Assuming it relates to the azov batallion
Russian invasion of Ukraine | Fewer tweets, more discussion
- Thread starter Wednesday at Stoke
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guys, do these peace talks mean anything? What's going on? Could this shit all be over soon? I doubt it, yet I have hope
It doesn't. It's a manufactured bit of propaganda that Putin is using to get Russians to support his illegitimate invasion. You seem to forget that the Nazis invaded Russia in 1941 and are hung up on a Tweet about pig fat on bullets meant to feck with Chechen warmongers who should have stayed home.
Again then. What claim did Kosovo had for independence? Or any state in history for independence? By your argument Latvia should have never left the German Empire.
If they were only attacking Mariupol he could argue that, his line is the entire country is run by Nazi’s (despite a Jewish leader!!)
Hopefully Russia would have learnt their lesson that they cannot attack a country that has the support of NATO (feel free to march eastward towards Arabia though). With that lesson we can allow them back into the world economy and not sever relations entirely
I live in ‘Arabia’, as do millions of other people. You may have your own feelings about leaders here, which I really don’t care about, but calling for Russia to attack other countries that you simply don’t like, given what we’ve seen over the past few days, and given what myself and my family have been through when Saddam invaded us, is frankly disgusting. Think before you post. This thread isn’t a free for all.
Please stop taking advantage of this awful situation to have a pop at Israel. We see you.
It's also very questionable geography. "march eastwards" - the Middle East is very much to the west of most of Russia and it's almost directly south of Moscow.
I remember that you have some ties to Ukraine but I wonder how close do you know Crimea & Crimeans? The referendum was obviously done by illegal means with Russian troops on the ground and henceforth isn’t legitimate, but whenever Crimeans wanted to join Russia is another point. And they certainly did, which is evident by many different social studies over the years (before and after annexation) and by the feeling on the ground (I remember having debates with many Crimeans on Putin in 2008-2012 as they saw him as a savior and the idea of joining Russia as a panacea for many economical & social issues that they’ve had at the time).
I don’t think that the idea of Donbass or Lugansk joining Russia was considered by many before 2014, for example. In Crimea, the thought was always there — and this is why Putin annexed it instead of doing his usual proxy-independent state thing a la DNR, LNR, South Ossetia & Abkhazia.
And to reiterate my point — the “referendum” was done with Russian military on the ground and it can’t be considered legitimate by any means. I guess we’ll never know how this referendum would’ve gone legitimately but it all indicate towards a landslide victory for the pro-Russian contingent. I think only Crimean tatars were against the idea out of the significant ethnic/cultural/social groups on the peninsula.
Hopefully Russia would have learnt their lesson that they cannot attack a country that has the support of NATO (feel free to march eastward towards Arabia though
What!? Unbelievable post, in so many ways.
Btw, what does the ‘88’ in your username refer to?
12000 Albanians killed and systemic opression. Also a grand-scale plan to displace them.
Wouldn't have even replied to him, mental post.
The word has long lost its original meaning thanks to Putin’s regime.
Yeah, more so, it’s more or less rehashing of multiple “historical articles” and speeches that Putin has published over the years.
Posts like these serve absolutely no purpose mate. Cop the feck on
I know. My point is just because an entity owns a land somewhere, should not mean that the people there can not fight for independence. For me, people in Kosovo had the right to independence, as people in Crimea.
I wonder if it's because a) Russia didn't have a lot of money with them, or b) The Swiss are very very good at hiding money
More Abramovich style PR for the scumbag bankers of Switzerland who need to polish their image after the recent Credit Suisse revelations which cast a massive shadow over that entire sector.
The situations are not comparable. The entire point of the Kosovo precedent is that Serbia have lost their right to Kosovo because of the attrocities committed.
Some are trying to paint it as "now you can have secessions at will" but it does not work like that.
Likely thinks the Middle East is east of everything because east is in the name. Let's be honest, based on the insanity of the post I'm impressed they know that East is a direction.
As above, it's partly Russia trying to drag this war back to the optics of 1945, but also referring to Ukrainians as Nazis is a casual anti-Ukrainian slur by Russia. The Ukrainian resistance fought alongside the Nazis against the Soviet Union during World War II, so that part of their history is complicated to put it lightly. What countries don't have a complicated relationship with parts of their history though? What countries don't have monuments to or symbols of things that many of us would rather were left in the past?
Obviously the democratically elected President of Ukraine, Jewish descendant of Holocaust survivors, is a Nazi and needs to be replaced with the only non-Nazi available which is a man called Pladimir Vutin who wears a fake moustache and has a face like a toddler who's drawn eyes on a potato too close together.
Would explain why they've scrambled their troops over the border.
Holy shit, you are Serbian and saying this. First one I heard who didn't say the usual 'Albanian terrorists, NATO/US bombed us cause they didn't like Serbia and wanted to make a base in Bondsteel'.
Looks like it's genuine. There have been a lot of similar articles touching the "Ukrainian question" since 2014.
So, should Indians kick out Americans because of the atrocities committed? Or rather the US should be British again, because the British were not committing atrocities, just imposing taxes. We cannot determine independent movements just by that.
That is surprising
I spent some time in Crimea a couple of years before the 2014 invasion and was struck by how Russian the culture and identity was there. Had there been a legit referendum, I think the Crimeans would've probably selected Russia (just not by the farcical numbers as in Putin's "referendum at gunpoint"). Even if Russia were to become a Democracy, I think there will still be considerable interest in retaining Crimea, which IIRC even Navalny is a proponent of.
Kyiv explosions happening now, showing on Sky News
My feeling is that if there is no systematic oppression, people of a country can decide to go independent only if the current country allows them. That's why despite I support Catalonia's independence, I think that Spain has the right to keep Catalonia for example. There is pretty much no oppression there.
I don't have a good understanding of Ukrainian politics to know if Crimea and Donbas region were discriminated. I don't think that just wanting to leave is a reason in itself, cause then it never stops and we go back to having 10000 tribes in Europe.
Saying that, I think at this stage it is irrelevant. Crimea is a part of Russia now, so I don't expect this to change even if Russia gets a pro-Western leader. I think it is more complicated for Donbas, but I do not think it can get back to becoming part of Ukraine. The important part IMO is for this to end as soon as possible. I guess best case scenario might be for Ukraine to be neutral military-wise in a new deal with Russia and US/EU/NATO, but join the EU. Russia then won't claim to be threatened and Ukraine will prosper economically.
True enough. As an F1 fan I immediately think about the British fascist Mosley, and how years later his son managed to shake off the stain of his family name and turn it into one that's now known for car safety - saving countless lives. But the stain will always be there to some extent even if the descendants have done completely different things in their life.
If Russia really want to play the "your country used to do this/that" game then they're just as guilty as everyone else. What matters is what they do now, and right now all I see is Russia committing war crimes.
BBC:
Leading Russian liberal newspaper Novaya Gazeta has sent an email to subscribers detailing threats it has received from the state media watchdog Roskomnadzor and requesting people vote on possible next steps.
Over the weekend, the regulator sent letters to a number of (remaining) independent media, demanding they delete material describing the conflict in Ukraine as a "war".
According to Roskomnadzor, the correct term is "military operation"; other terms that are apparently unacceptable are "invasion" and "aggression".
Novaya Gazeta asks its readers to vote on what the paper should do next - either “to continue our work under military censorship and implement the demands of the authorities” or “to cease our editorial operations until the end of the war”.
Leading Russian liberal newspaper Novaya Gazeta has sent an email to subscribers detailing threats it has received from the state media watchdog Roskomnadzor and requesting people vote on possible next steps.
Over the weekend, the regulator sent letters to a number of (remaining) independent media, demanding they delete material describing the conflict in Ukraine as a "war".
According to Roskomnadzor, the correct term is "military operation"; other terms that are apparently unacceptable are "invasion" and "aggression".
Novaya Gazeta asks its readers to vote on what the paper should do next - either “to continue our work under military censorship and implement the demands of the authorities” or “to cease our editorial operations until the end of the war”.
Too many questions for me to answer there.
I don't think land should be owned on an historical precedence because we've seen countless wars over the ambiguity of ownership and i don't see history affording rights to impose will. The people who take up home in any place should decide for themselves in a free manner and under no influence of threat, it's obviously never that simple and needs working through but that's the principle i'd stand behind. I'm against suppression of secessionism as i am oppression by military takeover, although the latter is obviously much worse than the former.
I've no idea if Crimea at this stage want to join Russia or reform with Ukraine, hopefully if Russia withdraws completely Ukraine do let them have that choice.
The Crimean referendum was a complete farce @harms. I'm surprised you posted this. It was done with Russian occupying forces, it did not have legitimate international observers, and there was no option on the ballot to simply "remain" and maintain the status quo. From Wikipedia:
Wikipedia said:
Absolutely polling in the past had showed a strong preference to either take on greater independence or to join Russia, but when Russia did what it did, it failed the Crimean people by ensuring that Crimea will never have legitimate means to self-determine their future. I've no idea how this issue is ever solved now.
Oh absolutely. I m not in favor of Catalan independence, because it just creates more borders. But if the Catalans do really want to be independent, who am I to judge it? Unfortunately, there is no quantative or qualitative way to measure oppression.
I'll be honest, I'm not entirely educated on Kosovo - Serbia situation, and am researching on it as our discussion goes on, but Serbia formed following Yugoslavias break up, drafted a constitution, that Kosovo disagreed with as they didn't want to be part of Serbia. That's a different scenario, as a majority tried to take over a minorities territory, after a break up of a former state union, when lines of new countries were drawn. If 2006 serbian constitution was acknowledged by the UN (can't find a valid report it was), then yes, they have no right for independence.
That's what I tried to say, historically, no country had a claim on any territory, everything was changing all the time, depending who had stronger military. That's why we have international laws in place now, that accepts and supports countries right to it's bound territory right now. If we start ignoring those laws, we're going back to medieval times, where everything is free game.
What argument did I make to base that claim again, bit confused on the last part?
Which is exactly what I've said (and @Raoul seconded). You can't have a legit referendum with "polite people" with guns "securing" every voting booth. And that referendum wasn't legit.
My point was on what an actual referendum would've been like (which makes your comparison with Ireland a bit off).
I guess these are linked?
