I know what I’m seeing and I’m absolutely convinced Itaume’s real deal and that it’s only a matter when not if he’ll be dominating the heavyweight division and on everybody’s lips. His only challenge is going to be finding opponents (or canon fodder) willing to box him.
The RedCafe Boxing Thread
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He's not going to marry you. Or maybe he is, you could be his mum for all I know.
When's his next fight?
Don’t think there’s one scheduled, but I guess he’ll be on an undercard soon.
Fighters can look extremely good against fodder. Until he does it against elite opposition, it's all in your head.
The game has levels, and until Itauma has fought at certain levels, it's impossible to tell how he'll do. I like him though, and he's definitely promising.
Ah ok, never heard about him.
Just watched it. Good for Dubois, who Joshua and his team have completely looked down on the whole time.
For all the good AJ has apparently done for boxing and all that, he's been a weirdo and a massive twat for the most part too with the transparent "I'm actually a good guy!" persona despite being anything but that. Including during this fight with his pathetic antics like the tongue, dropping guard and guiding Dubois to his stool. He won't be allowed to retire of course, but all the above being said, he still probably deserves a better ending than crawling around the mat like a baby trying to walk. Just.
Chances are he'll now do a weird (and suspiciously drugged up) interview where he can't even look in the right direction talking about the rematch and how scary he is, once Hearn orders him into the rematch.
For all the good AJ has apparently done for boxing and all that, he's been a weirdo and a massive twat for the most part too with the transparent "I'm actually a good guy!" persona despite being anything but that. Including during this fight with his pathetic antics like the tongue, dropping guard and guiding Dubois to his stool. He won't be allowed to retire of course, but all the above being said, he still probably deserves a better ending than crawling around the mat like a baby trying to walk. Just.
Chances are he'll now do a weird (and suspiciously drugged up) interview where he can't even look in the right direction talking about the rematch and how scary he is, once Hearn orders him into the rematch.
I can sort of understand what Joshua is saying it's not like Dubios is a difficult puzzle to solve but his aggression caught Joshua off guard I reckon, which is a mirror in his performance against Andy Ruiz.
I think the concern for Anthony is his punch resistance (which wasn't fantastic to begin with) is called into question. If there's ever a fighter I worry for when it comes to exchanges its Joshua when he goes blow for blow with a game opponent his chin never holds up.
Dubios upon reflection didn't even look to have turned his gloves fully over when he was punching, he landed grazing blows and Joshua was rocked.
That's a retirement level performance not on the premise of the outcome (losing) but the mitigating factor in punch resistance, he has to think about his long-term health.
Sorry but this comment is a complete load of fecking bollocks. To say people are just here for AJ is massively disrespectful and incredibly offensive. There are many here who are true boxing fans with great knowledge.
AJ is a bum, he's also not a nice person at all. Just ask all those who he used to bully at school. As for boxing, yeah he's a big guy, has a hard punch but his technique has always been lacking. Before his losses he just fought with power and after losing he tried to learn to box a little more but he's always been too arrogant, too cocky and too slow at reading the opponent as his first fight with Ruiz showed. Last night was a disaster. He continually made out he wasn't hurt and arrogantly kept just walking back in to the same punches. He's lucky he's not severely hurt or even killed.
He has the size and reach and could easily have kept Dubois at bay and taken his time to break him down but he just went in for an all out war. That was never going to work as Dubois can take a punch and AJ can't. Mind you, in the heavyweight division especially, one punch can finish anyone and that's what makes it so exciting and often unpredictable. The thing is, shit fighters with good punches can get lucky but always get found out. Wilder and AJ both fall in to that category.
I grew up watching Marvin Hagler, Sugar Ray Leonard, Nigel Benn, Chris Eubank, Mike Tyson, Joe Calzaghe, Roy Jones Jr, Barry McGuigan, Manny Pacquiao, Oscar De La Hoya, and so many more ... AJ isn't worthy of being classed anywhere near any of them. Granted he's won two world titles and credit to him for that, I couldn't do it. But he won them at a time the heavyweight division was weak in comparison to previous times and it still is. Dubois is promising but I don't think he's anything truly special. Usyk is definitely a great fighter and Fury as much as he has the heart of a lion and as much as great boxer he is, he's still nothing TRULY special. More awkward if anything. But that's subjective really and a debate that's had in pubs and front rooms all around the world each time people gather to watch boxing.
Just because not all of us post here regularly doesn't mean we are just part time fans or AJ haters. I don't hate AJ just hate the hype and personally find it funny that people defend him when not really knowing what he's like or because of his name rather than his actual boxing ability (or lack thereof)
I just don't post here often because I spend fight nights with mates and we usually get smashed and make a night of it as we did last night when every single one of us said AJ could be in serious trouble so feck knows what that commentator was on about saying everyone thought AJ was going to walk it. Had they not seen Dubuois fight before? Not seen his recent fights against Usyk or Hrgovic or Miller?
AJ needs to retire now, and Fury will be soon unless he gets lucky against Usyk. If he does he will get his trilogy but if he loses again he will be on Netflix next December against AJ.... Guaranfeckingteed .. Oh, and unless he gets lucky ... He's fecking losing that too.. All day long.
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To be fair, I agree with a lot of your post. However, you are totally deluded if you can't see that AJ is the biggest appeal to boxing casuals in decades, just look at how many times he has sold Wembley out against medicore opposition. Therefore, it is quite clear that a lot of 'people are just here for AJ', which is totally fine as they obviously find watching/following him entertaining. In terms of character, well, let's not get into the characters of a lot of sportspeople...
I agree that AJ is not elite, which has now been proven, but my point is that there is no need to ridicule a guy who won Olympic gold and is a two-time world champion. I'm obviously fighting against the tide on that one as it is the society we live in, turbocharged by the internet obviously.
I never said he didn't have appeal. Of course he does. He is charming, good looking and has an amazing physique. He also speaks well at times and comes across relatable to many. His olympic win was deserved and was before he went all out on size. Since he turned pro he has been massively over hyped, overrated and hugely mismanaged in my opinion.
As I said in my post, he had the ability and reach to keep Dubois at bay but through arrogance, recklessness and severely disrespectfing his opponent he chose to instead go toe to toe. Aside from the very last round he didn't catch Dubois with any decent punches instead was just used as a punchbag himself.
I love boxing, always have, and many fighters are absolute wankers, but if they are they own it or back it up in the ring. AJ pretends to be otherwise yet his mask always slips and as shown in the ring, he can't back it up either. That's why as much as I think Fury is a cock, at least he fecking owns it and he has backed it up time and time again. Not always pretty, but he's still managed to find a win. Although I think in Ulysk he's bitten off more than he can chew especially at the age he is now. But the thing with Tyson is he's always unpredictable and when people write him off he is at his most dangerous because he hates losing and literally lives to prove people wrong. AJ is all about the money and glamour and has been for a few years. He lost the respect for the sport that made him and ultimately believed his own hype.
I don't doubt he's got all the potential in the world but the more experienced bruisers would school him at the moment. The likes of Zhang, Chisora, Parker before you even get to the elite.
His Management team quite rightly will get him progressively tougher tasks to get rounds into him and look for titles in about 3 years.
The problem will be in contracting the right type of opponent to give him this.
Just seen a few of his fights. The mam needs better quality opponents. He's only fought against...well below average fighters.
He had a great career. Sure it was carefully staged, dutifully pampered, well above his real worth as a boxeur since his contested olympic gold… yet at this stage, please sir AJ, just retire your cash-cow figure from your promoter’s fingers without damaging your own health and reputation further… imho.
Even against bums you still need to hit them, his accuracy and hand speed are off the scale for a heavyweight, so is his footwork. It’s so obvious the guy is a generational talent. I’m not saying he should be fighting the best already, I’m all for slowly bringing him and he’ll struggle to find the opponens anyway. Although Frank Warren did mention Joyce or even Parker within the next 12 months would you believe.
Anyway, for me it’s clear he’s the future of heavyweight boxing and he’s destined to become a superstar of boxing that that will probably transcend his sport being a heavyweight.
You’ve not seen him: take a punch, handle adversity, have to fight on the backfoot, take on any puzzle, go through a war of attrition, be outsized against someone who fights back, overpowered etc. etc.
Going forward and outclassing fodder isn’t anything special for high profile boxers; they get fed cans to tune up their game. It doesn’t mean much until they are actually in 2-way contests and we get to see what they are made of.
Joshua was knocking people out for fun at a similar stage in his career and I can remember the over the top reaction to his speed and punching strength at the time. He had something like 20 KO's or TKO's running and was winning most inside a couple of rounds.
Watch some of his amateur fights I’d say. And a lot of his opponents have outsized him, he’s not a big heavyweight. His last two opponents were not mugs btw, even if he made them look that way.
I get what your saying, but Itaume is not your average boxer.
Joshua won Olympic gold ffs.
Itauma is nothing like Joshua btw, Itauma’s talent is on a different stratosphere.
Yeah, and easily won his early fights as a pro looking great doing so. Joshua was levels above them, but still struggled at the top which is why it's difficult to tell early on.
Itauma could turn out amazing and I hope he does, but we won't know until he moves up a few levels of opponent.
People watch heavyweight boxing to watch AJ get knocked out. He’s a preening, fight dodging gobshite. Detestable human being. He acts like an Heavyweight all timer and has never been more than Frank Bruno with better PR and safeguarding.
He’s the Michael Owen of boxing. Weird little edgelord that’s lucky he’s built like a brick shit house.
There’s only been two heavyweights to blow me away when first watching them, one was Mike Tyson, the other is Itauma.
People saying Itauma isn't hyped, as though that really matters, but I'm sure he is hyped. I've read and heard a lot about him and I haven't followed boxing as much for a while now. I'm constantly getting articles about him pop up on my news feed on my phone. He must be doing something right.
I haven't seen him though so can't give my opinion on what I think. Sometimes you can tell really when there's a good boxer coming through, some of the talents, like Curmel Moton, at the lower weights, who they've been talking about since he was a kid. There's a few others too. Tank is another good example from recent years. On the flip side, boxing does often see overhyped fighters fall flat on their face as soon as they're tested, but I think a lot of these fighters do lack some fundamentals if you look carefully.
I haven't seen him though so can't give my opinion on what I think. Sometimes you can tell really when there's a good boxer coming through, some of the talents, like Curmel Moton, at the lower weights, who they've been talking about since he was a kid. There's a few others too. Tank is another good example from recent years. On the flip side, boxing does often see overhyped fighters fall flat on their face as soon as they're tested, but I think a lot of these fighters do lack some fundamentals if you look carefully.
That’s the thing about Itauma. He’s got the fundamentals, technically he’s wow class. I don’t think he’s even been hit properly in his professional bouts. His footwork is outstanding. He’s got skills, speed, accuracy and a bomb of a left hand. I haven’t spotted a weakness. Most of his fights are in full on YouTube.
Any idea why he isn't lined up for another fight? He wanted a fight on the Joshua card but obviously didn't get one and was/is meant to be on the undercard for the upcoming Fury v Usyk rematch in December but as of yet he's not. I know Warren has said he wants Parker or Joyce next but seeing as Joyce fought and lost to Chisora recently that's not going to be any time soon, and certainly not given the rumours he could be severely injured and shouldn't fight again. Parker has also called out Dubois and I can see that being lined up too. So where does that leave Moses?
That’s my main issue with Joshua he’s so unlikable and fake the guy is a clown
Hope he carries on there’s another 3-4 of those losses coming he’s shite
Problem Dubois has is that he lacks personality. He seems a nice guy but just dull. Maybe it's just me. I know for real boxing fans that means sht but boxing is a show and the likes of AJ and Fury became as big partly because of thier personality.
No, but who in his right mind wants to fight him? They might not believe my hype on here, but you can bet they do in professional boxing.
You should really do something productive with all this built up rage you seem to carry.
Well the trouble is he's at a crossroads. He can't continue to fight journeymen or those at the end of their careers as it just doesn't help him professionally or with the media and the public. He also hasn't earned the right to step up to say Fury or Usyk level, and as I said if Fury wins he gets a trilogy rematch if he loses he retires but possibly comes back for the Joshua fight on Netflix and their millions.
He still has time to be added to the card in December as planned but I've read numerous articles and listened to a few podcasts and there seems to be a big load of radio silence when it comes to Moses even being mentioned at the moment. He really needs another fight sooner rather than later otherwise it could be a year since he last fought and that is no good whatsoever for a promising up and coming fighter who really need to get out there with two maybe three fights a year earlyish in their career to promote themselves, get recognition with the public and a desire for them to want to see him more, and also to move up the rankings and obtain number one challenger status for an eventual title fight.
Yet again the heavyweight division is in a lull outside the top two or three big names and a few older boxers who all have multiple losses on their records. It does appear that Moses is in limbo right now with few wanting to risk ending their career just to give him a step up. Joyce being injured really hasn't helped, I just worry Joshua, Chisora, Whyte or Parker may be a little soon for him but there aren't too many other options that can give him the fight, rounds experience and status that he needs to step up a level.
His brother is also a great prospect at Light Heavyweight and it's going to be interesting to see who he gets lined up with next too.
It's quite funny that the cruiserweight has come up and beat all of the big bad heavyweights.
That’s so unfair. Usyk was already a PfP contender before he moved up. For me Usyk is already up there with the greatest & most skillful boxers of all time and he’s horribly underrated in this thread. What Usyk has achieved is quite remarkable. An absolute legend. You can compare him to Holyfield in terms of a cruiser weight fighting heavyweights, but Usyk is a far superior boxer to what even Evander Holyfield was.
I'm more taking the piss out of the heavyweights who dismissed Usyk.
Quite a few ranked 10-20 would take him on for a Turki payday but not take jobbers wages to face him.
It's up to Fwank whether or not he wants to match him that highly and take the associated risk.
Joyce is probably the best next opponent for him all things considered.
As I mentioned a couple of times in previous posts, Joyce has lost three of his last four fights and taken some heavy punches. He froze in a recent interview before the Dubois fight and many are suggesting he's seriously injured, especially as he's hardly been seen at all since his recent loss to Chisora. He's also 39 so the last thing he needs is losing to a up and coming hungry, powerful, rapidly quick fighter like Moses. Considering the concerns in the press and from his fans in boxing forums, I think he would have to undergo some pretty thorough examinations before he was given the OK to fight again. His reply to the rumours was hardly convincing either.
Yeah Joyce sounds punch drunk all the time, not surprised considering his style. There are 2 or 3 upcoming British heavyweights Moses could fight, but I guess they’ll be running scared. And the money’s always an issue of course. But I’m not too worried about Moses, he’s too good for boxing to pass on and Fwank knows what he’s doing the crafty bastard. Moses I could see boxing a lot in the states, they’ll love him there.
One thing that is kinda sad about this heavyweight era is that despite having a decent pool of talent, the resume of most of the top guys bar Usyk, really don't hold up well when to compared to historically great heavyweights.
What i mean by this is:
What i mean by this is:
- Fury's best win is Wilder but Wilder has such a thin resume, that its hard to rank how good he was (his best win is against Ortiz whose best win was Bryant Jennings? Charles Martin? not exactly world level...)
- Wilder losing to Parker and Zhang comprehensively harms him massively in terms of legacy.
- AJ has a decent resume (Parker win has aged really well imo) but lost to Ruiz (tbf he did avenge this), lost 2 times in comprehensive fashion to Usyk and then got blasted out by Dubois. On top of this he hasn't fought Fury or Wilder.