Arsenal did the right. I can guarantee you the next decision will go in Arsenal’s favour. Liverpool always get favourable calls because Klopp and their fans will go after them and the cowardly refs are scared of the fallout.
VAR, Refs and Linesmen | General Discussion
- Thread starter Samid
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Are you referencing the overturned penalty in our game?
I've only seen the goal a couple of times and not a great angle, but yes, never mind the ball in/out debate, the 2 handed push into the back of the defender, enough to leave him on the floor, being ignored was outrageous.
Although their fans didn't think it was a foul when Odegaard clearly shoved Eriksen from behind at our place last season, so maybe they appreciate these pushes being allowed
There was clear handball/penalty against Liverpool that they just ignored for some reason in that first half. Embarassing stuff.
Commentators didn't even bother mentioning it even though it was shown on a replay
Well it's not Manchester United, nothing will be said about it anymore.
Serve arsenal right. You have to be for better officiating and better var all the time not just when it suits your own team.
This has always been offside though. It's not a VAR thing, it is just that with VAR it is easier to spot these kind of offsides.
Whether or not these kind of offsides was why the rule was introduced is irrelevant - gaining an advantage from an offside position is absolutely something that should be disallowed in the spririt of the game. Then of course you can have the discussion what kind of offside margin you should allow (I think they should have a bit more margin of error giving more benefit of a doubt for attackers), but that is a different matter to me.
Anyway, I always maintain that they need to make the law clearer, so there isn't any subjectiveness in it (when it comes to offsides). It is those part of the rule that causes things to be incosistent - it is impossible to get consistent decisions when the law leaves room for interpretations.
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Brilliant by Arsenal. People can talk all day long but that is what you do. That is why Arsenal is usually getting decisions for them.
Our club should be doing this. With even more stronger words. Why is ManUtd treated badly by referees and VAR? We should demand investigations. We should demand transparency with mics and cam. We should demand tapes from games we have been playing. We should demand answers how our opposition always gets decisions for them when they play against us. TenHag and our board must raise voice because treatment of us have been nothing short of a scandal.
It's not brilliant as VAR was brilliant for them before this, they're just sulking because a decision has actually went against them instead of saving them.
It's a clown show. You can't whinge about it just when it suits your agenda. They were fine with shit decisions for other teams against them.
These decisions they're moaning about aren't even incorrect decisions ffs
OK I could be willing to accept that. Do you know of any videos on YouTube showing simular incidents where a goal was ruled out?
Surely it must happen every week if that's the case.
And I'd disagree strongly that the majority of VAR offside decisions are in the spirit of the rule. The rule was introduced to prevent goal hanging. I dont think anyone envisaged that one day, officials would be arbitrarily freezing a video at the point they decide the ball was played. And then proceeding to choose a random camera angle to plop lines down to determine whether or not an attackers eyebrow was 5mm offside.
When you have to get to that stage to determine if it's onside. Then it should just be onside.
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I think the chance of seeing a repeat of that decision this season is zero. Which is a good thing to be clear because it was a stupid call.
If you watch the goal again and look at Joelinton's reaction, he stood there for a few seconds looking at the ref while his teammates celebrated. Even he couldn't believe the ref has given itI've only seen the goal a couple of times and not a great angle, but yes, never mind the ball in/out debate, the 2 handed push into the back of the defender, enough to leave him on the floor, being ignored was outrageous.
Although their fans didn't think it was a foul when Odegaard clearly shoved Eriksen from behind at our place last season, so maybe they appreciate these pushes being allowed
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eth should more often blame the refs
We know that Arsenal have been getting decisions in their games. Yesterday, it should have been freekick before the goal.It's not brilliant as VAR was brilliant for them before this, they're just sulking because a decision has actually went against them instead of saving them.
It's a clown show. You can't whinge about it just when it suits your agenda. They were fine with shit decisions for other teams against them.
These decisions they're moaning about aren't even incorrect decisions ffs
However the points is that they protect the club by making that statement. We let referees, VAR and everybody else bully us without even asking, how, what and why are things happening against us.
Maybe we do ask how, but behind the scenes. You're not supposed to publicly slate the refs, which I'd take as VAR too. Arteta should be fined for his stupid outburst. I am 100% sure this was a fave of them to hand bans and fines out for a couple years ago.
Arteta is just trying to look like he is passionate about it and thinks his public show of childishness will get people on his side.
Referees do need to be held more accountable, I've always said it. They just get away Scott free no matter what they do, worst they get is demoted for a game or 2 then they're back making shit decisions with zero consequences.
It's usually the VAR guys who are doing the worst. Proper phoning it in, sure they don't even pay proper attention.
Well yes, but it wasn't that long ago Salah stood miles offside, the goon defender dealt with the ball as he needed to, then Salah ended up scoring straight after.
That sort of incident should have been way more important to clamp down on.
To expect the defender to leave a ball, not being 100% clear if Salah was lurking, level or offside, is ridiculous.
What's embarrassing about this?
Just watch the highlights how the feck that goal stood ffs. And this is exactly what ETH should have been doing instead of saying feck all when we got shit on by refs and VAR.
Nice to see Klopp getting yellow carded, these managers get away with too much these days.
Behind the scenes? Well it doesn't help us anything. Lets see
Lost against Arsenal because of refs and VAR. Lost against CP because of refs and VAR. Lost against Tottenham because of refs and VAR. Lost against ManCity because refs and VAR. Would we have won those games? At least some of them.
We got some weird decisions against Burnely, against Wolves and now against Fulham even if we won. Not to mention all those small decision that influence games like yellow cards in early stages, on important players, freekicks and so on.
Nope, but I wasn't being very clear, to be fair.
Robert Sanchez took out Jesus in our match against Chelsea in a very similar fashion to Onana vs Wolves. We didn't get the penalty and and it wasn't really made a big deal of by commentators, pundits or anyone - apart from salty Gooners. There were then a few posts in this thread about how if that was Onana it would have been constantly brough back up even weeks later. Which is fair enough, this is a United forum after all.
It was just in response to a post that saying Arsenal have only had a single decision go against them in the last year. We've had loads go against us as can be seen in throughout this thread. It's just instantly framed as anti-United, which, once again, makes sense as this is a thread complaining about refs on a United forum.
Tbf we lost a lot of those games by just being shite. VAR didn't help, but we didn't help ourselves either.
I don't and I frankly don't have the energy to look it up.
My general memory from watching football 15 years ago though was that offsides were called much faster and didn't wait until the player was deemed to be active. Again, just because it's a slight offside and hard for a lino to spot does not make it less offside.
I actually found a video of a slightly similar situation
I know it isn't the same but a ball is crossed into the area, where an offside player makes an attempt but mistimes it, and the ball falls to an onside player and a goal is scored shortly thereafter.
Not at all.
Against Arsenal. Garnacho scores clear goal. Disallowed. Arsenal scores a goal that should have been freekick.
Against CP. Crystal Palace scores a goal that is similar the one Evans got his disallowed week before. Player infront of keeper. We should have penalty.
Against Tottenham. When the game was equal we should have had clear penalty. Nothing given.
Against ManCity. When the game was equal they gave goal to ManCity for nothing.
Inclusive all little decision going their way.
Yes, I agree that the debilerate thing is crazy. That should absolutely, in the spirit of the game, be offside (haven't actually seen this particular instance but seen a fair few fitting that description). Unfortunately the rules are so bad in these situations so that these kind of goals can be allowed.
Tables like these are always dumb though because it doesn't count all the instances where VAR could (should) have intervened but didn't, like Romero handball, Gabriel foul on Højlund and potentially Ward handball where he tracks the ball for 40 yards before turning his back to it at which point his hand flails out and denies Rashford a shot on goal.
It just counts where VAR overturned an on-pitch decision and you can't say you're hard done by if the linesman misses an offsides that VAR shows was offside. That's just getting the right decision.
Fair enough.
The officials have added plenty of Kloppage time here, and just as im typing they get their equalizer.
Tbh I started to seriously question what the hell is wrong with the PL refs. I can't remember a game where they're even slightly decent at their job anymore. While in Europe football like CL or EL most of the time the ref are very decent, balanced and unbiased. Except when the match involves some teams like Barca or Madrid. Which made me to question even more.
There's got to be a table of the various amounts of added time when each team is chasing a result. Seems nailed on 8+ minutes when Liverpool or Arsenal aren't winning regardless of what happens in the actual game.
Playing 10 extra minutes in a game where there was one 1-2 min VAR check and no other major stoppages... for what reason?
Playing 10 extra minutes in a game where there was one 1-2 min VAR check and no other major stoppages... for what reason?
Well the ball didn’t go out of play. It wasn’t offside and the ‘foul’ wasn’t clear and obvious enough to overturn. The defender was stooping and going down before any contact. Don’t know what all the fuss is about.
It’s embarrassing because Arteta couldn’t actually explain which decision was incorrect. He’s just upset he lost. He looked stupid. Exactly as ETH would have looked if he’d done the same.
I don't know if the ball went out or not. But it's fecking obvious the Newcastle player was using his hands to push the Arsenal defender. From when it's legal to use your hands to push another player down when that player is running while competing for the ball? What you'd need more for that to be obvious enough?
This so completely different though. The offside player here distracts the goalie who has to come out to cover a potential shot, leaving the goal wide open for the other attacker.
None of those things happened with Maguire yesterday. I think you'd be hard pressed to find an example of what occured yesterday being given as offside.
I’d have to watch it again but at the time I didn’t think it was a foul, it was very weak from the defender.
So basically Arteta is having a meltdown and the club are releasing statements because of a subjective ref decision that happens to every team everyweek
I don't think it's obvious he pushed him at all. From the wider angle the defender is already leaning forward to head the ball before Joelinton's hands make contact. I couldn't see a noticeable shove forward but the defender definitely throws his legs back when he feels the contact.
It's not a clear cut foul for me.
We can agree to disagree I think. There's nothing stupid or wrong or embarrassing in fighting for your team.
Especially when you feel you're hard done by a wrong decision. Even if you got fined (or actually look stupid) the refs would have to think twice before deciding to shit on your team again. Because they know you won't stay silent and accept that.
Going by this logic they should not have the pen given for City don't you agree? Because we could argue all day what's enough or not.
Interfering with the keeper is so much more clear cut in that instance. I'd be more partial to a rule closer to that of 15 years ago but its not how it currently stands. The ball passing the general vicinity of an offside player isn't against the rules.
Theres probably one or two offside players on every set piece taken today. Unless they play the ball or interfere with an opponent its not a foul. Maguire didn't play the ball, he didn't block the defender, he didn't block the keepers view - who didn't make an obvious reaction to maguire not reaching the ball. He was onside for Garnacho's pass. I dont see the offence other than it passed near him leading up to the goal.
It just feels like they've lurched off in a stupid direction from not disallowing that goal that had an offside player dummy a shot in the 6 yard box. It was City who scored it i think.