He wasn't gassed, he was mildly concussed because he ate a big shot from Klit trying to finish him.
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He wasn't gassed, he was mildly concussed because he ate a big shot from Klit trying to finish him.
I don't see that Joshua was winning on points either but didn't think WK was winning by much either. Maybe 1-2 rounds ahead.
Which is all the judges had it as really, tbf. Just the other way around. swap 2 rounds & the fight score changes on all 3 cards - that's not so bad. There's been much worse, certainly.
They are encouraged to score all rounds for one guy or the other though aren't they? So is it WK for ''eating up all the real estate'' erm, plodding forward or AJ for landing the cleaner but not super dangerous 1 or 2 shots in a few of the non-action rounds.
I wasn't that impressed by Joshua actually - the other guy is 41 & hasn't boxed for a while. AJ gets hit quite easy, doesn't take a punch too great in that it stopped him totally for 3-4 rounds - WK should have put him away really. And there is the obvious stamina & workrate problem - why WK at 41 was snaffling rounds for most of us.
For a great fight recently, does anyone recall Katsaidis - Mitchell ?
Which is all the judges had it as really, tbf. Just the other way around. swap 2 rounds & the fight score changes on all 3 cards - that's not so bad. There's been much worse, certainly.
They are encouraged to score all rounds for one guy or the other though aren't they? So is it WK for ''eating up all the real estate'' erm, plodding forward or AJ for landing the cleaner but not super dangerous 1 or 2 shots in a few of the non-action rounds.
I wasn't that impressed by Joshua actually - the other guy is 41 & hasn't boxed for a while. AJ gets hit quite easy, doesn't take a punch too great in that it stopped him totally for 3-4 rounds - WK should have put him away really. And there is the obvious stamina & workrate problem - why WK at 41 was snaffling rounds for most of us.
For a great fight recently, does anyone recall Katsaidis - Mitchell ?
Wilder
Wilder has just been left behind in the stakes of who has proven something in the ring with Joshua actually taking on a boxer of recognised pedigree and winning. Wilder has fought nothing but bums and nobodies to this point in time - similar to Joshua before last night - so going up to the level Joshua has now placed himself at lends itself to even more questions about Wilder than there can be answers to. Having said all that, what makes you think Wilder would have an easy time with Joshua?
Ditto.
On the contrary; Wilder constantly shows a lack of ring intelligence and bails himself out with something unorthodox that would have just as much chance of getting him absolutely crumpled on the floor against a proper counter-puncher (he swings wild, off-balance and totally exposes himself constantly once he opens up). Joshua is stiff and mechanical, but he has more fundamentals than Wilder. It could easily be a shock to Wilder to have to deal with a fighter who has a solid game plan and some quality. He has nothing close to that on his resume to date. The way Wilder punches, there's a highlight reel defeat KO for the ages in his future if the right boxer comes along. Not necessarily saying that will be Joshua, but there's far more questions for Wilder to answer than him at the moment. Joshua's camp can also actively analyse post-fight against quality now and work on his weaknesses all the more - his experience will go up a few notches off the back of this. Wilder has no clue about that kind of deep water in that kind of company.
Wilder is as little known here as Joshua probably is in the States. There's nothing epic about them meeting outside of the hype train. HW is a poor division with a weak top 10, and Wilder hasn't made any waves despite his "0" record. I wouldn't be surprised if there were just as many people, if not more, who would want to see Fury-Joshua over Wilder-Joshua, in the UK or possibly Europe. Reversed, it makes sense that you want to see Wilder against someone British because that's where the two top fighters in the division reside (if we consider Fury as such still.) For once, the US needs the UK boxers more than the UK does theirs. Just goes to highlight the state of the HW division that this is the case.
Wilder's shots are the ones he mightn't see as they are wild, unorthodox with very little telegraphing. They're the ones that are most likely to end the fight outright. Even though Joshua doesn't move his head or slip punches, he can at least brace himself for the incoming shots he can see but can't avoid.
Agree with @Fortitude, Wilder needs a big fight himself before Joshua/Wilder can become a mega fight.
Wilder is a long way behind Joshua at this point, but if he can do something similar to Joshua last night then we really do have a super fight on our hands. Personally I think Wilder will get sparked out by a smart top class boxer, he's just too wild and open, Wlad would deal with him easily.
Wilder is a long way behind Joshua at this point, but if he can do something similar to Joshua last night then we really do have a super fight on our hands. Personally I think Wilder will get sparked out by a smart top class boxer, he's just too wild and open, Wlad would deal with him easily.
Klitschko couldn't have done what he did tonight against Fury, because Fury is just too tall, quick, and slippery.
That fight was always a losing one because Fury had Klitschko beat in all the attributes that he's relied on throughout his career - he wasn't able to sit behind the jab and lean on a man so much bigger, and he couldn't change his style to take the fight to Fury.
Joshua outboxes Wilder quite easily for me. Needs to work on his stamina though.
Can't help but feel Klitschko will look back on Round 6 and 7 and regret not putting him away. He was scared of getting pegged himself. AJ on the other hand came in for the kill any time he thought Klitschko would go.
However a lot of flaws in AJ game, was blowing by 6 or 7, no footwork, no head movement, no chin, no stamina, no boxing brain and no plan B. A phenomenal athlete in the gym but being fit there and being fit in the ring are 2 different things.
Think he needs to work with someone who encourages him to box and move, bring something else to his game as landing that big punch may not be enough against someone who boxes and moves as Klitschko did in large parts of that fight, forcing him to miss a lot. His lack of movement made him a target for the hook and jab.
Have to say though despite the constructive criticism of his raw talents, his uppercut was phenomenal. Very surprised to see Klitschko standing after.
However a lot of flaws in AJ game, was blowing by 6 or 7, no footwork, no head movement, no chin, no stamina, no boxing brain and no plan B. A phenomenal athlete in the gym but being fit there and being fit in the ring are 2 different things.
Think he needs to work with someone who encourages him to box and move, bring something else to his game as landing that big punch may not be enough against someone who boxes and moves as Klitschko did in large parts of that fight, forcing him to miss a lot. His lack of movement made him a target for the hook and jab.
Have to say though despite the constructive criticism of his raw talents, his uppercut was phenomenal. Very surprised to see Klitschko standing after.
Anyone know how much it costs for a pub to show last night's fight?
Curious to settle a discussion I was having as so many places around my way weren't showing it, while the ones that were you struggled to see a TV they were so rammed.
Curious to settle a discussion I was having as so many places around my way weren't showing it, while the ones that were you struggled to see a TV they were so rammed.
Fury
Stylistically, Fury is a horrible fight for Joshua - the worst in the division - because he does all the things Joshua will be bothered by, and, he will pot-shot a boxer whose head doesn't move of the centre line all night long.
This is of course assuming Fury is fit, which is probably never going to happen.
I reckon if these two do ever fight, it's a question of who can get in the others' head and get an emotional response out of them to make them deviate from the gameplan. Fury's the kind of idiot who could start showboating or trading after a verbal exchange, for example. And maybe, after one too many taunts, Fury can get Joshua to swing wider and leave himself wide open on the counter.
Hardly fair. Joshua himself has said he's not the finished article, and even taking this fight on was done with acknowledgement of one working his way up against one who is almost at his end. If Klitschko was in his prime, Joshua's camp wouldn't have taken the fight for another year or two. Putting the very best of Klitschko in there would surely warrant the very best version of Joshua, too, which, we've yet to see.
Interesting one, that. Not sure who I would say is a 'better' boxer, but if asked who was the more natural and outright talented, I'd go Fury each time. I think it would be an incredibly frustrating night for Joshua, his fans and those who hate Fury.
He's 27 and just getting to grips with what he's doing now. Can't see him undergoing something like that - might cause more harm than good and confuse him come crunch time in the ring. I think his camp will just try and work on a gameplan for unorthodox fighters and at least get him to keep his hands up. I don't think he can learn how to move his head, but he can definitely get better at parrying and rolling with punches than he does.
He has to close the distance on the front foot to put in work on Fury. Fury fights just as well on the backfoot and laterally as he does going forward and he has more stamina than Joshua by a wide margin - the likelihood of Joshua getting a chance to plant his feet and go to town on Fury is remote, imo. He's more likely to tire whilst chasing and eating jabs than Fury is circling him and landing awkward jabs.
Stylistically, Fury is a horrible fight for Joshua - the worst in the division - because he does all the things Joshua will be bothered by, and, he will pot-shot a boxer whose head doesn't move of the centre line all night long.
This is of course assuming Fury is fit, which is probably never going to happen.
As above. I just don't think you learn how to move your head at 27 - you either have it or you don't. He needs more contingency, though, he's there to be hit without offering even a blocking hand or deflecting elbow, which is a concern.
If we say he has twice the power, than he also has half the movement, stamina, ringmanship, reflexes and element of surprise. He also has little lateral movement and I do think Fury could run away/evade him all fight quite comfortably. You can't hit what you can't catch and in a jabbing war, considering all the angles Fury works for himself and his ability to fight backwards, laterally and stand his ground, it's a bigger challenge for Joshua than Klitschko, who from the outset would think he could simply stand right in front of Joshua and outbox him and would thus stand his ground all night, which in turn gave Joshua a target to actually tee off against.
That's not a smart strategy though is it? How many shots, and how much fatigue would that cause? For how many unsuccesful attempts does he try to do that, and how much would he be down on points should he realise it's not a viable strategy? Fury can make Joshua overextend himself numerous times as frustration builds and he fights well at full length on the backfoot. He also slips for the reset and position better than anyone else at HW by a distance. Not sure Joshua has the arsenal of punches to deal with that.
I reckon if these two do ever fight, it's a question of who can get in the others' head and get an emotional response out of them to make them deviate from the gameplan. Fury's the kind of idiot who could start showboating or trading after a verbal exchange, for example. And maybe, after one too many taunts, Fury can get Joshua to swing wider and leave himself wide open on the counter.
Yes. Agree with all of this.
He also has quality exit strategies once he's done with his punches and combinations. He's rife for making his opponent mad and then lash out. It would be interesting to see how Joshua deals with it all - there's definitely more issues for Joshua to contend with in what Fury does than the reverse, imo.
I really believe there's an epic, humiliating knockout in Wilder's future if the right HW comes along. Like how Mayweather sparked out Hatton kind of KO with him absolutely sprawled out as his own wild momentum is turned back on him in combination with the oncoming punch.
He's a trainer's nightmare, but until he fights boxers who can expose him, it's all hearsay, I suppose.
I think about £300-£400 ish from what I can work out.
Another thing to take note of in a matchup vs. Fury: Joshua holds his head extremely high and leaves his chin open. He never tucks and he doesn't move his head. Against a bigger man with a longer reach, more speed, fluidity and more guile, he's working a handicap going into that fight that camp won't really fix.
He's not a bobber and weaver, so he would have to work through the jab or over it all the while with his chin high. Could be a recipe for a shock KO, that...
He's not a bobber and weaver, so he would have to work through the jab or over it all the while with his chin high. Could be a recipe for a shock KO, that...
What a night!!!! Adrenalin is still buzzing. There were loads of little fun fights at wembley train station. Huge guys just starting sparring each other for fun cos they were all so hyped!!
Thought he was dead and buried in 5th and 6th. Felt like crying a la Barcelona 2009.
But the feelings during the 11th were the closest I've gotten to Nou Camp 99. Priceless experience. Thanks AJ!!
Thought he was dead and buried in 5th and 6th. Felt like crying a la Barcelona 2009.
But the feelings during the 11th were the closest I've gotten to Nou Camp 99. Priceless experience. Thanks AJ!!
Never was that much of a Klitschko fan to be honest, but he was sublime last night. Real grit, he fought like a real man.
As for Joshua, even taking the chauvinistic angle into account, I still can't really see how anyone would get genuinely enthousiastic about him. Don't hate the guy or anything, but he just doesn't fight like he's the real, real deal. Massive credit for his fitness though, juicing jokes aside. The man's got tremendous discipline and attitude to be in shape like that. If he keeps up that level of dedication, he'll be the champ for years to come, even more so because I don't see anyone matching him.
Such a shame Tyson Fury will probably never get back into the shape required to be a real match-up for Joshua. Because I would love nothing more than see how those two styles would match up. Fury would need to be even fitter than he was for the Klitschko match though, and stay discplined for at least 6 months prior to that fight. Which is literally mission impossible given his mental problems. Joshua in last night's shape would probably kill a half arsed Tyson looking for a pay day on his normal 70-85% fitness levels.
As for Joshua, even taking the chauvinistic angle into account, I still can't really see how anyone would get genuinely enthousiastic about him. Don't hate the guy or anything, but he just doesn't fight like he's the real, real deal. Massive credit for his fitness though, juicing jokes aside. The man's got tremendous discipline and attitude to be in shape like that. If he keeps up that level of dedication, he'll be the champ for years to come, even more so because I don't see anyone matching him.
Such a shame Tyson Fury will probably never get back into the shape required to be a real match-up for Joshua. Because I would love nothing more than see how those two styles would match up. Fury would need to be even fitter than he was for the Klitschko match though, and stay discplined for at least 6 months prior to that fight. Which is literally mission impossible given his mental problems. Joshua in last night's shape would probably kill a half arsed Tyson looking for a pay day on his normal 70-85% fitness levels.
The costs vary depending on the capacity of the pub.
A standard sized boozer will pay over £1,000 a month for Sky Sports at the moment. Not sure about PPVs but we used to pay about £300 (that was more than 10 years ago) for a big fight.
Which would be a valid point if we hadn't seen Fury caught, wobbled and knocked down several times in his career by boxers smaller, slower and weaker than Joshua.
So you predict him to be champ for years to come, he brutally knocks out everyone to share a ring with him, including the greatest champ since Lewis and you see nothing to be enthusiastic about?
What is the chauvinistic angle BTW?
Still be rolling on the floor from that uppercut
Amazed at just how overrated Fury has become since that Wlad fight, he's a smart man if he never boxes ever again and I suspect he knows that.
Just seen the score cards, Joshua up 3 points on two scorecards going into the 11th?? Seriously Eddie Hearn?!
So glad he got the knockout now, as it would be a travesty for Joshua and British boxing if they tried robbing Wlad
So glad he got the knockout now, as it would be a travesty for Joshua and British boxing if they tried robbing Wlad
Pretty much, yes.
As far as chauvinism, obviously I can imagine last night's fight at a sold out Wembley felt much more intense and emotional if Joshua is yourfellow countryman. But then again over here we had someone like Overeem, with plenty of people absolutely adoring the guy, while I never got past the 'lukewarm' stage of excitement either.
If you didn't get excited about last night you simply don't like boxing. It doesn't matter what country you come from.
Agreed, Klitschko at the age of 35-36 would have KO'ed AJ by round 5-6.
It's a stupid point @Water Melon as AJ aged 29-30 would probably spark out Klitschko aged 35-36.
Last night was a great learning curve for AJ not to go all out hellraising after a knockdown against the top top fighters.
Totally. I am struggling to think of a more exciting big fight...........in my lifetime?
There's been a few, but none I can remember like that at HW. Normally that's because people in this division just don't get up after punches like the ones that downed both fighters in the 5th & 6th.
Absolutely incredible from both, I still can't fathom how Wlad stayed on his feet after that uppercut in the 11th... that's not human!
Agreed. He had him done after the knock down but took his foot off the accelerator and allowed AJ to recover. Once the round wore on and the bell was near, it was obvious he would escape.
I think you also need to take into consideration how fecked he was after round 5, it had as much to do with that than anything. And as AJ himself showed in that same round, going in too hard after a knockdown could be very dangerous.
How much Joshua learns from this will depend on how much time he gives himself to reflect and correct things in the gym. Given that his next fight would be him going for 20 fights, 20 wins 20ko's, the narrative probably doesn't fit with being a bit more careful in the ring.
Yeah, I was talking about still not getting really enthousiastic about the fighter Anthony Joshua. Don't think I've said the fight wasn't spectacular, because it actually was pretty awesome.
Not stupid at all. Klitschko aged 41 having not fought for very long, still had a decent chance to finish him. I have not seen much from AJ proving that he will be able to defend his title for a sustained period. As for going all out hellraising, it was Wlad being too old, thus giving Joshua time to recover.Time will tell, but AJ needs to improve a lot to stay at that top, top level.
You do realise one of the fighters last night in that spectacular fight was Anthony Joshua right @Henrik Larsson ?
Of course it's stupid, you're saying a prime 36 year old Wlad would beat AJ at this age, well AJ is still a rookie in boxing terms. So to even it up by taking 3-4 years off Wlad you have to add 3-4 years to AJ also.
Epic fight and great heart shown from both fighters.
Fair play to Joshua, he has beaten a legendary fighter and shown he can weather the storm. To me though if I was another top heavyweight this fight would have only made me more confident of being able to beat Joshua. Yes he is a powerhouse of an athlete and can overwhelm you if you don't keep the distance but if you can survive his initial onslaught and if you can catch him clean then you pretty much have a sitting duck to finish off for the next few rounds. When he gets caught clean he seems to instantly gas and does nothing for the next couple of rounds, so any decent finisher could end the fight right there. This is where Klitschko made the mistake of not going for the kill in the 6/7 rounds. Maybe he didn't have the stamina to do it but I think a younger fresher fighter would have finished Joshua there. The same thing happened when Dillian Whyte caught AJ, he seemed to gas and take 2 rounds to recover.
Joshua is making British boxing big again and he is great for the sport so all credit to him but someone is going to catch him and finish him off sooner or later if his powers of recovery don't improve.
Fair play to Joshua, he has beaten a legendary fighter and shown he can weather the storm. To me though if I was another top heavyweight this fight would have only made me more confident of being able to beat Joshua. Yes he is a powerhouse of an athlete and can overwhelm you if you don't keep the distance but if you can survive his initial onslaught and if you can catch him clean then you pretty much have a sitting duck to finish off for the next few rounds. When he gets caught clean he seems to instantly gas and does nothing for the next couple of rounds, so any decent finisher could end the fight right there. This is where Klitschko made the mistake of not going for the kill in the 6/7 rounds. Maybe he didn't have the stamina to do it but I think a younger fresher fighter would have finished Joshua there. The same thing happened when Dillian Whyte caught AJ, he seemed to gas and take 2 rounds to recover.
Joshua is making British boxing big again and he is great for the sport so all credit to him but someone is going to catch him and finish him off sooner or later if his powers of recovery don't improve.
I think I've explained my point of view, not sure what the point of your reply is though.
Put it into perspective how underwhelming the heavyweight division generally is, what would a 21 year old Mike Tyson done to 41 year old klitschko?
I just find it hard to get excited about UK fighters, and the media doesn't help. They had people genuinely convinced that Ricky hatton stood a chance against mayweayher, and now they are hyping Aj up a bit too much. He is an extremely likeable fella though, so I do hope he befomes as good as they are making out he can.
I just find it hard to get excited about UK fighters, and the media doesn't help. They had people genuinely convinced that Ricky hatton stood a chance against mayweayher, and now they are hyping Aj up a bit too much. He is an extremely likeable fella though, so I do hope he befomes as good as they are making out he can.
That your point of view makes zero sense. It's quite clearly a biased point of view that even a spectacular fight can't sway.
He would've possibly got knocked out. It'd have been similar in round 5 and Tyson would've gone for the kill, but if he'd then gotten clocked on the counter like AJ... well, he never showed that he could stand a punch like Wlad or Joshua last night.
My fave boxer ever to watch but let's not rewrite the past.