United under LvG: verdict so far!

[Empire]

Also Louis van Gaal a couple months ago talked about how the injury crisis has prevented 'automaticity', so the entire thing working like a machine, he said that requires consistently selecting the same 11.

His rotation policy will be interesting next season, I get the impression he wants the same starting 11 every match and would prefer to change only when he is forced to or to implement a specific tactical strategy to exploit an opposition weakness.

 

[carlosp]

I think more accurately put (and more important in the system we're playing) is that Rooney presses from the front, and does so tirelessly.

This was apparent on Sunday, he pressed endlessly and chased down every backpass played to Mignolet. Indeed, at one point Rooney almost stole the ball from him.

RvP and Falcao don't offer this at all and it makes a massive, massive difference (even when Rooney's having a 'bad game'.

Without the pressing from the front I assure you that we wouldn't've dominated Liverpool at Anfield.

RvP back tracks quite a bit and helps in midfield but people seem to miss that.

Falcao on the other hand has had terrible first touch, terrible decision making and is slow. Really terrible season for him. I prefer RvP any day over Falcao. Rooney though is a work horse, people critised him on the weekend, he didn't have a great game but he put in a shift. Good enough for me.

 

[dutchred]

Also Louis van Gaal a couple months ago talked about how the injury crisis has prevented 'automaticity', so the entire thing working like a machine, he said that requires consistently selecting the same 11.

His rotation policy will be interesting next season, I get the impression he wants the same starting 11 every match and would prefer to change only when he is forced to or to implement a specific tactical strategy to exploit an opposition weakness.

I agree. I think he will paly his best 11 every week. He is a believer in fitness and assumes that if you are fit you can play 2 games a week. We will see tactical changes but not rotation, except for the non European cup games

 

[Rams]

I think over the past few weeks the way United pressed when the opposition when they had the ball resembled more like something I would expect from a team coached by Van Gaal. I also think having Carrick back helps as well.

 

[Adebesi]

Also Louis van Gaal a couple months ago talked about how the injury crisis has prevented 'automaticity', so the entire thing working like a machine, he said that requires consistently selecting the same 11.

His rotation policy will be interesting next season, I get the impression he wants the same starting 11 every match and would prefer to change only when he is forced to or to implement a specific tactical strategy to exploit an opposition weakness.

From what I've read he likes to have different players who understand the roles of the positions within the system, so he can change personnel without it changing the way you play. I think he understands the need for rotation from a freshness perspective, he'll obviously have what he feels is his strongest team but he'll use his squad players as any team competing on several fronts must.

Above all Van Gaal is a systems man so for him the individual might even be less important than for other managers. As long as the backup players understand the role he's asking them to play and execute his instructions he's happy. Ultimately he'll want to get that automacity even without the same players necessarily playing every week.

 

[Tomuś]

The new approach being implemented by LVG is probably the most radical change of direction this club has made since Ron Atkinson done away with the more pragmatic style of his predecessor Dave Sexton. It's been the mantra of United that we play with two out and out wide players and skin the opposition with exciting counter attack style football.

It's been great fun for the best part of 25 years but has it really been the right approach all of that time ? Domestically you would have to say yes but United are bigger than just enjoying domestic success and two Champions Leagues - one every twelve years during the Fergie years- I think is under achieving.

Van Gaals obsession with possession is slower, undoubtedly less exhilarating but ultimately I think we can become more of a force in the CL. It is football with the hand brake slightly on but his style will encourage concentration, discipline and patience and his philosophy of the ball coming to the player as opposed to the player going to the ball is centred around creating space when not in possession and vision and accuracy of passing when you've got the ball at your feet.

You obviously need the personnel and not just the tactics to unlock the meanest of European defences but sometimes under Fergie in Europe I felt we were easy pickings and some of our very worst European performances were when we ironically tried to play the way can Gaal is now but we had players who weren't comfortable playing a slow possession game, it was everything their Saturday approach wasn't but under van Gaal I feel we will be far better suited and prepared for CL football.

Fergie evolved with time and we became a much different animal in Europe. Our away performances of 07-11 were mostly admirable from the tactical point of view (with few glaring exceptions). Watch us against Inter at San Siro in 08/09 season, Fergie ate Mourinho tactically. Or Shalke away in the SF a couple of year later. Milan away in 09/10 campaign... I think the influence of Queiroz in the mid-2000s has helped a lot. Prior to that we didn't have the personnel (04-06) and before that we admittedly were too gung-ho.

EDIT: In Fergie's last season our play was influenced by Rene's watchword 'attack less but with greater quality' we were winning games while not fully controlling them which was best seen in the big games (Chelsea away, City away). Van Gaal revolution is visible. I've never seen us play the way we did at Anfield last Sunday but then again I'm far from being an expert on tactics. Will search for some tactical analysis from the game.

 

[red_7]

Improved pressing, Carrick and a proper system are the reasons for me. I always said drop the 2nd striker for the sake of the team.

 

[Cantonaaa!]

Improved pressing, Carrick and a proper system are the reasons for me. I always said drop the 2nd striker for the sake of the team.

Every poster on here said we should drop RVP and Falcao and play Rooney up top in a 4231. Most would have Mata and Herrera in there as well. Just took LVG 8 months and a fit Carrick to stumble across what we knew all along..

Joking aside, I'm really pleased with recent performances, just a shame with the international break. They always seem to come when we hit some form..

 

[theyneverlearn]

We'll really know if LvG has learnt when RvP is fully match fit. Will he drop Rooney back into the CAM/CM role to accommodate him? It would be disappointing if he does and would confirm to me that LvG stumbled into this winning formula by having RvP and Di Maria out.

 

[Sarni]

We'll really know if LvG has learnt when RvP is fully match fit. Will he drop Rooney back into the CAM/CM role to accommodate him? It would be disappointing if he does and would confirm to me that LvG stumbled into this winning formula by having RvP and Di Maria out.

This will be a true test. Regardless how it sounds, I'd rather van Persie was unavailable for the rest of season so we could quietly reach the end of it playing good football and staying in top 4. I really fear that his comeback will disrupt the flow of our game as I strongly suspect that van Gaal will make him automatic starter once he's back due to their Dutch connection and I just don't see how you can fit him in without dropping an important player (Fellaini or Herrera as Rooney will likely remain first choice, only moved into midfield).

 

[Adebesi]

Every poster on here said we should drop RVP and Falcao and play Rooney up top in a 4231. Most would have Mata and Herrera in there as well. Just took LVG 8 months and a fit Carrick to stumble across what we knew all along..

Joking aside, I'm really pleased with recent performances, just a shame with the international break. They always seem to come when we hit some form..

I think they call that "a true word said in jest."

 

[legball]

Whats your view on the claim that the team took time to understand to implement a difficult system and then suddenly got it and implementing perfectly Van Gaal Philosophy at Spurs and Pool games? With greatest respect, to attribute the reasons for the last two successful games (not just winning 3 points but the performance at least first half of each game) to only a difficult prefect system which was understood by players slowly and taking time to learn it, is a bit BS to be honest! If we had Carrick back for the Arsenal game, do you think we would have exited so easily? Its hypothetically but we can use it for purpose of debating. There are more than one reason we played so well in the last two games and I believe Carrick is one of them

Stop talking nonsense. Carrick entering the pitch against Arsenal culminated in us losing grip of the game and losing it. It's a bit silly to put down the performance of a whole team to a single player coming back from injury. By all means don't give Van Gaal any credit but your logic is so flawed, it's laughable. How about you exonorate Van Gaal when we played badly, seeing as Carrick was out injured at that time?

 

[MDFC Manager]

I think over the past few weeks the way United pressed when the opposition when they had the ball resembled more like something I would expect from a team coached by Van Gaal. I also think having Carrick back helps as well.

Improved pressing, Carrick and a proper system are the reasons for me. I always said drop the 2nd striker for the sake of the team.

Yeah someone posted a stat few pages back. It said United have been the best/most pressing team in the league since January.

 

[legball]

The notion that we simply clicked against Spurs is quite wrong. In fact, our first half against Swansea and Arsenal [we lost both games] was among the best I've seen us play, though we were lacking a bit in attack. The signs have been there if we bother to look closely. I have always said that the reason we played slowly is simply because the bulk of our players are not good passers, so, like any new trick, accuracy rather than speed is what you'll try to achieve at first. In the last few games, the speed of the pass has increased and for me that is what it is mainly down to, secondly, there's a better understanding of the movement and actions of team mates. If you think it's simply down to Carrick coming back and having Mata in the team, then I'm sorry for you. We're not there yet, as we saw in some parts of the second half against Liverpool when we displayed that little bit of fragility that has plagued us when put under pressure, so, that still needs sorting out.
For me, the buck always stops with the manager, if we're doing badly, he gets stick, if we're playing well and winning then he should get the credit [or majority of it]. I don't understand people who are quick to criticize managers, then slow to give them any credit when they do something good. If he wanted, Van Gaal could still have gone with 2 strikers with either Rooney+ Falcao or James, he could still have decided to have Rooney in CM, RVP being injured might be a factor in playing Rooney as a lone striker, but I'm arguing that he could still have gone 2 strikers if he wanted, he could have had Di Maria straight back in at Anfield because of pace, but he didn't do it too. I think the players are beginning to get it, and LVG is beginning to understand the league better, having Giggs there helps. Many of the players have improved, even Lord Herrera has improved on the one thing he was lacking before, he's now playing like a proper CM, which is what LVG wanted of him all along. Smalling has improved immensely, Fellaini, Young etc. Then, we have 2 big games [many wrote us off] and he somehow managed to motivate the boys to step it up [motivation is a big part of management too] and we got results. I think the manager is doing something right.

 

[Escobar]

There are many reasons to this and I'd like to add the Arsenal game as a potential turning point as well. That loss seems to have given the team a huge lift (or rather push) despite losing the game

 

[redevil2]

Stop talking nonsense. Carrick entering the pitch against Arsenal culminated in us losing grip of the game and losing it. It's a bit silly to put down the performance of a whole team to a single player coming back from injury. By all means don't give Van Gaal any credit but your logic is so flawed, it's laughable. How about you exonorate Van Gaal when we played badly, seeing as Carrick was out injured at that time?

You should read post #3318 before you post about this. Thanks

 

[legball]

You should read post #3318 before you post about this. Thanks

I have. It didn't stop you from picking the worst example though to back up your point, amazing.

 

[redevil2]

I have. It didn't stop you from picking the worst example though to back up your point, amazing.

Are you stupid or just having problems?!

I gave you the benefit if doubt you haven't read my apology earlier on but you did read it before you went on and on. Terrible people on the internet everywhere trying to win an aguement which has become an non issue any more. What have you gained?

 

[legball]

Are you stupid or just having problems?!

I gave you the benefit if doubt you haven't read my apology earlier on but you did read it before you went on and on. Terrible people on the internet everywhere trying to win an aguement which has become an non issue any more. What have you gained?

Terrible people? winning an argument? ok then.

 

[noodlehair]

I said four or five good performances in a row and I'd consider it progress. We've had two very good performances in a row all of a sudden, so I'll see what happens from there.

Think the team has looked balanced and strong the last two games. You can suddenly see what everyone is supposed to be doing and they all seem comfortable with what they're doing. Fellaini is used effectively instead of to hinder us. I've actually liked watching us play the last two games. There's been a sudden change in attitude from trying to pussy foot around teams to going right for their throat. We've only seen that in tiny parts up until now...usually 10 minutes spells in the odd game, like against Swansea.

I've missed watching a United team who turn up with the attitude of "we're going to just come at you with our game and it's up to you to deal with it"...I don't think we've had that even for the last few years under Fergie. Not against teams like Liverpool anyway. I really hope we keep it up. If we did I reckon I'd forget about all the silly things Van Gaal keeps saying and doing.

The only thing I'd say is, he's basically just done what everyone has been saying he should do for bloody ages. Put Rooney up front and put some bloody midfielders in midfield instead of Wayne fecking Rooney. We play a team of players playing in roles they're comfortable playing in, and in a formation that isn't completely flawed, and mysteriously we look like a competent football team. It's hardly revolutionary. I'm still completely baffled what LVG was trying to achieve by deliberately not doing this.

 

[Browniee]

So glad we have Villa next at home, so we can continue our form into the two 'tough' ones.
One thing for sure is that it's going to be a very exciting end to the season.

 

[#07]

 

[ChaddyP]

This makes me mad

 

[Sam]

That first month or so totally fecked us, its got to be said.

 

[R'hllor]

I see people having a go at him now regarding RvP and some others,can only guess his reasons,not only due tones of injuries but i understand why at the start of season he needed all players on his side.Things did not look great on the pitch but even then players fought for him,our results were better compared with our performances. Lets not forget that RvP scored some important goals,Falcao scored vs Everton etc.

 

[An Irish Red]

I'm relatively happy with Van Gaal. My only real concern at the minute is the exclusion of Rafael.

 

[Dante]

Wenger's philosophy maintains itself over entire seasons.

Mourinho's philosophy stuck with Chelsea even after he got sacked in 2007/08.

The real test for LvG's methods will come against Villa. It's easy to show good form in two quickfire games. It'll be much harder to maintain it after an international break. If United can do that, it'll be proof that his philosophy is finally beginning to take.

 

[KiD MoYeS]

I've a hell of a lot of faith in van Gaal, I've remained mostly calm this season.

 

[Getsme]

I’ve been very critical of him at times and I completely stand by my posts, however I’ve never lost faith in his ability to manage the Club (granted I’ve come close a couple of times).
Id imagine he would admit it himself that he has made some terrible mistakes this season, I believe he severely underestimated the physicality and competitive than comes with being involved in the Premier League. On top of that the mundane football stunk of a manager that was afraid to take risks. However, all that seems to have changed in the last couple of months and everything seems to finally be clicking, I also find his honestly not only very assuring but refreshing as well.

If we continue to play and develop the way we are I’d be happy for LVG to stay on, even if we don’t get top 4.

 

[milemuncher777]

I've been critic of Lvg but I'm delighted with how we've performed in last couple of games. Most importantly the style of play has changed from the dross we served up until now. Hope it continues.

 

[gerdm07]

Hopefully the Woeful Winter of 2015 (feel free to use this term ) is behind us. I must say it was consistently the most uninspiring football I have watched in my 16 years watching United.

 

[Shark]

Hopefully the Woeful Winter of 2015 (feel free to use this term ) is behind us. I must say it was consistently the most uninspiring football I have watched in my 16 years watching United.

You can't be serious.

 

[Chesterlestreet]

You can't be serious.

Well...let's see...

I have seen worse in my time as a United fan. I certainly have. But the worst we've looked under Aloysius has been feckin' horrible, nothing less. So, he owes me a pint or two for those performances, he does. He knows that, though, so we're in the pink like that, Aloysius and me.

 

[The Mitcher]

Well...let's see...

I have seen worse in my time as a United fan. I certainly have. But the worst we've looked under Aloysius has been feckin' horrible, nothing less. So, he owes me a pint or two for those performances, he does. He knows that, though, so we're in the pink like that, Aloysius and me.

Nothing is as worse as Moyes, at least with Louis when we were playing badly we could have got something out of the game.

 

[legball]

Wenger's philosophy maintains itself over entire seasons.

Mourinho's philosophy stuck with Chelsea even after he got sacked in 2007/08.

The real test for LvG's methods will come against Villa. It's easy to show good form in two quickfire games. It'll be much harder to maintain it after an international break. If United can do that, it'll be proof that his philosophy is finally beginning to take.

We'll beat Aston Villa.

 

[Blue always red]

The opening fixtures done us over. Those games that we lost/drew from winning positions really facked us, we'd be challenging right now if not for them.

 

[imperi]

The opening fixtures done us over. Those games that we lost/drew from winning positions really facked us, we'd be challenging right now if not for them.

Feels weird right? We've seen some pretty bad football and huge criticism, but if those injuries and that horror Leicester show did not happen, feck we could have gone for the title. Despite all the injuries and a fair amount of games with uninspiring football we managed to grind out points. With the progression we are showing now, it really makes me excited for next season, I have faith in LvG getting us back on top.

 

[Adebesi]

I have hope again. We may not get 2nd or even 3rd but it's nice to at least believe it's possible. It feels like it's been a while.

It's funny because when we went out of the FA Cup things looked like they might all go tits up. If we'd then lost to Spurs the season would've risked going the way last season did. But this doesn't feel like last season.

 

[Empire]

That first month or so totally fecked us, its got to be said.

Starting 11 in the first match:

De Gea

Lingard
Jones
Smalling
Blackett
Young

Fletcher
Herrera

Mata

Rooney
Hernandez

Nani was subbed on at half time it looks like to get his trial, Cleverley had his in the next game playing 90 minutes and Welbeck was subbed on, Michael Keane came on for an injured Smalling after 44 minutes, Fletcher started again and then the next match, Anderson even made an appearance for a little while against Burnley.

Can't blame the manager too much, he had a long world cup and came straight into the job, he was right in giving each player a chance and to be fair he assessed them pretty quickly. When this season is over I hope he has a fantastic holiday and then gets the transfer business done early.

 

[Empire]

Id imagine he would admit it himself that he has made some terrible mistakes this season.

He would also state he has made some excellent decisions this season such as how he dealt with the injury crisis, doing well defensively despite not the best defence on paper and continuous injuries forcing changes in each of those defensive positions except Valencia, how he has performed in the big important matches, his results since the transfer window has closed putting him second with only one point behind Chelsea. Let's not forget he came into the job after the world cup, he needed time to assess players and so those first three matches fielded the likes of Blackett, Michael Keane, Lingard, Fletcher, Cleverley, Nani, Hernandez, Welbeck, Anderson etc.

Bad decisions, good decisions, the net effect is probably neutral and that's why he is exactly where we expected him to be, looking good in the race for top four with a chance of still finishing second.