Come one. The ball glanced off the top of his head as he headbutted him.
It's more akin to getting a slight touch on the ball and following through and fouling the player, which is regularly given as a foul.
VAR, Refs and Linesmen | General Discussion
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Come one. The ball glanced off the top of his head as he headbutted him.
It's more akin to getting a slight touch on the ball and following through and fouling the player, which is regularly given as a foul.
I think it's silly to call it scandalous.
It looked like a run-of-the-mill clash of heads to me. If they both make contact with the ball within the same action and Saliba heads the ball before making contact with the attacker, it's hardly a head butt.
There's obviously scope for it to be a penalty, but it's far from clear cut. It's the type of call where VAR is unlikely to intervene with whatever decision is taken on the field. With had quite a few of those not go our way this season, so it's a little annoying. I'm far more annoyed by our limp display today, though.
This the arsenal pen? 100 percent a pen. And as you say, if this was the feet equivalent it would be a pain all day.
It's not a clash of heads, one has headbutted the other.
Why should it be any different than a high foot? Pen for me
Well obviously you see it that way.
You don’t think the obvious Joelinton handball being ignored by VAR was scandalous?
Oliver’s VAR call for a penalty against west ham that was ridiculed all round?
Bruno Fernandes red card that was overturned?
You mentioned Newcastle. I would need to rewatch these. Which would require me to find them.
If Saliba had have headed the ball full on as opposed to just a glance do you feel it would still be a penalty? If he still made the contact with Pedro too
I had to think about it, but I guess so. The way he headbutted the Brighton player was more than just the accidental aftermath.
Completely agree and find it astonishing that we had a referee +var red card overturned on appeal. That's how bad that decision was and shouldn't be possible. Michael Oliver's crusade against us is due to continue tomorrow, so I imagine there will be another red card / penalty against us, unless he's been instructed to keep the title race (and relegation race in our case) interesting.
Penalty. You can’t just , headbutt someone, even if it wasn’t meant
I mean, everything I wrote before “it’s hardly a head butt” isn’t merely my point of view - it’s literally what happened. The subjective part is what you make of it and it’s not only Arsenal fans who think it’s an unusual call - the match commentators, pundits and a load of journalists all stated that you rarely see a penalty given for that.
The funny thing is, I’m not even saying that it isn’t a necessarily penalty. Just that it was a soft one where VAR is unlikely to intervene either way as opposed to head butt, stonewall, nailed on pen.
It's a debatable one I agree. I do feel Saliba is quite unlucky though
We are never getting a pen for that, but I think it's still a clear pen and I can't understand why Arsenal fans are going nuts over it.
Pedro is in control of the ball, he's trying to nick it around Saliba, who has gone in and shaved the ball slightly with his head and taken out Pedro. It's not a simple clash of heads because Pedro has possession of the ball. Saliba is not in control of what he's doing and has mistimed his attempt to claim the ball, resulting in Pedro getting wiped out.
Pedro is in control of the ball, he's trying to nick it around Saliba, who has gone in and shaved the ball slightly with his head and taken out Pedro. It's not a simple clash of heads because Pedro has possession of the ball. Saliba is not in control of what he's doing and has mistimed his attempt to claim the ball, resulting in Pedro getting wiped out.
It's not though. It's your interpretation. Saliba gets a slight contact on the ball, but he's late and he headbutts Pedro.
It's similar to how a follow through on a tackle, even if contact is made on the ball, is still a foul.
As for VAR, everything is subjective with VAR these days as the bar is stupidly high for intervention. It's an unusual incident today but I don't think it's particularly soft.
I agree it was a penalty.
Whats funny is the same people calling it penalty were also vigorously defending the non pen decision last season when Onana absolutely wiped out the Wolves player.
Whats funny is the same people calling it penalty were also vigorously defending the non pen decision last season when Onana absolutely wiped out the Wolves player.
MOTD going strong on “not a penalty”.
Perhaps because it was a different incident
After watching the highlights, I have no idea how Burn doesn’t get sent off. Yes he moves his arms in a bit; but he’s doing a full on starfish pose before that, and his arm ends up disrupting Spurs. It’s a stonewall second yellow.
They're talking bollox as well. "He clearly heads the ball". Well no, the ball clearly touches the top of his head as he's about to head butt Pedro.
But that doesn’t matter. The rule is the armpit line, and it’s clearly beyond that.More shoulder than hand/arm for Burn IMO
No it's not it's pretty much on the line.
The more you read this thread the more you understand why the referees are so bad. Everyone trying to one up each other with dumber and dumber interpretations of every incident depending on who they support or who they hate the most this week.
You have weird body. Your shoulders and armpit start at your elbow.
Agree with this.
Just seen the highlights of the Brighton penalty. I’m really surprised by the backlash. Saliba has not touched the ball and ended up head butting Pedro. Clear pen. Fair play to the ref for spotting it in real time.
Not really. Both players went for the ball and in Onanas case utterly wiped out the player and in Salibas case it was a graze.
Both were penalties. I am on consistent on both. Unlike you. I dont let tribalism cloud my judgement.
Agree with that.
Seeing some say that commentators were calling it unusual, which it was due to the nature of what happned but as far as the decision goes it looks correct to me.
Most times something vaguely similar to that happens is when an attacker has already headed it over/wide/into the goal etc. and the contact makes no difference in terms of what could have happened next. We've started seeing penalties being given for that kind of thing now too although it's still a bit rare.
In this one the ball is still in play and Pedro is trying to get to it so it makes it more obvious or easier to give.
There’s a lot of truth in that. For what it’s worth I think the Brighton penalty was harsh and I have no doubt there would be carnage in here if such a decision was given against United.
I think this is a penalty, it's not two players challenging for header with the ball in the air.
Pedro has just knicked it round him and Saliba has gone in with his head, totally missed the ball, made contact with his head. I'd say that's more similar to a mistimed ground tackle and worthy of a penalty.
Well, you really made a mess of that, didn’t you? I never said it whether i thought it was a penalty or not. As it happens, it depends what day of the week it is with constantly changing interpretations. In my view, there was no intent from Saliba, he was just a bit slow to it and the ball had gone so there was no goal scoring opportunity lost, although to dismiss it as just a graze is showing your colours whereas Onana got the emotional treatment with “utterly wiped out“. I think Saliba was fairly hard done to as it was a genuine coming together, but that didn’t help De Ligt at West Ham, (where the decision was universally condemned) did it? Perhaps you could have cited that example. If I was the ref I would not have given it but in today’s context, where a passing whisp of wind is enough to knock most players over, it’s understandable that it was… and you are quite correct, in some respects, that it was similar to the Onana one, too, although your “wiped out” remark, again, shows your colours. Again, there was no opportunity lost, as the ball had gone before Onana arrived, and the wolves man, big a unit that he was, went rolling arround like he’d been shot, when there was a less hard contact than yesterday and no injury whatsoever. Just another fanny hamming it up.
Erm…. Okay?
Which decisions have NUFC had that were factually incorrect lately? By the laws, it wasn’t handball yesterday and the ball hits Burn armpit high (more luck by design perhaps).
On the flip side Gordon has been elbowed in the box by VVD and Kulusevski and neither were given as a penalty, VVD should have been sent off, Dubvraka got kneed in the face by Solanki yesterday, not even looked at.
The ref added 10 mins yesterday & another 3 and this is the same ref who added 5 mins against Lpool, stopped the game for over a minute in added time and blew dot on 5 mins when we had a 3-1 on 1 break.
Just saying.
On the flip side Gordon has been elbowed in the box by VVD and Kulusevski and neither were given as a penalty, VVD should have been sent off, Dubvraka got kneed in the face by Solanki yesterday, not even looked at.
The ref added 10 mins yesterday & another 3 and this is the same ref who added 5 mins against Lpool, stopped the game for over a minute in added time and blew dot on 5 mins when we had a 3-1 on 1 break.
Just saying.
Probably not the forum to be posting this question on after your team had a goal allowed against United that was actually a handball.
Ok, it wasn’t handball though. Shoulder definitely, upper arm arguably but nothing there to say it was definitely handball. Joelinton’s was more factual than opinion?Probably not the forum to be posting this question on after your team had a goal allowed against United that was actually a handball.
I not expecting much support here for sure . Ange was quality yesterday in his interviews, he’s losing it big time. All things being equal turning into fair and balanced mate. Go on Ange, say what you mean.
It hits his tricep not his elbow.