No doubt a massive factor, don't get me wrong. I just think that in his early years he was probably too selfless and was always destined to burn out because of it.
10
Season Average Rating
- Appearances
- 39
- Goals
- 8
- Assists
- 10
- Yellow cards
- 8
- Status
No doubt a massive factor, don't get me wrong. I just think that in his early years he was probably too selfless and was always destined to burn out because of it.
Fair enough and then Rooney deservedly won't even make the bench again. Hopefully he won't be to blame if we're poor again then
I don't blame Rooney for anything this season.
He can just offer us nothing going forward, his ability has dropped like a lead balloon, his fitness seems to have deteriorated, and he's taking up a space in our squad for someone who is still fit and able to play at the top level.
How can you say this with any certainty?, maybe you're the one talking rubbish.(I'm not saying you are but stop pretending you know for sure)
Good job that the Earth is flat.
The caf said that Rooney is the worst player in the squad, not even a championship level player, contributes nothing, can only pass to Valencia, we would play better with 10 men than with him in the team, etc. It is not clear if those are still true if he isn’t club captain, paid much less than 300k/week, and didn’t hold the club to ransom twice.
In any case however, his stats don’t seem to support such view, so how was it that such a shite player can have such decent stats compared to his team mates, could it be because of pure luck due to his lucky goals, fake assists, or weak oppositions? We have our own opinions on that, but here are the numbers, for forwards and midfielders only:
We won 16 of the 23 matches with Rooney in the starting lineup, for a win ratio of 70%, below only Mata. Our win ratio without Rooney starting for us is 50% (19 of 38). Rooney started in 13 league matches and 10 non-league matches, and he didn’t pick the matches he played. If we play better without Rooney in the squad like everybody said, then it’s not reflected in the results of the 61 matches that we have played so far.
Rooney is the second highest contributor of goals and assists for us, with less starts than most of the others. The argument for lucky goals and fake assists may be used against his quality, but not his contribution, at least for the goals, as they are counted all the same. Even if we take out half of his assists, the remaining numbers still do not reflect a useless and worst player in the squad.
Another curious thing is that he started in 5 of our 6 highest scoring matches when we scored 4 goals, which were against Fenerbahce, Feyenord, West Ham, Reading and Wigan. The only exception was against Leicester when we scored 3 goals from corners. It seems that playing with 10 men did not hinder us to play well after all.
He may be finished as a top level footballer, he is surely finished with us as Jose doesn’t trust him anymore, he is beyond any doubt finished as a 300k/week player, but one should know the numbers above while saying that he contributes nothing or calling him the worst player in the squad.
In any case however, his stats don’t seem to support such view, so how was it that such a shite player can have such decent stats compared to his team mates, could it be because of pure luck due to his lucky goals, fake assists, or weak oppositions? We have our own opinions on that, but here are the numbers, for forwards and midfielders only:
We won 16 of the 23 matches with Rooney in the starting lineup, for a win ratio of 70%, below only Mata. Our win ratio without Rooney starting for us is 50% (19 of 38). Rooney started in 13 league matches and 10 non-league matches, and he didn’t pick the matches he played. If we play better without Rooney in the squad like everybody said, then it’s not reflected in the results of the 61 matches that we have played so far.
Rooney is the second highest contributor of goals and assists for us, with less starts than most of the others. The argument for lucky goals and fake assists may be used against his quality, but not his contribution, at least for the goals, as they are counted all the same. Even if we take out half of his assists, the remaining numbers still do not reflect a useless and worst player in the squad.
Another curious thing is that he started in 5 of our 6 highest scoring matches when we scored 4 goals, which were against Fenerbahce, Feyenord, West Ham, Reading and Wigan. The only exception was against Leicester when we scored 3 goals from corners. It seems that playing with 10 men did not hinder us to play well after all.
He may be finished as a top level footballer, he is surely finished with us as Jose doesn’t trust him anymore, he is beyond any doubt finished as a 300k/week player, but one should know the numbers above while saying that he contributes nothing or calling him the worst player in the squad.
Who are going to be Caf's scapegoats if Rooney and Fellaini are not here next season.
Lingard is pretty useless isn't he?
The caf said that Rooney is the worst player in the squad, not even a championship level player, contributes nothing, can only pass to Valencia, we would play better with 10 men than with him in the team, etc. It is not clear if those are still true if he isn’t club captain, paid much less than 300k/week, and didn’t hold the club to ransom twice.
In any case however, his stats don’t seem to support such view, so how was it that such a shite player can have such decent stats compared to his team mates, could it be because of pure luck due to his lucky goals, fake assists, or weak oppositions? We have our own opinions on that, but here are the numbers, for forwards and midfielders only:
We won 16 of the 23 matches with Rooney in the starting lineup, for a win ratio of 70%, below only Mata. Our win ratio without Rooney starting for us is 50% (19 of 38). Rooney started in 13 league matches and 10 non-league matches, and he didn’t pick the matches he played. If we play better without Rooney in the squad like everybody said, then it’s not reflected in the results of the 61 matches that we have played so far.
Rooney is the second highest contributor of goals and assists for us, with less starts than most of the others. The argument for lucky goals and fake assists may be used against his quality, but not his contribution, at least for the goals, as they are counted all the same. Even if we take out half of his assists, the remaining numbers still do not reflect a useless and worst player in the squad.
Another curious thing is that he started in 5 of our 6 highest scoring matches when we scored 4 goals, which were against Fenerbahce, Feyenord, West Ham, Reading and Wigan. The only exception was against Leicester when we scored 3 goals from corners. It seems that playing with 10 men did not hinder us to play well after all.
He may be finished as a top level footballer, he is surely finished with us as Jose doesn’t trust him anymore, he is beyond any doubt finished as a 300k/week player, but one should know the numbers above while saying that he contributes nothing or calling him the worst player in the squad.
The fact he is second in the goals plus assists table is more a damning indictment of our attacking players. But there is at least a reasonable basis for hoping that Martial and Rashford will improve and Mkhitaryan be more settled in his second season (I won't comment on Lingard). With Rooney, this is as good as it gets and it might even get worse as his physical conditioning further declines. As for the correlation between Rooney starting and United winning, the teams you list - Fenerbahce, Reading, Wigan - give the game away. He does not start against strong opposition (at least until the last two weeks when we gave up on the league).
We have plenty of guys to blame- Lingard, Young, Smalling, Jones, Carrick, Blind,Mata depending on whoever is starting in the fixture
Rooney has been benched for the tougher fixtures this season so don't let his stats deceive you. His most telling contribution this season was probably the goal at Stoke and assist to Rashford against Hull. Other than that it's a few tap-ins and nothing hugely important.
Stats and miniskirts.
He's started in tougher games than most other guys- Arsenal away, Spurs Away, City Home, Chelsea Away(?).
.The caf said that Rooney is the worst player in the squad, not even a championship level player, contributes nothing, can only pass to Valencia, we would play better with 10 men than with him in the team, etc. It is not clear if those are still true if he isn’t club captain, paid much less than 300k/week, and didn’t hold the club to ransom twice.
In any case however, his stats don’t seem to support such view, so how was it that such a shite player can have such decent stats compared to his team mates, could it be because of pure luck due to his lucky goals, fake assists, or weak oppositions? We have our own opinions on that, but here are the numbers, for forwards and midfielders only:
We won 16 of the 23 matches with Rooney in the starting lineup, for a win ratio of 70%, below only Mata. Our win ratio without Rooney starting for us is 50% (19 of 38). Rooney started in 13 league matches and 10 non-league matches, and he didn’t pick the matches he played. If we play better without Rooney in the squad like everybody said, then it’s not reflected in the results of the 61 matches that we have played so far.
Rooney is the second highest contributor of goals and assists for us, with less starts than most of the others. The argument for lucky goals and fake assists may be used against his quality, but not his contribution, at least for the goals, as they are counted all the same. Even if we take out half of his assists, the remaining numbers still do not reflect a useless and worst player in the squad.
Another curious thing is that he started in 5 of our 6 highest scoring matches when we scored 4 goals, which were against Fenerbahce, Feyenord, West Ham, Reading and Wigan. The only exception was against Leicester when we scored 3 goals from corners. It seems that playing with 10 men did not hinder us to play well after all.
He may be finished as a top level footballer, he is surely finished with us as Jose doesn’t trust him anymore, he is beyond any doubt finished as a 300k/week player, but one should know the numbers above while saying that he contributes nothing or calling him the worst player in the squad.
I'll still say it with my chest. One of the worst players in our squad.
The caf said that Rooney is the worst player in the squad, not even a championship level player, contributes nothing, can only pass to Valencia, we would play better with 10 men than with him in the team, etc. It is not clear if those are still true if he isn’t club captain, paid much less than 300k/week, and didn’t hold the club to ransom twice.
In any case however, his stats don’t seem to support such view, so how was it that such a shite player can have such decent stats compared to his team mates, could it be because of pure luck due to his lucky goals, fake assists, or weak oppositions? We have our own opinions on that, but here are the numbers, for forwards and midfielders only:
We won 16 of the 23 matches with Rooney in the starting lineup, for a win ratio of 70%, below only Mata. Our win ratio without Rooney starting for us is 50% (19 of 38). Rooney started in 13 league matches and 10 non-league matches, and he didn’t pick the matches he played. If we play better without Rooney in the squad like everybody said, then it’s not reflected in the results of the 61 matches that we have played so far.
Rooney is the second highest contributor of goals and assists for us, with less starts than most of the others. The argument for lucky goals and fake assists may be used against his quality, but not his contribution, at least for the goals, as they are counted all the same. Even if we take out half of his assists, the remaining numbers still do not reflect a useless and worst player in the squad.
Another curious thing is that he started in 5 of our 6 highest scoring matches when we scored 4 goals, which were against Fenerbahce, Feyenord, West Ham, Reading and Wigan. The only exception was against Leicester when we scored 3 goals from corners. It seems that playing with 10 men did not hinder us to play well after all.
He may be finished as a top level footballer, he is surely finished with us as Jose doesn’t trust him anymore, he is beyond any doubt finished as a 300k/week player, but one should know the numbers above while saying that he contributes nothing or calling him the worst player in the squad.
These are very interesting stats. Thank you.
I believe that he played better against weaker teams, which was his stats look inflated. I tried to run a statistical test (the Goodman and Kruskal's Gamma) but the results did not prove significant. I was trying to compare using a Good Game variable (good game with a goal or assist or bad game with none) versus a Good Team variable (weak opponents or strong opponents). Perhaps this is due to small sample size, as I realize that he played at least 45 minutes 22 times this season against weak opponents and only 5 times against strong opponents. So if he had played more games against strong opponents, I would have gotten a better result. This also shows how little Jose trusted him by playing him only 5 times against strong opponents. He did not play in many crucial knockout matches in the EL, FA Cup or EFL Cup also.
I still think that his stats look inflated because he usually played against weaker teams, despite the lack of statistical evidence yet.
how about just watch him play, and judge from that like the manager does
Great post. Interesting numbers indeed, his minutes are considerably down from last season but this presents a valid argument that his contributions per minute are on a very steep uptick, which is very surprising. If he does end up staying next season and producing something similar on reduced minutes or even a further uptick on form would be immensely welcome in the grand scheme of the evolution of our team.The caf said that Rooney is the worst player in the squad, not even a championship level player, contributes nothing, can only pass to Valencia, we would play better with 10 men than with him in the team, etc. It is not clear if those are still true if he isn’t club captain, paid much less than 300k/week, and didn’t hold the club to ransom twice.
In any case however, his stats don’t seem to support such view, so how was it that such a shite player can have such decent stats compared to his team mates, could it be because of pure luck due to his lucky goals, fake assists, or weak oppositions? We have our own opinions on that, but here are the numbers, for forwards and midfielders only:
We won 16 of the 23 matches with Rooney in the starting lineup, for a win ratio of 70%, below only Mata. Our win ratio without Rooney starting for us is 50% (19 of 38). Rooney started in 13 league matches and 10 non-league matches, and he didn’t pick the matches he played. If we play better without Rooney in the squad like everybody said, then it’s not reflected in the results of the 61 matches that we have played so far.
Rooney is the second highest contributor of goals and assists for us, with less starts than most of the others. The argument for lucky goals and fake assists may be used against his quality, but not his contribution, at least for the goals, as they are counted all the same. Even if we take out half of his assists, the remaining numbers still do not reflect a useless and worst player in the squad.
Another curious thing is that he started in 5 of our 6 highest scoring matches when we scored 4 goals, which were against Fenerbahce, Feyenord, West Ham, Reading and Wigan. The only exception was against Leicester when we scored 3 goals from corners. It seems that playing with 10 men did not hinder us to play well after all.
He may be finished as a top level footballer, he is surely finished with us as Jose doesn’t trust him anymore, he is beyond any doubt finished as a 300k/week player, but one should know the numbers above while saying that he contributes nothing or calling him the worst player in the squad.
Fenerbahce, Feyenoord, West Ham (off a cliff this season), Readying and Wigan - hardly the most inspiring list of teams to list when showing how a player has shone. Also, I think this misses the point. Rooney has had some moments (that FK to save a point v Stoke, I think it was) and has some goals. At the start of the season, he also benefited from playing in that run we went on before we hit the run of losses and subsequent wall of draws. All through though, while stats are routinely bandied about to defend him, his general play has been appalling. His first touch was never the best, but now it takes him about 4-5 to get the ball under control - and that's when it doesn't just bounce off him to the nearest opposition player. He also has a massive deleterious effect on our play by slowing everything down massively when he has the ball. Then there's the maddening predictability of passing to the right-back (or player in that position at the time he passes).
All said and done, he's not the worst player in the squad overall, but there are few that can match his lows. In the Spurs game, he was absolutely awful. He's always had "spurts" but those are now long gone too. He now veers between the average and the abysmal and that's not good enough. His "average" is better than a couple of other players perhaps, but his "lows" are surely the lowest (barring perhaps Smalling and Darmian).
On Rooney, I'm now beyond stats and the results of those. Frankly my eyes tell me the obvious - he's done. Finished at this level. Can even his staunchest fans mention the PL teams he'd immediately strengthen?
All said and done, he's not the worst player in the squad overall, but there are few that can match his lows. In the Spurs game, he was absolutely awful. He's always had "spurts" but those are now long gone too. He now veers between the average and the abysmal and that's not good enough. His "average" is better than a couple of other players perhaps, but his "lows" are surely the lowest (barring perhaps Smalling and Darmian).
On Rooney, I'm now beyond stats and the results of those. Frankly my eyes tell me the obvious - he's done. Finished at this level. Can even his staunchest fans mention the PL teams he'd immediately strengthen?
I do agree with you. The stats do not tell the full story how bad he is now. In fact, I think the current bad form in the team is partly due to him. He does not offer any movement and he just passes the ball and stays at his usual spot. I feel that whenever he plays, players like Mata and Martial always look very isolated.
As for the goals, I thought there were some that were total flukes (freekick against Stoke & flick against Reading).
I think we have a different focus on the aspects of his performance in this discussion. You are talking about his all-around game, his action on the pitch, which was generally and usually poor, do I disagree with that? No, I don't disagree, although he wasn’t always like this, like probably in November when the Caf were I think quite pleased with his performance, hence we put the beard in his profile picture. Anyway, although I don’t share the harshest opinion on his all-around game, I can understand why people are so disgusted with it. This is not what I was talking about.
What I was questioning about is, if he is as bad as some people said about him, why is it not reflected in his stats? My focus is on the effect of his (dire) on-pitch performance to both the result of matches that he played in and his own quantifiable contribution in goals and assists, compared to his team mates. If his (dire) on-pitch performance was detrimental to the team, then I would expect more losses in the matches that he started. If his on-pitch performance was so awful that he contributed nothing, then his goal and assist tally should be among the worst in the team. What I meant to show was that, if results are what we concerned about, his contribution is arguably better than most of the others, which is at odds with the label that people put on him.
On what you said about Fenerbahce, Feyenoord, West Ham (off a cliff this season), Reading and Wigan being hardly the most inspiring list of teams to list when showing how a player has shone, I didn’t mean to list the matches that Rooney has shone, but those are the teams (with Leicester) that we managed to score 4 goals against, and Rooney was involved in those matches (except Leicester), I also think that most of the players (not just Rooney) must have played pretty well in the matches that we scored 4 goals. My point was more about, how can the worst player in the squad be involved in 5 of our 6 highest scoring matches of the season. On the side note, with the exception of Wigan, those teams are no minnows. We lost in the Europa away games against Fenerbahce and Feyenord. West Ham is still 12th in the table, with only 3 points distance to Southampton in the 8th. Reading is third in the Championship and having a play-off for promotion to the Premier League.
Expect him to start tonight, play 90 mins and stink the joint out again. Might as well use him for a meaningless match
Selfless?
The guy plays football, not being made a bouncer.
Do you honestly thinks players like ronaldo, giggs, beckham, messi and many other footballers that starts at 16 didn't start running since teenage?
Besides. He's 31 not 35
Or score again and get in the final because for all his bad play, the lad has a knack of scoring
Here are some more numbers to see whether Rooney's high winning percentage is due to weak oppositions.
On the criteria for strong oppositions, I use the following:
Premier league: top 5 + Everton, due to the 8th and 16th are only separated by 5 points.
Europa: Fenerbahce, Feyenord, Anderlecht, Celta Vigo (weak: Zorya, St Etienne, Rostov).
EFL: M. City, Southampton (final) (weak: Northampton, West Ham, Hull).
FA: Chelsea (weak: Reading, Wigan, Blackburn).
Comm. Shield: Leicester (former champion, trophy).
Total 24 matches vs strong oppositions from 61 total matches (39%).
Rooney started 7 of his 23 starts vs strong oppositions (30%), which is below average, but comparable to Fellaini 33% (9/27), Zlatan 32% (13/41), Young 27% (4/15), and Mata 26% (8/31).
We won 9 of the 24 matches vs strong oppositions (38%). None of our players won more than 50% of matches vs strong oppositions. Mata and Lingard won 50%, Rooney won 43% (3/7).
We won 26 of 37 matches vs weak oppositions (70%). Rooney has the highest win ratio of 81% vs weak oppositions (13/16).
We can interpret the numbers as we wish. For me, Rooney did play fewer matches vs strong oppositions, but he is not alone (percentage wise), so are a few others such as Zlatan and Mata. His win ratio vs strong oppositions is comparable to the others, his win ratio vs weak oppositions is the highest among our players.
Here are the detailed table:
Southampton 0:0 Man Utd
Very good pass to Martial there.
Martial should have done better though.
Martial should have done better though.
What a first touch
This lad looks a talent.
Mama mia Wazza! That touch, turn and pass.. Messi would be proud
Great touch and pass, I'm still slating him for it because it sparked the usual response from Phil Neville on my feed. "I can't believe anyone questions Rooney" "He's got years left"
Very poor cross there.
It's starting to get to the point where I'm struggling to remember him being good.
Why on earth didn't he cut it to Mkhitaryan then?
This guy eh. How the actual feck is he not being subbed.
Really hope we dont remember him as this Rooney, doesnt deserve that. Woeful footballer as of now.
And guys going about his assists, go watch them. Lingards amazing run in CS final was also an assist but not really an assist.
And guys going about his assists, go watch them. Lingards amazing run in CS final was also an assist but not really an assist.
Might as well run
him into the ground to rest others
Imagine he was getting minutes to get him ready for the final
Imagine he was getting minutes to get him ready for the final
Let's not even joke about it
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