What do we still need? Aka The never ending story

Todd said:
Still need a first-choice striker, a first-choice holding midfielder, a backup midfielder, a backup right back, and a starting central defender.

This is assuming that we're looking to sell Lindelof, AWB, and McTominay.
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Surely first choice striker is Rasmus, would still like to get Toney late in window if we could sell maybe Sancho & Pellistri heck even Antony if we could get interest. I also like Rabiot as backup midfielder (if it fits within INEOS wage and contracts structure)
 
I think if McTominay, Casemiro and Sancho leaves, we should have funds to get 2 good midfielders. We definitely need it as we cannot rely on Mainoo to run the midfield. 4th choice midfield could be Amarabat when there are injuries issues.
 
Onana
Altay

Dalot Yoro Martinez Shaw
Kadioglu Maguire Branthwaite Malacia

Mainoo Ugarte
Amrabat McTominay

Garnacho Bruno Rashford
Amad Mount Antony

Hojlund
Zirkzee​

I could see us doing this in terms of the starters and backup 11 once the window is done. Amrabat on cheap as a squad player for deep areas is fine and I think we do it. Antony I'd love to get rid of, but it'll take a few years to get rid of guys. I think Wan Bissaka leaves and we get Kadioglu, and I feel like we'll push for Branthwaite rather than De Ligt to have that 2nd left footed guy so we can push Martinez to LB if needed in emergencies.
 
De Ligt, Rabiot and Ugarte will make it a top window. We sign a good mix of experience and emerging talent.

Midfield options- Bruno, Mount, Eriksen, Mainoo, Ugarte, Rabiot and Hannibal

Sell - Scott, Casemiro, Lindelof
Loan - Amad
 
ManRed said:
De Ligt, Rabiot and Ugarte will make it a top window. We sign a good mix of experience and emerging talent.

Midfield options- Bruno, Mount, Eriksen, Mainoo, Ugarte, Rabiot and Hannibal

Sell - Scott, Casemiro, Lindelof
Loan - Amad
Click to expand...
I think we will sell a lot more players than fans think?
Dan Ashworth has obviously been looking at this and has probably decided with Wilcox and Berada that they should concentrate on easy outgoings like those listed below, yes they’d like to get rid of Antony and Sancho for £60-70m combined but no one is playing their wages, I also think and I maybe wrong that Wilcox convinced ETH to make peace with Sancho as he had him and J Frimpong as his main right side when he managed City under 18’s and knows them both well and together how good they are.

Wilcox who seems to get on well with ETH probably said look at times we need to change shape and formation and if we get you J Frimpong who ETH loves, you’ll see the best of J Sancho. We need him playing if we are going to sell him and he’s miles better than Antony.

Players Sold:
S Mctominay - £30m/65k
Hanibal - £12m /25k
F Pellistri - £15m/25k
AWB - £18m/90k
V Lindelof - £10m/120k
Casemiro - £15m/350k

This is realistic and if you add this to the £40m the club has currently generated by selling W Kambawla, M Greenwood, DVB, A Fernandez and more importantly the wages saved on all those players plus Martial, B Williams and R Varane, the club should generate £140m of player sales and probably more importantly £50m of cash for this summers transfers and agent fees plus reduce the weekly wage bill by £1.575m per week that’s a saving of £81.9m per season before we add new players .

So Far we’ve probably used £40m of cash and we are working with maybe no more than £150m providing we sell well, remember if we sold in SA they normally pay upfront in one instalment.

Players Bought;
Joshua Zirkzee £36m/95k per week on 4 year instalments £9m of cash this summer plus Agent Fees of £11m
(£20m cash used for this transfer)
Lenny Yoro £44m/110k per week on a 4 year installments £10.5m of cash this summer plus estimated Agent Fee £4.5m
(£16m Cash used for this transfer)

Dan Ashworth is a football Director who understands PSR/FFP and all aspects of football finances as does Berada, Wilcox and more importantly our new CFO, Roger Bell. SJR made a payment of approximately £120m to be used to pay off some of the club’s credit card facility to free up working capital to improve the squad. Selling homegrown players like Scott McTominay and Mason Greenwood allow the club to generate 100% profit from these players and potentially spend £300m providing they have the working capital and cash to pay the selling clubs and agree to pay these clubs in instalments rather than upfront payments, this is why a player like J Neves will sign for PSG rather than United because they will pay upfront cash in the same way city tend to. Just a rough guess of the club was to have a ridiculously good window which means selling all the above players listed and then purchasing the following players ;

M Ugarte - Loan Obligation to buy £6m/160k wages
M De Ligt - £40m/190k wages
J Frimpong - £34m/160k wages
A Rabiot - Free/200k wages
I Toney - 45m/200k wages

This would be a combined Spend Gross of £205m or £65-70m net spend and the wages would still be reduced by £400-500,000 per week before the 25% Europa clause is added this season. We might find that if we do sell this well then a few low cost younger players are added to the squad and under 21’s as well.

Let’s be honest here, Adrien Rabiot may just be using the club again so we may keep Amrabat or sign a young DM that we’ve never heard of , Ivan Toney may just be a pipe dream but he may have also been told to wait until we’ve sold players
To make room in the squad for him.

If someone had said United would sign Zirkzee, Yoro, De Ligt, Frimpong, Ugarte, Rabiot and Toney this summer a few months ago, most fans would have said; “What are you smoking?” But now something like this could genuinely happen and for less than £100m net spend?
 
Why are we seemingly not trying to get Frimpong who is available for Zirkzee money?
 
RedWilliam said:
Because he's more of a winger. And super tiny. Might be too light for Premier League.
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Might be perfect in a 343 or 4231 with play making right winger like Amad or Sancho that slide him in, means that we would have to make sure the double pivot is more defensively minded and I’m not sure Kobbie just yet suits that formation but it could work?
 
I could be way off… but I just have this feeling Hannibal will be incorporated into the squad.

He has ability and if it could just be refined there’s a squad player in there.
 
Woziak said:
I think we will sell a lot more players than fans think?
Dan Ashworth has obviously been looking at this and has probably decided with Wilcox and Berada that they should concentrate on easy outgoings like those listed below, yes they’d like to get rid of Antony and Sancho for £60-70m combined but no one is playing their wages, I also think and I maybe wrong that Wilcox convinced ETH to make peace with Sancho as he had him and J Frimpong as his main right side when he managed City under 18’s and knows them both well and together how good they are.

Wilcox who seems to get on well with ETH probably said look at times we need to change shape and formation and if we get you J Frimpong who ETH loves, you’ll see the best of J Sancho. We need him playing if we are going to sell him and he’s miles better than Antony.

Players Sold:
S Mctominay - £30m/65k
Hanibal - £12m /25k
F Pellistri - £15m/25k
AWB - £18m/90k
V Lindelof - £10m/120k
Casemiro - £15m/350k

This is realistic and if you add this to the £40m the club has currently generated by selling W Kambawla, M Greenwood, DVB, A Fernandez and more importantly the wages saved on all those players plus Martial, B Williams and R Varane, the club should generate £140m of player sales and probably more importantly £50m of cash for this summers transfers and agent fees plus reduce the weekly wage bill by £1.575m per week that’s a saving of £81.9m per season before we add new players .

So Far we’ve probably used £40m of cash and we are working with maybe no more than £150m providing we sell well, remember if we sold in SA they normally pay upfront in one instalment.

Players Bought;
Joshua Zirkzee £36m/95k per week on 4 year instalments £9m of cash this summer plus Agent Fees of £11m
(£20m cash used for this transfer)
Lenny Yoro £44m/110k per week on a 4 year installments £10.5m of cash this summer plus estimated Agent Fee £4.5m
(£16m Cash used for this transfer)

Dan Ashworth is a football Director who understands PSR/FFP and all aspects of football finances as does Berada, Wilcox and more importantly our new CFO, Roger Bell. SJR made a payment of approximately £120m to be used to pay off some of the club’s credit card facility to free up working capital to improve the squad. Selling homegrown players like Scott McTominay and Mason Greenwood allow the club to generate 100% profit from these players and potentially spend £300m providing they have the working capital and cash to pay the selling clubs and agree to pay these clubs in instalments rather than upfront payments, this is why a player like J Neves will sign for PSG rather than United because they will pay upfront cash in the same way city tend to. Just a rough guess of the club was to have a ridiculously good window which means selling all the above players listed and then purchasing the following players ;

M Ugarte - Loan Obligation to buy £6m/160k wages
M De Ligt - £40m/190k wages
J Frimpong - £34m/160k wages
A Rabiot - Free/200k wages
I Toney - 45m/200k wages

This would be a combined Spend Gross of £205m or £65-70m net spend and the wages would still be reduced by £400-500,000 per week before the 25% Europa clause is added this season. We might find that if we do sell this well then a few low cost younger players are added to the squad and under 21’s as well.

Let’s be honest here, Adrien Rabiot may just be using the club again so we may keep Amrabat or sign a young DM that we’ve never heard of , Ivan Toney may just be a pipe dream but he may have also been told to wait until we’ve sold players
To make room in the squad for him.

If someone had said United would sign Zirkzee, Yoro, De Ligt, Frimpong, Ugarte, Rabiot and Toney this summer a few months ago, most fans would have said; “What are you smoking?” But now something like this could genuinely happen and for less than £100m net spend?
Click to expand...

I would be staggered if we can manage to negotiate loan deal for Ugarte, hope we have told Toney that but all I am seeing is no interest from Utd/Arsenal/Chelsea. There seems to be a feeling amongst some that Frimpong doesn't defend enough to be replacement for AWB. Yeah Rabiot is a tough one to read but we should at least speak to him.
 
croadyman said:
I would be staggered if we can manage to negotiate loan deal for Ugarte, hope we have told Toney that but all I am seeing is no interest from Utd/Arsenal/Chelsea. There seems to be a feeling amongst some that Frimpong doesn't defend enough to be replacement for AWB. Yeah Rabiot is a tough one to read but we should at least speak to him.
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Toney will be left to the last day of the window and all those clubs will be I. With a cheeky £30-35m bid?
 
Midfield is still very light to me. Can't really trust Casemiro, Eriksen or Mctominay. Wide attacking positions are also a concern but I think we'll just have to gamble on Rashford, Sancho and Antony coming good.
 
I think its time not to feel too sentimental about players like "Casemero/Eriksen/McTominay/Sancho/Rashford/Antony/Lindelof/Bissaka".
I would be the first one really feel happy if any of the above can take us to the next level or play a crucial role as a squad player but I cant imagine Lindelöf is coming and saving us when we are defending 1-0 lead OR Casemero/Scott marshalling midfield in those situations or the attackers scoring 2 goals in last 10 mins, This was clearly visible in last 2 years when we were defending the lead in last 15-20 mins or need to score.

As much as I love to see them do well for us, I think it is better to move out these players and find some reliable ones to make a top team (look at city,real depth)
 
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kps88 said:
Midfield is still very light to me. Can't really trust Casemiro, Eriksen or Mctominay. Wide attacking positions are also a concern but I think we'll just have to gamble on Rashford, Sancho and Antony coming good.
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Yeah definitely need Ugarte and either Rabiot (yes I know) or Amrabat. Obviously we are still lacking a deep lying playmaker but it will have to wait. Shame we couldn't sell Rashford and Antony because could then have made a real play for Williams/Kvaratskelia
 
Lets throw some names out there. if Ugarte, Neves and Zubamendi cost too much, what are the alternatives? Which midfielder, linked or not, would be someone you'd like to see at United that is a realistic option?
 
DutchSerb said:
Lets throw some names out there. if Ugarte, Neves and Zubamendi cost too much, what are the alternatives? Which midfielder, linked or not, would be someone you'd like to see at United that is a realistic option?
Click to expand...

Depends what sort of midfield profile, are you talking about a DM or more of a deep lying playmaker
 
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diarm said:
Did we include a buyback of any type in that deal?
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No, but he wouldn't cost more than 20 million euros I guess, since his contract is up in 2025. Also we have a good relationship with Lille now.
 
In:
Ugarte €45m
De ligt €50m
Rabiot (free)
Full back.

Out:
Eriksen €5m
Maguire €30m
Mctominay €25m
AWB €20m
 
TheNewEra said:
In:
Ugarte €45m
De ligt €50m
Rabiot (free)
Full back.

Out:
Eriksen €5m
Maguire €30m
Mctominay €25m
AWB €20m
Click to expand...

Kadioglu as the full back maybe

So you think Lindelof stays over Maguire?

Still concerned about the lack of experienced goalscorer in the squad,maybe we can get to January and pick someone up then
 
Ins

Kadıoğlu
De Ligt
Zubimendi
Sverre Nypan loan back to Rosenberg
Amrabat or Gudio Rodriquez (still available free transfer)

Outs
Mctominey
Casimero
AWB
Antony
Maguire
Lindelof
 
The-Mezzala said:
Ins

Kadıoğlu
De Ligt
Zubimendi
Sverre Nypan loan back to Rosenberg
Amrabat or Gudio Rodriquez (still available free transfer)

Outs
Mctominey
Casimero
AWB
Antony
Maguire
Lindelof
Click to expand...

Can't see Casemiro sold without Saudi interest
 
What is our strongest XI currently without any more signings or sales?

I keep in mind that we won our last 3 matches with Fernandes as the false 9
 
LawCharltonBest said:
What is our strongest XI currently without any more signings or sales?

I keep in mind that we won our last 3 matches with Fernandes as the false 9
Click to expand...
---------------Onana
Dalot--Yoro--Martinez--Shaw
------Casemiro--Mainoo
Garnacho--Bruno--Rashford
----------------Hojlund

A case can be made for Amad over Rashford and Zirkzee over Hojlund.

We still need a starting DM to replace Casemiro, and backup CB(to replace Maguire/Lindelof), backup CM(to replace McT/Eriksen), and backup FB(to replace AWB).
 
Central midfield is our one glaring weakness at the minute.
Currently we're going into the season with:

Mainoo - who is a brilliant prospect and absolutely deserves to be in the first XI, but we'd be stupid to rely on him as a first choicer to start every match. It's not in either of our interests to put that responsibility on him this early.

Casemiro - who is still capable of playing passes that only Eriksen can better and is our best aerial threat, but has no legs or stamina.

McTominay - who has the most energy of our midfielders, is our biggest goal threat from CM, and is probably our best option when it comes to ball progression through midfield. But he is positionally poor, is a limited passer and goes hiding too easily.

Eriksen - the best passer of the lot, but has no legs and is too easily bypassed.


We should be looking at two CMs regardless of sales. One needs to be a certified starter, and the other an option to rotate with Mainoo.
 
Finding a CM to accompany Mainoo is an absolute priority.
I can't trust our progress unless we address this issue that has been unresolved for years.
Not to mention it would also help De Ligt and Yoro to settle in and strengthen our defense.
 
aeh1991 said:
Would put the backup FB as top priority, so we can finally sell AWB
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I see where you're coming from but in my opinion it is the least important position and would rather improve our spine first. Even if Casemiro comes good this season he can't play so many games.

We are also 1 CB injury away from having to play in a completely different way, which for me is unacceptable and a repeat of last season. Just thinking about it gives me PTSD.
 
we've had a lot of talk about whether or not we should be adding a forward other than Zirkzee given we would have him, Rasmus, Garnacho, Rashford, Amad, Pellestri

i just don't think we have the quality in that group to score enough goals to fight for the league title

now take that into account and look at liverpool who have Nunez, Salah, Diaz, Gakpo, Jota who is clearly a better attacking group than we have YET they are heavily linked with Japanese star Takefusa Kubo for 71m
 
bosskeano said:
we've had a lot of talk about whether or not we should be adding a forward other than Zirkzee given we would have him, Rasmus, Garnacho, Rashford, Amad, Pellestri

i just don't think we have the quality in that group to score enough goals to fight for the league title

now take that into account and look at liverpool who have Nunez, Salah, Diaz, Gakpo, Jota who is clearly a better attacking group than we have YET they are heavily linked with Japanese star Takefusa Kubo for 71m
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I think we have to forget the notion of challenging for the title for another few seasons just yet. We are building a future team, not one for right now.

We’ve not taken any giant steps in recruitment that vastly improves this team from last year yet. Maybe in 2-3 years Rasmus, Garnacho, Mainoo, Amad, Yoro are in a far better and more competent space to go and do something and I think they can just not right now.

I also think Rasmus will score plenty of goals if we can sort out the service and create some proper chances for him.
We still need at least 1 other CB and 2-3 midfielders and possibly a RB. Then hope we can move some on to be able to look at a creative winger type
 
bosskeano said:
we've had a lot of talk about whether or not we should be adding a forward other than Zirkzee given we would have him, Rasmus, Garnacho, Rashford, Amad, Pellestri

i just don't think we have the quality in that group to score enough goals to fight for the league title

now take that into account and look at liverpool who have Nunez, Salah, Diaz, Gakpo, Jota who is clearly a better attacking group than we have YET they are heavily linked with Japanese star Takefusa Kubo for 71m
Click to expand...

Who should be added do you think?
 
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