The Argument for Giggs as our Next Manager

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Overachieving, the best managers are able to overachieve, Klopp, Garcia and Simeone for example showed their quality by overachieving and maintain their teams where they shouldn't. it's not an easy thing, it's not a short time thing.
I might be totally wrong, but I think it's much harder to over-achieve in the English game. I guess you could argue that he should go abroad but that would be unlikely.

Give us an example from this league. Would you have taken Mark Hughes after his work at Blackburn? Who else?
 
First off, Comparing with Pep-Enrique is not of much use because of completely different scenarios. Though Pep did something revolutionary, he also had peaks of Messi-Xavi-Iniesta together to implement those ideas and thus win trophies. Enrique had couple of stints before but he has basically fine tuned the well running machine and then got likes of Neymar and Suarez upfront with Messi, something which Pep didn't have.

My idealistic thinking on this topic is that Giggs will learn/would have learnt the best of 2 different styles of SAF and LvG and will combine it both for good. How he can 'prove' himself is a question though. Proving himself at small club doesn't guarantee that same manager can handle bigger club but it obviously gives a manager first hand experience of managing first team and learn things which by being assistant he can't. At least one coaching stint for him will be nice before the board judges if he will be good enough.
In the event that by that time LvG goes, things are back up good again, that is we have won a title and 1-2 more trophies, our youngsters have clicked, are reaching peak and that they trust Giggs, in such scenario appointing Giggs will be less risky. If team is still just fighting for 4th then it will be better to get someone with more experience, let Giggs go out and manage smaller teams and then see if there is scope of reunion in future.
 
Paul Hayward got paid to write that. Take it in.

Coaches create good football teams. What they communicate to players on the training pitch is what matters. If clear enough that work is then translated on to the competitive field.

If Giggs is an elite coach, brimming with creativity and progressive ideas, then fantastic. If he knows how to make a team win football matches then great. But Hayward doesn't know that. He knows absolutely feck all. Waffle about "tradition" is simply that, waffle.

Our next manager should be the best available football coach in the world. It's really that simple, provided he can speak the language and adapt to the country. Everything else is just cliched, sentimental nonsense.
 
I might be totally wrong, but I think it's much harder to over-achieve in the English game. I guess you could argue that he should go abroad but that would be unlikely.

Give us an example from this league. Would you have taken Mark Hughes after his work at Blackburn? Who else?

The premier league isn't a good example, because the clubs owners decide to go abroad for their managers, so he should go abroad. And there isn't one coach in the PL who is good enough, outside of the big foreign names.

Edit: Monk should be followed though.
 
Read a bit more about Pep, and you'll find that he got rid of the c team and merged it with the b team (who had just been relegated to the fourth division - not third). He got rid of a load of players in the process.

Busquets wasn't the Busquets we know today, and actually only got into the b team consistently half way through the season.
Pedro wasn't as valued by others as he was by Guardiola. The reserve teams had been neglected for years and Guardiola was the one to reinstall pride.

He wasnt given the role - he insisted on it instead of a better paying director/ambassador role at the club. The b team manager's role wasn't a high profile one, to say the least.

He was able to prove his vision for the game could work, and got his team to such a level that they outplayed the first team.

You talk as if he was handed a high achieving/higly skilled b team and coasted.
He proved his methods and his character.
Yeah there were definitely several players that became great under Pep. Pedro was one of them. Probably undervalued by previous manager but reached unthinkable level under Pep. Players like Keita and Adriano or Abidal, were the same. Good players under other managers but became great players for Pep. Even Messi was at insane level under Pep.

I'd really love Guardiola to come and revolutionize United. From the youth systems to reserves to first teams to scoutings. Everything!!. SAF football was great but Guardiola football is another level. Its somewhat similar to Lvg football but with much better creativity and pace and cutting edge also the ability to kill teams. Lvg football is far to slow.
 
An other reason why he needs to go and prove himself, is because it's crucial for a coach to be convinced by his own abilities and the only way to do that is by actually coaching and be successful. If Giggs doesn't do that he will be forced to be an instant success, otherwise he will doubt his own abilities and the players will doubt too.
 
You cant find much joy in life if you refuse to take any risks just in case they fail.

Every managerial appointment is a risk. For me, even with one of the big names touted, there is no guarantee of success. I have outlined the reasons why I think that Giggs could even be less of a risk than some of the other suggestions made.
Also, you are right in that Giggs loves the club - with that in mind, if things werent going well, I suspect he might be the first person to hold his hands up and admit it.
Agreed with everything you said there. It's a win-win situation for us.
1. If he is successful, he's making history because of who he is and all
2. If, god forbid, he couldn't make it, it's a risk we take as much as the risk we take with some other manager who doesn't have the advantage of Giggsy's unique United experience and status and love of the fans etc.
3. We know quite well Giggsy is capable of achieving at least top 4, as he has every incentive to help United, not about saving his job but to not ruin the club and disappoint his fans. This is an important element any other manager would not have.
 
When opposition fans are all for something like this you know it's a shite idea:D
You know full well he's dying to see Giggs fail but we know it's only his wishful thinking. I agree with every word and opinion the OP says. There is nothing not to like about the idea. Win-win
 
Agreed with everything you said there. It's a win-win situation for us.
1. If he is successful, he's making history because of who he is and all
2. If, god forbid, he couldn't make it, it's a risk we take as much as the risk we take with some other manager who doesn't have the advantage of Giggsy's unique United experience and status and love of the fans etc.
3. We know quite well Giggsy is capable of achieving at least top 4, as he has every incentive to help United, not about saving his job but to not ruin the club and disappoint his fans. This is an important element any other manager would not have.

How do we know "quite well" that Giggs has the coaching acumen and capacity to achieve a top four finish? Where is that evidence?

Every manager we hire has an incentive to achieve here. It's an outstanding job opportunity at one of the biggest sports clubs in the world and the financial package is huge. That's incentive enough right there.
 
An other reason why he needs to go and prove himself, is because it's crucial for a coach to be convinced by his own abilities and the only way to do that is by actually coaching and be successful. If Giggs doesn't do that he will be forced to be an instant success, otherwise he will doubt his own abilities and the players will doubt too.
First of all, I don't see Giggsy is someone who will doubt himself easily. And as the OP suggested, he will have many quality people to help him out (those who grew up with him and played with the greatest success football ever have. Those friendship will translate into unconditional help to assist him as well as to help the club thrive. For they all are united fans till they die)

Secondly, like the OP said, the experience he will gain by managing a lesser club doesn't mean any guarantee. In fact it may even be counterproductive because in other club the structure and financial setup is different. What experience he can possibly gain by spending a few years managing a 6th or 7th or even a relegating club? It would add nothing to make him better in managing United. His unique position fits the bill like a glove in my opinion.
 
Agreed with everything you said there. It's a win-win situation for us.
1. If he is successful, he's making history because of who he is and all
2. If, god forbid, he couldn't make it, it's a risk we take as much as the risk we take with some other manager who doesn't have the advantage of Giggsy's unique United experience and status and love of the fans etc.
3. We know quite well Giggsy is capable of achieving at least top 4, as he has every incentive to help United, not about saving his job but to not ruin the club and disappoint his fans. This is an important element any other manager would not have.

Its actually not a win win situation in that he is an inexperienced candidate who has never managed a professional football club. He's purely a rose tinted choice by those clamoring for identity over success.
 
In a couple of years we could have young players like depay, martial, wilson, janauzj, periera, shaw, mcnair all ready to step up as a group and dominate the leage for years...

if only we could find a manager who has experienced something like that to help them ;)

I hope he gets the opportunity and we give him a good couple of years to show what he can do.
 
How do we know "quite well" that Giggs has the coaching acumen and capacity to achieve a top four finish? Where is that evidence?

Every manager we hire has an incentive to achieve here. It's an outstanding job opportunity at one of the biggest sports clubs in the world and the financial package is huge. That's incentive enough right there.
I just know. And I believe many have the faith. As a manager, it's not just about how good you're (in coaching and in management), it's about how you can use the right people and trust them to help you. We know he's not lacking those people who are willing to help and with selfless intention. These people have united in their blood and you can't argue that Giggsy's unique position is not to be matched by any other managers.

As to other manager working here, you're right about incentive. But the key issue is whether they have the unique knowledge and personal feeling of United to make it work and command the respect and agreement from everyone within the club? Giggs will make mistake along the way, but as we know so has LvG. The upside of having Giggsy is there is one less problem to worry about (hint: transition). And if Giggsy employs a good assistant who he can trust, I don't foresee failure. It's almost a risk free situation.
 
Agreed with everything you said there. It's a win-win situation for us.
1. If he is successful, he's making history because of who he is and all
2. If, god forbid, he couldn't make it, it's a risk we take as much as the risk we take with some other manager who doesn't have the advantage of Giggsy's unique United experience and status and love of the fans etc.
3. We know quite well Giggsy is capable of achieving at least top 4, as he has every incentive to help United, not about saving his job but to not ruin the club and disappoint his fans. This is an important element any other manager would not have.

I'm glad you're not in charge of the club. We don't know any of those things - not least because he's never managed a side.

Nice idea - but appointing Giggs would be nothing more than a shot in the dark.

The fact that Moyes was sacked after 7 months tells you how key it is that this club achieves in terms of results. Champions Leage qualification in particular is key to the commercial success of the club. Hence why a safe pair of hands in Van Gaal was brought in to get us into the top 4.

We're the sort of club who will attract the very best managers given the history of the club and its financial position. Talking about United experience isn't relevant because we're no different now from any other big club. The best managers will come in, impose themselves and do the job - just like they have at other clubs.

Appointing him is an unnecessary risk. He needs to go and actually do the job elsewhere first and show he's the right man for United on merit - not some romantic notion that it's meant to be.
 
Its actually not a win win situation in that he is an inexperienced candidate who has never managed a professional football club. He's purely a rose tinted choice by those clamoring for identity over success.
There is no basis of this suggestion. Many on here are trying to be patient with Van Gaal who's only have two more seasons to prove himself and some of you are willing to be trophy-less for seasons to come. Why not give Giggsy a chance because the risk with any other manager is the same if not higher.
 
In a couple of years we could have young players like depay, martial, wilson, janauzj, periera, shaw, mcnair all ready to step up as a group and dominate the leage for years...

if only we could find a manager who has experienced something like that to help them ;)

I hope he gets the opportunity and we give him a good couple of years to show what he can do.

Loads of clubs can say that. Arsenal have had a great team in waiting every other year for ages.

The reality is the club are too concerned about results - both footballing and financial to take a punt on a manager just because the fans will sing his name.

He's no more qualified than any other ex-United player and less so than a lot of them. He needs to cut his teeth somewhere before this is even considered.
 
There is no basis of this suggestion. Many on here are trying to be patient with Van Gaal who's only have two more seasons to prove himself and some of you are willing to be trophy-less for seasons to come. Why not give Giggsy a chance because the risk with any other manager is the same if not higher.

The difference is Van Gaal has won all kinds, hence his getting a chance to prove what he can do.

And the fact is plenty of top managers with lots of experience and lots of trophies will fancy this job when Van Gaal goes.
 
There is no basis of this suggestion. Many on here are trying to be patient with Van Gaal who's only have two more seasons to prove himself and some of you are willing to be trophy-less for seasons to come. Why not give Giggsy a chance because the risk with any other manager is the same if not higher.

I doubt LvG is going anywhere before the end of his contract, and if we manage a trophy or two during that time, I wouldn't at all be surprised if he extends. As for Giggs, its highly irresponsible to "give him his chance" with the future of the club at stake. We should be pursuing a qualified manager who managed a big club at the highest level before, not one who has never managed any club at any level.
 
I hope he gets the opportunity and we give him a good couple of years to show what he can do.

That's all dandy in people's minds, enhanced by a wave of optimism. But just to cover all the bases, what happens when we give him a good couple of years, we don't qualify for Europe, lose out on competition money, lose out on broadcasting revenues, lose out on a part of the Adidas money, watch a club legend fail at the job, watch people have a go at him, watch Bayern and Barcelona pull further, maybe watch a couple of our own players angle for a move in the face of non-competitiveness, watch the best players join clubs who have qualified for Europe, prove that we have learnt naught from the Moyes debacle in terms of appointing a manager with zero credentials in Europe.

Do we really need another experiment that might set us back a couple of years at the very least if things go tits ups, especially in the wake on the damage 2013/ 2014 did to the club, and the effort we had to make just to get back in the reckoning for Europe, let alone be in the reckoning for league or European honors. And on the financial front, lose 200+ million in a couple of seasons, a few seasons after the whole episode under the previous manager cost the club $80 million :

http://www.bloomberg.com/bw/article...d-blames-david-moyes-for-80-million-in-losses
 
First of all, I don't see Giggsy is someone who will doubt himself easily. And as the OP suggested, he will have many quality people to help him out (those who grew up with him and played with the greatest success football ever have. Those friendship will translate into unconditional help to assist him as well as to help the club thrive. For they all are united fans till they die)

Secondly, like the OP said, the experience he will gain by managing a lesser club doesn't mean any guarantee. In fact it may even be counterproductive because in other club the structure and financial setup is different. What experience he can possibly gain by spending a few years managing a 6th or 7th or even a relegating club? It would add nothing to make him better in managing United. His unique position fits the bill like a glove in my opinion.


If he isn't successful at the beginning, he will doubt like every other coach on earth, the people around him will be useless in that aspect. And the experience is the most important thing in life for the most basic things and it's even more important in an high profile job, the players needs to know that he can ride every obstacles and he needs to know it too.

I will love to see him coach the team successfully or not, but it's a stupidly romantic idea. On the top of my mind I can only think about two coaches who coached a "big" team without a very solid experience and succeeded LVG and Guardiola, they both signed extremely systemic clubs where the young players play the same system since they are 7 years old. And LVG was an assistant manager for almost 10 years.
 
I'm glad you're not in charge of the club. We don't know any of those things - not least because he's never managed a side.

Nice idea - but appointing Giggs would be nothing more than a shot in the dark.

The fact that Moyes was sacked after 7 months tells you how key it is that this club achieves in terms of results. Champions Leage qualification in particular is key to the commercial success of the club. Hence why a safe pair of hands in Van Gaal was brought in to get us into the top 4.

We're the sort of club who will attract the very best managers given the history of the club and its financial position. Talking about United experience isn't relevant because we're no different now from any other big club. The best managers will come in, impose themselves and do the job - just like they have at other clubs.

Appointing him is an unnecessary risk. He needs to go and actually do the job elsewhere first and show he's the right man for United on merit - not some romantic notion that it's meant to be.
I can say the same thing to you!

Every bit of your concern against the idea was addressed in the OP. Why not go back and read it again please?
 
This is something of a follow-on from the "If not LVG then who?" thread, and it is something I am aware has been discussed before (including by myself) but I think there is enough here to merit its own thread.

I am in the apparent minority who thinks that Giggs should be our next manager after LVG. This is on the assumption that LVG is going to retire perhaps after the 16/17 season - or maybe a year later if he fancies extending his stay.

So, my arguments (and counter-arguments to some of the commonly put forward ones against him) for Giggs' as the next long term manager are as follows;

1) "Lack of Experience" & Similar Arguments - "send him out and let him earn his stripes at another club first".
The most common argument against Giggs is his lack of managerial experience. The thing is however, managing Manchester United is not like managing some mid table club. Ego and arrogance aside, we all saw what happened when a Premier League stalwart in David Moyes made the step from Everton (a decent club themselves) to United - he was completely out of his depth. With this in mind, why is there this assumption that Giggs needs to go and manage an Everton, and that doing so will somehow qualify him to manage United?

What Giggs does have at the moment however, is a very strong United pedigree. He has been at the club since he was a boy, he knows the club and how it operates like the back of his hand. This to me is far more valuable than a few years managing a mid table team, which in reality does not say anything about how well equipped he is to manage United. If anything, I would rather see him appointed at United without having gone and been at other clubs for x amount of years - better to appoint him now while he has the benefit of strong exist relationships with the current staff, players and club itself.

2) Giggs is a proven winner who commands respect
On a related note to the above, Giggs has won it all with United. One of the big failings of Moyes (arguably) was that because he had not won trophies or competed at the top levels of competition, he did not or could not command the respect of the players. Giggs would definitely not have this problem, and in addition to respect, he also knows the players and the backroom staff already. Further to this is that he knows the fans and the expectations at the club - he understands that just getting the 3 points every week is not enough for us.

3) We do not want another lengthy "transition" after LVG
The majority of fans seem to want a Klopp, Guardiola or Mourinho after LVG leaves. My big concern with this is the lack of continuity it creates. Any of those managers will arguably want to bring in their own backroom staff, will want to make substantial changes to the team, the system, the style of football etc... just like LVG has.
So with one of those "big names", the scenario we end up with is LVG having been here for perhaps 3 years (of which at least the first can be labelled as transition), only for a new manager to come in and start a lengthy transition themselves. And what is the guarantee that they will stay longer than LVG has?

Personally, when LVG steps down I expet him to be leaving a squad capable of challenging for the PL and CL. What I want is someone who can come in and continue what LVG has started, without making wholesale changes across the board/pitch. Giggs fits this criteria - the very fact that he is not an experienced, established manager means he is not likely to be quite as 'set in his ways' as the likes of LVG, and will not have his established system or philosophy that he needs to imprint. On the contrary, if Giggs takes over then it will be on the back of him spending 3+ years working under LVG and learning from him. This relates to my next point...

4) Giggs has learnt from the very best.
Does anyone really think that after working with SAF, Moyes and LVG, Giggs wont have picked up on both the good and bad traits employed by each? Giggs may not be experienced himself, but he has had the opportunity to learn from arguably the greatest manager of all time, another highly successful top calibre manager in LVG, and has witnessed what can only be described as an unmitigated disaster in Moyes' brief tenure.

I am not trying to claim that this is a direct substitute for first hand experience, but working under some very high profile names both as a player and a coach is bound to rub off on someone who is eager to learn and keen to get into football management. And Giggs is no slouch, LVG has come out praising him and saying that he has talent for management already.

Finally,

5) Giggs would not be on his own
Just as he has learnt from SAF and LVG, if appointed I am sure that both of those two would be happy to lend advice and support to Giggs if required, while he gets settled in to the job. On top of this are his other contacts and friends in the footballing world like Scholes and Neville, and even his relationship with the senior players in the squad like Rooney.

If he was made manager, Giggs would be surrounded with experienced staff, players and contacts like SAF who have seen it all as a football manager. I do not think that Giggs would be so arrogant or egotistical to insist on striking out on his own in his first management job. He would continue to learn and benefit from the experience around him, to adapt and build on the framework and foundations being put in place by LVG as we speak.




Some of this may sound romantic, but as others said in the other thread - what is football without a bit of romanticism from time to time? We have seen others like Guardiola and even Garry Monk make the transition from playing to managing with little-to-no experience successfully, and for me, when LVG leaves, the context and environment will be just right for our own Pep-like appointment. I would not have backed Giggs to take over from SAF, nor from Moyes, as the time and circumstances simply were not right for such an appointment, but for the reasons stated above, I think that after LVG the circumstances will be right, and that Giggs could add his name to a list including the likes of Busby and Ferguson, as one of the great managers of his generation.

If you have read all this then thanks, and I hope you give it some thought rather than just dismissing the notion of Giggs as manager out-of-hand.

6) He looks bloody good in a suit.

Seriously though, you make a lot of good points and I'm not averse to the idea at all.
 
I doubt LvG is going anywhere before the end of his contract, and if we manage a trophy or two during that time, I wouldn't at all be surprised if he extends. As for Giggs, its highly irresponsible to "give him his chance" with the future of the club at stake. We should be pursuing a qualified manager who managed a big club at the highest level before, not one who has never managed any club at any level.

So, are you saying that even giggsy has gained his experience elsewhere, he would never be employed back to manage United? Because I don't see giggsy will be employed by a big club at the highest level any time soon, before he's qualified by your standard to manage us.
 
Loads of clubs can say that. Arsenal have had a great team in waiting every other year for ages.

The reality is the club are too concerned about results - both footballing and financial to take a punt on a manager just because the fans will sing his name.

He's no more qualified than any other ex-United player and less so than a lot of them. He needs to cut his teeth somewhere before this is even considered.
I doubt many on here would consider SAF today... he has only won in Scotland... cup winners cup is a joke etc etc
 
I think its wrong to believe that if United will get Ryan we will go back to a flat 4-4-2 system. We will see plenty of familiar faces back, most of whom will offer little to no expertise to United (Butt, the Nevilles etc) however I cant see how Giggs would implement a system which became outdated long before he actually retired. Its like a British general fielding longbowmen in Iraq just because he's British.

I've got mixed feelings about promoting internally. On one hand its great because it keeps some sort of consistency in the team. The players you've got would know the manager, how he thinks and what he expects. On the other hand it means that the knowledge pool will remain stale. People like Ryan Giggs had two managers in their entire career (three if you add LVG). How can he really say that the approach taken by his former manager in a certain situation was right or could be better? He never seen any other approach before?

However some clubs did made it work. Liverpool during their glory days, AC Milan during their glory days and Barcelona during their glory days are a clear testament of that. Stating that observe what these clubs had in common.

a - they were in their glory days (or at the cusp of it). For example Guardiola's task was to promote his mega talented kids to first team. Enrique (who was absolutely cack at Roma) had to keep the Barcelona juggernaut going. Same things can be said about Capello and lesser so Paisley and Ancelotti

b - Most of these former players were also football generals. Ancelotti, Guardiola, Enrique were charismatic chaps, managers on the pitch. Giggs is a great servant of the club but he doesn't come across as a leader

To conclude, clubs using such system tend and must be ruthless. For example many mention Ancelotti or Capello as clear example of how this system can work. However for every one of them there were also a number of Inzaghis, Seedorfs, Leonardos and Cesare Maldinis whom Milan ruthlessly sacked, sometimes in less than a year. Can United be as ruthless with Giggs if things doesn't work out?
 
I doubt many on here would consider SAF today... he has only won in Scotland... cup winners cup is a joke etc etc

What Fergie achieved with Aberdeen defied common logic, he took them to a level no one expected of them, which is what great managers do, they get their teams to overachieve. He didn't just win in Scotland, he made Aberdeen the first Scottish champions outside of Celtic and Rangers in over 14 seasons, and just to prove that wasn't a flash in the pan, he won it again, twice infact, to go with 5 domestic Cups in as many seasons. On the European front, he beat Bayern Munich, reigning European Cup champions Hamburg managed by Ernst Happel of all people, and Real Madrid; clubs who were notches beyond Aberdeen both at the time, and in terms of historical relevance. That's no mean feat, a fairly recent equivalent for his level of success given what he inherited with Aberdeen, would probably be Mourinho at Porto, or Simeone with Atletico, or Klopp with Dortmund.
 
So, are you saying that even giggsy has gained his experience elsewhere, he would never be employed back to manage United? Because I don't see giggsy will be employed by a big club at the highest level any time soon, before he's qualified by your standard to manage us.

With good reason. I expect United will follow the same line of reasoning when the time comes.
 
If he isn't successful at the beginning, he will doubt like every other coach on earth, the people around him will be useless in that aspect. And the experience is the most important thing in life for the most basic things and it's even more important in an high profile job, the players needs to know that he can ride every obstacles and he needs to know it too.

I will love to see him coach the team successfully or not, but it's a stupidly romantic idea. On the top of my mind I can only think about two coaches who coached a "big" team without a very solid experience and succeeded LVG and Guardiola, they both signed extremely systemic clubs where the young players play the same system since they are 7 years old. And LVG was an assistant manager for almost 10 years.
Of course there no guarantee he will be successful but we can say this of any manager coming in. There is also no evidenxe he would completely lose his confidence if he's not instantly successful. And if he's lost his confidence he would not carry on even the club wants him to stay because he would have the interest of the club in his heart first and foremost

Let me ask you these:
1. Do you agree United is a unique club? Not just because I am biased but how many other top flight club which has enjoyed success similar to us and under one manager?
2. How many retired player of Giggsy's stature and success (who's home grown and worked under the same manager - someone who's agreed by every footballing great that he's the greatest manager of this country if not of the world) who aspires to turn into management has done it within their own club? You have no evidence to proof it will be risky.
3. Do you agree those around him who have the knowledge and skills would give him unconditional help, something any other manager can't have the benefit of? The trust they have towards each other also very very rarely exists when we are dealing with other I coming manager. They will bring in their own team and it would be Moyes all over again!

LvG has the benefit of Giggsy helping him which has made his job easier. His successor will not have such benefit of Giggsy needs to go elsewhere to manage some smaller club. The transitioning will need to start all over again
 
With good reason. I expect United will follow the same line of reasoning when the time comes.
So by your reasoning, Giggsy should never manage united?

The reason why Giggsy will not get a job of the highest level elsewhere is, he's not a home grown player in any other club and has not enjoyed success with that club, non working under the greatest manager in that club... The criteria of employing Giggsy at United is because of his unique position with the club, a position no one person can match.
 
So, are you saying that even giggsy has gained his experience elsewhere, he would never be employed back to manage United? Because I don't see giggsy will be employed by a big club at the highest level any time soon, before he's qualified by your standard to manage us.

Yes pretty much. Why should he be exempted from the normal qualification standards required to get the biggest job in club football ?
 
6) He looks bloody good in a suit.

Seriously though, you make a lot of good points and I'm not averse to the idea at all.
7. Giggsy is someone who will have the best interest of United in mind, something other incoming manager may not have because their own interest comes first. If he realises he's not up for the job he will not take over
 
Yes pretty much. Why should he be exempted from the normal qualification standards required to get the biggest job in club football ?
Again the answer is already given above (in my post I told you Giggsy is in an unique position no other manager has).
 
Again the answer is already given above (in my post I told you Giggsy is in an unique position no other manager has).

I disagree with your answer. Him being homegrown is utterly irrelevant to his actual management qualifications.
 
Again the answer is already given above (in my post I told you Giggsy is in an unique position no other manager has).

To be fair, the answer smacks of circular reasoning, and extrapolation just to prove the sense of uniqueness.
 
To be fair, the answer smacks of circular reasoning, and extrapolation just to prove the sense of uniqueness.
Well I don't agree. If anything is being extrapolating its the constant aguement against him managing United. The case for him being appointed has a great deal more merits IMO
 
Well I don't agree. If anything is being extrapolating its the constant aguement against him managing United. The case for him being appointed has a great deal more merits IMO

There is no case for him being appointed beyond the usual identity politics of wanting a homegrown manager.
 
I disagree with your answer. Him being homegrown is utterly irrelevant to his actual management qualifications.
Home grown and also being successful for over 2 decades working under Fergie within that time gives him some management skills he had learned along the way. Again the personel he can draw in to assist him are those he can trust and rely on, something no other manager can do without upsetting the club's basic fabrics.

Besides he's undergone the trauma of Moyes regime and LvG iron management style, he's more mature now for sure
 
1. Do you agree United is a unique club? Not just because I am biased but how many other top flight club which has enjoyed success similar to us and under one manager?
2. How many retired player of Giggsy's stature and success (who's home grown and worked under the same manager - someone who's agreed by every footballing great that he's the greatest manager of this country if not of the world) who aspires to turn into management has done it within their own club? You have no evidence to proof it will be risky.
3. Do you agree those around him who have the knowledge and skills would give him unconditional help, something any other manager can't have the benefit of? The trust they have towards each other also very very rarely exists when we are dealing with other I coming manager. They will bring in their own team and it would be Moyes all over again!

1. No United isn't a unique club and the success under one manager is totally irrelevant in Giggs potential appointment.
2. My proof is that manager is a real job, who needs experience and skills, you gain experience and skills by doing that job, that would be like telling me that the son of a great carpenter is potentially a great carpenter because he watched his dad do it for years, he will be a great carpenter after years of carpentry unless is a freak, which is possible but unlikely.
3. Every other managers have the unconditional support of those around them( I suppose that you are talking about the Class 92), and in our case those around him are as inexperienced as he is, and if they are that good than we should hire them, not him.

You see, because I'm irrational I'm behind that appointment but you have to realize that it's a very stupid idea, because the odds are totally against a potential success.
 
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