Young Tyson didn't have to withstand a punch. He'd have absolutely mauled every single fighter currently in the division.
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Young Tyson didn't have to withstand a punch. He'd have absolutely mauled every single fighter currently in the division.
I have not seen a rookie turning 28 in less than 6 months. That is plain stupid. Also the technique is far from perfect and getting a knock dowm from a 41 year old champion who has not boxed for a while and is bound to lose form tremendously and permanently, shows a lot to me. Wlad kept his belts for 4382 days having defended them for 23 times. Let's see if Joshua is able to defend his belt 7-8 times. You are saying he is not a finished article yet, so he will definitely prove me wrong. Until then he is a 27 year old boxer who won against a 41 year old one, being very close to a defeat and avoiding it only due to his opponent's age/physical condition.
Then you don't know boxing.
18 pro fights going into last night is a rookie in anyone's book. Turned pro in 2013.
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Yeah he eventually did, like every boxer, and he couldn't handle it when it came.
Joshau won't ever be the finished article. He is a crap boxer in terms of his skill set, so he is never going to outbox anyone. But what he does have is incredible strength and power to overwhelm his opponents. As soon as he starts to slow down physically, probably by his early thirties, he will be finished.
You appear to be completely missing the points in a few discussions here.
No. Tyson would have destroyed Wlad. You're talking as if AJ and Tyson are at a similar level. For one Tyson had a great chin and great defence, AJ has neither. Prime Tyson would walk through last nights Klitscko and Joshua.
Tyson had a great defence, but a great chin?
And how the feck are you saying AJ doesn't have a good chin after what he withstood last night?
It's interesting. I would actually say the way last night's fight played out pretty much confirmed my 'bias' against Joshua.
Yes a great chin. There are plenty of examples of this. A shot Tyson took Lewis's shots clean for half the night without even fighting back.
You seem to not know boxing at all. The guy is turning 28 has a shite technique and is already reaching his peak physically. After 32 he will start to decline. Rookie was Tyson crushing chins at 19, a kindergarten amateur by your standards.
Prime Tyson would destroy prime Klitschko. AJ is several tiers below Tyson, Lewis, Klitschko etc.
Joe Calzaghe v Jeff Lacey at Cardiff takes some beating, it was mental. Quite a few of Nazeems fights up there, Froch v Pascal, Froch v most people to be honest.
Calzaghe Lacy was a one sided beat down, some of Froch's were and Nas vs Kelly was an all time great bout but non of those were on the scale of 90000 at Wembley.
Benn V McLellan...was like Rocky Vs Drago. Insane fight.
You just can't beat the gatti ward fights and corrales Castillo not too far behind.
For anyone who's never seen this, I highly recommend it;
For anyone who's never seen this, I highly recommend it;
I think its because Tyson Fury looks about 49 and acts, at least when not messing about, a lot older than Joshua. But its true, in terms of careers Fury is well ahead experience wise. However AJ has the bigger stadiums or arenas starting to rack up, which is probably more to do with Hearn being better than Mick Hennesey than anything. Can you imagine Hearn working with Fury, he's a promoters dream!
Tyson still the king, people are saying AJ is because he beat a Klitchsko that "turned up" but the truth is, he beat a 2 year older Klitchsko, who'd not fought since the Fury fight, had already been beaten and arguably broken by Fury (Bellew's words) with massive home advantage. Fury didn't let Klitchsko get anywhere near him most of the night, there are even pictures of him with his hands behind his back several times lol.
Still, all that been said, Joshua has proved himself in his first big step up, in a fight not fighting American tin cans or British bums. He is a threat and making waves, but again, a lot of that is down to Hearn, the slimeball that he is. He's making big shows with lots of his fighters.
Fury needs to stop munching junk food, sort his head out/motivation and get and spank these few fighters, Joshua, Wilder, Haye, Bellew, Parker. Just put them all away then get back on the pick and mix with his family watching films. Haye needs to get recovered and KO big mouth Bellew like we all know he can, even at if its at 40. Bellew needs to realise he's not the hype of being in a rocky film or beating a man on one leg, Wilder needs to stop being so desperate for the British action scene because despite what a couple have said in here, he ain't the big thing of USA boxing at all, he doesn't even fight MSG or Vegas, he's almost always camped in Alabama in front of a few thousand. Parker just has a few belt and Joshua can just carry on.
As you could tell last night, wanted Wlad to win, but don't like his style or his boring ways, just wanted AJ to get a decent test for once, and even if Joshua won, he more than got that. We now know he can be really hurt, not just by Whyte in a round, but that he can be dropped. Wlad could have finished him if he was that kind of fighter or not knackered himself recently. Joshua is not this steroid munching, invincible robot machine that the hype was having us believe and the other fighters will know that now.
Tyson isn't the king of anything. He walked away from the sport so he has no claim to any crown.
Depends if you're on about the stadium/crowd capacity or excitement overall. Calzaghe was, it was at cardiff with 50k, and was one of the best fights of all time. Lacey was a champion, all hyped up by USA, the odds were with him to win but Joe ruined his mind after that. Its was pure drama all fight with great atmosphere. Naz was doing things even Joshua and Hearne shows don't do now, magic carpets, the ring flips etc. When he made Kelly wait 10 minutes will being a dancing shadow behind the screen to men in black song was stuff of dreams today, then the fight itself. Naz had agility, footwork, skills and power way above his weight.
Its one of those debates really you get on youtube comments, who was a better fighter, would Tyson have KO'd these HW fighters today in this era, what was the best show, who's better Messi or Ronaldo or Luis Ronaldo or Diego. All that actually matters is that boxing right now and for a while has been awesome, especially the HW division and that is thanks mostly to what Fury did in that big fight in Germany, he freed it all up from the Wlad/Vitali domination of the belts and now we have Joshua with 2 belts, Wilder with one, Parker with 1 and Tyson Fury with the Ring belt and recognised lineal champion/undisputed. Its all up in the air with lots to sort out and enjoy. Hearn as well, scumbag that he is, deserves massive credit for a lot of the drama and entertainment hes put on. He got booed by all 90,000 last night it seems which is wried because of lot of those fans in there were there for the night out or boxing casuals, bit like this thread, notice how there's names of posters cropping up all over the shop all of a sudden. Most of these people won't watch IFL tv and those boxing channels where Eddie Hearn whores himself out and apples and pears everyones interviews ha ha.
Good times. Not impressed by Quigg though, at all.
Disagree mate. He's done it and won all the belts but the WBC. He's still the king, the daddy of the division and they all know it. Joshua certainly does and that was the biggest, loudest call he gave out at Wembley last night.
Someone mentioned in here that Fury called out AJ on twitter, but Fury hammers everyone from all angles on twitter. Not long ago he was getting in the ring doing the 'wwe stunt' with Wilder after his fight in the US. Joshua wants Fury and I think Hearn will move to get it if he sees its possible. Wouldn't mind seeing Wilder v AJ while we wait, at least one of them gets found out and Bellew is right when he told bomsquad boy that he has a bigger name on his CV than you, that's kinda sad for a 38-0 fighter with 37 KO's.
We'll see. Everyones an expert right now lol.
As much of a comedy show as it is, if mayweather and mcgregor do fight, boxing will win and there will be some more light shone on it that's been slowly shining more on the MMA world for a while.
Boxing just needs to make more superfights happen now and put there money where there mouth is. Throw millions and millions at Golovkin and SOG to meet at a catchweight, and get Tyson fury back asap to take on Joshua. As much as I'd expected Aj to win the fight, it's potential to be a classic
Boxing just needs to make more superfights happen now and put there money where there mouth is. Throw millions and millions at Golovkin and SOG to meet at a catchweight, and get Tyson fury back asap to take on Joshua. As much as I'd expected Aj to win the fight, it's potential to be a classic
I really think looking at the extended history of someone like Fury, who has been an oddball out of the gate is pointless. Perhaps that goes both ways and his last performance is an anomaly, but for the sake of argument, let's say it's not and that's the incarnation Joshua would face - all the problems for Joshua would stand. He's no ring general and he'd have to cut off the ring to catch Fury. That's a bothersome night of boxing for Joshua, imo.
No chance ^. Fury would break Joshua in the press conference alone. We saw mister humble rattled by Dominic Brazille from the USA when he said a few basic things in that outside photoshoot, now imagine what Fury would say to him. In fact he's already been doing it. And its not as if AJ can get angry and shove him around, or act all gangster drug dealer is it. he's a 6ft8in gypsy traveller. 
But yeah couldn't wait for that one, and the build up would be immense. Fury v Klit, Chisora v Whyte, Haye v Chisora, Groves v Froch, there's been some cracking build up in recent years.
But yeah couldn't wait for that one, and the build up would be immense. Fury v Klit, Chisora v Whyte, Haye v Chisora, Groves v Froch, there's been some cracking build up in recent years.
There's far more evidence to suggest the Klitschko fight was a one off. And as I've said previously, Klitschko really didn't look prepared for that fight. Klitschko ate plenty of shots Fury would have been KOed by. Even if Fury has the better of the exchanges you can't avoid Joshuas power, speed and combinations for 12 rounds.
The preparedness excuse/reasoning only goes so far - Klitschko was bemused for a number of reasons, one of them being that he got thoroughly outboxed. Dealing with a bigger man was baffling for him, and it will be for Joshua, too. Joshua holds his chin high and doesn't get exposed for it often, he will vs. Fury.
Given Fury has a lot more stamina than Joshua, there's potential for massive diminishing returns from Joshua in the latter rounds - it's an early stoppage win for Joshua, or a long, difficult night with a points loss, imo.
What? He just bet the best boxer in the division. Parker and Wilder I don't think are good enough but it's heavy weights and one mistake can end your night. There isn't really the depth in the division so I could see him easily uniting the belts an doubting a run together.
Good, so lets see if he is able to defend it for the next 3 years.
Either he was prepared or he wasn't. I think, all evidence considered, and comparing how he prepared for Joshua fight, it's safe to assume he wasn't. He just fought a man bigger than him and knocked him out. Despite dominating Fury wasnt even able to get close to that.
It'll be difficult for him to expose Joshuas chin when he's running away for 12 rounds. He wasn't prepared to engage with Klitschko, he's not going to be planting his feet and throwing power punches against someone with the power of Joshua, he's just not going to risk it.
The same was said last night regarding Stamina. And yet despite coming in heavy and with an overly risky approach, he still had enough left to knock out a very durable Klitschko.
Will be a hell of a fight regardless.
I rate that fight over any of the Ward-Gatti trilogy, and I also rate the Barrera-Morales trilogy over Gatti-Ward too......why? The talent on show are leagues above Ward-Gatti, no offence to them at all, the heart and courage on show in the Gatti-Ward was remarkable. But neither of Gatti-Ward are elite talents at all really. Barrera-Morales was just a pure hatefest from two all-time greats.
All classic viewing of course. Regardless of personal rankings.
But feck, I loved the Castillo-Corales, just as I was getting into all, why I rank it highly I guess, made me a fan. Round 5 last night felt vaguely similar to Round 10 of that too, with Klit down and out, but coming back to nearly finish Joshua in that round(and for me saved himself from a 10-8 round scoring wise), belter of a round.
Seems you share my opinions on boxing down to a tee.
Completely agree on the Fury point. He outclassed Klit in his own backyard and received not even half the hype AJ has. Goes to show how much movie star looks and a 6 pack can do for you.
Bellew is the most annoying cnut in the sport. His face is everywhere - living off that win vs a one footed Haye.
AJ won Olympic gold and destroys everyone that gets in the ring with him. Fury had an unremarkable career up to the Klit fight which included close fights against total bums, showing up totally out of shape at times and rarely having exciting fights with knockouts.
Add to that the general unpleasantness that comes out of his mouth and it is no surprise the general public don't warm to him.
Yes AJ's looks do help but it is only a small part of the story.
Talking about Fury, who's currently suspended for testing positive on nandrolone last year (so not the cocaine).
This seems like a recent update, apparently finally facing the Anti-Doping panel next week together with cousin Hughie.
http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/boxing/tyson-fury-ate-boar-every-10303972
Makes me wonder how the outcome will relate to Joshua, he's so obviously juiced up to the max you'd assume that if they nail Fury next week, sooner or later they will decide it's time to bust Joshua too. It might be more convenient to accept Fury's explanation of eating too much wild boar.
This seems like a recent update, apparently finally facing the Anti-Doping panel next week together with cousin Hughie.
http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/boxing/tyson-fury-ate-boar-every-10303972
Makes me wonder how the outcome will relate to Joshua, he's so obviously juiced up to the max you'd assume that if they nail Fury next week, sooner or later they will decide it's time to bust Joshua too. It might be more convenient to accept Fury's explanation of eating too much wild boar.
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What do you mean time to bust him? He is tested just like they are. Hughie Fury has terrible body acne doesn't he, one of he nastier side effect of roids.
Why people think Fury would beat AJ, genuinely curious?
He's a bigger man, and he's somehow got incredible cardio. He's basically your name, an enigma in the ring, so awkward and keeps range brilliantly.
Hmmmm, he is serving a doping ban currently.
He's incredibly inconsistent tho. Haven't boxed for long time, has fitness issues and I can't see him being the more active one in a fight against AJ because of the pure power he'll be up against. Besides AJ will be even more experienced and Fury IMO doesn't have the same power as Wlad to deck him down.
Just quite literally really, that it's interesting to see what line they're going to take. Because independent as the anti-doping panels might be, in pretty much every sport there have been so many examples throughout the years of a certain 'political' element being involved regarding who gets punishment after positive tests. And now a week after what could be seen as the revival of the heavyweight division, there's a hearing of Fury, the former heavyweight champ who's been tested positive for nandrolone. Will they take a hard stance, and what will the consequences be if they do? My guess would be they don't want the negative attention, and might accept some vague line of defense by camp Fury. But it really is just a guess.
There's that bizarre weird bias again
Still not sure where your getting at man, again quite literally. Starting with the word bias, I basically said I feel Joshua is a tremendous athlete and a great professional, but I just can't get that excited about him as a fighter, or his actual technical boxing skills for that matter. You said you rate Joshua, for example as a guy who will be at the level where he would beat a 35 year old Klitschko by the time he's 29. My conclusion would be: we both have a certain bias towards Joshua. So why are you repeatedly pointing out my 'bias', isn't that like a thief calling a burglar a criminal or something? Or am I misunderstanding the word bias, and is a person only biased when you have a more negative perception of something? In that case, my apologies for misunderstanding.
I also don't see how pointing out that Joshua is obviously juicing in combination with pointing out that Fury has tested positive for nandrolone is an example of bizarre bias. Or do you mean technically, because Joshua has never tested positive? That would be a valid point I guess. Though it would be an incredibly naive point too, considering the amount of top level fighters (and also athletes in general) who've tested positive over the years, and surely you remember the people who refused to believe someone like Lance Armstrong was using PED's.
Interestingly enough, I actually haven't got to many real ethical or moral problems with fighters using PED's. From Vitali Klitschko back in the day to Fury or Jon Jones in recent times, or all of my favourite K1-fighters, there are so many examples of athletes getting caught. Whether I like them or not doesn't really get influenced by whether they're juicing, because it's so obvious they pretty much all are in one way or another.
He's most likely been on the juice at some point. Its impossible to maintain that kind of physique with how much cardio is involved with boxing.