We're talking about hobbers here, he acts like a 12 year old on here constantly...
Sander Berge | Signs for Fulham
- Thread starter Tom Van Persie
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik and Imran are here to talk about a frustrating 2 points dropped at Crystal Palace. They then discuss the regeneration of Old Trafford. Finally, Nik is joined by special guest Michael Statham from the Football Oranje podcast - who gives us a more in depth look at our EL opposition FC Twente, and then runs through the (many) Dutch connections currently at United.
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No creativity, no vision, slow (yeah, I know he ran fast straight forward on a 40 meter test) but really slow when he has to twist and turn that big frame and slow on those important first steps , sloppy on the ball, poor passing, has a tendency to disappear from games, weak defensively, invisible offensively, makes at least one crucial error every game he plays.
Yeah, I'm not a big fan. Not even good enough for our very poor Norwegian national team.
(And I have watched him since he was 17.)
Yeah, I'm not a big fan. Not even good enough for our very poor Norwegian national team.
(And I have watched him since he was 17.)
You shouldnt let a 12 year old live rent free with you, people might ask questions.
So you’re saying he has a chance?
Still would have to sell McTominay or Casemiro to buy Berge and it looks like McTominay is refusing to go and no one wants Casemiro.
I might agree with you but first tell me what’s a CS?
Edit - Got it, you meant Championship. The point was just because he plays for Burnley which are now in the CS, people scoff at him.
I haven't seen a price mentioned yet, it all comes down to the price IMO he is not world class but he is definitely an improvement on McT as a deep midfielder, and unless Case gets a new set of legs he is an improvement on him too (obv not in pure ability), sub £15m (ideally sub £10 +addons) I am all for this, add him and Collyer to the bench I see it as a very smart move, especially if we are a to bring in another midfielder.
I think INEOS have been smart so far, and depending on price I see this as a no-brainer, cheap, good level, young enough, provides squad depth,
I think INEOS have been smart so far, and depending on price I see this as a no-brainer, cheap, good level, young enough, provides squad depth,
a midfield Weghorst, please no.
Saudi window is open till october. The theory is they will wait till Europe window shuts then make their moves. Clubs who want to offload players who they no longer want to keep will accept lower offers for them as Saudi clubs won't compete with each other for the same players.
This one is gonna be a no for me
how would that work, we won't sell him if we can't get a replacement anymore.
I like him and am on board with the signing, based on my research on him so far.
Potentially one of those "undervalued" floor-raiser signings that we should be making more often, until we have a truly elite squad which is hard to improve by anything other than some of the best players in the world, see Real Madrid, City and Arsenal as the current examples. But we aren't there yet, which is my point.
Berge likely improves the current team, as we are going through a massive rebuild, and we can also sell for a profit if we want to do that in a few years' time, since he would be coming for cheap. If we don't sell, then he will still be a bargain. Also enables us to spend big on a priority long-term target when they become available a few years down the line, like potentially Adam Wharton in one of the upcoming transfer windows beyond the current one. If we sign a 60 million DM now that's not even ideal for our plans, like Ugarte would very much be, it would make it much more complicated to go and spend another 60 million, or more, on the actual optimal target within 1-2 years of signing Ugarte for big money. Would be shooting ourselves in the foot financially, both with the transfer fee and the wages.
I recommend everyone to check this small thread and the short clips out before moaning and whining about this potential arrival:
Just these short samples of footage alone make it obvious in my opinion that he is a much better fit for our midfield than Ugarte would be, for a fraction of the Uruguayan's price. Berge is very tall, but seems fairly mobile, is a surprisingly good ball carrier, and has a good passing range as well. I can also see him being good at recycling possession and spraying vertical passes throughout a game, which would be very important if paired with Mainoo, because the latter isn't that type of player. We've seen Amrabat do it in a few games last season, who is by no means world class at it, but it was good and useful, and a far cry from what Casemiro can provide there. If Berge is an upgrade on both of them in this, among other things, then he would already be worth it.
Youssouf Fofana, another name linked today, would be another undervalued, but floor-raiser signing for a few seasons IMO. And by the time the squad evolves to the point where Berge/Fofana is not starting quality anymore, they can be useful squad players for us, or we can sell them for profit, and then we can go and spend 100 million on a generational talent to replace them.
Robertson and Wijnaldum are good examples mentioned by another poster, although they did in the end develop into great players. However, if Berge/Fofana wouldn't, it wasn't the main incentive behind signing them in the first place.
However, Tomiyasu to Arsenal is the best example that instantly comes to mind for me. Cheap signing in 2021, he improved their squad at the time and raised the physical flooring of the team as well, and 3 years later he's a very good squad player for them that they can also sell for a profit if they choose to. All of this can be true for Berge/Fofana as well.
Our recruitment policy needs to involve these types of deals as well, especially so early on in our project. We do need to pay a premium for the absolute best talents from time to time, but finding bargains for cheap is also essential. Even City, at the height of their powers with already having the best squad in the world, managed to improve the team with an unexpected, cheap punt like Akanji 2 years ago.
Potentially one of those "undervalued" floor-raiser signings that we should be making more often, until we have a truly elite squad which is hard to improve by anything other than some of the best players in the world, see Real Madrid, City and Arsenal as the current examples. But we aren't there yet, which is my point.
Berge likely improves the current team, as we are going through a massive rebuild, and we can also sell for a profit if we want to do that in a few years' time, since he would be coming for cheap. If we don't sell, then he will still be a bargain. Also enables us to spend big on a priority long-term target when they become available a few years down the line, like potentially Adam Wharton in one of the upcoming transfer windows beyond the current one. If we sign a 60 million DM now that's not even ideal for our plans, like Ugarte would very much be, it would make it much more complicated to go and spend another 60 million, or more, on the actual optimal target within 1-2 years of signing Ugarte for big money. Would be shooting ourselves in the foot financially, both with the transfer fee and the wages.
I recommend everyone to check this small thread and the short clips out before moaning and whining about this potential arrival:
Just these short samples of footage alone make it obvious in my opinion that he is a much better fit for our midfield than Ugarte would be, for a fraction of the Uruguayan's price. Berge is very tall, but seems fairly mobile, is a surprisingly good ball carrier, and has a good passing range as well. I can also see him being good at recycling possession and spraying vertical passes throughout a game, which would be very important if paired with Mainoo, because the latter isn't that type of player. We've seen Amrabat do it in a few games last season, who is by no means world class at it, but it was good and useful, and a far cry from what Casemiro can provide there. If Berge is an upgrade on both of them in this, among other things, then he would already be worth it.
Youssouf Fofana, another name linked today, would be another undervalued, but floor-raiser signing for a few seasons IMO. And by the time the squad evolves to the point where Berge/Fofana is not starting quality anymore, they can be useful squad players for us, or we can sell them for profit, and then we can go and spend 100 million on a generational talent to replace them.
Robertson and Wijnaldum are good examples mentioned by another poster, although they did in the end develop into great players. However, if Berge/Fofana wouldn't, it wasn't the main incentive behind signing them in the first place.
However, Tomiyasu to Arsenal is the best example that instantly comes to mind for me. Cheap signing in 2021, he improved their squad at the time and raised the physical flooring of the team as well, and 3 years later he's a very good squad player for them that they can also sell for a profit if they choose to. All of this can be true for Berge/Fofana as well.
Our recruitment policy needs to involve these types of deals as well, especially so early on in our project. We do need to pay a premium for the absolute best talents from time to time, but finding bargains for cheap is also essential. Even City, at the height of their powers with already having the best squad in the world, managed to improve the team with an unexpected, cheap punt like Akanji 2 years ago.
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I presume some clubs will make do without a replacement till January window?
Good post. We have to trust these guys to find bargains. Some of them are going to be broken toys who can statistically still give us something we are missing. Liverpool made such a great squad with players like this.
I agree, although I think Liverpool had to rely a bit too much on these punts and value buys working out for them, which is one of the biggest reasons why they couldn't keep up with City for 7 years straight and had many off-seasons where they didn't challenge for the title or didn't even make the CL sometimes.
I also trust the scouting department to be able to find very good, cheap deals like maybe Berge could be. They've always been one of the best in the world at their job, but I feel like in past years their input and opinion was often very wrongly ignored by the club.
we’ve actually been linked with this guy a few times over the years too. Maybe our scouts love him. From pure stats he does seem to serve a purpose even if his game isn’t aesthetically pleasing.
This guy is a downgrade on McT the CDM.
I also forgot to mention in my initial post that he was one of Kompany's most trusted players, playing the most Premier League minutes from the whole Burnley squad last season, and the second most minutes in all competitions overall.
Considering Kompany's philosophy, that's a good sign that Berge could play and potentially perform well in a bigger club who plays a possession-based, controlling type of game.
Not the worst move we could make if the fee is reasonable. Although better than Casemiro is a very low bar.
We need some aerial presence in the side to cover the likes of Martinez.
We need some aerial presence in the side to cover the likes of Martinez.
Was never quite impressed when he played for Sheffield United. Looked very cumbersome
What was the risk with Dan James? We end up selling him for more than what we bought him. If it works we can potentially get a bargain, if not then we can sell the player for profit or get most of the refund of what we spend.
Thats excellent shame we were shit in attack in the mean time ey
As a fellow Norwegian I completely agree with you.
IMO Berge will be no improvement, and I genuinely believe that the current past-it version of Casemiro offers us a lot more than Berge ever will as a DM.
Not better then McT as a DM/CM/10/“impact sub” or whatever either.
If the price is good, then why not?
I actually think he is a lot better than McTominay, at the proper bread and butter of the midfield role.
He makes himself available, plays safe, but does have a good passing range when given time, and more importantly actually knows his position.
He would improve our bottom level.
But I say again, only if the price is good!!!
I actually think he is a lot better than McTominay, at the proper bread and butter of the midfield role.
He makes himself available, plays safe, but does have a good passing range when given time, and more importantly actually knows his position.
He would improve our bottom level.
But I say again, only if the price is good!!!
So, basically, we should not sign Berge because of James
It’s definitely not the point. There are exciting talents in the CS, one bought by Spurs, just this window, even. This guy is not that.
If the objective is to not make much progress, knock yourself out; plenty of players we can get in to do that. If, however, the plan is to become a CL club this season, quality appropriate players need to be brought in, just like every CL aspirant club has in their ranks or is bringing into their ranks.
Is Berge someone who can elevate the top or bottom level here?
How are you so sure that he’s not a good player or the required quality? I think he’s a very good player who would elevate us to be very honest. There are some quality aspects about his game. And who are these supposed quality appropriate DM’s you talk about? Because I can tell you that the market for a DM is a bleak one. All your Zubimendis and Ugartes have glaring weaknesses in their game. They aren’t your top quality too. On top of that they are out of reach for us financially.
Sounds like McTominay Lite to me. It's fascinating seeing some people in here trying to talk him up as a hidden gem who they've always secretly really rated. Never once seen his name mentioned as a potential worthwhile signing before today, here or anywhere else.
He shows for the ball and can give it to somebody else in the same colour shirt under pressure. Aside from also being a tall midfielder, he couldn't be much more different to McTominay.
It might come down to how the fee is structured. I wouldn’t be shocked if PSG demanded the majority up front with less bonuses and incentives.
This bloke is just covering all bases.
No thank you, he’s no better than McTominay
Seem him a lot for Norway. He’s developed nicely over the past couple of years, and I think he’s someone who would fit a lot better into a more dominant ball playing side than a side like Burnley. He’s not really a defensive midfielder though, so wouldn’t be an alternative to Ugarte.
If we can get him on a cheap, he’d fit our side a lot more than McSauce, so I wouldn’t mind selling the latter and replacing him with Berge.
Unless he steps up another level I wouldn’t want him as a starter. We should bring in someone like Ugarte to be the main choice in a double pivot next to Mainoo.
If we can get him on a cheap, he’d fit our side a lot more than McSauce, so I wouldn’t mind selling the latter and replacing him with Berge.
Unless he steps up another level I wouldn’t want him as a starter. We should bring in someone like Ugarte to be the main choice in a double pivot next to Mainoo.
McTominay is a player like Fellaini or Soucek who could be really effective as an advanced midfielder in a mid table side. McTominay isn’t good enough on the ball to play for a side that wants to compete for the title.
Berge is tailor made for a dominant side and he’d fit our team a lot more than McTominay even though I won’t argue he’s better. McTominay is perhaps better, but I’d rather have Berge.
We’ve got Ugarte taste and Berge finances
You can have the best 1st 11 but unless you have decent squad options any team will struggle in the league, Berge on the cheap is smart business, we have 2 over the hill players, 1 wonderkid and untested youth available in a deeper midfield position, we have numbers capable of playing a more advanced midfield role but unless we improve our depth further back then we will fall down, we still need a 1st 11 starter even if we sign Berge
Had a poor season but I'm sure he'd do better than Amrabat did with his chance last season or McTominay's actual midfield work. As long as the fee reflected his poor season and not being a particularly great player I'd be okay with it
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