This is an amazing bias post, I don't remember the Spurs one, but the other 3 were fine. Stop playing the victim, it's embarrassing.
VAR, Refs and Linesmen | General Discussion
- Thread starter Samid
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Absolutely do agree that interfeering with the keeper is more clear, but I do not get how anyone can see the situation and say that he didn't impact/interfere with the defender. Had the defender reached the ball had Maguire not been there? Hell do I know, and it doesn't matter.
Look, we are never gonna agree on this one. It is fine to have different opinions, but I really think this shows the issues with the rule. Before they sort out the rule you are never not gonna get decisions that divides the fans. And in regards to offside, as opposed to other situations, there can exist a rule that does not allow room for subjectivity.
I've found it amazing that so many are adamant Garnacho was onside.
I personally think the City one was harsh but moreso from the perspective that VAR doesn't usually get involved in those incidents, rather than me thinking it's never a foul.
Spurs one should've been a penalty, to be fair. Especially considering other penalties that have been given since for very similar incidents. But it wasn't bias, it was just the refs being shit.
The City one is suspect because it's Oliver on VAR, who shouldn't be getting involed in that decision let alone refereeing any City related games since he's just been over in the UAE getting paid by City's owners. Even if he's done nothing suspect there's still a clear conflict of interest that brings his role into disrepute.
Which pen for City? Against us?
I thought it was soft and not clear he was impeded at all as he made the most of the contact. If you're making a point about consistency then I agree the lack of it is what's infuriating. It must be a nightmare for players to navigate. 9 times out of 10 it's fine except randomly they decide it's enough to award a penalty.
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Can we get one of those Ulez demo folk with a hammer into old trafford and sort that camera out then?
It definitely matters because that would be a justification to rule the goal out as opposed to the black hole of justification that currently exists. I think if Maguire cant get to the ball having stolen a yard on him with momentum going towards the ball (as oppossed to the opposite way to hold an offside line) then its pretty clear the defender wasn't going to get there. You can argue the goalkeeper which is at least plausible but i think its bullshit and they've basically reverted to if anyone is offside, its offside for one decision and will have a billion astericks and exceptions for every other offside decision this season.
I don't really disagree, though I have no issue with clubs speaking to the relevant people about clearly awful decisionscand a lack of consistency, but that's unrelated to what you said.
Are retrospective reds still a thing? If so, how does Guimaraes escape any punishment for his forearm smash?
Fair enough but this guy was offside. Was Maguire offside when Garnacho crossed it though?
Maguire impedes and affects the defender's ability to play the ball, he even nearly gets a toe on it. I don't know how you're possibly arguing against that.
There was a similar one given a couple of weeks ago against Brentford, though I would argue it was much less clear than yesterday's:
But this isn't anyone. This is a player that's actively trying to reach and play the ball and a defending player are in direct physical contact with him. Maguire would not have been deemed offside if he stopped his run, or didn't lunge himself to try and reach the ball or if he wasn't physically interfeering. But fair enough, you clearly don't think he is impacting the defender, I disagree.
Because he plays for one of two clubs who have fingers in political pies.
Well, there is that.
Hate saying it but Casemiro or Hannibal does the same, and it’s missed, you just know it’ll be in Prime Minister’s questions on the Wednesday.
Think they scrapped those a few years ago.
That's fair enough.
I remember Højlund getting fouled and we should have had a pen, pulled down.
Except he did block the defender. It's obvious he impedes the Fulham's defender from trying to get on the ball. It's quite likely Fulham defender would get to the ball if not for Maguire impeding him. Therefor it's offside. I really don't see why is everyone so upset about this decision.
OTOH, Hojlund not getting a penalty vs Arsenal was daylight robbery.
It's not brilliant as VAR was brilliant for them before this, they're just sulking because a decision has actually went against them instead of saving them.
It's a clown show. You can't whinge about it just when it suits your agenda. They were fine with shit decisions for other teams against them.
These decisions they're moaning about aren't even incorrect decisions ffs
For me that’s the point I have seen the replay several times and I am struggling to say without doubt the original and on field decisions we’re clearly wrong.
What I have heard little or nothing about is the Havertz potential red card. He was out of control, went in with excessive force and paid no attention to the safety of the player.
Well when you put it like that....
Not really since the introduction of VAR since all incidents are considered to have been dealt with (apart from the time when they ignored that and rescinded MacAllister’s red card for going in studs up on an opponent).
I've heard Carragher say Gabriel "needs to be stronger" for the Newcastle goal.
It's hard to be strong if someone is pushing you in the back with both hands mid-air!
It's hard to be strong if someone is pushing you in the back with both hands mid-air!
If he stopped his run then he would have been blocking the defender and would still be punished (probably more legitimately). I presume he didn't know he was offside. I dont think the defender was getting there and i think there was minimal interference from maguire beyond existing.
I dont even particularly care where you draw the line for interfering with play, it'll change again next week.
Nah be strong you wuss
I agree that they should speak directly to the people involved with direct conversations. Statements just seem to put pressure on the refs going forward.
And was he offside when Garnacho crossed the ball? Genuine question.
I ask because when Eriksen lobbed the ball in McTominay who scored was actually offside, but it didn't matter because he was onside when the cross came in.
Once again, when it is easy to explain things, people shouldn't make it difficult by trying to find some other excuse.
Everyone knows by now how many decisions have gone against us. Both big and little decisions. They are there for everyone to see.
Everyone knows by now how many decisions have gone against us. Both big and little decisions. They are there for everyone to see.
Utd had penalty chalked off once by Craig Pawson because Maguire was offside, but the rules actually stated the opposite, that the foul happened before he could play the ball, so the penalty should have stood. Although, that was a slightly different version of events.
FA rules state: "In a situation where a player in an offside position is moving towards the ball with the intention of playing the ball and is fouled before playing or attempting to play the ball or challenging an opponent for the ball, the foul is penalised as it has occurred before the offside offence."
But anyway, yesterday Maguire was offside when the ball was played, attempting to get to it impeded the defenders actions. It was offside.
Refs were inconsistent before VAR and they will be inconsistent with VAR. its just a tool to help them make decisions, it doesn’t guarantee they will make good decisions.
I would wager that Arteta knows what he is doing with his rant too. He knows that will buy him a decision later on down the line.
I would wager that Arteta knows what he is doing with his rant too. He knows that will buy him a decision later on down the line.
Because if that goal happened at the other end of the pitch:
A) It wouldn't get called and the goal would stand
B) It would get called and ESPNFC would do a 2 hour special about how bad of a call it was that favoured United
Arteta and arsenal, the entire football club I mean, are a complete embarrassment
Conveniently managing to not speak about the clear and obvious error when Havertz wasn’t sent off, when whining like a 6 year old who’s just had his iPad taken away about something that wasn’t clear and obvious.
Go feck yourselves - what goes around comes around.
Conveniently managing to not speak about the clear and obvious error when Havertz wasn’t sent off, when whining like a 6 year old who’s just had his iPad taken away about something that wasn’t clear and obvious.
Go feck yourselves - what goes around comes around.
Any scousers here? As great as Luton's goal was today, it shouldn't have counted. There was a clear handball by Barkley. The announcers were certain it wasn't a handball because he had his back turned to VVD as he was heading it. But turning your back doesn't give you free reign to put your arms up. With the old laws it would be counted as ball to hand and play on, but with the new laws, that's a handball, and as great as Luton's goal was (at'a boy Chong), it should have been called back with a penalty awarded to Liverpool
Of course they aren't going to talk about it. But isn't that also part of the problem? Hate to sound like my mom but "2 wrongs don't make a right". Yes, Havertz should have been sent off and the ref in charge (and VAR) should be punished for only giving a yellow card. But just because there is that screw up it doesn't mean it's ok to screw up the goal. And do you really expect Arteta to stand up and say "my man should have been red carded"? When asked about it he said something along the lines of "this is the problem", referring to horrible calls not being made correctly in what is supposed to be the best league in the world...
That's pure conjecture.
By the rules goal was offside. Maguire impeded the play and a correct decision was made. I don't really understand why you are upset. Because we didn't get to cheat our way to win? No thanks, man.
So what exactly was clear and obvious about the goal that needs correcting?[/QUOTE]
Yeah if he didn't air swing at the ball, which neither he nor the defender were getting to, the goal would have stood. That's farcical imo.
I haven't seen the incident but if his back was to the play then presumably it would be deemed accidental handball.
Accidental handball by an attacking player is only a handball offence if that attacking player scores directly from that incident, so that wouldn't be handball under the current rules.
It’s just about as farcial as not being allowed to pick up the ball with your hands for a quick throw in before it rolls over the line evne though it’s obviously going to go out for a throw in if you don’t pick it up.
It’s easy: An offside placed Maguire was actively competing with the Fulham player for the ball, and by doing so he effected the Fulham players chances of clearing it. Would it have made much of a difference if Maguire was a few more cm behind and onside? Probably not, but that’s besides the point.
What is farcial, however, is the difference in VAR outcome for Newcastles goal against Arsenal. Does the ball cross over the line? VAR has no angle to prove that the on pitch decision (flag stays down) is wrong so they don’t intervene, but it’s pretty much an exact replica of Rashfords pass to Højlund where the VAR, with no proper angles, decides the ball has rolled over the line. That is farcial.
Not to mention that Joelintons push on Gabriel should be a freekick 10 out of 10 times. Joelinton mistimes the header and is on his way down, with both arms stretched out into Gabriels back, when the ball comes in and hits him in his chest. It’s madness that it’s allowed
It’s not farcical. Maguire was involved in active play hence the offsides. Had he not been involved in active play (I.e. remained stationary due to being in an offside position), the defender would have covered Garnacho and may have prevented the cross or at least the goal.