Sergio Aguero

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There isn't any reason why it couldn't work. It's just like everyone saying that Tevez and Rooney couldn't work together but with the sheer amount of players we have at the moment and the fact i expect Owen to impose himself more as the season goes on, I can't see this happening unless we off load some of our players. We do seem to be bulging at the seams at the moment.
 
It could work better than Berbatov and Rooney. I'd agree that Aguero isnt what Rooney's perfect partner would be, but he'd still be a good fit - And it would also still give Berbatov a role to play if we needed a taller option in there or someone to pass the ball around from a bit deeper. We'd also have the option of Berbatov behind Aguero and Rooney if we really needed to get ourselves a goal. A bit like when we had Berbatov, Rooney, Ronaldo and Tevez all playing last season when we needed to take a gamble.

Aguero actually does good work and is able to set up team mates as well, but importantly he's a much better taker of chances than Berbatov and his pace would stretch defences allowing more space for Rooney or whoever he is playing next to. He could also play wide in a front 3 and be more dangerous than our wide players often are.

Normally the fee would be the stumbling block and I'd put the idea down to fantasy but... I think we'd benefit a lot from signing him, regardless of whether it took all our remaining funds.
 
It could work better than Berbatov and Rooney. I'd agree that Aguero isnt what Rooney's perfect partner would be, but he'd still be a good fit - And it would also still give Berbatov a role to play if we needed a taller option in there or someone to pass the ball around from a bit deeper. We'd also have the option of Berbatov behind Aguero and Rooney if we really needed to get ourselves a goal. A bit like when we had Berbatov, Rooney, Ronaldo and Tevez all playing last season when we needed to take a gamble.

Aguero actually does good work and is able to set up team mates as well, but importantly he's a much better taker of chances than Berbatov and his pace would stretch defences allowing more space for Rooney or whoever he is playing next to. He could also play wide in a front 3 and be more dangerous than our wide players often are.

Normally the fee would be the stumbling block and I'd put the idea down to fantasy but... I think we'd benefit a lot from signing him, regardless of whether it took all our remaining funds.
Nice clear summary there.

I'd say Rooney's perfect partner would be something like what Dwight Yorke's peak form was but I don't think there are any players out there similar to Yorke at his peak. If Saha wasn't injured that often or if we got Drogba or maybe even Torres, then I'd say there probably the best suited for Rooney's style.

We were all Berba wanking last year but as time goes by, he's oozing class and perfect touches haven't quite shone in a pacey United side. Though he is still a good addition to our squad, his price tag seems hefty.
 
I think Aguero and Rooney could make it work. Talented players usually find a way. As stated above, it might not be ideal for Rooney but Aguero is class and has a good head on his shoulders and we can always find room for players that have a good attitude and an abundance of class.
 
Rooney's particular characteristics makes it difficult to slot him in a role and find the ideal partner for him. On one hand he is pretty direct, whose instinct is to take the player and score the goal rather then create chance for others. You won't see Rooney making the flicks Barbie does. On the other hand he just cant resist from dropping deep and lets face it, while he does score loads of goals he will never be a lead the line striker. Under such circumstances you need someone who has a wide range of characteristics + the attitude to adapt to every circumstances. Yorke is a good example to what we need. Aguero has the talent but maybe not the physique needed to slot in that role.
 
Rooney basically is a Yorke type now. He's even started to get the heading down.

The problem is that a few years ago, his perfect partner would probably look nothing like who his perfect partner would be today.

Gone are the days where Rooney was able to go past half a team on his own with his dribbling. He's barely able to beat a man these days. Or when allowing him to shoot from just outside the box meant a goal was on the cards. Those goals are few and far between now. Judging from some of his more recent matches his passing isnt what it once was either. He used to create chances with some of the best reverse passes I've ever seen and start moves by accurately depositing the ball onto the flank before moving into the box. Nothing like that anymore, although thats Berbatov's role now.

You might say Rooney of old would be a good partner for the current Wayne Rooney.
 
Rooney basically is a Yorke type now. He's even started to get the heading down.

The problem is that a few years ago, his perfect partner would probably look nothing like who his perfect partner would be today.

Gone are the days where Rooney was able to go past half a team on his own with his dribbling. He's barely able to beat a man these days. Or when allowing him to shoot from just outside the box meant a goal was on the cards. Those goals are few and far between now. Judging from some of his more recent matches his passing isnt what it once was either. He used to create chances with some of the best reverse passes I've ever seen and start moves by accurately depositing the ball onto the flank before moving into the box. Nothing like that anymore, although thats Berbatov's role now.

You might say Rooney of old would be a good partner for the current Wayne Rooney.

:lol: Your a nutter mate
 
:lol: Your a nutter mate

Even I agree with him. Rooney's certainly become less brilliant and more economical and sensible than he used to be. I'm not sure which I prefer to be honest. Rooney's long range efforts these days are so average, something he was exceptional at once. His shots always had venom behind them. I don't understand why that isn't the case now. He's always looking to place everything. Even from long range it's always an attempted curler.

I miss the explosiveness.
 
I agree with him. Rooneys style has definately changed since joining United. Matured, if you will.

Is that completely a good thing though? He was meant to be brilliant. To do things few others could.
 
Er, when Rooney came through he used to get more bookings than goals. Defenders also didn't know what to expect, whereas now they are alot more wise to him. Despite this his goal return has vastly improved and his all round contribution to the team. He's a much better player now.
 
Depends on how you view it I guess.

Not really. Ronaldo's game matured in the 2006/2007 season but he still did brilliant things. Same with Messi. Same with most top players. Rooney seems to be consumed by the obsession to do things properly, rather than just going out there and expressing himself as well.
 
Er, when Rooney came through he used to get more bookings than goals. Defenders also didn't know what to expect, whereas now they are alot more wise to him. Despite this his goal return has vastly improved and his all round contribution to the team. He's a much better player now.

His goal return in the league was best in 05/06, when he was playing in the way described.

He's changed as a player, a bit better overall but he seems less unique. Less dangerous with the ball at his feet perhaps, though much more likely to hurt you getting on the end of someone else's through ball. He's improved on a few key areas of his game, his off the ball running and recently his heading skills, but the things that made him look so special when he first played for us dont seem so out of the ordinary now.
 
His goal return in the league was best in 05/06, when he was playing in the way described.

He's changed as a player, a bit better overall but he seems less unique. Less dangerous with the ball at his feet perhaps, though much more likely to hurt you getting on the end of someone else's through ball. He's improved on a few key areas of his game, his off the ball running and recently his heading skills, but the things that made him look so special when he first played for us dont seem so out of the ordinary now.

Pretty much spot on. I think there has to be a balance. Look at all the top players and there's a balance between brilliance and maturity. They keep it simple when they have to and maintain discipline, but know that they can turn it on at the right time. Brilliance from Rooney these days is a rare moment which is celebrated but almost a relief rather than a regular occurrence.
 
It's strange though isn't it? It seems like the coaching staff and Fergie prefer players this way: Ronaldo, Anderson, Rooney have all become less exciting (Ronaldo's starting to beat men for fun at Real again it seems...) yes during their 'learning years' at United...
 
It's strange though isn't it? It seems like the coaching staff and Fergie prefer players this way: Ronaldo, Anderson, Rooney have all become less exciting (Ronaldo's starting to beat men for fun at Real again it seems...) yes during their 'learning years' at United...

See with Ronaldo and Anderson the situation is a bit different. Ronaldo was poor at decision making and had to improve a lot in this aspect, and did so in the 06/07 season. IMO his inability to go past players as well towards the end of his United career had more to do with form, and his emphasis to score goals. Whether that's Fergie's emphasis it makes no difference. To be honest, we needed him to focus on goals heavily as well because we had a lack of proper goal scorers in the team and he was brilliant at it.

Anderson is a funny one. None of us really know whether he was this swashbuckling new Ronaldhinio before United, and we've rarely ever played an 'attacking midfielder' so it made sense to have him in the centre of midfield and IMO playing him the way we have will benefit us in the future, and get him more used to the physical side of the English game.

Rooney on the other hand has played all his football in England, this is where he belongs and has been a fairly mature player from the start. Yes, you could argue we need his focus to be on goals now that Ronaldo is gone. But these kinds of players (Rooney, Ronaldo etc) are too talented to be consciously restricted in expressing their unique talents. Rooney was a mature footballer (footballing maturity) when he was 18 for me. He always knew when to pass and when not to, so for me he's not someone who needs to be so 'correct' in his game. He's mean to go out there and terrorize teams.
 
Ronaldo was blessed by the fact that the team was built around him. If Ronaldo didn't want to backtrack then we would get another hardworking striker to make sure that someone do it for him. Anderson had struggled by the fact that we don't have an quality defensive midfielder at our side. Under such circumstances he had to learn to do his share of work and not drive forward as much as he used to be (anyway he was pretty shite at it since he never scored goals). Rooney was always seen as the mr fix it of all system flaws. When the gaffer needed someone to lead the line he would send Rooney to do it, if he needed a flank man he would send Rooney to do it. Unfortunately I think that his game had suffered because of it.
 
Rooney doesn't look as good as when he first entered the side because now he is expected to do all the work himself. When he came to Utd he was playing with Ruud, an out and out striker. Same when he plays with Heskey with England, he is given more freedom.
 
Anyway, I'd like to see Rooney's strike partner to have these attributes: At least the same pace + acceleration, has a better finish, and will lash onto through balls. I think El Kun is one of them. I would have like Benzema but he chose RM over us. Anyway judging by Benzema, the new French Ronaldo, has no where near the accurate finish of any Ronaldo's yet.
 
he's got it pretty much spot on, i have just watched a show on some of rooneys best play and was speechless at some of his early stuff, nowadays he doesn't really make the jaw drop as he once did with his dribbling and fantastic strike

I remember watching the highlights of one of his games for Everton against us awhile back and he was our defenders were absolutely frightened of him. He was bullying them left right and centre. I think we won the game but this 18 or 17 year old was making our defenders look like rubbish. It's the kind of highlights you watch from games of the very best footballers in the world. I doubt you can even make such a clip from one of Rooney's games these days. Maybe a few delightful long passes and crosses, but pure brilliance, I don't think so.

This is one of my biggest fears amongst United players. Rooney not fulfilling his potential because I'm so in awe of the prospect of how good he can be and how it would feel if he never actually fulfilled it.

This thread has now gotten me a bit sad :( I always thought he was just a bit more 'special' than any young player at the time. He just had a habit of making the pitch his stage for Everton, then England and then us. It's a bit like Mourinho, Ronaldo or Messi these days. God knows if it will continue for them but in their respective roles you just get a feeling they're destined for greatness and no matter what they do, that's just in the script for them. I'm worried about Rooney in that respect. When he had that awesome season as a 19 or 20 year old for us, I thought this kid is just going to tear into world football and kill defenders for fun. Screamers at 16, stunning at a world cup at 18, bought by the best club in the world and a dream debut as well at 18, and a brilliant season at 20 (or 19). It's just not been as special since. He's now actually behind a few players his age, which wasn't the case when he was 18.

I think i need to stop posting in this thread now :(
 
Well you have to remember when Rooney first came out he probably received less attention from defenders before his reputation built up and now he attracts alot more attention.

Why haven't Ronaldo, Messi, Gerrard, Torres etc gotten less brilliant? Just making the point that top players can get 'found out' for max a season. They're normally just too good to stop. It's as if the defenders know what they're going to do but still can't stop them from doing it.
 
I remember watching the highlights of one of his games for Everton against us awhile back and he was our defenders were absolutely frightened of him. He was bullying them left right and centre. I think we won the game but this 18 or 17 year old was making our defenders look like rubbish. It's the kind of highlights you watch from games of the very best footballers in the world. I doubt you can even make such a clip from one of Rooney's games these days. Maybe a few delightful long passes and crosses, but pure brilliance, I don't think so.

This is one of my biggest fears amongst United players. Rooney not fulfilling his potential because I'm so in awe of the prospect of how good he can be and how it would feel if he never actually fulfilled it.

This thread has now gotten me a bit sad :( I always thought he was just a bit more 'special' than any young player at the time. He just had a habit of making the pitch his stage for Everton, then England and then us. It's a bit like Mourinho, Ronaldo or Messi these days. God knows if it will continue for them but in their respective roles you just get a feeling they're destined for greatness and no matter what they do, that's just in the script for them. I'm worried about Rooney in that respect. When he had that awesome season as a 19 or 20 year old for us, I thought this kid is just going to tear into world football and kill defenders for fun. Screamers at 16, stunning at a world cup at 18, bought by the best club in the world and a dream debut as well at 18, and a brilliant season at 20 (or 19). It's just not been as special since. He's now actually behind a few players his age, which wasn't the case when he was 18.

I think i need to stop posting in this thread now :(

I wanted to say these things from quite a while, you have perfectly interpreted my thoughts and feelings about him. Completely agree.

But, the thing is he is only 23 and is there any chance that he could once again lit the world alight?
 
some of the stuff in this video he just doesn't seem to do anymore which is a huge shame, what could have been...

NOTE: this video is made by a everton fan so quite alot of bitterness

 
Why haven't Ronaldo, Messi, Gerrard, Torres etc gotten less brilliant? Just making the point that top players can get 'found out' for max a season. They're normally just too good to stop. It's as if the defenders know what they're going to do but still can't stop them from doing it.

Well he has not been found out really? I think I'm right to say that he has been increasing his productivity every season since then which has in turn helped the team perform better in my opinion. He now knows when to pass more, or when to shoot and when to dribble alot more.

I still remember the contrast in attention he was getting during the 05/06 season compared to that of the 06/07 season and he still managed to bag 23 goals in the latter season. Even now he has 5 goals so far, yes he may not look as spectacular but in my opinion neither does Messi compared to when he was 18.

If you think he is an amazing dribbler now, when Messi first came out he would try take on everybody and 9/10 he will succeed but it's not alway the right option. At one point the Spanish press were claiming he was not as explosive in his next season.

However, that does not help the team, (taking on everybody etc) you have to learn to know when to dribble and when to pass the ball and this is something Messi has confessed he has worked on. Messi has changed his game in that aspect and Barca have become even greater as a result. Even though Messi destroys teams with his dribbling, anybody who has followed this kid since he came through the ranks would know he used to do it even more, as mind boggling as that sounds.

He now knows when to pass and when to dribble alot more making him more effective than ever. Last season 38 goals and 13 assists or so speaks for itself.



Although Rooney is not as talented, his situation is similar, he may not be as spectacular but he is certainly a better player as he has learned how to maximize his attributes which is a good reason we have been so successful in the last three years.

People say Ronaldo was more spectacular in 06/07 but in 07/08 he learnt how to maximize his attributes alot more to become more productive in deciding the outcomes of matches. He became a catalyst to winning the CL, if you contrast his performances in that season, to when we went out against Milan in the San Siro you could see how he matured even further for the benefit of the team.

In my opinion Torres is a fantastic player but he does not contribute to games as much as Rooney does. I'm very happy with Rooney's contributions so far and in my opinion he has got better every year.
 
I wanted to say these things from quite a while, you have perfectly interpreted my thoughts and feelings about him. Completely agree.

But, the thing is he is only 23 and is there any chance that he could once again lit the world alight?

Of course he can but he isn't right now. And he'll be 24 in a week or so.
 
Well he has not been found out really? I think I'm right to say that he has been increasing his productivity ever season since then which has in turn helped the team perform better in my opinion. He now knows when to pass more, or when to shoot and when to dribble alot more.

I still remember the contrast in attention he was getting during the 05/06 season compared to that of the 06/07 season and he still managed to bag 23 goals in the latter season. Even now he has 5 goals so far, yes he may not look as spectacular but in my opinion neither does Messi compared to when he was 18.

If you think he is an amazing dribbler now, when he first came out he would try take on everybody and 9/10 he will succeed. However, that does not help the team, you have to learn to know when to dribble and when to pass the ball and this is something Messi has confessed he has worked on. Messi has changed his game in that aspect and Barca have become even greater as a result. Rooney may not be as spectacular but he is certainly a better player as he has learned how to maximize his attributes which is a good reason we have been so successful in the last three years.

In my opinion Torres is a fantastic player but he does not contribute to games as much as Rooney does. I'm very happy with Rooney's contributions so far.
I don't think you're getting the point at all. We're not taking about whether Rooney is better now than he was then. The question is whether he can be as brilliant now as he was then. I don't know about Messi but he's now no longer a teenager but he's still destroying defenses for fun, with maturity and yet with brilliance. Same with Ronaldo. Kaka was doing at 25 too. Gerrard despite being overrated produces far more 'brilliant' moments these days than Rooney. The point is Rooney rarely smashes teams the way Messi and Ronaldo do. He rarely does that to anyone these days. Yes he plays well, but frightening defenders everytime he picks up the ball, it just doesn't happen anymore.

My point is that you naturally expect a quality player's game to mature as he gets older and enters the prime of his career. But there's no reason for the magic to just almost completely exit from his game. Look at the top players in world football, they all turn it on every other game. Rooney if he did the same would be in the top 3 footballers in the world. He's that talented.

Producing moments of magic.
Having a frightening long range shot.
Having genuine venom behind pretty much every effort.
Being able to beat defenders consistently.

These are elements of his game that have diminished. And for all his improvements, you say he's maximized his attributes. I disagree. These were some of his stronger attributes when he was younger. IMO Rooney is so talented that he's still a quality player despite having regressed on some of his major strengths, and improved on some (heading, goal poaching, decision making) of his weaker areas. And I think maximizing ones potential lies in improving your weaker areas but also keeping your strengths strong.
 
some of the stuff in this video he just doesn't seem to do anymore which is a huge shame, what could have been...

NOTE: this video is made by a everton fan so quite alot of bitterness



I don't know where all this Judas shit comes from, Everton aren't even our rivals.
 
Rooney is only 23. Let's give him a few years to rediscover himself, or something like that

The thing is, it's going to be very hard for him to discover himself if fergie insists on playing him everywhere except his favourite position. I know people would argue that this season fergie's playing him in his proper striking position, but then again it seems berbatov is the one who's dropping deep and not really rooney.
 
The thing is, it's going to be very hard for him to discover himself if fergie insists on playing him everywhere except his favourite position. I know people would argue that this season fergie's playing him in his proper striking position, but then again it seems berbatov is the one who's dropping deep and not really rooney.

I agree. Its evident that Rooney is more comfortable in dropping deep and exploit spaces left by the main striker. He is more direct than the typical link man so the striker must be able to drop deep too and create spaces for other to exploit (like for example Saha) but the main striker should not be Rooney but the other striker.
 
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