We are an awfully coached team

Jezpeza said:
how do you rate telles and dalot out of interest? Quality?
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telles has had a good career pre united. dalot is a joke i dont see anything

but the problem is still the coaching, not sure why a thread called 'we are an awfully coached team' has turned into a player bashing thread. we have better players than nearly every team in the league and look the worse team most weeks
 
Crashoutcassius said:
telles has had a good career pre united. dalot is a joke i dont see anything

but the problem is still the coaching, not sure why a thread called 'we are an awfully coached team' has turned into a player bashing thread. we have better players than nearly every team in the league and look the worse team most weeks
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i think we think we have better players
 
Crashoutcassius said:
go back a few pages and nobody blaming the players just the coaching... now we have 'bottom 6 players' hahaha
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The answer is somewhere in between. Some of our players are playing a level below where they should be and some are playing at their natural level. Others are mentally and physically checked out.

Our defensive lineup keeps switching every game, our tactics drift from one game to the next. There's no cohesion in the team. When our first team selection doesn't work out we look at the bench and Rangnick see's 3 CB's. I don't get Rangnicks choices in the last few weeks at all. Granted you don't want to throw a youngster into this mess, but whats the point of having 3 CBs on the bench? Why not remove one of those and put in a youngster at the very least to give them the experience of a match day?

Rangnick to me seems like a man with clear visions of how he thinks football should be played which is often correct. But struggles to put that into practice and struggles with the every day management of a football club. I'm clutching to the straw of short term pain, long term gain. As the decisions Rangnick has made since joining the club have been... bewildering.
 
It really hasn’t helped that Ralf has had to cobble together a coaching team out of nowhere. His guy who probably would have been his assistant took his job at Lokomotiv Moscow (a move he probably regrets now with the whole Ukraine thing). I think Ralf was hoping at least one of Carrick or McKenna would have stayed, but Carrick has taken a sabbatical and McKenna got the Ipswich job.

So yeah, a perfect storm as to why we suck as a team.
 
Rangnick just isn't capable of motivating or organising this team in its current state. You can tell he has given up by his press conferences.

Having said that, Im not sure many could do much with this side. The new manager has to come in and cull the dead wood.
 
Crashoutcassius said:
just think its funny that nobody thought that when ole was the coach and 2nd place was called a failure
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i was never really one who bashed ole. If we didnt sign CR7 which forced us to try and play possession based football and stuck to his counter attacking stuff we’d probably be above chelsea as theyve not had a great season. Albeit with the odd frustrating results and blanks against smaller sides. All his bashers were too busy saying ‘told you so’ to acknowledge it was the attempted change of style that did for him.

AWB, Shaw, Maguire and Rashford are ones that have been in awful form but will be very good again if they regain form. Its just i cant stand seeing the likes of lingard, telles, dalot, on the pitch. They were never and will never be united quality. Its not even a form thing
 
RedBanker said:
Ralf's situation is untenable really. He doesn't have the dressing room. Most players don't give a damn. And he leaves in a few weeks now. So do most of the players tbh. But yes overall, since being appointed he has had zero impact on our results and hasn't improved our fortunes whatsoever. Failure.
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Yes but you’re not going to get a tune out of this squad. Its too unbalanced, packed with extremely average and over the hill players.
 
RedSky said:
Fred, a somewhat capable midfielder prone to brain farts.
Matic, a very good passer but slow as feck, his legs were gone 2 years ago let alone this season.
McTominay, he's a very, very average midfielder. I struggle to name one thing he's good at. Doesn't score goals anymore either.
Pogba, lazy but very good on the ball. Defensively shocking.

Those are our options.... these are the same options we've had for what, three seasons now? It's just woeful. Fred can do a job as a squad player and Pogba is the very definition of a luxury player. None should be starting for us and yet here we are. It's borderline insane.
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We sent Garner, Pallestri, and Van de Beek on loan along with Laird, and Williams. We could have done with a couple of these over the season.
Also I cannot understand why we didn't bring in Kamara in January, for 10million. This could have been the difference in getting top 4 place.
 
Bestietom said:
We sent Garner, Pallestri, and Van de Beek on loan along with Laird, and Williams. We could have done with a couple of these over the season.
Also I cannot understand why we didn't bring in Kamara in January, for 10million. This could have been the difference in getting top 4 place.
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It's been explained numerous times why we didn't make any signings in January.
 
Media suggest the new coaching team (ten Hag, McLaren, Van der Gaag, Ramsey) have modernized United a lot and it's a world away from recent seasons

How much do we think the improved coaching will improve the team
 
LawCharltonBest said:
Media suggest the new coaching team (ten Hag, McLaren, Van der Gaag, Ramsey) have modernized United a lot and it's a world away from recent seasons

How much do we think the improved coaching will improve the team
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Been saying it for ages, but it'll be a night and day difference. Obviously only 1-2 weeks so far so not yet, but over the season thatll be the biggest difference. You go from Ole, to Rangnicks with a bunch of MLS coaches as interim, to Ten Hag who developed Ajax into their brilliant play. Its a world of difference and it'll show more than any player signing.
 
LawCharltonBest said:
Media suggest the new coaching team (ten Hag, McLaren, Van der Gaag, Ramsey) have modernized United a lot and it's a world away from recent seasons

How much do we think the improved coaching will improve the team
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Im hoping for a big improvement. Just the fact we now have a proper coach/manager will make a huge difference, and this is with out any major incomings so far.
 
LawCharltonBest said:
Media suggest the new coaching team (ten Hag, McLaren, Van der Gaag, Ramsey) have modernized United a lot and it's a world away from recent seasons

How much do we think the improved coaching will improve the team
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I think it's a great start and will only get better. Too many times I watched United last season and we had no style, no plan. This year I expect us to at least look like we have a style of play, an idea of how to create and score.

ETH will also know this time next year which players are not going to make it in his United team, and what is needed to take us up to the next level. I'm excited for the season ahead.
 
LawCharltonBest said:
Media suggest the new coaching team (ten Hag, McLaren, Van der Gaag, Ramsey) have modernized United a lot and it's a world away from recent seasons

How much do we think the improved coaching will improve the team
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Assuming he can get the players to buy in to it, we should notice a significant improvement. But it will take time. The main beneficiaries will surely be the younger players, who will hopefully now see United as a place where they can develop and hone their skills.

Overall, the biggest difference is likely to be in the buildup phase, where we have been stuck in a 90s time wharp for at least six years. It will also be nice to watch a team with a discernible style of play.
 
LawCharltonBest said:
Media suggest the new coaching team (ten Hag, McLaren, Van der Gaag, Ramsey) have modernized United a lot and it's a world away from recent seasons

How much do we think the improved coaching will improve the team
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Logic would say some will improve some will suffer. I think Sancho will do well anyway.

Either way I reckon it'll be another tough season ahead, it'll take time regardless of new signings or not.

Not really sure what is "interesting" to watch here. It's a small clip but from the looks of it they need a lot of work on first touch and ball retention.
 
Cautious optimism for me. Does feel good to have a coach with a style of play.

Hopefully he’s backed with players that can implement it quickly.
 
Training is nice and all... I'm just afraid during actual matches it'll be the same shit all over again. Fred giving the ball away, Maguire panicking, De Gea kicking it out for a throw in. I have nightmares about those.
 
Keefy18 said:
Not really sure what is "interesting" to watch here. It's a small clip but from the looks of it they need a lot of work on first touch and ball retention.
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There’s nothing.



ETH is clearly a better coach than say Ole but it’s impossible to tell from short clips. A lot of this stuff is just branding for clicks, happens every time a new manager comes in. Just as useful to talk about the stars signs of United players and what it means for the season.
 
Same guys said ralfs video analysis had us playing better after one session with him. It's all on the pitch through a season. Nothing to learn watching a few clips, just people confirming what they previously believe, whatever that may be
 
Sweet Square said:
There’s nothing.



ETH is clearly a better coach than say Ole but it’s impossible to tell from short clips. A lot of this stuff is just branding for clicks, happens every time a new manager comes in. Just as useful to talk about the stars signs of United players and what it means for the season.
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Of course, I wouldn't argue otherwise.

We'll only see it, if at all in a few months most likely.
 
Keefy18 said:
Logic would say some will improve some will suffer. I think Sancho will do well anyway.

Either way I reckon it'll be another tough season ahead, it'll take time regardless of new signings or not.

Not really sure what is "interesting" to watch here. It's a small clip but from the looks of it they need a lot of work on first touch and ball retention.
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Seems like they only bought enough bibs for one group. That's what happens if you alienate Mike Phelan - the king of the bib.
 
tenpoless said:
Training is nice and all... I'm just afraid during actual matches it'll be the same shit all over again. Fred giving the ball away, Maguire panicking, De Gea kicking it out for a throw in. I have nightmares about those.
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Then those players will need to be dropped and / or replaced with players who are capable of performing ten Hags instructions.

That’s what backing a manager is.

It isn’t just buying who he wants - it’s supporting him when shit gets going IN a season.

This is what Utd keep failing to do, and it’s something that many (not all) Utd fans seem to miss when talking of ‘backing the manager’.

It’s why the club keeps changing managers and has built a toxic dressing room, imo at least.
 
Keefy18 said:
Logic would say some will improve some will suffer. I think Sancho will do well anyway.
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Yeah that’s pretty much it. Some players will be able to adapt to this new style and others won’t and will hopefully be phased out with time.
 
It’s the first time we’ve appointed a coach with a track record of executing modern tactical ideas. Bet it’s something of a culture shock to the players.
 
Rhyme Animal said:
Then those players will need to be dropped and / or replaced with players who are capable of performing ten Hags instructions.

That’s what backing a manager is.

It isn’t just buying who he wants - it’s supporting him when shit gets going IN a season.

This is what Utd keep failing to do, and it’s something that many (not all) Utd fans seem to miss when talking of ‘backing the manager’.

It’s why the club keeps changing managers and has built a toxic dressing room, imo at least.
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Agree.
 
Realistically I expect us to start well in terms of team spirit, effort and trying to play better football.
Results in most cases will follow

but I do think players not used to a higher intensity, will struggle later the season
will it eventually play off.
 
Hopefully this thread can be closed, locked archived and banished to the history books.
Looking forward to the change next year. There will be a lot of downs but long term I am positive
 
tenpoless said:
Training is nice and all... I'm just afraid during actual matches it'll be the same shit all over again. Fred giving the ball away, Maguire panicking, De Gea kicking it out for a throw in. I have nightmares about those.
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Agreed if ETH can get rid of those three 'misteps' alone, he will have hit the ground running for me!
 
Rhyme Animal said:
Then those players will need to be dropped and / or replaced with players who are capable of performing ten Hags instructions.

That’s what backing a manager is.

It isn’t just buying who he wants - it’s supporting him when shit gets going IN a season.

This is what Utd keep failing to do, and it’s something that many (not all) Utd fans seem to miss when talking of ‘backing the manager’.

It’s why the club keeps changing managers and has built a toxic dressing room, imo at least.
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I don't think this is true. There's no use backing a manager if he's past it (LvG, Mourinho) or out of his depth (Moyes, Ole). With the exception of Moyes (who was clearly never good enough anyway) all of those guys got plenty of time, and I'd say both our fans (at least our match-going ones) and our board were far more patient with them than supporters of most other big clubs would've been, and by the time they were sacked it was painfully obvious it wasn't going to work out.

Our issue since SAF hasn't been not backing managers. It has been completely scattershot recruitment (of both managers and players). Hopefully that will change now.
 
HookedOnAPhelan said:
I don't think this is true. There's no use backing a manager if he's past it (LvG, Mourinho) or out of his depth (Moyes, Ole). With the exception of Moyes (who was clearly never good enough anyway) all of those guys got plenty of time, and I'd say both our fans (at least our match-going ones) and our board were far more patient with them than supporters of most other big clubs would've been, and by the time they were sacked it was painfully obvious it wasn't going to work out.
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They got time and money sure, but because we've invested so poorly and then confounded that problem with another (rewarding the poor players for under achieving) we are in a situation where we've still got players like Jones, Bailly, Shaw, McTominay, Martial etc hanging around.

A manager needs actual alternatives if he is going to drop a player... if Shaw under performs he's replaced by an equally or worse player in Telles. McFred had their spots threatened by an ageing Matic.
 
I suspect the deficiencies of some players will be amplified, a result of the regular lionisation of players for their physical, rather than their technical attributes. Enjoy the ride folks! Its going to be a bumpy first year.
 
mitchmouse said:
Hell - it would be nice to enjoy watching us again!
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That is all I am looking for, well that and to be able to come onto the Caf to a thread titled - We are a beautifully coached team, so we can all partake in the circle jerk of our glorious football
 
Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber said:
I don't care for the media's opinion on the matter. Its as changeable as the wind. The proof will be on our last 2 pre season games if we are indeed making progress
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Why specifically the last 2?

We could play well against Pool (unlikely) then poor in those 2 games you mention.

I'm expecting fits and bursts of form which is completely synonymous with our lot, playing when it suits and vanishing the minute they are put under any pressure.
 
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