No, comparing Ronaldo with Pogba and coming to the conclusion that Pogba is/was the better player, is nonsense.
Who is comparing the maturity of the two? Adnan has brought up Ronaldo, for some reason.
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We will never win the league with Paul Pogba in the team
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No, comparing Ronaldo with Pogba and coming to the conclusion that Pogba is/was the better player, is nonsense.
Who is comparing the maturity of the two? Adnan has brought up Ronaldo, for some reason.
Every player, in every position, will come out badly when compared to Ronaldo. It’s as unfair a comparison as it is silly (I know you didn’t make it @noodlehair)
Ronaldo was afew months shy of his 24th birthday when he won it actually.
Not every player, and definitely not in half his time with United.
How do you mean rightly? He was only 18/19 ffs and he wasn’t even the best player in the reserves! He had no consistency
Mostly because he wasn't trusted to start over Rafael and Park (who was having his worst season ever). At that point, the trust to stay at United and feel like he will get sufficient playing time just wasn't there. You can't argue with the results. He shined the very next season with Juve. We can speculate that he might have played more with United in the next season, but you could not know that at the time Pogba made his decision to leave.
I’ve seen people comparing him to De Bruyne, but I doubt Kevin would look as good in a double pivot.
That was 1 match.. ONE
I think he was led astray by his agent
It’s obviously worked out for him but I wish people would stop rewriting history. He wasn’t great in the reserves so he didn’t warrant being put straight in
This OP and thread has become legendary. It’s like an all out attempt to break the world record for the number of times of being wrong.
Elephant in the room mark 2.
With France he mostly plays in a middlefield 3. He is not the main man. He is not the playmaker either - Payet is.
What he does is pop in now and then with a good goal or a good pass. But he certainly has not carried the team at all.
He may be the most hyped player in the French team but definitely is not the most important.
I'd say we (France) would be better with Tolisso and Kante as the two anchoring the middlefield and one player further up the pitch.
At Juve he had Marchisio, Pirlo and Vidal playing around him and wasn't expected to carry the team as he was still a young player learning his trade. And I don't think he has made the step up yet.
But I hope he some day he will.
What he does is pop in now and then with a good goal or a good pass. But he certainly has not carried the team at all.
He may be the most hyped player in the French team but definitely is not the most important.
I'd say we (France) would be better with Tolisso and Kante as the two anchoring the middlefield and one player further up the pitch.
At Juve he had Marchisio, Pirlo and Vidal playing around him and wasn't expected to carry the team as he was still a young player learning his trade. And I don't think he has made the step up yet.
But I hope he some day he will.
Actually he was doing alright for the reserves, and it wasn't until we had to start playing him on the wings to make room for Gibson that he started underperforming with the reserves. At least that's my memory of what happened then. I'm sorry, but one game made a big deal in his mind. Park is not a midfielder and was having his worst season for us. He was clearly on the decline starting that year. Rafael is not a midfielder and was trusted over Pogba.
What matters is the confidence Pogba had in getting significant playing time the next season. That is why he demanded that contract clause (which was ridiculous and Fergie was right to not give it). He just no longer had that confidence. He made the right choice to leave as he got significant playing time the very next season in a midfield where I originally thought was much tougher to get in the lineup. Fair play to him.
Oh great if you ignore a member who started the thread you don't see the thread anymore.
Swell.
Swell.
We were talking about his first three seasons here, which is before. In any case, I do get your point Pogba should impose himself on games consistently and perform to instructions rather than do whatever he wants/prefers.
I don't think playing in a midfield two will ever get the best out of him, but when asked to do so he has to get on with that assignment.
I ment the opening post, not Pogba
I knew that, was joking. Don't blame you for thinking otherwise though in this place right now
Not sure if this has been posted but I just read a stat that the Spurs defeat ended Pogba's 36-game unbeaten run in the premier league. Assuming this is true.....it would counter the OP surely?
Bingo!
He's never actually 'carried' or run a team to any great level. And he doesn't show any of the characteristics of somebody who can do so.
He's a player that you really drop into a fully functioning team, and he'll add gloss and support players that are better than him.
It would be a concern if any team was reliant on Pogba to lead them to success. Likewise Di Maria. Some players have lots of ability, but just can't be built around for major success. Ozil is another example. He supports better players to a high level, and you would be silly to build around him or to have him as your main man.
Pogba could be world class if used properly. 3 man midfield.
No he's not.
He hasn't come even close to living up to the hype. He's had good games, but no more so than some of the others. It's not knee jerk either - take off the rose tinted specs and count how often he actually gives the ball away. He's not consistent but people believe what they're told.
I think Pogba has tremendous potential. He is so strong and very skillful. The biggest problem I have with him is his decision making. Dribbing when he shouldn't (taking on 2 or 3 players near our own penalty area), not making the simple pass when it is clearly the better option or passing when he should be driving into space with the ball himself. As a result he does lose the ball a lot. Hopefully as he matures he'll improve. Good to know that Mourinho is not afraid to take him on and sit him down when needed.
A lot of revisionist history going on with people now saying he's not our best player. Ok fine let's lose him for another 3 months and see how we get on.
Don't visit this end of the forum often but wow what a thread. The guy has had a couple of average games and only one terrible one, has been mostly good or great for you.
If you will never win the premier league with him in the team, its certainly not because of him.
If you will never win the premier league with him in the team, its certainly not because of him.
Yep what’s that stupid “thing” to underrate him like that. He is good when used properly. Even Alexis Sanchez loses the ball ffs. But the impact those guys have or the space they create by attracting all the players, that’s what matters.
So, younger than Pogba is now then. He was also runner up the year before...with the award being based on the year beading up to the award. Pogba isn't going to be winning United's player of the year award, never mind anything else.
I don't understand what you point is here? You're not going to convince anyone on either side of the fence that Pogba is better than Ronaldo.
You're inventing an argument no one is interested in having.
It's not really revisionist. He's our best player when he turns up (and De Gea doesn't have to do anything). He rarely turns up when it matters though.
He turned up against Arsenal, but even then De Gea was clearly our best player and won us the game. Pogba set up a couple of goals for us while we were left so open in midfield that Arsenal had about 50 chances. Then he got himself sent off.
There's been no point this seaosn wher ehe has been our best player with anything approaching consistency. There was only one smmall run of form last season from him in the lead up to Christmas.
That's not much from someone who is the team's "best player"
Do you even understand what you read at times?
I never said Pogba is a better player than Ronaldo. What I said was, many would argue that Pogba in his formative years at Juve was better than what Ronaldo showed for us in his first 3 seasons. @antohan even corrected you, but you don't seem to grasp or want to understand that.
What I don't understand is why people think "moving him further forward" will somehow magically make his decision making better. It will make it more important, not better.
Not sure how the logic works that because Pogba is playing in a midfield three, he'll suddenly pass the ball to someone in space instead of trying to take on three defenders and have a shot.
No, if you want a fair comparison Pogba's age at Juventus makes him comparable to the LAST three years Ronaldo was at United. Not the first three. Ronaldo is 32...that means he was 23 when he left United.
What point is it you're even trying to make? Pogba at Juventus was "arguably" better than Ronaldo at United...IF you for no actual reason ignore Ronaldo's three best years at United. What kind of argument is this? Who cares.
A point that has no relevance whatsoever. Plenty of players were better than Ronaldo in those first three years. And Ronaldo was 18 when he joined us. How old was Pogba at Juve?
Ronaldo is 33 and he left United at 24. Pogba was 19 when he joined Juventus. From 19-22 Pogba was brilliant and more consistent for Juve than what Ronaldo showed for us in the same time period in comparison. It took Ronaldo three seasons to become consistent in his performances whilst Pogba was basically getting superlatives thrown in his direction by a legend like Pirlo as a teenager. The point is, both players started their careers as teenagers at two huge clubs and you can make a case for Pogba being more consistent in his performances in that time period compared to Ronaldo. Pogba is still relatively young at 24 and I'm confident he's gonna add to his stellar reputation in the coming years.
Yep. He's an excellent player but struggles big times when games get congested. I don't see how anyone can deny that based on actually watching our games. He essentially oscillates from magnificent to irrelevant even thought the ratio is of course easily in favour of the former.
But if we want to win big trophies it is needless to say that we need our supposed talisman to improve on these weaknesses.
To be more specific in the tighter games he just looks out of synch with the game both offensively and defensively. Offensively he wants more time than is available and can't adjust to the games faster tempo with less decision making time. Defensively he loses his man and doesn't track runners quick enough.
The title of the thread is sensational but there's a point there which Jose needs to address.
I'm not the one arguing against it. It was a comment I made in an earlier post that someone took issue with. I know there was many players better in the same time period. Ronaldo wasn't even considered the best talent at Sporting when we signed him.
De Gea was amazing but no way we were going to score 3 against Arsenal without him. Also I think the person you mean to criticise is Mourinho for playing Pogba in a system he shouldn't be; no way I can criticize him against Arsenal. I can't remember a time at Juve when he played as a DM. Because no way he would've gotten into FIFA XI playing there and certainly no way he would cost as much as he did.
I think it's more a case of him trying to do to much rather than "not turning up" as you put. He has all the required attributes to make him one of the worlds best midfielders - exceptional passing range, great vision and awareness, pace and stamina in abundance, physically able and he can seemlessly adabt to a variety of roles in the midfield area. Everything he needs to succeed at the very highest level of the game. No other player currently at the club comes close to his ability level by comparison.
The issue with Pogba is that he tries to do too much, like dribbling past 3-4 opposition players or attempting those extravagant Hollywood balls that he seems so keen on. I'm not sure if it's over confidence in his own ability or even a lack of confidence in his team mates ability that forces him to adopt the "if I don't do it no one else will" approach, but one way or another he has to stop overdoing it and learn to keep it simple.
For the record if we do win the league over the next couple of years - and I firmly believe we will - then it will be because of Pogba's influence on the team rather than in spite of him.
Yep, got it in one. We may have a lot more fans than you, but nobody ever vouched for their quality.
He wasn’t great on the one occasion I saw him in the flesh: the debacle in the League Cup at home to Crystal Palace. Saint Ravel was crap as well. The only reserve who looked half decent was Diouf. ‘Nuff said...
Apart from de Gea, who is our best player in their eyes? Hasn't every player gone through bad form? Rashford, Martial, Lukaku, etc... It's clear Pogba has been our best player. Really weird for people to disagree with that.
A world class player can play in any position and formation, Pogba can be a phenomenal on he’s day but then so can anyone.
Well, to be fair, not all midfielders are complete as well.
Look at Ozil or kroos. Ozil doesn't even dare shoot from outside the box anymore. He has no power. Kroos is too defensive now and most of his shots are weak.
Some playes like xhaka can only shoot but overall play (dribbling and passing) is poor.
Some players can't defend as they are too small eg David silva.
Of course, they are some good in defence but their attack isn't as good as pogba.
No one can match pogba's potential and ability
Look at Ozil or kroos. Ozil doesn't even dare shoot from outside the box anymore. He has no power. Kroos is too defensive now and most of his shots are weak.
Some playes like xhaka can only shoot but overall play (dribbling and passing) is poor.
Some players can't defend as they are too small eg David silva.
Of course, they are some good in defence but their attack isn't as good as pogba.
No one can match pogba's potential and ability
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