Not from scratch. The South African variant is the most resistant so far and every vaccine tested on it has at least given some protection. So a booster dose with a tweaked vaccine should give excellent cover. Plus I think there’s only so many ways the virus can change to avoid existing immunity. Otherwise it will change so much it might no longer have the same effects (i.e. being highly contagious/making us sick etc)
SARS CoV-2 coronavirus / Covid-19 (No tin foil hat silliness please)
- Thread starter Don't Kill Bill
- Start date
Not from scratch. The South African variant is the most resistant so far and every vaccine tested on it has at least given some protection. So a booster dose with a tweaked vaccine should give excellent cover. Plus I think there’s only so many ways the virus can change to avoid existing immunity. Otherwise it will change so much it might no longer have the same effects (i.e. being highly contagious/making us sick etc)
I heard on BBC radio today reports coming in that those suffering long term covid effects have found quick relief from those symptoms once vaccinated. Anecdotal evidence so far as no study has been done but the numbers reporting relief has been encouraging apparently
They didn't skip the animal trials, but some of the animal trials ran alongside human trials. In particular phase 1/2 volunteers were receiving the first test doses of vaccine while the research team were doing animal trials.
Animals used during testing included mice (toxicity, dosage and mutagenicity). Chimps and macaques were used to check dosage, antibody response and efficacy (yes - that does mean they deliberately tried to give the animals covid)
In diseases with known human/animal correlates - that is where the animal seems to respond to the virus and the vaccine the same way humans do - they can do a lot more of the efficacy testing on animals. You can test flu jabs on ferrets for example. But before you can do that you have to know for sure that a jab that's effective in ferrets/mice/guinea pigs or whatever is also effective and safe in humans.
We don't have those known animal comparisons for covid, so we had to have clinical trials with tens thousands of people getting the vaccines, and wait for them to get infected in the course of their daily lives instead. It's those large scale human trials that provided the safety and efficacy data for the authorisation.
The long covid groups I'm on have been saying this for months. It's not always successful but like you say anecdotally it has worked.
I called my GP to get my daughter a jab to help her out of all this pain and suffering. The cnuts aren't interested because they're following the government priority group guideline and doing zero groundwork themselves. And her bloodwork is clear so nothing they can do. I don't use the word cnuts lightly in this instance.
Shit, what a pain. Hope you can get your daughter a jab soon. I wish that there was some capacity for doctors etc to operate with the guidelines but also have the ability to act where exceptional circumstances require outside the guidelines thinking.
This is exactly where the government needs two way collaboration with GPs to be collating and then offering pathways back up the chain. Even if it's rejected by those higher up. So far for the past year GPs (the 5 or so that I know) have done the opposite. They try to convince you it's in your head, and when you strongly push back the best they can do is shrug their shoulders and say they're following guidelines.
For my daughter I'm waiting for a welcome letter to one of the newly formed Covid clinics. Been waiting for six weeks.
Are they accepting people at long Covid clinics without any evidence they’ve ever had Covid? I’d have thought serological evidence of past infection (or a history of positive PCR test) would be among the main criteria for referral?
My daughter tested negative for anti bodies. I asked the GPs if this means she could have something else (lupus, etc?). Quiet. Then they referred me/her to the long covid clinic.
I think the delay in any response is due to the clinics and their resources being sidetracked with the large number of covid cases over Christmas and New Year, understandably. Now that has calmed down quite significantly I'm hoping things progress.
Disappointing news on convalescent plasma.
Ok then. If you’ve been referred then you should get an appointment. 6 weeks isn’t that long a wait to be seen about a chronic condition. And I think you’re right about the recent surge delaying NHS outpatient services.
Interesting. That's consistent with the Eli Lilly trial on monoclonal antibodies conducted in December on hospitalised patients - minimal/zero benefit.
Their other trial, with an antibody mix prescribed to newly diagnosed covid patients, has had better results.
https://www.fiercepharma.com/pharma...-combo-cuts-hospitalizations-and-deaths-by-87
There's a similar trial underway in the UK using a product from AZ.
Nothing but facts. Locking down a virus with 99% survival rate is going to create a massive bigger hole for all of us in the future. If you thought mental health was getting bad before 2020 just wait a couple years.
Ok Rafa.
Many out of how many? It's widely accepted that most who get covid experience little to no symptoms. I feel sorry for your neighbour and all the other outliers, I feel very bad for those who suffered and died from this virus.
I know one person who died from this virus, personally. Unfortunately he was obese and diabetic (similar to my dad). What may also have added to his death is he had a bad life style (drinking lots of booze, smoking, not getting enough sleep, etc). I know 25+ people who got covid in my circle (including relatives over the age of 60 years old) who are thankfully all fine now. It was a bad couple of days but they're all living their lives normally now.
I'm sorry that covid exists and impacts a small amount of people much more harshly than the majority, but treating this disease one year later as if it was the Spanish Flu of 1918 is wrong.
Last edited:
That's all you can add to what I said? Or are you bothered because I said it has a 99% survival rate. I know that bothers a lot of people when that fact is mentioned so I don't blame you. The covid effects I believe are real if you had it, but I don't believe they're as widely existent as they say it is. From an anecdotal experience of knowing again more than 25 people who have had it, none have had any lingering effects.
Covid is so politicized that we can't even have an open and honest debate anymore without being labelled a conspiracy theorist.
The Spanish flu killed just over 2% of the people it infected. Based purely on people you know, covid is killing 4% of the people who catch it. Not a very convincing argument that covid is less dangerous than Spanish flu.
Yeah, there were a few tabloid stories forecasting a baby boom based on the premise that more time shacked up = more baby-making, which a lot of people seemed to take at face value despite it being completely at odds with the psychology of sex, contraception, parenthood...but economists were predicting a big decline months ago.
I wonder if there are stats on single mother pregnancies. Presumably less dating has reduced that stat but it's a complete guess on my part.
I think the bit you're probably missing is that Spanish Flu was in a time when science was a long way behind where it is now and it was difficult / slow to get news across counties never mind continents.
Covid has been kept in check precisely because of the rules in place and if they weren't there it could have killed a similar number to Spanish Flu. You can't really say "compare the mortality numbers to Spanish Flu" when the scenario is completely different and if anything it shows why lockdown and vaccines are important because look what happens when that wasn't possible to the extent of now.
Think it could be longer than 6 weeks , I was referred in August and still no appointment.
God yeah, all new arguments there.“BARELY DISCUSSED” my hole.
Blatant fishing. The worry is how many fries like Ronaldo's Mum it catches. In this day and age of intellectual advancements.
Maybe depressed and concerned people are less confident in the future...
I think you are right
US Birth rates
United Kingdom
In the United Kingdom the baby boom occurred in two waves. After a short first wave of the baby boom during the war and immediately after, peaking in 1946, the United Kingdom experienced a second wave during the 1960s, with a peak in births in 1964.
Ireland
The baby boom in Ireland began during the state of emergency which existed in the country during the Second World War.Laws on contraception were restrictive in Ireland and the baby boom was more prolonged in this country. Secular decline of fertility began only in the 1970s and particularly after the legalization of contraception in 1979. The marriage boom was even more prolonged and did not recede until the 1980s.
Western Europe
France and Austria experienced the strongest baby booms in Europe. In contrast to most other countries, the French and Austrian baby booms were driven primarily by an increase in marital fertility.In the French case, pronatalist policies were an important factor in this increase.[35] Weaker baby booms occurred in Germany, Switzerland, Belgium and the Netherlands
Southern Europe
Baby boom was absent or not very strong in Italy, Greece, Portugal and Spain. There were however regional variations in Spain with a considerable baby boom occurring in such regions as Catalonia
Eastern Europe
There was a strong baby boom in Czechoslovakia, but it was weak or absent in Poland, Bulgaria, Russia, Estonia and Lithuania, partly as a result of the Soviet famine of 1946–47.
Nordic countries
The baby boom was very strong in Norway and Iceland, significant in Finland, moderate in Sweden and relatively weak in Denmark.[17]
Asia and Africa
Along with the developed countries of the West, many developing countries (among them Morocco, China and Turkey) also witnessed the baby boom.The baby boom in Mongolia, one of such developing countries, is probably explained by improvement in health and living standards related to the establishment of a socialist society.
Latin America
The baby boom also occurred in most Latin American countries (with the exception of Brazil, Argentina and Uruguay). An increase in fertility was driven by a decrease in childlessness and, in most nations, by an increase in parity progression to second, third and fourth births. Its magnitude was largest in Costa Rica and Panama.
Source: wiki
Yes but he was fat and didn’t sleep enough, you idiot. It’s completely different for everyone else because they’re thin and get enough sleep.
There’s more than 2 million dead because of covid, I wouldn’t be so dismissive. World economies don’t make a habit of screening themselves for no reason.
Are people more or less unhealthy now? Obviously back then there was little in the way of sanitary practices but people weren't really bloated fatties and made of sterner stuff. Are we weaker now because we have caned antibiotics? Does modern medicine and sanitation allow the weaker to survive and propagate?
Isn't the estimation range for Spanish Flu insane though? you literally have people suggesting fatalities from ~20m-100m
People are far healthier now. A big part of the reason Spanish Flu's second wave was so deadly was because it first took hold in the malnourished and exhausted soldiers of World War 1.
Christ. I went down the rabbit hole of reading threads posted by other posters. Humanity really depresses me. Why does everything have to be related to governments conning people and conspiracy theories? When did the general public fall so far? Or has it always been like that and Twitter and FB just expose them more to a wider audience? It’s very depressing to see common sense is gone. One young girl was saying smugly that she doesn’t wear a mask to pick up her kid from school and that everyone else is sheep. She being congratulated for being a ‘hero’ and “on the right side of humanity”.
back in reality we’ve had a teacher hospitalised for weeks and now suffering with long covid, and a few other teachers had covid too. No doubt thanks to parents like her
Hmm, 181 deaths in the UK today compared to 242 last Thursday. A bit disappointing, I was hoping for a low hundred maybe even double digits. The downward trajectory could be naturally plateauing since we've reached low figures.
If you're looking for the (almost) full vaccine effect covering the full 70+ group, gives it another couple of weeks. Most of those dying now caught the virus in February.
Covid cases back up again today and with the return of schools it seems inevitable we're going to see an uptick as we reopen without having the numbers under control.
Literally 1.5million extra tests done in the last 3 days, and the 7-day average ticked up by 0.5%. The fact it's such a tiny increase should be reassuring (also suggests the false-positive rate of these LFTs is probably a bit less than the 1 in 1000 being bandied about)
Yeah, definitely. Plus, as @Grinner alludes to we’re comparing two very different populations, then and now. It’s a pointless comparison anyway. We know for a fact the absolute nightmare this poses for our health services every time society has eased off lockdowns over the last 12 months so anyone still spouting bollox along the lines of “it’s just flu” is either totally agenda driven, with no interest in understanding the reality of the situation, or dumb as a bag of rocks.
Is there any reason for these extra tests other than more people presenting with symptoms?