Yes, actually that's Zlatan's job. He plays with his back at the goal, and if he could control the ball then he can pass to any surging player of ours. It's standard play when you have strong tall forwards.
10
Season Average Rating
- Appearances
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- Goals
- 8
- Assists
- 10
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Yes, actually that's Zlatan's job. He plays with his back at the goal, and if he could control the ball then he can pass to any surging player of ours. It's standard play when you have strong tall forwards.
We see very different games.
Watch the three videos again and give me examples.
Go on! The proof is here.
Someone of Pogba's ability could clearly handle a ball played to him there. Would have obviously been the better pass, not that you'd ever admit that though. You seem to see everything that is good in Rooney and nothing that is bad. It is just as bad as people seeing all bad and nothing good.
I can't imagine any other player having one pass picked over as much. The pass went to the forward in the box, it's a good pass.Saying Pogba was the better pass is totally hypothetical bordering on ridiculous.
Last few pages have been gold here.
Watch the first two minutes of the video. That's the first half. Rooney created more than anyone of our players in the first half. A shoot that was saved on the line, an excellent free kick that Zlatan could not convert, a run on the right and a good pass to Martial who couldn't meet the ball. That was pretty much our best chances in the first half.
The first half! And actually Rooney improved in the second half!
The level of abuse that Rooney receives here is unreal!
The first half! And actually Rooney improved in the second half!
The level of abuse that Rooney receives here is unreal!
Saying Pogba was the better pass is totally hypothetical bordering on ridiculous.
Last few pages have been gold here.
Its been very difficult for those of us on the side of Rooney/ understanding football.
would it have been a bad pass it it have gone backwards or something?
Saying Pogba was the better pass is totally hypothetical bordering on ridiculous.
Last few pages have been gold here.
I never said it was a bad pass, I said Pogba was the better pass. The reasons Nick gave for saying Pogba was the worst pass was mirrored and worse in the pass to Zlatan which I pointed out.
If the convo about it is boarding on ridiculous doof, then don't get involved as we all know you are above this.
Would you expect people not to respond to your condescending post?
I think in this thread you throw reasonable expectations out the window.
Is it surprising that nobody has any remarks about the three videos above?
Or actually, we did have a remark. One guy said that Rooney's video must be fake (edited) because that's not what he remembers from watching the game!
Or actually, we did have a remark. One guy said that Rooney's video must be fake (edited) because that's not what he remembers from watching the game!
Ridiculous. Zlatan is the striker. Getting the ball to him is the desired outcome. The only reason someone would pass to Pogba there is in hope that he can get it in to Zlatan. Rooney found a direct way to get it to Zlatan. Zlatan's touch failed him there (which is perfectly acceptable but just imagine the outrage if Rooney had a touch like that)
I mean be honest. Think Pogba played that pass to Rooney and his touch was similar would you be saying "oh that was a terrible pass, it was too fast and Rooney couldn't control it" ? This place would shit on him for his disgusting first touch.
Pogba was in empty space, passing to him would have given Zlatan more space and dragged defenders out of position to stop Pogba from either getting a shot off or driving into the box.
It was the wrong decision.
It was the wrong decision.
Ok I'll be honest. No I wouldn't.
Very interesting, factual and supports the pro - Rooney discussion in a reasonable way - his first touches and being caught in possession are not shown - were they significant in his overall performance?
Still images are worthless.Whatever!
Look at how marked Ibra is and how wide open Pogba is! Whatever! Green laughing smiley! Look at me making a point!
Still images are worthless.
Look at how marked Ibra is and how wide open Pogba is! Whatever! Green laughing smiley! Look at me making a point!
But exactly! Rooney anticipates where the players are moving to, and he foresees the developing situation. A second later, when the ball is ready to arrive, Zlatan is open and Pogba is not!
Perhaps the main problem is that most people do not understand football?
Still images are worthless.
Look at how marked Ibra is and how wide open Pogba is! Whatever! Green laughing smiley! Look at me making a point!
Pass it to Pogba then everyone moans about how little service Ibra got. Its a good ball, well executed. Pogba may have got the ball and lost it immediately, or had another poor shot. Zlatan had a poor touch but it is easier for him to do something from the position he receives it than Pogba could have.
But exactly! Rooney anticipates where the players are moving to, and he foresees the developing situation. A second later, when the ball is ready to arrive, Zlatan is open and Pogba is not!
Perhaps the main problem is that most people do not understand football?
Perhaps the main problem is that Rooney spent three seconds lining up the pass instead of just playing it straight to Pogba on his first or second touch?
We'll never know!
The pass to Pogba could have been played along the ground, which makes it easier to trap. It could have been played with less power, which makes it easier to trap. It could have been played quicker, which gives the defence less time to react, and Zlatan has his back to goal and no runs around him. Pogba could have played Mkhitaryan through. Micky read the pass to Pogba and tried to make himself available for the quick pass in behind, and could have found Zlatan with a pass or a cross into the box from out wide.
The sooner you get off the idea that Rooney is The Infallible God of Football, the better. He makes mistakes. All of our players do.
And this is after Zlatan's bad touch. He could have split the ball to Pagba, Mata, or Miki. Anyway, bad touches happen.
So do bad passes. In fact, bad touches happen quite often after bad passes.
I didn't create the videos. Are you suggesting the Rooney video is doctored to make him look good, and the Zlatan and Miki videos are doctored to make them look bad?
Sure. And if that's what you understand from football and from the situation in the pictures above, I don't think I can help you, sorry!
Don't worry about it. I'm purposefully trying to drag Rooney down in an attempt to balance out the rose-tinted hero worship currently going on in this thread by the likes of you and LouisDanGaal. I didn't actually think he was that poor in the second half. But his first half was garbage. No doubt about that.
In reality I think Rooney has been poor enough to warrant getting dropped, and I want to see José, Zlatan and Mkhitaryan challenge Rooney's position of power in the team by making him a less influential figure both on and off the pitch, so we don't have another undroppable Rooney situation like we had under van Gaal. If we're going for the title we can't afford that. Sooner or later Rooney's goals and assists will dry up and he'll be nothing but dead weight. It's happened too many times in the last few years for me to think this is finally going to be definite end of his several months-long stinkathons. I'd much rather have Mkhitaryan as an established starter before that happens. Long-term gain over short-term gain and all that.
My first post in this thread after the game said Rooney delivered a great assist and played his best game of the season so far on Saturday. That's my honest opinion, but one game doesn't influence the bigger picture. I think our title challenge will be more successful if Rooney isn't starting every single game like he was last season.
Except i didn't say he was a massively important player though.
Also it's rarely bumped when he's injured obviously because A it's a performance thread and B because the ones in here constantly moaning about his performances are happy he's not in the side.
For the record i'm not even suggesting his performances at times don't warrant criticism or that people aren't entitled to moan. People can moan all they like.
I'm simply pointing out the irony of someone moaning about others moaning, in a thread thats already full of moaning.
Doesn't surprise me it's the biggest thread at all when it's full of page after page of moaning as i said.
By exaggerating your own position you don't threaten our arguments or refute what we put forward but just make your own understanding of football really come in to question. I don't think anyone will read your dissection of the Rooney pass to Zlatan and think you have a point anywhere along the line.
Probably let the goals and assists dry up before dropping him, no? given that they win us games and mkhi hasn't got a goal or assist yet. Mata and Martial have also been worse than Rooney.
Our title challenge will be more successful if we play the players who are creating or scoring goals for as long as they are doing those things. If rooney isn't contributing for a few games, drop him, easy as.
I am certainly not looking him through rose-tinted glasses, I comment when he has a bad game, my average rating for him in the 2 games I have marked is a 7, although I didn't do one after his garbage game a few weeks ago for anyone, that isn't one of my highest ratings for a player at all. Its just there are only a few of us actually supporting the club captain in here so I come across as contrary and more pronounced even though my position is incredibly moderate.
Still images are worthless.
Look at how marked Ibra is and how wide open Pogba is! Whatever! Green laughing smiley! Look at me making a point!
Rooney makes that pass and people would say it's easy to make a pass like that under no pressure. He can't win.
It's a tough situation with Rooney. On the one hand, his general play is extremely lackadaisical, but as we've seen already this season, he's still very much capable of game winning moments. He puts up the numbers.
Don't worry that guy does know what he is talking about, he is just trying to drag down the thread, because that is what this place needs, less optimism
I know he put in those apparent transfer requests in but this forum still loves Ronaldo to death so this bizarre hatred of Rooney is really odd. Also, if nothing else, I'm glad to have him around as he still feels like the only connect from the Fergie era. Winning the title with 10 new players would be great but in some strange way, I wouldn't feel connected to the team because it's just been too many changes too soon. I hope Rooney plays at a good level and contributes to our success because it would be more enjoyable for me if someone like him or Carrick played an integral part in our wins.
Two transfer requests in order to score a fatter pay cheque for him and his agent. Everything was rosy again once he got a bit more in the bank. For Ronaldo it was never about the money. His dream was to play for Real and we let him pursue it, of course pocketing a world record transfer fee in the process. Ambition is a much more desirable characteristic in a person than greed.
Ronaldo was also a model professional during his time at the club, gave it all in training and was remarkably consistent on the pitch, as well as being arguably our best ever player during those three best years at the end. Rooney hasn't stayed professional, hasn't always delivered on the pitch, regularly shows up out of shape at the start of the season or after an injury and has been caught being an idiot off the pitch more than a few times, whether it's something small like smoking or drinking on holiday or something big like cheating on his missus.
Also, ironically the "only connect to the Fergie era" would have most likely been the first player out the door if Fergie had stayed another season. Sentimentality wins you nothing in football. People didn't seem to have an issue with us moving RVP, Rafael, Nani, Hernandez on last summer, citing them all as 'deadwood'. At some point all the Fergie players will all be gone, and I'd rather we hang on the ones that are consistently good than the ones that aren't if the aim is to keep them for as long as possible. De Gea, Smalling and Valencia have all performed at a much higher level than Rooney over the last 12 months and they all have more time left at the top. If we have to hang on to the Fergie players, why not them instead?
Rooney's performances on the pitch and his actions off the pitch since that first transfer request has left him with a dwindling supply of goodwill from me personally. I don't feel the club or me as a fan owes him anything more than what he's already been given. His place in the team can be justified as long as he's putting up goals or assists and Mata and Martial are failing to set the world alight, but as soon as the numbers dry out he's by far the most droppable of the three based on his general play. Sentimentality, dressing room politics or any other factor being speculated on in this thread shouldn't come into play when that decision has to be made by Mourinho. The only thing that matters is what he brings to the team, and apart from goals and assists, it's currently very little. While I won't in any way neglect the importance of that (if you're going to bring something to the table it might as well be exactly that, really) it isn't the be-all-end-all of football. Did Pogba provide goals or assists a against The Saints? Nope. Best player on the pitch? Yep.
Is it surprising that nobody has any remarks about the three videos above?
Or actually, we did have a remark. One guy said that Rooney's video must be fake (edited) because that's not what he remembers from watching the game!
Well you've got the wrong end of the stick so maybe I should explain myself better. The 3 lost balls in 1 minute wasn't included in that video so it was edited for all the 'good' things Rooney did.
I said I remembered the video differently because in that video, he did the basics alright and didn't look' bad', as we are all saying he was. The 'bad' are things you can only formulate from a full 90min game or at least have a highlight video compiling literally every single touch/moment of his game, which this one doesn't. Again it's the same but consistent criticism like his lack of movement, touch, his creativity with the ball, lack of actual penetrative ability (like Mata/Martial) etc whilst occupying the most central areas of space (a heat map won't show the times when we had the ball, how he was ahead of Pogba/Fellani) and couldn't offer anything consistent enough to build from. It requires partnerships and ability from all players in the team on the pitch to attack or defend.
In my original post I criticised the performances of Mata, Martial and Zlatan; their poor performances can 'justify' the lack of understanding between Rooney and the others.
So finally we have ability. I'll be straight the point, Rooney has produced stats and game changing moments so far this season but a player in his position and minutes should be doing that at the very least. We aren't a mid level team where you can get away with playing poorly and producing moments to change the game for you. We should be creating numerous chances and/or playing fluid football every single minute.
Rooney's consistent ability imo is below average and has been for the past 18months. Worst it's in the below half of the team. He's meant to be our main creative/goal scoring threats ffs.
Holy cow. The weird logic train regarding Rooney continues. It has come to the point where we should drop a player because we predict they will not score or assist even though they have consistently been doing so?
A few months from now we're gonna have a good laugh at this thread. We still are! Only on this forum would a performance like last weeks get slaughtered considering it's Rooney.
Excellent post.
Still, I don't see Mourinho dropping Rooney, no matter how terrible his effect on our football, as ling as Rooney contributes with goals and assists. It's not going to happen.
Why do you think that? So far there has been no evidence of this. Mata may be more effective at number 10 and create more than Rooney, but he is the one subbed off instead of Rooney. There is much more competition for places in the team, but Rooney still seems assured of his place in the team. Based on how he was playing, he should have been subbed off way before his assist. He still has the manager's special confidence and a priviledged position in the team.
Uh isn't that how a highlights video is supposed to be though?
When Mhikitaryan and Rashford were doing their stuff, They seemed to take over the number 10 position and Rooney seemed to drop deeper or shift over to the LW some more. The problem with Rooney at 10 is that he creates nil and he disrupts the flow of the team. Mhiki would be my choice at 10. Rashford was effective because he came in as LW but also made many of his best moves as a second striker, from a more central position.
The problem is that we cannot play a full match, or even a full half, with the formation we had at the end of the match, as it does not have a good defensive balance. We were able to get away with playing that way at the end because by then Hull were focused almost 100% on defending the 0-0 score.
Shit hits the fan if he fails to perform against City. Both from a supporter's perspective and Mourinho's
I can't recall the last time Rooney was under this much pressure, with nowt to hide behind. Even his best mates in the media are saying "OK he was poor against Hull but, he still kept going"
Tick tock!
I can't recall the last time Rooney was under this much pressure, with nowt to hide behind. Even his best mates in the media are saying "OK he was poor against Hull but, he still kept going"
Tick tock!
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