My thought also, a No Fly Zone is good on paper, sadly in this situation thats where it should stay on paper
Russian invasion of Ukraine | Fewer tweets, more discussion
- Thread starter Wednesday at Stoke
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As someone who has shed many tears over what has happened in Syria too and criticised the cruel visa policies of the UK Home Office for many years, I don’t get this mentality. Eastern Europeans have been “other-ed” by the West and used as a political football just as much those of other ethnicities.
How are you chiding the countries, which given the Schengen zone means essentially the entire EU, for helping people flee a war in a country that directly borders them? Syria was and still is an absolute tragedy, but the situation is not comparable in terms of the neighbouring EU just waiving visas and letting them walk across. Criticising those countries who are doing the most now makes no sense. Are you sitting there lamenting Moldova, challenging the hypocrisy of one of the poorest countries in Europe, for welcoming people who are fleeing war in a neighbouring country, because they didn’t do the same for a war in a more distant place?
We all could have done more in the past, we all should have done more in the past, but you are falling into the trap that dictators want if you let previous inaction lead to further inaction.
No. It just would lose in a dogfight against top aircrafts.
However, there would be no dogfigts. The enemy aircrafts would get destroyed without seeing F35.
Head in the sand.
Fox News are very unbiased and free speech compared to these. They are like Putin's personal twitter account.I had a conversation yesterday with someone who helps out with a volunteering effort I'm a part of. Always been nice to me and we have things in common like sports and art projects that whenever I see him we usually talk about. Yesterday though he went off the rails about this situation and I felt a little embarrassed and trying to not prolong the subject with other people around. Naturally it's a topic of discussion among the group but he later pulled me aside to say we're all wrong and believing lies. Asked him what he meant and he went on to he gets all his news from Russian sources like RT and he is furious at the coverage of "those poor Ukrainians dying" (said sarcastically) from western media which he calls propaganda. I made the point that what he is doing getting all his information from one side is no different just because it's the side you like and that ended that. I didn't have him down as a crank.
That just made me think. Trump in the White House during this would give away so much intel and info via Twitter
I think the idea was that the EU would reimburse or provide newer models to the countries that supply the planes. Judging by the twitter thread below, it might prove to be too costly though.
I've not seen any fighting rhetoric, it's all sanctions.
Everyone wants peace until you are not in a position to get it. Then it's too late.
If Putin gets away with this, who knows where he would draw the line? Sanctions is the most effective way to punish Putin.
Of course, the cynic in me is definitely thinking Johnson is loving this because he was gone in any other scenario.
You always wonder about those in the Second World War who thought appeasement was the right track, or then surrendering and looking for a peace deal when Nazi Germany was dominating the war.
Fox news got pretty close while orange man was potus though.
Cheers!!
Pure coincidence on Putin's part. Wait till he finds out.
'I am going to be rich' look on his smirky little face.
I forget who said this recently but it is very accurate that there are people who wishes us to do nothing until we reach a point where they can then say 'there was nothing that could be done.'
Anonymous have been pretty active these days.
Same as my Russian mate. Telling me I am listening to western propaganda.
It's interesting to see different explanations for the invasion.
1: NATO & Ukraine's domestic policy
2: Ukraine's resources
We've seen in this thread statistics about Ukraine's natural resources and hence the suggestion that Russia wants to control these.
3: Ideology
The third would be the ideological explanation, as in Putin having contempt for Ukrainian nationhood and wanting to wipe them off the map.
1: NATO & Ukraine's domestic policy
- Michel Kofman in his pre-invasion assessment of the situation never said anything about Putin's ideological problems with Ukraine at all. It was basically a geopolitical analysis focused on NATO and establishing a pro-Russian government.
- Rob Lee had the same line of thinking as Kofman, noting that Russia saw worrying trend lines such as Turkey selling drones and involving itself in Karabakh, Ukraine's domestic policies shifting to the West. Hence, a desire to establish a pro-Russian government.
2: Ukraine's resources
We've seen in this thread statistics about Ukraine's natural resources and hence the suggestion that Russia wants to control these.
3: Ideology
The third would be the ideological explanation, as in Putin having contempt for Ukrainian nationhood and wanting to wipe them off the map.
Thats what got me thinking, Trump was destroying his own country and people and they still deflected
Gifting stuff like airplanes to Ukraine is literally borderline declaring war yourself. Giving weapons is treading close enough but seriously, part of the effort should also be to deescalate.
you’ll be giving the mad man a reason on a plate to go legitimise his actions against everyone.
you’ll be giving the mad man a reason on a plate to go legitimise his actions against everyone.
Post modern politics is all about gaslighting, and proliferation of fake news causing confusion to the point where people conclude they 'don't know what to believe'. The end goal is that the public look to a 'strong leader' i.e. dictator. This pattern has been embedded in western politics via interference in elections too. See US 2016 election, French election 2017 and Vote Leave campaign.
It's not a stretch to conclude that Russia conspired to appoint liars/dishonest figures in office in leading western countries to degrade public trust in our leaders.
That wouldn't be possible.
It really is unbelievable what I am reading here. It is fooking amazing. My family lost their men during WW II. They bloody volunteered knowing full well that Hitler was just rolling over Europe and western part of USSR. They never thought nah, it is too risky. Why would we fight for Russians when we are not Russian. People being shit scared that their government could be giving their aircrafts to Ukranian pilots to fight Putin. It really is amazing. You know what? What if Germany bombed the sh!te out of Kaliningrad and told the Russian president, this is German territory and it was occupied during WW II. You touch us and we have enough capabilities within NATO to nuke you instantly from all sides?
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Far from it. The narrative has been spun that way because of the cost but it's an incredibly capable aircraft. Nothing outside the US's own air force would stand a chance against it.
What do you mean specifically? You want the West to intervene militarily?
Maybe. Or just realistic.
West is already intervening. I am just really surprised that people areshit scared to be seeing their fighter aircrafts being given to Ukranian pilots to fight against cnut who has declared a war against pretty much powerless country. The cnut who if takes over Ukraine will be right next to these people's doors.
I've not seen any either - heard it though
Liz Truss is a twat.The opposite really. People are dying in an unjust war. That's the reality you choose to avoid.
Elaborate please. I'm open to reassurance.
I'm not really sure what you're getting at here? Nuclear weapons didn't exist at the outbreak of WW2. Had they done the war wouldn't have made it past 1939.
If Germany today bombed Kaliningrad they would cease to exist as a country within about an hour.
Its a funny series of convos the past four-five days. Both of us are accusing each other of being suckers to our respective propaganda! My previous experience of this are with Trumpists.
Eventually, you give up and not bother having any discussions other than asking the time or matters of such trivialities. At some point the world will grind to a halt.
So you ought to be sh!t scared that your aircrafts flown by Ukranian soldiers could be used against the agressor, who, in case of victory, will be sitting next to your door, with nukes right next to him?
There's an open discussion about thermobaric weapons now.
Some liberators these guys. But let's stay realistic.
Some liberators these guys. But let's stay realistic.
With all this unfamiliar US UK equipment being given to the Ukraine, there obviously must be technical advisors arriving with it.
Boris press conference just now was pretty good and very moving when the Ukrainian reporter pleaded for help and a no fly zone.
Boris said there was no way they could send in any planes as it would mean shooting down Russian planes.
Sanctions and defensive support is the only way to defeat Putin
Boris said there was no way they could send in any planes as it would mean shooting down Russian planes.
Sanctions and defensive support is the only way to defeat Putin
Ukraine have claimed that thermobaric weapons have already been used against them, right?
IAF commander: Israel first to use F-35 jet in combat
“We are flying the F-35 all over the Middle East."
I am not sure why the Americans cant send in the F-22 with their tiny radar cross-section, almost undetectable by the Russians and shoot off a few missiles onto the convoys from over the horizon.
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