If he can't get top 4, he needs to go. Simple as that. The honeymoon period is over and he still doesn't know what's his best X1 one week to the next. Even Moyes in all his misery got 4 points off Arsenal and beat them at home. Losing a game of that stature this late in the season at home is not excusable.
United under LvG: verdict so far!
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The starting XI will be different anyway after the summer.
First bit is fair enough, but we've got 3 points off Arsenal (away) so far, and have yet to play them at home. It was a cup tie.
The case for Pochettino was decent this summer and it looks ever better now. His teams are in good shape, press well and play a simple 4-2-3-1 that basically would have suited us had we bought a winger instead of Falcao, which we easily could have. Herrera is basically a rich man's Mason and Blind is a matured Bentaleb. He'd have fit our personnel well and had us pressing. I think this team could be in the same spot we're in now but be better to watch:
------Rooney-----
Winger-Mata-DiMaria
---Herrera--------
--------Blind------
Shaw---------Rafael
---Rojo---Smalling
-------DeGea-------
It's fairly easy to see how that would work with just the one different late August purchase, or even with no buys and Rooney on the left and RVP up front.
This is what baffled me. If we're going to play direct football then we need to do it properly. Fellani used to destroy teams for Everton when they took a direct approach. I remember the game he had against us, the way we're playing, he'll never be able replicate that sort of performance.
Wow, just wow. Losing to Arsenal nowadays are not acceptable. The bars are set pretty high it seems. I guess losing any game this late in the season is not excusable. I say sack any manager that loses any game from now on till end of season.
This! Just think how much worse it would have been if we had managed to get Vermaelen
More pain coming up for us. Spurs are good enough to beat us next week and Liverpool will trounce us.
It is unacceptable if the manager still can't differentiate his hand from his dick. He had followed a game plan at Emirates that has proven successful in the past against Arsenal and for some reason went totally against it today. When we had the momentum he made a change that effectively ended our attacking thrust out of fear that the game was getting too open for him, left Fellaini out there instead of adding someone like Mata even after realizing that we were effectively getting pinned in our own box with Blind and Carrick in midfield.
Basically Arsenal did to us what we have done to them since 2006. Sit back, stay patient and capitalize on the mistakes. That is the reason the performance was inexcusable. We were finding success with him back around Christmas but now the team has firmly stalled and its in danger of going backwards.
I can only agree with this post, it's been a few weeks now that I feel like I'll have no pb if LVG is sacked at any given time. We have only improved in pointlessly keeping the ball among our CBs and DMs. Other than that there isn't an aspect of football we have consistently showed a big difference with Moyes. With Moyes it was painful and we knew he was out of his depth, LVG came with a lot of promise at the start and it's been underwhelming to say the least. Fellaini is a good player but we should never set the tactics to get the best out of, we are not Everton, we have other players.
A new piece by Barney Ronay who is unsurprisingly as baffled as we all are, decent enough read and he doesn't over-elaborate or use too much flowery language as he is sometimes guilty of.
http://www.theguardian.com/football...-van-gaal-manchester-united-route-one-arsenal
http://www.theguardian.com/football...-van-gaal-manchester-united-route-one-arsenal
He deserves to get shot for the subs he made yesterday alone, he simply handed the initiative to Arsenal, baffling.
We've been better the last month or so I think, but the general lack of progress towards playing decent football is tough to stomach.
Decent football or entertaining football?
He is worse than I ever thought. Needs to be sacked as soon as we are out of the race for the top 4, which as things suggests is almost a certainity now.
More than 2/3rd of the season gone and this team has looked worse each week. There isn't a department we have improved. Hell, we are playing Big Sam football and even failing at that. Shambles.
More than 2/3rd of the season gone and this team has looked worse each week. There isn't a department we have improved. Hell, we are playing Big Sam football and even failing at that. Shambles.
The problem is the negative consequence after sacking him.Those merry go round about needing time to address the squad,team in transition and big money being spent recklessly again with the new manager.
Why is it that all new Manchester United managers would have to assess the squad again instead of finding the gaps that need to be filled? If the 7 blokes who worked as Chelsea managers between both Mourinho spells didn't need that long before finding the right players (more often than not when Roman's not involved), then tell me why it would be an issue for United?
It's just a matter of having brains at the right place and decisiveness when taking action.
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I've given LVG loads of stick but I don't think he was to blame for yesterday or at least no more than most games. The only thing I'd have changed from the starting lineup was playing Carrick instead of Blind. It's not like no one ever saw Blind's defensive shortcomings before this game.
Aside from that he didn't do much wrong. I'm a big Herrera fan but one would think he was pinging through balls left, right and centre judging by the way some are reacting. Bringing Carrick on was the right move and it didn't effect us negatively until Valencia and then eventually Di Maria fecked us over with 2 moments of idiocy.
Up and till Di Maria got sent off, I thought we looked a lot better than we have in recent weeks. The tempo was quicker, some genuine link up play between our front players. If not for Valencia's feck up I'd have backed us to win it.
I actually feel a lot more positive about our top 4 prospects
Aside from that he didn't do much wrong. I'm a big Herrera fan but one would think he was pinging through balls left, right and centre judging by the way some are reacting. Bringing Carrick on was the right move and it didn't effect us negatively until Valencia and then eventually Di Maria fecked us over with 2 moments of idiocy.
Up and till Di Maria got sent off, I thought we looked a lot better than we have in recent weeks. The tempo was quicker, some genuine link up play between our front players. If not for Valencia's feck up I'd have backed us to win it.
I actually feel a lot more positive about our top 4 prospects
On the other hand LVG was never going to be a long-term appointment anyway. It just didn't make sense, and resulted from the hysteria that led to the sacking of Moyes.
That's probably fair. I guess I meant entertaining, though we haven't been great defensively either, as much as we've been excellent at employing David De Gea.
He's still trying very hard to make himself look like a genius and failing massively at it, hence the silly substitutions at half time, tactical changes etc. - anything to make him look extra ordinary.
Just look at the number of players that LVG "cleared out" between last summer and this January.United always have a big squad (not so such now thankfully) so it will take time for the manager to evaluate who are to keep,to send on loan and to get rid.Chelsea's manager usually doesn't need to care about the youngsters as well.
I don't see the point in keeping him just to maintain continuity. What has he shown so far that makes us think that he would improve things next season? The expectations were already so low this season. What would be the expectation next season? A top 8 finish and a good cup run?
There is also a real danger in him giving another transfer fund to waste. None of his summer signings have worked so far. He is making players look worse than they actually are.
Good shout. Big Sam could be available soon I hear...
'Arry will play more entertaining football. Heck, he would be more entertaining with the press too.
I totally agree.What I am trying to say is fans by default will think whoever we bring in as a new manager will do a better job.That's not the case.We have to make sure we do it right this time otherwise this club will find it hard making the way back to the top in the next 5-10 years.
We were poor and also being poor for the past year doesn't excuse that
If Ancelotti becomes available....
I would take him faster than you can say "philosophy."
Beware I am a slow reader. Phallic-------sophy
Take our squad minus the 150 million spent and tell me where he'd have taken us in the league, without midweek football distraction.
erm mid table?
It is starting to feel like last year. The fans are dreading the big fixtures coming up. He has to go if we don't make top four.
Agreed. Although we've been around the top 4 nearly all season so far I think most of us have been realistic enough to realise it's been a somewhat false position when you look at actual team and individual performances.
The next 10 games will tell the tale though, we're at the business end of the season now and there's no hiding place. Succeed or fail, no excuses.
LvG's struggles have truly made the work Mourinho has done for us look even more fantastic.
He's done exactly what everyone in here was hoping for when Fergie stepped down and I guarantee he would've done the same were he the United manager. Used his first season back to begin shaping his squad while still remaining highly competitive both domestically and in Europe and in his second season has us as favorites for the title. He immediately came in and identified which players weren't going to cut it and replaced them with the exact players we needed. He quickly established his "best XI" and we play essentially the same team every match. The complete opposite of what LvG is doing (injuries have played a part in that, obviously).
I can't imagine that if José were your manager and was given basically unlimited funds like LvG was, you'd be struggling like this. I don't think he'd have OK'd a single one of the signings you've made. No chance Mata, Fellaini, Herrera, etc would have been signed.
Not to sound like a doom monger, but I think it's going to be a mistake that'll haunt your board for years to come. You guys would hardly have skipped a beat if he was appointed instead of Moyes.
He's done exactly what everyone in here was hoping for when Fergie stepped down and I guarantee he would've done the same were he the United manager. Used his first season back to begin shaping his squad while still remaining highly competitive both domestically and in Europe and in his second season has us as favorites for the title. He immediately came in and identified which players weren't going to cut it and replaced them with the exact players we needed. He quickly established his "best XI" and we play essentially the same team every match. The complete opposite of what LvG is doing (injuries have played a part in that, obviously).
I can't imagine that if José were your manager and was given basically unlimited funds like LvG was, you'd be struggling like this. I don't think he'd have OK'd a single one of the signings you've made. No chance Mata, Fellaini, Herrera, etc would have been signed.
Not to sound like a doom monger, but I think it's going to be a mistake that'll haunt your board for years to come. You guys would hardly have skipped a beat if he was appointed instead of Moyes.
You are completely right, our board have their heads well and truly stuck up their oh so moral arses.
Correct - Mourinho was the ONLY man to take over from Fergie. This will be one of the biggest cock ups by the board!!
Get rid. He's not the man to take us forward and it has been evident for a while. I know I'll get shot down, but he's doing more damage than good now, similar to Moyes. The only difference is he probably hasn't lost the dressing room yet.
Watching yesterday's game I had a realisation that, actually, van Gaal is doing a decent job, certainly a lot better than he is given credit for.
Look at the Arsenal squad, it is better than ours in every department except the goalkeeper, and they're just 1 point above us in the league. He's doing extremely well in my opinion to keep us in the top 4. He's got half a squad (literally) that, when they are either sold or their contracts run out, will end up at mid table sides.
Not to turn this into a Mourinho thread, but I disagree with the poster above about Mourinho. He would have done better than Moyes, no doubt, but I can't see how he would've done better than van Gaal under the same circumstances. He wouldn't have the luxury of flogging half the squad, we struggle to give players away due to the massive contracts they are on, let alone recoup massive fees for them. That's without allowing for the fact our executive vice chairman or whatever Woodward wants to call himself, is an idiot.
There are far bigger problems than van Gaal at the club, who, in my eyes, is still one of the top coaches in the world.
Look at the Arsenal squad, it is better than ours in every department except the goalkeeper, and they're just 1 point above us in the league. He's doing extremely well in my opinion to keep us in the top 4. He's got half a squad (literally) that, when they are either sold or their contracts run out, will end up at mid table sides.
Not to turn this into a Mourinho thread, but I disagree with the poster above about Mourinho. He would have done better than Moyes, no doubt, but I can't see how he would've done better than van Gaal under the same circumstances. He wouldn't have the luxury of flogging half the squad, we struggle to give players away due to the massive contracts they are on, let alone recoup massive fees for them. That's without allowing for the fact our executive vice chairman or whatever Woodward wants to call himself, is an idiot.
There are far bigger problems than van Gaal at the club, who, in my eyes, is still one of the top coaches in the world.
I always agreed with the whole concept you exposed here.
We talk about the board and, yes, they are guilty of making the wrong decisions. However if I had to corner a single man as a prime suspect in swaying our board irreversibly in the wrong direction, it's Sir Bobby Charlton. People can say whatever they want about Sir Bobby, but I feel like I will curse that mistake upon him for several years to come and might never forgive him for that.
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A lot seem to be turning but the Club is taking steps in the right direction, it's just slower than we had all hoped.
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