Clearly AWB's fault for the goal, just decided to take a nap knowing full well that Welbeck was on top of him. I was wondering at the time of the goal if he could have done better but having watched it back and thought about it, AWB needs to take responsibility and clear that, Lindelof shouldn't be expecting him to make such basic errors. What's the point in having a RB when you expect the CB to do his job as well?
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Season Average Rating
- Appearances
- 45
- Clean sheets
- 17
- Goals
- 1
- Assists
- 2
- Yellow cards
- 4
- Status
I'm a cb I know how to play the position if that happens to me I am blaming myself you should never get under the ball like that if there is no one around you.
Looking back, AWB's technique for heading the ball is just awful and Lindelof jumps a bit more than I thought he did. It's easier to see in the close-up.
I don't see how you can put Lindelöf at fault for the goal. That's all on AWB.
One uncharacteristically rash slide apart I thought he had a fine game
One uncharacteristically rash slide apart I thought he had a fine game
Its really strange that posters have the same expectations from AWB as they have for Lindelof on a cross into the middle of the goal. Is Lindelof bad at attacking because he doesnt get forward as much as AWB?
Its a different position and none of the popular fullbacks in the premier league would beat Welbeck in the air with his height. Darnell Furlong at WBA, Doherty who has 10 starts for Spurs and Joel Ward win a lot of headers per 90 mins (4+) although most of them are against wingers who arent 6'2 so they might win it. Other than that your rightback isnt beating him to the ball. So unless you think we should be playing Joel Ward at rightback I dont see how you can excuse Lindelof from his mistake.
Its a different position and none of the popular fullbacks in the premier league would beat Welbeck in the air with his height. Darnell Furlong at WBA, Doherty who has 10 starts for Spurs and Joel Ward win a lot of headers per 90 mins (4+) although most of them are against wingers who arent 6'2 so they might win it. Other than that your rightback isnt beating him to the ball. So unless you think we should be playing Joel Ward at rightback I dont see how you can excuse Lindelof from his mistake.
I agree. I am a cb for me if I concede that I'm looking at myself
AWB is very week 1v1 in the box, but I don't see how that automatically takes away all the responsibility from him. It’s quite standard to move over the team like this and then the full back has to do some defending inside the box as well.
I’ve pretty much come to the conclusion that if we want to play AWB we have to accept 2-3 goals like this over the season. It’s not the end of the world, he does many other great things for our defence. To stop this kind of goals, our best weapon is to put pressure on the opponents so they don’t get to hit those accurate crosses. This is something we did very well against Chelsea.
And of course we shouldn’t lose possession in vulnerable positions as Pogba did.
I’ve pretty much come to the conclusion that if we want to play AWB we have to accept 2-3 goals like this over the season. It’s not the end of the world, he does many other great things for our defence. To stop this kind of goals, our best weapon is to put pressure on the opponents so they don’t get to hit those accurate crosses. This is something we did very well against Chelsea.
And of course we shouldn’t lose possession in vulnerable positions as Pogba did.
It's really strange that posters think a 6ft fullback who is touch tight to a striker should somehow be absolved of blame because a CB who is covering the central area of the box cannot grow another 6 inches to block a cross the fullback should really deal with. I'll be blunt: it just shows a complete understanding of football on your part if you are comparing the two here, as if they both have the same job.
AWB doesn't even have to beat Welbeck in the air (someone who has only scored 5 more headed goals in his entire career in the PL compared to Sterling), he just needs to stop him having a clean run at it. It's a big part of his job. If you watch the goal, AWB literally takes a step away from the ball before attempting to attack it. It's so, so poor.
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Yep. A simple body on Welbeck could have easily prevented the header. Weird to hang the majority of blame on Lindelöf.
AWB did terrible there but I can't completely absolve Lindelof not because he didn't make an attempt but simply because he misjudged the flight of the ball. This was a carbon copy of that goal in the Europa league last season (can't remember the team).
He should read the flight of the ball a little better and move backwards to head. For what it's worth, with the way he attempted the header, if Welbeck was his man (which he wasn't) he would still have lost it.
So Lindelof has to grow 6 inches to head a cross that he had all the time and space to reposition to?
I just dont see it.
Many RB's (especially all the attacking ones people are crying about) wont manage to stop welbeck make a run on goal. On the other hand so many CB'S would be able to head that cross out without having to grow in inches.
Wan Bissaka looks like he is positioned okay but Welbeck tricks him to get inbetween him and Lindelof. If wan Bissaka was supposed to stop that he would be grinding on the back of Lindelof's ass. @The Original said it perfectly, Lindelof mis timed and misjudged the flight of the ball. Wan Bissaka was also not good enought but the goal was very central in areas Lindelof should cover not Wan Bissaka. Maguire to me heads that out with ease.
well the ball is not that High so height should not be a problem for AWB in this situation. His man is Welbeck and should have delt with it.
In your opinion who is more to blame? AWB or VIC?
Gary Neville made it an art form. He didn't expect his world class CBs to do everything for him.
Well it's Ekeke. If you read even half of his posts in here you'd think Lindelof had murdered his family.
Its clear people disagree on that
All the time... Eh? Do you think it was a gently lofted cross or something? If he soends any more time back peddling then he won't jump in time. He shuffles his feet quickly enough, gets a decent leap, but ultimately, he can't get close enough to it.
Most FBs aren't over 6ft and don't need to take a step backwards like a cartoon character in order to attack the ball. If Lindelof has all the time to readjust, then AWB must have all day. The fact he doesn't jump is bad enough, that he ends up lower than his natural standing position is inexcusable.
Edit: Even on the video you put up as evidence it's solely based on AWBs poor defending and has nothing to do with Lindelof.
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A truly embarrassing comment
Are you genuinely suggesting that you know the position better than Lindelof, the guy who's paid 150 grand a week to play for Manchester United?
It's OK. I'm a fullback so I KNOW it should be the FBs responsibility to deal with that.A truly embarrassing comment
Are you genuinely suggesting that you know the position better than Lindelof, the guy who's paid 150 grand a week to play for Manchester United?
I play as a striker and when Martial or Cavani feck something up I might turn to the lads in the pub and go "I would have scored that" in the heat of the moment but it takes a whole new level of arrogance to seriously say he knows better than a United starter how to play their position.It's OK. I'm a fullback so I KNOW it should be the FBs responsibility to deal with that.
It's OK. I'm a fullback so I KNOW it should be the FBs responsibility to deal with that.
It's okay some people disagree with what you saw
Maguire doesnt let the ball touch his hair gel like Lindelof does. No wonder we need to upgrade Lindelof next, the guy has been a player that has missed and even avoided making headers and aerials through out his United career. But that's okay your a RB
It's okay some people disagree with what you saw
Maguire doesnt let the ball touch his hair gel like Lindelof does. No wonder we need to upgrade Lindelof next, the guy has been a player that has missed and even avoided making headers and aerials through out his United career. But that's okay your a RB
Yes, Maguire never fluffs his headers does he
If we're getting a new CB it will be in competition for the rotation. We will play a large number of games over the course of the season and it's not plausible to rely on just Maguire and Lindelöf to be fit for all of them. Lindelöf will still play a lot of games and for a good reason. There are bigger problems in this team than at CB IMO but it would good to get someone in to keep all defenders on their toes much like the Shaw/Telles situation. But you could say the same for RB and for sure in our attacking positions as well. Getting a magical upgrade on a position now isn't as clear-cut as some of you like to believe.
Whoosh! There goes the joke eh?It's okay some people disagree with what you saw
Maguire doesnt let the ball touch his hair gel like Lindelof does. No wonder we need to upgrade Lindelof next, the guy has been a player that has missed and even avoided making headers and aerials through out his United career. But that's okay your a RB
Both made a mistake but you should expect your CB to deal with crosses against tall opponents because if not them then who? Theres nobody. So its on them, unless the cross is right near the keeper then they can help too.
As I said, its a mistake most fullbacks are going to make. Thats why they arent CBs
Yeah as i mentioned earlier it looks like Vic got the timing wrong. The cross was really good and Vic probably thought he would get it.
But AWB never had to jump to get the ball. Just follow and prevent Welbeck. I expect a RB for us to do that. On the floor AWB takes care of everything so he knows how to defend
People trying to claim Lindelof should have dealt with that ball or had time to adjust
Simply put Bissaka has been found wanting at the back post yet again. It is a nice bit of movement by Welbeck to pull off Bissaka, he actually doesn’t even do that much he just lets Bissaka go and Bissaka loses him. Then he does what Bissaka should be doing which is anticipating that Lindelof isn’t getting there and gambles on it. Bissaka needs to do the same thing and be aware of Welbeck and just get body to body or infront of him. This is something Shaw is really good at. If he can’t win the header he makes sure it’s as difficult as possible for the attacker.
Lindelof for me had a pretty good game.
Simply put Bissaka has been found wanting at the back post yet again. It is a nice bit of movement by Welbeck to pull off Bissaka, he actually doesn’t even do that much he just lets Bissaka go and Bissaka loses him. Then he does what Bissaka should be doing which is anticipating that Lindelof isn’t getting there and gambles on it. Bissaka needs to do the same thing and be aware of Welbeck and just get body to body or infront of him. This is something Shaw is really good at. If he can’t win the header he makes sure it’s as difficult as possible for the attacker.
Lindelof for me had a pretty good game.
Thought Lindelof was decent enough yesterday - had some good clearances and headers, especially the one in the last couple of minutes. I also thought he brought the ball forward decently enough. He wasn’t pulling up trees or anything but solid enough.
Like @ivaldo said, as a defender you don't have to beat the attacker in the air to prevent him from scoring, you can tie a header, disturb the attacker enough so that he doesn't get the power or direction he wants or screen him off so that he doesn't reach the ball at all. Winning the header is far from the only successful way of defending a cross.
Also, simply being taller doesn't guarantee that you'll win a header from a cross, otherwise Peter Crouch would've scored 100 goals a season.
Let me clarify myself, Pogba, Shaw, Lindelof and AWB are all at fault. I certainly wouldn't absolve AWB at all.
I'm not placing the majority of the blame on Lindelof at all.
I'm just saying he should have done better, period. You don't get into that position marking no one and then justify 'couldn't jump any higher' or 'it was a decent cross'. No, he did poorly for it, plain and simple. Again watch the damn clip, he rests on his back foot and almost stops in tracks just as the cross comes in.
Granted, if he had cleared it, I would have clapped my hands and said 'good header and defending'. However, it was poor by virtue that he missed it.
It's not a stretch at all to call out a clear deficiency. Is it not justified to say Pogba dallies on the ball in midfield too much or AWB has poor passing ability?
Lindelof has lots of history of mistiming the flight of the ball.
Off the top of my head, Hudderfield and Crystal Palace from a few years ago. That infamous clip of Mourinho in the studio talking about how Lindelof is poor at heading (and wanting a new centre back), then right on cue, in the warm up session, he literally ducks under a ball. West Brom, Sevilla etc. That's just off the top examples.
This is not one of those 'I can find youtube clips of Bebe and make him look like Messi' bs. It's undeniable he has 'consistent' issues (not every game but often enough where it's alarming) with this.
I'm not placing the majority of the blame on Lindelof at all.
I'm just saying he should have done better, period. You don't get into that position marking no one and then justify 'couldn't jump any higher' or 'it was a decent cross'. No, he did poorly for it, plain and simple. Again watch the damn clip, he rests on his back foot and almost stops in tracks just as the cross comes in.
Granted, if he had cleared it, I would have clapped my hands and said 'good header and defending'. However, it was poor by virtue that he missed it.
A truly embarrassing comment
Are you genuinely suggesting that you know the position better than Lindelof, the guy who's paid 150 grand a week to play for Manchester United?
It's not a stretch at all to call out a clear deficiency. Is it not justified to say Pogba dallies on the ball in midfield too much or AWB has poor passing ability?
Lindelof has lots of history of mistiming the flight of the ball.
Off the top of my head, Hudderfield and Crystal Palace from a few years ago. That infamous clip of Mourinho in the studio talking about how Lindelof is poor at heading (and wanting a new centre back), then right on cue, in the warm up session, he literally ducks under a ball
. West Brom, Sevilla etc. That's just off the top examples.This is not one of those 'I can find youtube clips of Bebe and make him look like Messi' bs. It's undeniable he has 'consistent' issues (not every game but often enough where it's alarming) with this.
Granada 0:2 Man Utd
My man of the match. Seeing that kind of pass on European night is essence of what United should be.
Other than that, clean performance.
Other than that, clean performance.
Covered Maguire's ass more than once and got a deserved assist for a pass that feels like he plays once every game.
Good today. Did his job and bailed out his overeager partner.
I can't wait to hear what fault Ekeke will construct tonight.
Didn’t put a foot wrong all night and provided a quality assist, MOTM for me tonight.
Scholes esque
Solid performance MOTM.
Good defending, calm with and without the ball and then the nice assist.
Great to have his long balls to Rashford as weapon against a team that set up like Granada.
Great to have his long balls to Rashford as weapon against a team that set up like Granada.
He was good tonight, great assist. I would be annoyed if we didn’t keep a clean sheet with Kenedy and Soldado up front though.
The pass for the goal was the best thing we have done all night. Sensational pass.
It was only Granada but still good game by him today, came up with an odd assist too I will give it to him today.
A good night's work. Only fair to acknowledge it. Lovely of him and Rashy to pull the Sheff Utd routine out of the bag.
I agree, we should keep a clean sheet and this type of match is perfect for Lindelof and AWB. However I fear Tuanzebe might struggle in the next game. Hope he proves me wrong.
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