Shocking, isn’t it?
Hubris & selfishness will keep spurring this pandemic along until true lockdown measures are enacted, those with actual punitive consequences for rule breakers.
SARS CoV-2 coronavirus / Covid-19 (No tin foil hat silliness please)
- Thread starter Don't Kill Bill
- Start date
Hubris & selfishness will keep spurring this pandemic along until true lockdown measures are enacted, those with actual punitive consequences for rule breakers.
Yes, the people we should be really sorry for are the very elderly and those who are terminally-ill, who may not have much time left even without Covid. If you're 20-something and healthy this is just a blip in your life, as you have decades still to come when everything will be back to normal.
I'm going to be a boomer now, but I wonder what everyone did during the last war when all the men were sent away for years and years, with no internet, telephones or anything other than the occasional little letter.
The actions of the government negate the efforts of the people. Time and time again.
To re-phrase this slightly, how many lives are you happy to sacrifice for your life? If just one person has to die so that you can have a piss up is that okay? This is purposefully inflamatory, but this virus can't be considered at an individual basis, that's not how it works. It thrives on our sociability.
Through no fault of their own, some individuals have had their lives shortened by this virus. Not only that, their families haven't been able to grieve with limited funeral allowances. Imagine that - someone you love is dieing, but you cant see them - not only that, but then you can't even get together and have the support of friends and family after they have died. Imagine you're one of these people then imagine seeing someone decide they're "done with lockdown" becasue they've had to sit at home and work.
Healthcare, care workers, teachers, supermarket staff, delivery drivers all have had to work throughout this pandemic. These people have been purposely putting themselves at risk for us in the general population so that we can have the privilege of being able to shield away from this virus.
You are allowed to make your own decisions and everyone has their own position that they are coming from. Just try to understand all contexts. Please.
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Do the actions of the government negate the actions of the people time & time again?
Or should people be held accountable for their own actions?
Remember to tell everyone with mental health problems staying at home to give it a rest, they’ve got the internet ffs
You’re demanding a full lockdown aren’t you? Who is it that has the power to do that?
Jesus
While you’re at it you may as well say feck people’s parents, feck their grandparents, feck the NHS, feck the teachers, feck the key workers....
Not only does Italy have a higher death rate, the death rate per capita is higher. Belgiums is over 50% higher than ours. In the early months comparisons were being made between Germany and the UK. If I remember correctly, it was suggested the lower number of deaths to infection ratio was due to Germanys health systems handing of the crisis. As I understand it, the main reason for the comparatively low number of deaths was due to a younger demographic making up the majority of those infected. In the UK the death rate was aided by a calamitous decision to send untested patients back into care homes, by the UK Government during a pandemic resulting in a tsunami of infections and death.
One important lesson I've learned during all this, is that sets of statistics taken in isolation, do not tell the entire story.
Yup. Lockdown was meant to be for 3 weeks. It’s gone on too long, the virus is here so we just have to live with it.
I think the UK's response has generally been poor throughout the pandemic. That said, I don't think it's an outlier in Europe or anything - its outcomes are broadly similar to most other large European countries. It's on the worse end of the spectrum, but it isn't some wild exception in the data.
I'd love to see the overlap between people who have spent decades shitting on mental health as made up suddenly are those who are suddenly very concerned about mental health now they have to wank and watch Netflix all day.
Christ.
I'm curious, what exactly do you think happens here in Ireland with the HSE if we just "live with it"?
Ignoring it isnt living with it. Its ignoring it.
This is what living with it looks like
Look - You staying vigilant to the guidelines is doing jack shit, the sooner you realise this the better for your own sanity. 8 months i have been hidden away from people i would love to see. Nobody else is sticking to the guidelines, so why should you? go out, see your family, just be sensible and keep a good distance. Its highly probably that you are not going to infect anybody. I would stake my mortgage on it. Even less probable that you are actually going to kill somebody.
8 months of my life i have been tucked away, ''saving lives'' apparently. Shit I'm a hero. Oh no.... wait a minute. I wasn't going to kill anybody anyway.
How many of you do-gooders went out for a meal during the eat out to help out month? If you did then you are completely hypocritical arguing against someone popping round their mams for a brew.
Just because Boris said you can doesn't make it right, much the same, when Boris says you can't, doesn't mean its wrong!
Whats the point in following the guidelines regarding seeing people when at a guess 50% of the people in the UK are not doing?
Christ, you're insufferable.
As aggravating as lockdowns are, it's made worse when you see someone who is lucky enough to be in a much more fortunate position than large swathes of the population whine because he is expected to follow the same rules as everyone else, seemingly unconcerned that not doing so will directly harm those around him.
Added to that, you claim we're no closer to a resolution even as vaccines are being delivered to people, you claim lockdowns don't work even as you fail to understand what they're supposed to achieve and you put forward a POV so obnoxious that it has prompted one of Redcafe's least intelligent posters to agree with you. None of that makes you look good.
I get that it's a strain (because it's a strain we're all going through), I get that there are mental health issues to consider (because guess what, a lot of us are going through those too) and I get that circumstances for you are tough (even as they're much tougher for many others who continue to show due care for those around them). None of that entitles people to act like selfish prats with little intelligence or self-awareness though. Your posts make you sound like an immature child.
It’s insane. They don’t care at this point. There are so many videos that show the full extent.
It will be the 20 year olds who can't find work again and pay the national debt for the rest of their lives
I'd rather be locked up in a nice house with garden than at uni in what is essentially a large closet too.
Of course previous generations went off to die in war so I'm not saying it's "woe is the 20 year olds" but I feel for them. I feel for everyone.
Jog on. That’s the biggest pile of self indulgent, selfish turf waffle I’ve read all year. Now do one
We all have to choose our own moral code.
I'm not going to say you can't see your nan. You are right everyone is being the rules and everyone thinks that they are doing is right because other people are doing it to and worse.
I'd ask you to please avoid the house party piss ups. See your mum. See your mates outdoors. Have girlfriends round. But avoid the house parties.
No judgement here
Not demanding a full lockdown, but it may occur if people can’t act responsibly. It’s not out of the equation if people’s actions don’t have consequences. There’s steps to take before a full, true lockdown.
Christ almighty, what fecking blather.
It’s willful mental deficiency like this regarding the pandemic that will keep the tragedy ongoing.
I’m not in the UK nor am I from there, so the specifics you regale here aren’t germane to me. But, if I had lived there, in no way would I have gone out during that time. Any person with a modicum of common sense would have sensed that it was a horrible idea, the eat out campaign. Trying to back engineer blame on the government for a person’s lack of using common sense is comically tragic.
But some people have shown they can’t take responsibility on numerous occasions. And those who can take responsibility can only do so much to effect the impact of others. So what do the Government do? They continue to tell people to use common sense. They are the only ones who can influence the behaviour of the masses with the decisions they make and they have continually shirked their responsibility to do that and made policy decisions that have continued to exacerbate the issues.
If you had a child who kept stabbing themselves with scissors would you keep giving them scissors?
Well, I hope for your sake you don't kill your mum, but it's incredibly selfish of you to seemingly be wanting to try.
That’s somewhat puerile to think that only governments can influence behavior of the masses. It’s a convenient excuse or rationalization to back engineer to limit ones own responsibility or culpability.
It’s not as though virtually every person on this planet doesn’t understand the issues pertaining to this pandemic. This isn’t 1918 with the flu. The world is far more connected with instantaneous information at our fingertips. If anything, governments are not listened to by the populace when they are trying to assist the public, but will be castigated when the public feels encumbered by what the government tries to do.
And, to think that any government could & would have played the cards totally perfect in this pandemic is also utterly laughable. It’s where the governments fail that the common sense of the populace needs to pick up the slack.
Edit - posted this earlier. I am curious as to how someone like yourself would shoehorn in governmental fault here & absolve this poor, obviously put-upon couple...
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...d-United-fight-complete-chaos-passengers.html
Sure, it’s anecdotal, but exemplary of the problem we face.
Well if anything, this thread has certainly weeded out a few selfish, mindless, simpletons....
Definite illumination of the like minded.
To be fair to SiRed, I think he's right to be fed up. I don't agree with him at all but it's a sentiment that's running wild now.
I'm wondering where the actual government support will begin for those who don't fit their bracket of home-owning, full-time employed folk. It feels like all talk about the mental health implications - of which a lot of precarious members of society will be suffering from - have gone unmentioned for ages.
I work in this area myself and there's this desperate sense of it all; almost like the experts aren't convinced anymore by the short-term suggestions we were given. Likewise, the training scheme they talked about to get people who've been made redundant/graduates into different areas.
It's very much got to a point where people are being asked to fend for themselves. Some will be responsible; others won't or will do it with bitterness.
Noodle touches on this regularly.
I'm wondering where the actual government support will begin for those who don't fit their bracket of home-owning, full-time employed folk. It feels like all talk about the mental health implications - of which a lot of precarious members of society will be suffering from - have gone unmentioned for ages.
I work in this area myself and there's this desperate sense of it all; almost like the experts aren't convinced anymore by the short-term suggestions we were given. Likewise, the training scheme they talked about to get people who've been made redundant/graduates into different areas.
It's very much got to a point where people are being asked to fend for themselves. Some will be responsible; others won't or will do it with bitterness.
Noodle touches on this regularly.
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So you don't bother to visit your mum or brothers during June, July, August and September when it was relatively safe and there were no restrictions to stop you from doing so.. You then decide to do so when there are restrictions and it is not safe to do so. I'm beginning to get this. I thought you were an idiot when all along its obviously just a cunning plan to kill your mum & siblings so that you end up with a tidy inheritance. Enjoy your winnings!
Here here
This whole year has made me wish I could flood the gene pool with chlorine
I see that the myth that ‘lockdowns don’t work’ has well and truly hit the main stream.
I’m sorry mate but it’s a false equivalency. My 27 year old self & my 25 year old girlfriend going to our 20-something year old mates is not going to kill anyone. I’m hardly going into an old folks home coughing on everyone am I?
I understand the risks, I wear the masks, I do the social distancing, I even wear gloves when I shop just in case I’m asymptomatic because I know others will be touching the same trollies/baskets, trust me, I care, but it’s unreasonable to expect people to sit in their house over Christmas whilst encouraging them to go to work in packed offices. Have you seen the trams? Packed, yet that’s ok but I can’t see my friends? Sounds like bullshit to me.
Thing is, the expert advice various governments were given at the start of the crisis underlined the fact that how governments acted and communicated with the public would directly impact adherence to whatever measures they put in place. As one group of academics and public health experts stated at the time of the Cummings incident, "there is ample evidence that effective epidemic control requires the public to trust and respect both the messages and the messengers who are advocating action". In other words this isn't opinion, it's an evidence-based description of how effective management of a pandemic works.
Obviously that doesn't remove one's own personal accountability but it also doesn't absolve governments of blame when they do things that inevitably reduce compliance on a large scale. Obviously no government will have performed perfectly, but it's not unreasonable to expect your government to perform adequately relative to those around them. It's easy to say "common sense" should pick up the slack but that's not how it actually works, as the government's own science advisors would tell them.
I don't think anyone is saying he's wrong to be fed up, or that he'd be wrong to talk about those issues if he wanted to talk about them. You'd be hard pushed to find many defenders of the government in here.
But people are obviously going to prickle at the suggestion that he's somehow absolved of his own responsibility, or be annoyed that people acting as selfishly as him are prolonging the restrictions we all face.
No, but you might go home to your parents or see your grandparents, or your mates might do the same thing. Maybe they have elderly people in their bubble, or maybe you do and shockingly, when you've all been stupid enough to infect each other you're significantly increasing the chance you are going to kill someone.
It's hardly the abstract absurdity you're pretending it is.
Shutting up sharpish here in Ireland now.
They must be seriously freaked by the cases. Couldn't even wait until like the 28th or anything
They must be seriously freaked by the cases. Couldn't even wait until like the 28th or anything
Look that’s a more reasoned post than saying “feck it I’m not wasting my 20s I’m having house parties”
and what about when they go and see a different mate who then DOES go to see his gran in a nursing home, its not just about you, or your mate decides not to be as considerate as you when he goes shopping etc? We all get it, it sucks, its hard, and not getting any easier in the short term, but it WILL get easier, and will get easier a lot quicker if more people follow the guidelines. There will always be assholes, thats life, and also, big difference in going to see your mum for a bit and behaving sensibly and "house piss ups"