Gündogan is most likely following Pep to City. At least that are the thoughts in Germany currently because his brother was seen meeting Pep's brother (and agent) in Amsterdam.
Toni Kroos
- Thread starter golden_blunder
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Gündogan is most likely following Pep to City. At least that are the thoughts in Germany currently because his brother was seen meeting Pep's brother (and agent) in Amsterdam.
I like Kroos. Maybe he's a good fit for us or maybe not but this thread really is a joke... I mean comparing him to Barry?
No one compared him to Barry.
Running the show tonight. 20 touches more than the next player. Always looking for the forward pass, as well, contrary to what a lot of people have said here. And a decent goal.
Ruthless Toni. We need him.
Kate would be great, but he is a bit similar to Schneiderlin. Kroos could have a good partnership with Schneiderlin in out midfield of 2. Gundogan would be also a good choice.he's shocking mobility wise. Certainly don't want, would rather Xhaka/Andre Gomes
EDIT: or Kante
In my opinion Kroos can control the game better than Xhaka and Gomes. Unfortunately, Kroos is not in good form at the moment in Real Madrid. But he is a class player.
Superb footballer - can't believe the naysayers on here. He's basically as near as you'll get to a late-era Scholes. Buy him, make him the focal point and get Schneiderlin and another, combative, midfielder to protect him and you've got a world class midfield.
id really fancy a double pivot of him and Schneiderlin with Herrera in front of them...sadly its but a dream....
Yeah, if you have the right midfielders around him. He is like Scholes only sans the goal scoring threat and aggression. He is a poor man's Scholes.
Not good enough. Gareth Barry
He was a passenger when Germany didn't have the ball, his nice passing doesn't negate his lack of agility or workrate IMO, I'd rather we built a midfield where the CM's could all contribute without the ball as well as with it.
What he said.
You judging him on a friendly when both teams were experimenting. If youre talking about his performances then why not mention the WC when he actually was class. He is so much more than just "nice passing". We have already been over this 'agile' thing havent we? Was Scholes agile, are Xavi and Pirlo agile? Pace isnt the only thing required to be a good footballer. Does it help? Absolutely! But thats why players like him and the ones I mentioned adapt their game to suit their weakness, for lack of a better word, by being intelligent with their positioning and their passing. Thats why these players are world class.
Yes, yes, yes. They were all significantly more agile than Kroos. Kroos is more in line with Xabi Alonso - in terms of agility.
You only have to look at Xavi dribbling Iniesta-style in the Qatar league. He's 10 years older than Kroos, and you genuinely still couldn't imagine Kroos dribbling like that in the Qatar league.
P.s. pace isn't agility.
No, I was commenting on his performance tonight like the ones drooling over him were, and there was nothing expiremental about that German side at all, it was their standard set-up systemically. My judgment on him is based off having seen him play many times for Real Madrid and Bayern. I don't know why Scholes, Xavi and Pirlo keep getting brought up, all of them were much more mobile than Kroos and Pirlo's positional play as a #6 was superb. Kroos is very immobile and his positioning defensively is poor, he just relies on the CM next to him to do all the hard work.
Thats like saying Scholes is not a good player because he didnt do the dirty work and let Keane and Carrick do all that for him. Thats not what they are in the team for. They are playmakers, making passes, moving the ball around, easing the pressure on the defense, connecting the defense with the offense and kick start attacking moves. Thats their main job.
It's not though as Scholes put his work in, he didn't just saunter around waiting for possession to be regained, he pressed and put tackles in, badly often I know, but the opposition knew he wasn't just a cone when they had the ball.
Kroos only works with 2 CM's in there with them doing all the defensive duties with him free to concentrate on his passing game, and frankly I don't want us to use that kind of #8/AM.
It's an insult to compare him to Scholes. And I'm not even a huge huge Scholes fan like some on here.
He does a few of the things Scholes did, but to a lesser standard.
You could tell Scholes started as a forward, because he had the dip of the shoulders, quick feet, little dribble that Kroos doesn't have at all.
And where's this weird idea that Xavi wasn't agile coming from? Xavi was constantly spinning and sidestepping challenges. He danced around the ball.
He does a few of the things Scholes did, but to a lesser standard.
You could tell Scholes started as a forward, because he had the dip of the shoulders, quick feet, little dribble that Kroos doesn't have at all.
And where's this weird idea that Xavi wasn't agile coming from? Xavi was constantly spinning and sidestepping challenges. He danced around the ball.
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Big fan of Kroos, him not pressing or struggling as a CDM or without someone to press next to him isn't exactly new information those who watched him at Bayern, or even his loan spell at Leverkusen would see that.
He's there to shift the ball stretch fullbacks and not misplace the pass, in terms of "total football" and smothering the opponent that's the kind of team Kroos belongs in, that's why he was "perfect" at Bayern.
He's the best deep lying playmaker there is, in terms of vision and carving opening teams that would lie with Messi currently but to spray passes around and stretch teams its Kroos (from a deep position).
I think interestingly enough with Kroos development if you remember the politics of him leaving Bayern it's that the board wouldn't meet his wage demands.
Bayern have "Bands" of pay in terms of your profile as a player, how long you've been there and Gotze was on more money when he was younger, and at the club a lesser amount of time, Kroos didn't like the injustice and left.
Pep did say "I want you to stay, I can make you a better player" along those lines to the press about Kroos and I think partially that's to do with his movement and pressing but ultimately I think that's just not him and you need someone along side him to do the dirty work.
Great player, perfect technique (I could watch him pass, take free-kicks and corners all day), not the quickest or the one to put tackles in but for what he offers he's great, I can see why someone like Herrera is probably a better fit at united, although if there were quick wingers that are lethal on the break Kroos would be your go to guy.
There's a gulf in class with Barcelonas midfield but you'd have to say if you had a box to box player (Herrera, Koke, Pogba, Vidal(before his move) alongside Kroos and a CDM like Scheiderlin it'd work.
He's there to shift the ball stretch fullbacks and not misplace the pass, in terms of "total football" and smothering the opponent that's the kind of team Kroos belongs in, that's why he was "perfect" at Bayern.
He's the best deep lying playmaker there is, in terms of vision and carving opening teams that would lie with Messi currently but to spray passes around and stretch teams its Kroos (from a deep position).
I think interestingly enough with Kroos development if you remember the politics of him leaving Bayern it's that the board wouldn't meet his wage demands.
Bayern have "Bands" of pay in terms of your profile as a player, how long you've been there and Gotze was on more money when he was younger, and at the club a lesser amount of time, Kroos didn't like the injustice and left.
Pep did say "I want you to stay, I can make you a better player" along those lines to the press about Kroos and I think partially that's to do with his movement and pressing but ultimately I think that's just not him and you need someone along side him to do the dirty work.
Great player, perfect technique (I could watch him pass, take free-kicks and corners all day), not the quickest or the one to put tackles in but for what he offers he's great, I can see why someone like Herrera is probably a better fit at united, although if there were quick wingers that are lethal on the break Kroos would be your go to guy.
There's a gulf in class with Barcelonas midfield but you'd have to say if you had a box to box player (Herrera, Koke, Pogba, Vidal(before his move) alongside Kroos and a CDM like Scheiderlin it'd work.
Good post. I'm a big Kroos fan but he's not especially Scholes-like and definitely has some way to go to get into that sort of company in terms of quality too. He excels at one third of what Paul Scholes excelled at.
He's not a Scholes clone and I don't think anyone is trying to claim that but his control, vision, appreciation of space and ability to ping a cross field ball on a sixpence is the closest to Scholes I've seen. That's partly the sheer ability but also his gait and passing technique are very similar.
Kroos is flawed but also utterly brilliant.
Kroos is flawed but also utterly brilliant.
Kroos would be a good Carrick replacement and is that nature of player
I still think we would need a more mobile CM as well - funnily enough a player in the mould of Modric, who is perhaps the closest thing out there to Scholes, would be ideal
I still think we would need a more mobile CM as well - funnily enough a player in the mould of Modric, who is perhaps the closest thing out there to Scholes, would be ideal
In terms of holding the ball, keeping himself open, spreading the play it was more Roy Keane like tonight. Toni does have a better shot on him.
Not seen enough of him in this deeper role at Real Madrid. Doesn't seem like the type of player to make that role his own and be more commanding off the ball. I think he's best more offensive, his technique is very good. I have lots of great memories when he was at Bayern. Would love to see him here at OT.
I don't think we can replace Paul Scholes, he's priceless but Toni is pretty good. I think his character would suit our club and he could really make a name for himself.
Who would we put along side? I think our midfield needs sorting out properly. I guess Morgan would remain, could be a good pairing. Seeing how went in for Morgan it would seem we won't be making wholesale changes.
Not seen enough of him in this deeper role at Real Madrid. Doesn't seem like the type of player to make that role his own and be more commanding off the ball. I think he's best more offensive, his technique is very good. I have lots of great memories when he was at Bayern. Would love to see him here at OT.
I don't think we can replace Paul Scholes, he's priceless but Toni is pretty good. I think his character would suit our club and he could really make a name for himself.
Who would we put along side? I think our midfield needs sorting out properly. I guess Morgan would remain, could be a good pairing. Seeing how went in for Morgan it would seem we won't be making wholesale changes.
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He's a possession recycler. The last thing we need is more of that, even if Kroos is miles better at it than anyone we currently have. Throwing a huge chunk of the transfer budget at a player that doesn't do anything to fix our immediate problems is idiocy at best. Even the best, most open-eyed passer in the world couldn't make us score goals since our attackers aren't doing their job. A right winger and a left winger/striker with pace and the ability to carry the ball forward and create chances has to be top priority. If we're adding to midfield I want to see more dynamic runners like Kanté, rather than the maestro types. Fixing our lethargic attacking play is way more important than bringing in Kroos to sit next to Carrick, Schweinsteiger, Schneiderlin and Blind playing sideways passes and racking up 85% possession in a 0-1 loss.
Whilst I agree with fixing the forward line if Kroos is available then we'd be foolish not to sign him if possible. (Carrick and Bastian) are older and winding down.
Kroos-Schneiderlin could be sweet
Would people here prefer someone calm and composed on the ball like Kroos or a more mobile and powerful player like Sanches? I think they'd cost roughly the same.
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Sanchez?
Yes, Renato Sanches.
Both players aren't at the same level, they don't give us the same guarantees and we lack composure in midfield. If Sanches was at Matuidi's level, you could have a point but he isn't. I don't know Sanches but is he better than Adama Traoré from Monaco or Saul who are powerful but also technically sound?
Edit: I don't really know if Sanches isn't at Matuidi's level.
Having a midfield that contains Carrick and Schwinsteiger i wouldn't say we lack composure. Kroos wouldn't improve us if we continue to play our current style. Good player but i don't think he is what we need to take us to the league next season.
Carrick is old and Schweinsteiger never fit. And there is cheaper and better options than Sanches.
True but for next season we still need a more competitive midfielder than another water carrier!. He is just Carrick II. But at the same time... I wouln't say no, next to Schneiderlin it would give our attack license to go gung ho.
But it wasn't the question.
The question was, who do you choose between Sanches and Kroos for the same amount of money? I choose Kroos because he fills a need and can actually justify his price. I saw Sanches twice, which is nothing, and I fail to see why he should cost that much when a dozen of players are cheaper and better, there isn't a dozen of CMs better and cheaper than Kroos.
Coincidence that he's found his goal scoring boots for the national team?
not really. Löw made him the fulcrum of the team and that is what he needs to thrive. He is class. Defensively he is dodgy when he has to be the deepest midfielder, but anyone should know that by now. Nobody would complain about his defensive workrate, if he´d play as CM next to a DM.
I could imagine Kroos as central attacking midfielder. He played that role for Leverkusen, Munich and Germany and is absolutely lethal in it. He's not perfect but would walk into any starting 11 on the planet due to his unique skill set.
Would love him at United.
Would love him at United.
This
Such a classy player if he's available we should be buying him. Right age and experience for us to replace Carrick with.