will come to rue our form since January would probably be a lot better with a good CM on board and i think we could have been in contention for top 4, could easily cost him his job here.