SARS CoV-2 coronavirus / Covid-19 (No tin foil hat silliness please)

Off-topic, but my father was with the 8th Army during the amphibious landings in Italy. They got off the boat into the water, he fell over. When he got back up, the two men either side of him had already been shot.

Ah, when being clumsy works in your favour.
 
Off-topic, but my father was with the 8th Army during the amphibious landings in Italy. They got off the boat into the water, he fell over. When he got back up, the two men either side of him had already been shot.
A lottery but of the nastiest sort. It wasn't Salerno he was at was it? I think that was the worst. Denis Healey was beachmaster at Salerno I believe.
 
Who would think that Dubya would be proved right when he gave that speech about pandemics? He was spot on and now the US is suffering because Dubya was ignored on this very subject.
 
Herd immunity will take approx 80% infected or vaccinated. So aiming for that without a vaccine is madness.

There is no reason to suspect we won't develop immunity although immunity to viruses tends to be shorter term than for bacteria. I don't think there have been proven reinfections although it is quite likely if people have compromised immune systems.

You don't think is achievable without a vaccine if it is controlled?
 
And that is how you feck all the work done on the quarantine. Letting the none essential workers back to work. Barcelona metro this morning


EVdoL_3WAAERMBl.jpg
 
Herd immunity will take approx 80% infected or vaccinated. So aiming for that without a vaccine is madness.

There is no reason to suspect we won't develop immunity although immunity to viruses tends to be shorter term than for bacteria. I don't think there have been proven reinfections although it is quite likely if people have compromised immune systems.

Isn't 50% the goal, then the decline starts ?
 
Who would think that Dubya would be proved right when he gave that speech about pandemics? He was spot on and now the US is suffering because Dubya was ignored on this very subject.

Going by that recent NYT article which triggered Trump it actually seems like several people/institutions in the US system realized the danger of this virus quite early and suggested strong measures. It looks like the failure occured at the top of the pyramid.
 
A lottery but of the nastiest sort. It wasn't Salerno he was at was it? I think that was the worst. Denis Healey was beachmaster at Salerno I believe.
I'm not sure, that was the only specific thing he ever mentioned about the war. I only found out more details after he died, as he kept every piece of paper he was ever given by the Army. He was in North Africa, he had the Italy Star among his medals and also had a Bulgarian ID card - I think the 8th Army were there in 1945. He was a motorcycle despatch rider, a dangerous job.He never even took his medals out of the box they'd been sent in.

It makes you wonder how things have changed when folk are moaning about not being able to go to a pub for a month or two. It's not a lot to ask of people.
 
Lots of people out and about over Easter around here but mostly groups of two from what I could tell and police seemed pretty lenient in general. Tracking data shows that the mobility of the population has been steadily increasing. This photo pretty much sums it up:

frankfurt-park-kontrollen-100~_t-1586611962174_v-16to7.jpg

Current measures are in effect until 19 April with government expected to annouce some relaxations this week, such as a partial opening of schools.
 
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I'm not sure, that was the only specific thing he ever mentioned about the war. I only found out more details after he died, as he kept every piece of paper he was ever given by the Army. He was in North Africa, he had the Italy Star among his medals and also had a Bulgarian ID card - I think the 8th Army were there in 1945. He was a motorcycle despatch rider, a dangerous job.He never even took his medals out of the box they'd been sent in.

It makes you wonder how things have changed when folk are moaning about not being able to go to a pub for a month or two. It's not a lot to ask of people.
Sounds like he led an interesting life.

my father-in-law, who is 81, has led a very interesting life too. Left home when he was young after his mum died, no one would look after him so he came down to England from Scotland, joined the army. Ended up in the SAS, then the firebrigade for 30 years and after retirement then became a driver for a few years for the cabinet office. Doesn’t talk much about his army years at all. He was on duty the night there was the horrific fire in the London Underground in the 80s? Doesn’t talk about that much either.
Does talk a bit more about a few of the scallywag MPs he used to ferry about
 
Sounds like he led an interesting life.

my father-in-law, who is 81, has led a very interesting life too. Left home when he was young after his mum died, no one would look after him so he came down to England from Scotland, joined the army. Ended up in the SAS, then the firebrigade for 30 years and after retirement then became a driver for a few years for the cabinet office. Doesn’t talk much about his army years at all. He was on duty the night there was the horrific fire in the London Underground in the 80s? Doesn’t talk about that much either.
Does talk a bit more about a few of the scallywag MPs he used to ferry about
I bet he'd have some great stories to tell. I always wanted to know more from dad, but I think the experience affected him profoundly and we knew never to ask anything, even as kids. He was no adventurer, he was a placid, bookish man, but they had no choice back then.
 
Lots of people out and about over Easter around here but mostly groups of two from what I could tell and police seemed pretty lenient in general. Tracking data shows that the mobility of the population has been steadily increasing. This photo pretty much sums it up:

frankfurt-park-kontrollen-100~_t-1586611962174_v-16to7.jpg
Wow... How do these people not feel paranoid as feck?! Not one mask? Was this definitely taken this weekend?
 
And that is how you feck all the work done on the quarantine. Letting the none essential workers back to work. Barcelona metro this morning


EVdoL_3WAAERMBl.jpg
That picture is scary. This is on a bank holiday too i take it? I hope to god this doesn't trigger another spike in the next 2 to 3 weeks. Is this relaxing of lockdown nationwide or just in Barcelona?
 
That picture is scary. This is on a bank holiday too i take it? I hope to god this doesn't trigger another spike in the next 2 to 3 weeks. Is this relaxing of lockdown nationwide or just in Barcelona?
Once the Gov't says that people can return to work, I assume that they will no longer pay the Furlough money so many people will have no choice
 
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Wow... How do these people not feel paranoid as feck?! Not one mask? Was this definitely taken this weekend?

Photo was taken in Frankfurt on Friday. But you would have seen similar scenes in all cities across the country. I haven't seen too many people wearing them but making face masks mandatory in some places (such as public transport) is one of the things being discussed at the moment.

Actually, they are mandatory in some places (but this is up to local governments and city councils) such as farmers markets. But even then, it is very inconsistent and in my city for example this only applies to the biggest of these markets:
 
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How can they allow rags like the Express to ask questions in a serious forum?
Because no-one is asking any serious questions anyway.

I stopped watching these briefings. Unless things have changed in the past few days the papers have been like they are owned by Boris and his ministers.
 
That picture is scary. This is on a bank holiday too i take it? I hope to god this doesn't trigger another spike in the next 2 to 3 weeks. Is this relaxing of lockdown nationwide or just in Barcelona?

Today there are people that are on holiday, others no. Tomorrow will be worse. Nationwide. Today they allowed companies to start working again (no bars, no restaurants and so)

Was it completely empty a week back?

Only non essential workers were allowed to work a week ago and yeah, I saw some pictures with the metro empty
 
The issue is more that it's a drug used for diseases like Lupus and there has been reports that some patients struggle to get it, all of that because a french doctor tried to make a name for himself. Clinical trials make total sense but the way he goes on twitter and sell his "research" is having bad consequences, he forced many countries to allocate a lot of money and energy on something that is showing little effect but because the press made it a miracle drug, everyone tries to debunk/confirm it in the most conclusive way.
https://www.lepoint.fr/sante/corona...raoult-12-04-2020-2371068_40.php#xtor=CS3-190

This study from the Montpellier CHU looks to try to go one step further and also include patient who are in advanced stages of diseases and with complications. We'll know soon enough I guess if Raoult is a misunderstood genius or a real fraud.
 
Because no-one is asking any serious questions anyway.

I stopped watching these briefings. Unless things have changed in the past few days the papers have been like they are owned by Boris and his ministers.

They pretty much are.
 
https://www.lepoint.fr/sante/corona...raoult-12-04-2020-2371068_40.php#xtor=CS3-190

This study from the Montpellier CHU looks to try to go one step further and also include patient who are in advanced stages of diseases and with complications. We'll know soon enough I guess if Raoult is a misunderstood genius or a real fraud.

Raoult is a fraud but the study itself deserves to be done more seriously. The example that you gave is only a part of the Discovery program, several other CHUs have already started their trials.
 
Money. Countries will crumble if this goes on for ages.


Yep. Unfortunately guys, wake up and realise that very soon the vast majority of countries on the planet are going to be in the position where they have no choice. Remember that movie about the guy trapped under a rock who had to cut off his own arm with a knife to survive? That is what is coming, deal with it. If you're vulnerable/at risk and/or terrified of leaving the house, you won't be forced to. You might lose your job. It will be on you to weigh up the risk/reward of that situation and whether you can survive without one until you do feel comfortable entering the real world again. Those who are not at risk will be encouraged to re-enter the real world slowly but steadily. Otherwise, the planet crumbles - simple as that.
 
Yep. Unfortunately guys, wake up and realise that very soon the vast majority of countries on the planet are going to be in the position where they have no choice. Remember that movie about the guy trapped under a rock who had to cut off his own arm with a knife to survive? That is what is coming, deal with it. If you're vulnerable/at risk and/or terrified of leaving the house, you won't be forced to. You might lose your job. It will be on you to weigh up the risk/reward of that situation and whether you can survive without one until you do feel comfortable entering the real world again. Those who are not at risk will be encouraged to re-enter the real world slowly but steadily. Otherwise, the planet crumbles - simple as that.

Thing is, you can still keep to social distancing if this happens, and it's totally upto you. Shopping would be difficult, but I think shops could still enforce it as they have been, but other than that, it's your choice to goto a pub, it's your choice to goto the park, it's your choice to do whatever.

The struggle will be for those who are working and can't socially distance, however I think companies will try their hardest to social distance in the work place for a good while yet.

Personally I'd probably take a risk of going golfing, but would stay away from the pubs and restaurants for a good while. Probably wouldn't have people round the house either for a while.
 
Yep. Unfortunately guys, wake up and realise that very soon the vast majority of countries on the planet are going to be in the position where they have no choice. Remember that movie about the guy trapped under a rock who had to cut off his own arm with a knife to survive? That is what is coming, deal with it. If you're vulnerable/at risk and/or terrified of leaving the house, you won't be forced to. You might lose your job. It will be on you to weigh up the risk/reward of that situation and whether you can survive without one until you do feel comfortable entering the real world again. Those who are not at risk will be encouraged to re-enter the real world slowly but steadily. Otherwise, the planet crumbles - simple as that.
The problem there is, what happens when the rules are relaxed and people start going back to work and school etc, then the infections rise again, sharper this time. Obviously it'll be lockdown again or just ride it out. Either way, you're either going to cripple the economy or cripple the NHS. So what do we do? Let everyone out, go the herd immunity route, face a massive influx of patients into hospitals, struggle and crumble under the strain, leading to maybe hundreds of thousands of deaths, lots of people sick and off work? It's a tough choice, and the economy is going to suffer either way.
 
The problem there is, what happens when the rules are relaxed and people start going back to work and school etc, then the infections rise again, sharper this time. Obviously it'll be lockdown again or just ride it out. Either way, you're either going to cripple the economy or cripple the NHS. So what do we do? Let everyone out, go the herd immunity route, face a massive influx of patients into hospitals, struggle and crumble under the strain, leading to maybe hundreds of thousands of deaths, lots of people sick and off work? It's a tough choice, and the economy is going to suffer either way.

I think some countries will be able to keep the infection rate low enough, even whilst opening up schools and shops.
Social distancing needs to continue though, for months.
Locking people in isn’t the only way to seriously slow the spread.