We wouldn’t have a Ferrari without Ole and his coaches though. So really it’s Ole at the wheel.
We are an awfully coached team
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We wouldn’t have a Ferrari without Ole and his coaches though. So really it’s Ole at the wheel.
I mean, that is the only way to make sense of the idea that ole is a PE teacher so, it has to be true
Probably about as much as big Sam. Should we get them to manage us instead?
With Bissaka and McFred you will go no where, it’s a mission impossible
4th place and europa league
4th place and europa league
You obviously didn't read the post that I was responding to. I was told nobody thinks Peps football is boring. Just me. Then I pointed out that it's not true. Then it's deflection time. A ad hominem attack on Felix. Why? Here's why that's done.
- The ad hominem attack is irrelevant to the discussion.
- The ad hominem attack is used as primarily as a diversion tactic, either to unjustifiably shift the burden of proof to someone else in the discussion or to change the topic.
- The ad hominem attack involves the faulty premise that an attack against the source of an argument necessarily constitutes a successful refutation of that argument.
No one has said that. But he should know what he's talking about, he has a UEFA B license
That's the bit they all miss, it's his management got us even in this Ferrari stage.
Let's shift on sure go again with someone else with new ideas, and gamble on the coaching being maybe superior but scrap the rest
Thought we were pretty good with that in first half. I was hoping 2nd half will continue the same. Did not.
Should have subbed players sooner.
Should have subbed players sooner.
"Brilliant"?
I think that's a stretch. A manager known more for managing plucky underdogs than the cut and thrust of club football with a juggernaut like United. Not really a fascinating insight to have.
He won the King’s Cup in 2001 and 2003; a tournament organised by the Thai FA. He must know quite a lot.
I honestly don't know what some people expect. We went away to West Ham, we dominated the game, we created numerous chances, we conceded a deflected goal, we still won the game. We had 61% possession and 10 shots on target, we should have had at least one penalty, we hit the post, Ronaldo missed a sitter.
At this point, it's just complete inability to admit they were wrong about Ole or its just a total lack of knowledge about football.
On the same note, Ole was criticised in the week for his substitutions, and perhaps rightly so. I was critical of them. My question is, are all those people who criticised his subs on Tuesday going to credit him now for bringing on the assister and the scorer of the winning goal?
At this point, it's just complete inability to admit they were wrong about Ole or its just a total lack of knowledge about football.
On the same note, Ole was criticised in the week for his substitutions, and perhaps rightly so. I was critical of them. My question is, are all those people who criticised his subs on Tuesday going to credit him now for bringing on the assister and the scorer of the winning goal?
That's peak knowledge right there
Folk want him to make his subs EARLIER.
Personnel isn't an issue. It can't be with the quality off the bench.
Our ball retention really is horrendous by elite team standards. I wish we had an "unforced errors" stat in football like we do in tennis to see if the stats match the eye test.
It's part of the reason we get hit on the counter so often. If we could reduce the amount of needless turnovers by 50%, even 30% it would make a big difference in the control we have over games. And it's not just 1 or 2 culprits giving the ball away as much as the fans like to scapegoat, it's the defence midfield and attack all getting in on the act.
Our pressing as a team is also a major reason we're being hit on the counter, teams just cut right through us every time we lose the ball.
I still think we should be creating more chances than we do given the attacking talent we have, even when we were playing well in the 1st half we didn't have many clear chances to show for it, West Ham arguably having the better chances.
It's part of the reason we get hit on the counter so often. If we could reduce the amount of needless turnovers by 50%, even 30% it would make a big difference in the control we have over games. And it's not just 1 or 2 culprits giving the ball away as much as the fans like to scapegoat, it's the defence midfield and attack all getting in on the act.
Our pressing as a team is also a major reason we're being hit on the counter, teams just cut right through us every time we lose the ball.
I still think we should be creating more chances than we do given the attacking talent we have, even when we were playing well in the 1st half we didn't have many clear chances to show for it, West Ham arguably having the better chances.
We probably are to predictable, but still
it seems like we’re difficult to stop. Our combination play in close situation up front is occasionally very very good.
it seems like we’re difficult to stop. Our combination play in close situation up front is occasionally very very good.
We are entering matches like Bambi on ice and learn as we go.
Coaching in the 2nd half though is top notch. Lingard curling it like a proper number 7.
Coaching in the 2nd half though is top notch. Lingard curling it like a proper number 7.
What does a good job in speaking for Ole to be in charge of recruitment. It doesn't really speak for or against his tactical acumen. And that isn't even a dig but a mere statement.
Probably because of the same reason that got repeated on here quite a lot on tuesday: "one game doesn't really change the overall picture". It was nice to see Ole get it so right today. Criticism will die down as soon as this is happening on a regular basis.
We have to try to get over this "I was right and you were wrong" stuff. It leads nowhere.
Yea but that domination, those chances, the possession, the goals, the shots, all that stuff, that was just individual brilliance.
Where were the patterns of play?
That's what important. Right?
People were accusing us of jumping on Ole after the Young Boys result.
So now following this game where we won, had so much possession, x many shots on target and whatever else, I'll point out the same problems (or at least the ones I'm complaining about) were still present.
It doesn't mean we'll never win games, dominate possession or create lots of chances. And games where we do just that don't mean those flaws weren't in evidence. Sometimes the positives outweigh the negatives and the positional problems end up not mattering as much.
It's not some damning indictment of Solkjaer as a manager. It's just a consistent, annoying negative would be solvable with a different coach being added under him, in the same way he sought a set-piece coach to try and address that problem.
So now following this game where we won, had so much possession, x many shots on target and whatever else, I'll point out the same problems (or at least the ones I'm complaining about) were still present.
It doesn't mean we'll never win games, dominate possession or create lots of chances. And games where we do just that don't mean those flaws weren't in evidence. Sometimes the positives outweigh the negatives and the positional problems end up not mattering as much.
It's not some damning indictment of Solkjaer as a manager. It's just a consistent, annoying negative would be solvable with a different coach being added under him, in the same way he sought a set-piece coach to try and address that problem.
It's bloody obvious with Fred and McTominay in midfield. If we get better players than them we will play better.
I had to google him. Hes a nobody, pretty sure the OP is trolling. I havent heard any pundit or ex player use the terms of ‘individual brilliance’ or ‘no patterns of play’ about us. Just meaningless buzzwords that supposedly count as categoric proof we are ‘badly coached’. I’ve pressed several to explain the meaning of the phrases and theres never been a half decent answer. Tend to just ignore those sorts of posts now
Who?
I actually thought Ole and the team did well today. We dominated and controlled the first half something we hadn’t done in ages. We played some nice passing too.
Second half when we started to flag, he made changes (something I’ve criticised him for not doing in the past) which were the correct changes in my opinion too. The one of his subs scored and won the game for us.
Not sure what there is to complain about today?
Second half when we started to flag, he made changes (something I’ve criticised him for not doing in the past) which were the correct changes in my opinion too. The one of his subs scored and won the game for us.
Not sure what there is to complain about today?
Lars Lagerback just said on Swedish tv that he doesn’t have enough patterns of play and it’s a joke that Phil Jones got another contract.
My dads mates sisters cousins mates brothers girlfriends sister said we relied on individual brilliance so thats all the proof needed really. Sack the PE teacher
I'm watching games with less attention.
Not really a comment about coaching, kind of, but I thought this season would see the end to some of Oles naive decisions. He got away with it today because De Gea saved the penalty but there are strange decisions. Why sub Fred for Matic in the 87th minute? How can he affect the game, it takes 5-10 minutes just to get up to the speed of the match for him. Lingard bailed him out aswell, but that will be the exception, not the rule with Lingard. I hope I'm proved wrong on that one.
As far as midfield is concerned it is in these games you expect our midfielders to step up the challenge. They're playing against a player in midfield who is being talked up as a replacement for them. Go out and show why people are wrong about that. Not sure who is trying to motivate our midfielders before games but it appears to need to be better.
As far as midfield is concerned it is in these games you expect our midfielders to step up the challenge. They're playing against a player in midfield who is being talked up as a replacement for them. Go out and show why people are wrong about that. Not sure who is trying to motivate our midfielders before games but it appears to need to be better.
There are games where Ole deserves criticism but for this game it's weird. West Ham away is a tough place to go, we scored 2 goals, hit the post once, Ronaldo missed 2 one v ones, he should have had 2 penalties. On other day this would have been much more comfortable win than what scoreline shows.
Matic did affect the game though, he helped win it
Yea, that's my point, strange decisions that he is getting away with. I didn't think be did either.
I'm not a fan at all, but Ole got it right today (well I don't think he needed to go with McFred,) but his subs were spot on, and we played better today than we did in a number of other games this season.So many tantrums having to be bottled up until the next time we drop a point.
Patterns of play are pre-drilled combinations of play. So for example when X player is on the ball Y player move here and Z player moves here, with all three knowing who X will pass to and what the player who will receive it is supposed to do with it next. You drill varieties of these patterns and that allows you to play quicker football, as players are reacting to things before they happen and not having to weigh up options when they get the ball in those situations.
For example the end result might be the difference between AWB seeing Sancho on the ball and reacting by making a run to overlap/underlap or AWB making that run before Sancho gets the ball because both he and Sancho have been coached to know that's what comes next (and with the CF making a certain run to create space for AWB because he knows what's coming too). In both cases the same thing might happen but in the latter case it happens a lot quicker, which allows for more incision and gets players into more advantageous positions.
Another example might be: Shaw makes a run up the pitch, Ronaldo drops deep, Shaw plays the ball to Ronaldo. Fernandes is drilled to make an arching run, being able to time it so that he's in the correct position and body shape to comfortably receive the ball from Ronaldo while facing the goal. Shaw (knowing in advance that the ball he's playing to Ronaldo will be going to Fernandes next) is able to aim the ball to the foot that allows Ronaldo to play a one-touch pass to Fernandes. Meanwhile Pogba (playing at LW) knows he has to stay wide to keep the opposition fullback engaged and offer a secondary pass option for both Shaw and Ronaldo. Because this is pre-drilled they're able to execute that combination at speed and with the right timing. Whereas if it wasn't pre-drilled Ronaldo might have to take an extra touch which kills the first time pass to Fernandes.
Those sorts of patterns are why you always see City scoring that same cut-back goal over and over again, for example. It isn't an accident, they've been drilled with different combinations of passing and movement to get their players into those positions.
Those patterns don't have to just be to break down opposition defences either. They can be to used to play through an opposition press too. And aside from incision they stop you from losing the ball as easily in dangerous areas.
Hope that's a clear enough explanation.
So you're criticising Ole's subs while also dismissively saying 'Lingard bailed him out'. Matic replaced the tiring Fred and provided the assist for the winner.
What the feck are you moaning about really? You're actually criticising him for decisions which ultimately won the game.
Thats all built on pass move. Which we have definitely implemented and improved on since the statue subuteo football of LVG and Mourinho.
I don't necessarily think the same little collection of set passing moves works or isn't predictable. The mighty city and there ‘patterns’ have drawn two blanks now this season. I suppose setting up these Patterns are a way of coaching and playing but its not the only way. Its not ‘patterns or you're shite’. Theres just no way we dominate possession and have started since project restart to score some pretty big hauls by accident or coincidence, thats just a stupid point to make.
Theres no way that our coaching staff just stick 11 players out on the pitch and say ‘erm yeah, try to win’. What do people think we do on the training ground? Shooting practice then hit the showers? Do you honestly think that Ole cant come Up with a crummy little passing move that any old fan from the age of 7 could? We used to plan stuff like that in primary school football practice. Its a pretty farcical point to try and make IMO
Everything that benefits Ole is him getting lucky and everything bad is Ole's fault so we should sack him and bring in someone good on Football Manager
The man who beat England with Iceland.
Perfectly explained. I have seen people here mocking things like "Patterns of play", "tempo", "tactics" as if they are figments of imagination and have nothing to do with actual football.
Where in reality, these so called figments of imagination are often the difference between a title winning team and a good one. A clear defined structure of play, defined roles and play patterns, combined with good passing and movement often elevates a team to another level, where even the average players look better than they actually are, helping them create and score more chances, break down deep blocks and even help them keep possession when down to less than 11 players.
Even today, we were so slow, tempo wise, so static, with extremely poor passing. But yeah, who needs "patterns of play" when we can wing it all the way to the title, right?
It is a beauty to watch really. Just pass the ball into the net 60 times a season like clockwork.
We weren’t slow. We controlled the game with a high line against a team parking the bus. We should have scored at least 4 today because of it. You play with patience against such severe low blocks which we did.
You can’t go on a long rant about not appreciating tactics and put today down to winging it for feck sake