There's no point taking this further. You're digging in on justifying a ridiculous red card that wasn't even given for the reason you're arguing for. There is as clear a consensus across football as I've ever seen that this is not a red card.
VAR, Refs and Linesmen | General Discussion
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There's no point taking this further. You're digging in on justifying a ridiculous red card that wasn't even given for the reason you're arguing for. There is as clear a consensus across football as I've ever seen that this is not a red card.
I’m in the minority too and I can see why he gave it. He’s late, shin high with all studs making contact with no genuine attempt to play the ball.
It’s very far from being in the worst decision camp.
I seem to remember Rooney getting a red for something similar
It’s very far from being in the worst decision camp.
I seem to remember Rooney getting a red for something similar
It's not a red card. It's not even a point of debate. If the ref gives a yellow it's a non incident
It's hard to call it the worst decision in a long time but only because there's a decision like this almost once a week these days.
But again, it won't get any better until there are some kind of standards of professionalism and integrity applied to premier league referees.
It's hard to call it the worst decision in a long time but only because there's a decision like this almost once a week these days.
But again, it won't get any better until there are some kind of standards of professionalism and integrity applied to premier league referees.
No surprise that Arsenal scream bloody murder and the BBC have an entire article highlighting the dodgy red card.
Seriously, if we want it to stop happening to us we need our manager and players to moan like that London lot.
Seriously, if we want it to stop happening to us we need our manager and players to moan like that London lot.
I think it's a red card because he simply doesn't attempt to play the ball.
It's cynical, it's cheating, he rakes his studs down the shin and he doesn't need to do it.
It's stopping a counter attack and to be honest it's typical arsenal tactics and it's about time they got some sort of punishment for their organised cheating, so I really don't understand the problem with a red card. I mean normally it's a yellow but I can -absolutely- sympathise with a red.
Anyone remember Rooney getting sent off vs. (I think) West Ham for stopping a counter with a kick?
He's deliberately kicked someone to stop a counter attack. It's an extremely cynical yellow and he doesn't even bother playing the football.
It's one of those tackles that has made football worse because managers like Guardiola and Arteta coach their players to do it.
The reason they are kicking off is because it's "normally" a yellow. But for me it's somewhere in between. It's an insanely cynical kick and they deserve a red card anyway because feck the endless dirty shits playing their anti football every game. If it stops them doing it next game then great, worth the media shit storm, football is better for it.
Surprised to see anyone here defend that decision.
(Almost) Worked for me as a Liverpool fan but it's just not even close to being a red. Terrible decision.
(Almost) Worked for me as a Liverpool fan but it's just not even close to being a red. Terrible decision.
I hate the practice of deliberately kicking players nowhere near the ball to stop counter attacks. So yeah, forgive us if some of us don't cry a river. And it was a nasty little scrape too, so who cares. If reds were given for that sort of thing consistently it would make football better for it, I dont like the whole "taking a yellow for the team!" mentality because to be honest it's just normalised cheating, like so much else in the sport.
I sympathise with the view. I think they should be punished more harshly or maybe more often than they are but not randomly at the whim of the referee. Its not a rule, it wont be applied again this season, its terrible refereeing.
That still doesn't fall under DOGSO even if it was relevant to the decision.
There's no point entertaining this mate. It's just not a red card.
I don't know what version of football you've been watching to thi k it's the kind of tackle that's made football worse. Go back 15 years and it's not even a yellow. Go back another 15 and it might not even be a foul.
Would Michael Oliver have given a Man City player a red card in the same scenario?
I think we all know the answer to that question.
I think we all know the answer to that question.
Never mind the shit he's pulled against us over the years, he's a just fecking shit ref full stop. And he keeps getting away with it for some reason.
With the reputation of ‘the best ref in England’. I don’t even know how that started.
They call him the best ref. He's the worst I've ever seen by a stretch.
Seems like not only is there a highly controversial Ref/Var call each weekend, but it’s usually got Oliver’s fingerprints all over it. How he hasn’t been demoted to the championship I don’t know. Yet he keeps fecking up, keeps getting big games (including the club that pays his wages) and never has to answer for it.
If it was Collina doing this I could get it. But he’s a shit ref! The juice isn’t worth the squeeze. Just demote him and move on.
If it was Collina doing this I could get it. But he’s a shit ref! The juice isn’t worth the squeeze. Just demote him and move on.
They were complaining about the red card on talksport and I thought it was likely just ex-Arsenal players being biased, but wow, that’s an absolute shocker. Bizarre that some on here supporting it.
It does make football worse, it's cheating and no different to feigning injury or diving - unless of course those are also facet of football that you think are good
I don't like systematic fouling either but the way to stop it isn't giving out red cards, it's giving out yellows quickly for it rather than what the refs do currently - "it's too early for a yellow", "it's his first offence".
Reds shouldn't be given for that kind of thing.
Yep, least of all an individual ref, halfway through a league season, deciding to unilaterally reinterpret a rule. I’d guess every club in the league has at least one player who commits deliberate fouls on the edge of the opposition area to stop a quick attack. It should definitely be stamped out, but not like this.
Not even sure he does try reinterpret it, I think he classes it, wrongly of course, as serious foul play.
I don't think he's biased, just terrible, but I think he's the same ref who bottled the Kovacic red against Arsenal last season?
He is indeed, yeah
Not a great look then. Think he was just back from Saudi at the time too
Edit: wow the emojis aren't great on here...
Nothing to see here thoughNot a great look then. Think he was just back from Saudi at the time too
Michael Oliver. He just loves Arsenal.
It's not a red card. It doesn't matter what ridiculous childish spin you want to put on it.
Crap refereeing is definitely somerhing that has made football worse, amd is relevant to this incorrect red card and Michael Oliver in general.
Unlike whatever you're going on about
Go back 150 years and that’s still a foul. It would also be a yellow card since yellow cards were first invented. The “game’s gone soft” stuff only applies to robust attempts to win the ball. Blatantly kicking another player in the shins as he runs past is as scummy as it gets and would always have been treated harshly by referees.
A red card is over the top, obviously. Which you can tell from the reaction of the Wolves players. But I have zero sympathy for such twattish behaviour by the Arsenal player.
It is quite obviously not a red card. Ridiculous decision
I recommend watching any game from the 90s and seeing if this is still your opinion after. Or the fa cup games from the 80s mutv sometimes have on. There's one where we basucally murder the oppositions best player and his mates have to carry him off while the game carries on because he can't walk.
Obviously there's a reason why you can't do that anymore but the idea tackles like this have suddenly crept in and started being treated too leniently is a load of bollocks. There's no point ever that it's a red card and it also happens far too quickly to assume it was calculated.
Why not juat say "haha I don't like Arsenal" which would be a perfectly valid way to make the same point about not caring that an Arsenal player was wrongly sent off.
The last bit goes without saying.
The cynical little tugs and trips to break down stop opposition counters at source is a new-ish thing. It’s a classic Pep tactic so no surprise the knock off Lego version has his team drilled in the same tactics. This was a more extreme version than usual. But yeah, not a red card.
I do agree that there should be something done to get this shit stamped out. But I don’t think random red cards for non red card tackles is the answer. But am 100% behind this approach when it’s Arsenal players being sent off.
Feels to me like the absolute joy of football is waning, and the relevant bodies are doing what they must to ensure it remains a spectacle.
There’s always a game on. Transfer windows are a bar bizarre sideshow of their own. Pundits and commentators are over the top in both their praise and their criticisms. One moment it’s the greatest night in football, the next it’s the worst signings in history.
Similarly, the refs are doing their utmost to ensure football remains the talking point all week. It feels so far fetched to think they’re making bad decisions on purpose, but when you have video replays, and you still get it so horribly wrong, what else is one to think?
That was a truly bizarre red card for Arsenal today, but it has everyone talking about it so perhaps that’s job done.
Or maybe I’m just falling out of love with the sport I cherished for a very long time.
There’s always a game on. Transfer windows are a bar bizarre sideshow of their own. Pundits and commentators are over the top in both their praise and their criticisms. One moment it’s the greatest night in football, the next it’s the worst signings in history.
Similarly, the refs are doing their utmost to ensure football remains the talking point all week. It feels so far fetched to think they’re making bad decisions on purpose, but when you have video replays, and you still get it so horribly wrong, what else is one to think?
That was a truly bizarre red card for Arsenal today, but it has everyone talking about it so perhaps that’s job done.
Or maybe I’m just falling out of love with the sport I cherished for a very long time.
Has there been a similar incident in the league? Or is this another Oliver/Dalot moment where we never see it again?
He’s genuinely the worst and he’s seen as the best. The red card stat is crazy too, especially when you consider the fact he completely ignored the obvious kovacic yellow against arsenal last season. He’s corrupt.
He’s genuinely the worst and he’s seen as the best. The red card stat is crazy too, especially when you consider the fact he completely ignored the obvious kovacic yellow against arsenal last season. He’s corrupt.
thats how i feel alot of the time lately
Ref, who is a c**t, got lucky with the decision. His red was validated on video, for the obvious reckless challenge. That was not why he gave it though.
One other overlooked thing. The Arse players are used to get away with a lot. Refs also give them a lot. It can be a factor with this kind of challenge. In a twister way, they never consider that a harsh decision may come their way.
Players do feel and sense this type of this on the field. And Arsenal and City are the main offenders. No way a mid table team even consider being so risky in this type of situation.
One other overlooked thing. The Arse players are used to get away with a lot. Refs also give them a lot. It can be a factor with this kind of challenge. In a twister way, they never consider that a harsh decision may come their way.
Players do feel and sense this type of this on the field. And Arsenal and City are the main offenders. No way a mid table team even consider being so risky in this type of situation.
Surely that ridiculous Arsenal red card will finally be the straw that leads to a complete overhaul of the VAR process. It’s so clearly completely the wrong decision and there is no way that VAR shouldn’t be taking one look at it and overturning it.
Get rid of the “clear and obvious error” requirement and just let the VAR decide if they think it’s the correct decision and have a sensible grown up discussion with the onfield ref, whilst watching the replay together if necessary. It’s really that simple.
Get rid of the “clear and obvious error” requirement and just let the VAR decide if they think it’s the correct decision and have a sensible grown up discussion with the onfield ref, whilst watching the replay together if necessary. It’s really that simple.
No attempt to play the ball and raking, studs up contact. It's a red.
If that was Casemiro or Ugarte today, nobody would be saying, 'Oh, poor Ugarte got a rotten decision, Jeff. That's up there with the worst I've seen.' They would just be pointing out that it was a justified decision by the letter of the law.
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He never went for the ball and scraped his studs down his shin. Have you watched the replay?
Magnificent edit
You had to get all that bile out of your system before coming back to your senses. You couldn't even keep your opinion for more than 10 minutes at 2AM.