SARS CoV-2 coronavirus / Covid-19 (No tin foil hat silliness please)
- Thread starter Don't Kill Bill
- Start date
It's either self isolate at home or go to hospital.
The first anti-vaxxers didn't get mumps. But as herd immunity dropped, they did.
You get figures by sampling, not by testing everyone. We don’t need to know the exact figure, we just need ranges with 95% certainty.
Shouting eugenics doesn't make you a humanitarian, or right. It just makes you look dumb.
Yes. Because we had a vaccine that provided heard immunity.
Try again.
One virus where we developed heard immunity naturally without a vaccine.
It shouldn't be hard. I don;t mean just the UK.
I'm talking anywhere, any humans.
Can anyone answer this please ?
Again.
I’ve read that and most arguments are not convincing to say the least. I specifically said if you go for schools etc. closure you go for a total lockdown as well (which UK is not prepared to do). Otherwise, I defeats the purpose of isolation as children and all the rest of the people would still interact outside a lot (as pointed out by the link you gave).
If 80% are getting it with 'mild' symptoms and self isolating at home, and are being told not to even report they are ill, how exactly do you think you are getting 95% certainty?
Vaccines work the same way as catching then recovering from a disease.
Diseases that are isolated by herd immunity disappear from the face of the earth. If you want examples, every single disease that ever died out.
I'm fine with that.
I care more about innocent, vulnerable people being chucked under the bus to save the Torys a few quid than I do about looking smart on a messageboard.
We'll agree to disagree, best of luck to you mate.
Statistics.
That's a pure guess. Evidence is they controlled it quickly and have had hardly any new cases for over a week now.
This is my question on the WHO approved method. What happens to economies if we go into a cycle of complete shutdowns for 18 months whilst we wait for a vaccine? This will result in mass business closures and mass job losses. This will have a massive societal impact and cause significant social unrest that I just don't think the WHO's singular vision has any comprehension of. They are not in the business of running economies and societies.
You could view the UK approach as utilitarian in that its seeking to protect the society as a whole whilst accepting that loss of life cannot be avoided and is a trade off for that. Of course this is unpalatable for many but the alternative could reap much worse consequences e.g. mass poverty, social unrest and governments becoming more authoritarian to maintain control.
They don't know how contagious it is but we seem to know that it is during the first symptomatic days that you are the most contagious, there are also cases of asymptomatic infected, here you have a report on the CDC about a case in China, it was also mentioned by the medical team at Montpellier. You can also read page 11 of that report from WHO.
And to not be misleading, it is a minority that is totally asymptomatic, it seems that even currently asymptomatic patients eventually develop some symptoms but again since they are not specific to Covid-19, it's very difficult to precisely spot cases without testing due to latency and the fact that it's not that remarkable.
They're still in social and economic lockdown. That's not sustainable.
It's guess work to an extent. But we know that the virus spreads in the absence of a lockdown, so in other ways it's empirical.
Maybe learn what that word means.
If you are ignoring 80% of cases on purpose, you cannot have an accurate understanding of the situation. It is the antithesis of a statistical approach.
If I responded to this properly, it would only embarrass you. For your sake, I won't.
Maybe look up 'confidence' in a statistics textbook.
This is just laughable.
We don't develop herd immunity to these kinds of viruses.
That is why it took a vaccine to eliminate polio, rubella and so on. Why we need flu jabs every year.
We tried just letting people get all of those things. We kept dying, because we don't develop antibodies.
People are getting coronavirus more than once. This is why.
Polio has an R0 of 5-7 and a mortality rate of 5-15%. COVID-19 is not close to those in either sense.
If a new Polio, with a similar R0 and mortality rate that we had no immunity to, and it got this far, we’d be fecked anyway.
So answer the question.
Tell me, which similar, mutating virus have we developed herd immunity to, without using a vaccine.
Thanks for this, I'd quite like to have a thread focused on what actual experts are saying so I can ignore most of the squabbling.
This in particular puts it in a way I hadn't considered, and the government should be trying harder to communicate. We need massive behavioural change for a significant time to come.
Thanks, dude. Before my current job, I was meant to work with Alzheimer's patients but now I'm in the IT industry.
There are not going flick a switch though are they? They will slowly reintroduce and any rise in infections will lead back to lockdown. They will not return to the highest levels of infection again - If they do then we are talking Armageddon but again no evidence supports that right now.
This. This is exactly what an infectious agent expert said on Joe Rogan.
Should those of us with a lower risk of being critically affected by Covid-19 stop washing our hands and start licking door handles?
Ten more dead in UK, total now at 21.
It's an absolute joke. Anyone that's contributed to this deserves a smack in the dick and gob. They should then be publicly shamed and punished with a thousand coughs to the face.
That's exactly the point. WHO doesn't care about economics or social impact, they suggest actions purely based on their expertise and knowledge how to at least control the virus spread, not necessarily stop it completely so I would trust them rather than governments whose primary goal is to keep the tax money coming in. Every country will take different action. Majority countries have chosen to take a hit on economy in order to stop it from becoming completely out of control, while UK chosen to just let the fire burn and hope for the best, decision based very much on financial aspects. Right now it looks to be an absolutely crazy and selfish approach and reminds me of movies where there is always 1 guy making a stupid decision after a stupid decision. Time will tell.
The article discusses the wider issues. Hibberd eventually concluding that it's a workable, if risky, solution (and a more feasible one for the UK than Singapore's would be).
It's an interview that presents both sides of an argument. Your 'key sentence' ignores one of those sides, and therefore can't be 'key'. If that's all you take away from it, you'd might as well be crossing out half the content with a marker pen.
There absolutely is such thing as key sentence. How can arguments from other side hold any water when it’s main element is currently baseless?
This is encouraging from an Irish perspective.
Rhyme, you aren’t coming across as leftist. You’re coming across asmore prejudist, intolerant and extremist than anyone I’ve seen online discussing this. The further you move left and the further you move right, the closer you get due to the horseshoe effect of dictatorships. You’re describing people as Tory with the same flippancy and distain as the far right describe things as Jewish.
I don't think it is exactly the point though. The economy sustains us all, at a basic level its how you obtain the means to feed your children. If it completely collapses then we are fecked. Going into numerous full societal shutdowns over 18 months will have much bigger economic impacts than I think people are realising. It isn't simply a public health issue, it's much bigger than that. There's going to be a big economic hit from just the two month impact we are currently experiencing. Each shutdown will be more crippling than the last.
@Dante what you’re essentially saying let’s slaughter a huge amount of people in order to see how our immune system reacts to it on reoccurring basis? Should we maybe wait and see first before making such decisions?
Do you think large economic and societal impacts can cause death and illness too? What good would there be surviving corona but starving to death?
Seems Iran are intent on completely fecking themselves.
We need a dramatic change in strategy and fast
A significant issue here is lack of media pressure. Imagine how the press would have treated a labour government with these figures and an equivalent strategy