Westminster Politics

africanspur said:
Again, have I said at any point that all brown people are to be celebrated or held up as role models?

Thanks for the suggestion but this teenager doesn't think that Sunak is a good person or has the best interests of other minorities at heart.

In fact, his viewpoint is pretty similar to yours in that paragraph funnily enough. Which I've said, probably 3 or 4 times now.

Yet still you and others say the same thing about sunak being a terrible person, as if literally anyone in this thread has said otherwise.

Some of the points are genuinely baffling, having never made them or anything akin to them at all.
Click to expand...

Because it winds me up mate that's why.

We watched Theresa May snuggly make a speech a few weeks ago during PMQs about the Tories now having 3 female prime ministers and suggesting they're this super progressive opportunities for all party which we know they aren't.

So if there are now young kids of British Indian descent looking at this and seeing it as a good thing it does concern me. We've already seen how many idiots there are in the current population who think Boris is relsteable because he messes up his hair and acts like a bumbling idiot.

So how many other people are gonna be out there who don't follow politics but see Sunak as a PM with the same skin tone as them and thus decide they want to support him and the Tories.

And then we will have to read all the articles and propoganda about the first minority PM again portraying the tories as progressive which they're not and never have been.

So yeah it frustrates me because your friends teenage son is just one example of the sheer propoganda which will come from this. And for me that is gravely concerning.

Edit: To clarify any minority in the top position is a good thing and I do agree with the basis of your argument. I really do. But I refuse to give this Tory government any credit after the austerity they've put upon all of us this last decade. I don't trust them and it worries me that they'll gaslight some naive people with this appointment. Because they're just a bunch of narcissists trying to grip power and theyre racist to the core.
 
lsd said:
One thing I never understand about politics especially here is the fuss that gets made about how rich a person is

While I'm no fan of Sunak or the Tories I fail to grasp why it matters how much money he happens to have.

Surely all that matters is what they actually do in the role as they are all rich anyway including the Labour Members he just happens to be richer than the rest.
Click to expand...
Relatability I guess. I suppose it's one thing that lots of politicians are posh privately educated individual but he and his wife are worth a shedload more than even your wealthy Tory MP or member.
 
Does Penny think she'll get anything in return for backing Rishi 1 minute before the nomination close?
 
VP89 said:
Does Penny think she'll get anything in return for backing Rishi 1 minute before the nomination close?
Click to expand...
Would be very surprised if she doesn't at least get offered a top job.
 
Second unelected PM in a month. Mm yum yum yum love this country so much.
 
Wilt said:
She’ll get feck all my guess ….or home sec
Click to expand...
altodevil said:
Would be very surprised if she doesn't at least get offered a top job.
Click to expand...
Well it'l be interesting either way!

For what its worth I think Rishi is acutally a lot more sound than people give credit. Whether he'll be enough to lead us to economic recovery and unite the nation who knows. I'm labour but at this stage I just want a rational thinker on board.
 
ThehatchetMan said:
Is that not a problem in itself though? 2 working class people that live in a council estate and go to a public school and play sports together. But the Asian kid relates more to a rich privately educated person with billionaire in laws than the friend they grew up with because they share the same skin tone?

So why would I feel represented because white men from powerful rich families have previously held esteemed positions of power?
It's quite obvious here what the growing trend is. Class means more than race when it comes to the highest positions of power. And thus I won't celebrate people based on skin colour.
As I've already said women in the UK were anything but excited by Thatcher being the first woman PM. And they felt the same about May and Truss too. Because these aren't relsteable women or role models, they judge them by their character and history.

You didn't say it but your post assumed it. You brought racism into the post talking about the racism his parents would have experienced. I'm simply highlighting that Irish people have also been treated horribly by the British.

I didn't think his parents were asylum seekers or suggest that? I said that had his parents been asylum seekers today that Suella would be sending them to Rwanda. And would he celebrate her had she got the top position on the basis of having the same skin tone? Basically I was just trying to highlight that her immigration policy in itself is racist and would have impacted many of those contributing to the UK today had it been implemented a century ago.

The kid by excited all he likes. I just don't think it's a cause worth celebrating. And honestly I'm exhausted by listening to these tories trying to portray themselves as some sort of progressive party with opportunities for all. And it's grossly concerning that some young British Indian kids might be looking at this and thinking "I want to be a tory. Look at Braverman, Patel, Sunak. This is a party which gives us opportunities". So I stand by my point whereby people should be judged on their character and their actions first and foremost, not their skin colour. And as a result of this, this isn't news worth celebrating for anyone of any age. But by this friends sons reaction, it shows how the tory party will now infiltrate and gain support in some quarters because of Sunaks skin colour. And that for me is concerning because this tory party is fuelled by racism with a handful of sellouts willing to represent them for personal gain rather than for the good of the people.
Click to expand...

Who said they relate more to the upper class brown guy? I'm saying that it's a totally novel sight for him. Seeing someone of the same skin colour is am almost impossible sight in the UK and across the West. That doesn't normalise that people like him can be in positions of power. Sometimes the reasons for that are explicit, sometimes implicit. But there is something about growing up and not seeing yourself represented in such positions at all.

I didn't say that you feel I represented by them. But a white kid growing up still grows up surrounded by white faces in positions of power. Of course, those faces are generally from a certain class background as you rightly point out and this creates great barriers to those from working class backgrounds, white or not. But the difference here is that a poor working class Bill in 2000 may have looked and thought....no chance of thay for me, it's full of rich toffs! But a working class Sanjay would look and think....no chance of that for me, they're all white rich toffs. The difference is subtle but there and simply provides yet another mental roadblock.

I'm not sure why you presume to speak for all British women, I certainly wouldn't. A quick search now seems to show that more women voted for Thatcher than didn't when she was pm. I wouldn't know what the general population would think now as almost everyone within my circles despises her with a passion.

My post didn't even come close to suggesting that white people can't experience racism or that the Irish haven't had an appalling time at the hands of the British either.

But why even bring up the Rwanda boats policy then? He's against the policy because he's a normal human being, he doesn't need to imagine his brown middle class parents fleeing across the sea to empathise with those people.

Jesus christ. Again,he doesn't support the tories, nor does he see sunak as a role model. I don't really know how many more times or ways I can say it.
 
Sunak will likely last longer than Truss, but I wouldn't be confident that it will be significantly longer.
 
lsd said:
One thing I never understand about politics especially here is the fuss that gets made about how rich a person is

While I'm no fan of Sunak or the Tories I fail to grasp why it matters how much money he happens to have.

Surely all that matters is what they actually do in the role as they are all rich anyway including the Labour Members he just happens to be richer than the rest.
Click to expand...
Fully Fledged said:
Empathy.
Click to expand...
Sparky_Hughes said:
for me, its because if we have a HoC filled with primarily very wealthy individuals who are they expected to make policy relating to the vast majority of the country, who arent. They dont have the relevant experience to know what struggles and hardships people face, and that would be ok, if they then selected a few people WITH that experience to advise them, but they wont, it will be mor oxbridge etonian twats, or sons of friends etc.
Click to expand...
Smores said:
It's not his current wealth that's key but his upbringing. You think Rees-Mogg for instance has a valid perception of the lives lived by most of the country? Its a simple matter of personal insight.
Click to expand...
saivet said:
Relatability I guess. I suppose it's one thing that lots of politicians are posh privately educated individual but he and his wife are worth a shedload more than even your wealthy Tory MP or member.
Click to expand...
 
lsd said:
One thing I never understand about politics especially here is the fuss that gets made about how rich a person is

While I'm no fan of Sunak or the Tories I fail to grasp why it matters how much money he happens to have.

Surely all that matters is what they actually do in the role as they are all rich anyway including the Labour Members he just happens to be richer than the rest.
Click to expand...

I think the major issue is that they make policy which ends up impacting on the general population and do so whilst totally insulated by its effects.

He's wealthy, that's his business. But using his support of brexit as an example. It barely affects him. Not nosy because his vast wealth insulates him against any negative economic effect but because that level of wealth also offers a degree of free movement that he just campaigned to remove from those who don't have that safety net.

Much easier to say let them eat cake when you've got a whole mansion full of food ready to go when your policies kick in.
 
Solius said:
Second unelected PM in a month. Mm yum yum yum love this country so much.
Click to expand...
Even though I don't like it we don't vote for the PM but for a MP because of that fact they have still got a majority they can have as many different people running the country as they chose. We have an elected government not a president.

As I said I don't like it but it's the Democracy that have got.
 
Let Tory battle commence...
Will there be unity.
Will they rally around Sunak.
Will the posturing progressively become corrosive.
Will the Boris worshippers stand behind Sunak.
Or will he last for the next 2 years....
 
Fully Fledged said:
Even though I don't like it we don't vote for the PM but for a MP because of that fact they have still got a majority they can have as many different people running the country as they chose. We have an elected government not a president.

As I said I don't like it but it's the Democracy that have got.
Click to expand...
It's not the democracy we need to have though.
 
@africanspur apologies if my comments in this thread have offended you in anyway.

I despise the tories to the core so the thought of them coming out of this with any form of credit really frustrates me. They're scum.
 
Fully Fledged said:
Even though I don't like it we don't vote for the PM but for a MP because of that fact they have still got a majority they can have as many different people running the country as they chose. We have an elected government not a president.

As I said I don't like it but it's the Democracy that have got.
Click to expand...

I know. It's just an absolute joke that it's allowed. You can just feck up and feck up and still get until 2025.
 
Fully Fledged said:
Even though I don't like it we don't vote for the PM but for a MP because of that fact they have still got a majority they can have as many different people running the country as they chose. We have an elected government not a president.

As I said I don't like it but it's the Democracy that have got.
Click to expand...

It's a bit of a weird combination here isn't it, especially in recent years. We have a parliamentary democracy with presidential-style leadership campaigns and general elections all being about voting in the PM.
 
Balljy said:
It's a bit of a weird combination here isn't it, especially in recent years. We have a parliamentary democracy with presidential-style leadership campaigns and general elections all being about voting in the PM.
Click to expand...
It is. People did vote for BoJo not the party or their MP.
 
How long do we give him?

Despite all the support in-house, the Tory electorate are quite clearly fuming. It's a shame the first Non-White PM had to be from the Tory party and someone who can literally afford to wipe his arse with pound notes.

I don't think the power struggle goes away, but the 'Party Unity' rhetoric seems to be the only thing keeping their engine running, although that was the case 48 days ago too.
 
lsd said:
One thing I never understand about politics especially here is the fuss that gets made about how rich a person is

While I'm no fan of Sunak or the Tories I fail to grasp why it matters how much money he happens to have.

Surely all that matters is what they actually do in the role as they are all rich anyway including the Labour Members he just happens to be richer than the rest.
Click to expand...

They’ve never lived the life they’re proposing to make policies to govern…

They’ve never lived anything CLOSE to it.

They have contempt for it.

That’s why the country is collapsing.
 
Buster15 said:
Let Tory battle commence... who is going to kick off the blue on blue tweets - my bet would be Dorries
Will there be unity. Unlikely
Will they rally around Sunak. Something about keep your friends close and...
Will the posturing progressively become corrosive. Is it not already?
Will the Boris worshippers stand behind Sunak. Close enough to knife him for sure
Or will he last for the next 2 years.... Will he last 2 months?
Click to expand...


im expecting more of this from her shortly
 
VP89 said:
Well it'l be interesting either way!

For what its worth I think Rishi is acutally a lot more sound than people give credit. Whether he'll be enough to lead us to economic recovery and unite the nation who knows. I'm labour but at this stage I just want a rational thinker on board.
Click to expand...
Imagine the financial markets will think him a safe bet
 
On the plus side, it isn't as if Labour is lead by someone who can't hammer the stupidity of Sunak's 'Eat Out To Help Out' scheme, because he both went along with and took part in it. Oh. Nevermind.
 
sun_tzu said:


im expecting more of this from her shortly
Click to expand...


And they have just said that Boris had 102 votes verified by 1922 Committee.
Sunak had a big decision on the structure of his cabinet. And Boris in or out of it.
 
ThierryHenry said:
:lol:

I love how humiliating this process has been for Boris's public backers, Guido Fawkes... and err, the one public backer of Guido on redcafe.
Click to expand...

Buster15 said:
And they have just said that Boris had 102 votes verified by 1922 Committee.
Click to expand...

Suspect he will be working behind the scenes to bring things crashing down in a GE so he can oust Sunak afterwards
 
My crazy indian family have already started with bizarre forwards.

"Hail Indians
We are captains of Industry
We now rule our past rulers
The ruled have become the rulers.
Jai Hind"


I'm proud of my race and heritage but please make it stop
 
It will be interesting to see exactly what the Tory right do next. Will they get behind Sunak knowing success would mean him staying on as the GE candidate, or will they undermine him at every opportunity and basically burn down what's left of the party.
 
Zen86 said:
It will be interesting to see exactly what the Tory right do next. Will they get behind Sunak knowing success would mean him staying on as the GE candidate, or will they undermine him at every opportunity and basically burn down what's left of the party.
Click to expand...
Think they will wait to see if hes prepared to let the NI protocal become a bigger problem with the EU - if he is and will sabre rattle for a full on trade war with the EU then the ERG will probably give him some time - if not they will get in line behind Dorries to stick the knife in and call for an election
 
You must log in or register to reply here.