Talks have started on the Belarus border, Ukrainians asking for Russia to pull out and a ceasefire.
Russian invasion of Ukraine | Fewer tweets, more discussion
- Thread starter Wednesday at Stoke
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It does, and that's the point. Letting Ukraine join the EU while being at war would immediately mean the whole EU had to join the war (as this is part of the Lissabon treaty), and therefore obviously would also in one the rest of the Nato by proxy. It's just the ultimate threat the EU has against Russia to make them retreat.
Most prisoners are not killers doing life sentences. I doubt they are sending people who are too dangerous to let out.
Nah... Talks have started deep inside Belarus... It's just one side doesn't realise that yet
Didnt they Russians do that against Napoleon when they abandoned Moscow? They let the prisoners loose just to loot things and make it impossible for the french to find food and worhty goods.
I’m torn because obviously things should be solved by discussion not conflict (I doubt anyone disagrees) but I feel like a lot of people ‘blaming’ expansion against Russia are ignoring the fact that Putin hasn’t exactly made Russia an attractive proposition for its former USSR territories. Why should Ukraine pay for his domestic failures as President? If they see a better future for their people why shouldn’t they be allowed to apply to the EU, NATO or whatever they want without fear of invasion?
Indeed, we should be wary of angering the Russian public long term because new leaders might exploit that. Japan under the US umbrella is an interesting case study with regards to helping a country after they've been 'punished'.One point I'll make, and not to seem like I'm pro-Russian, is that we need to be vary of the mistakes made after World War 1 to not completely humiliate the Russians following any negotiations, and provoke a worse response in future years.
We've seen that their economy can be devastated following the sanctions. That, coupled with the humiliation of not being able to conquer Ukraine, could have been extreme impact on the prison population and leaders, who can be very nationalistic.
Ofcourse Russia is 100% wrong in what they've done, but with peace talks we should negotiate that they completely withdraw from Ukraine but then lift sanctions put on them (if possible also the resignation of Putin). so that they don't fall into economic despair, like what happened in Germany after WW1.
Hopefully Russia would have learnt their lesson that they cannot attack a country that has the support of NATO (feel free to march eastward towards Arabia though). With that lesson we can allow them back into the world economy and not sever relations entirely
I'm guessing here, it's probably prisoners who are close to parole/on good behaviour who are being given the task, rather than rapists and the like
Absolutely agree. It should be our goal to remove Putin, create some disarmament treaty and most importantly essentially allow the Russians to blame this stuff on Putin and his close advisors. That way they could save their face and return to our common economical system.One point I'll make, and not to seem like I'm pro-Russian, is that we need to be vary of the mistakes made after World War 1 to not completely humiliate the Russians following any negotiations, and provoke a worse response in future years.
We've seen that their economy can be devastated following the sanctions. That, coupled with the humiliation of not being able to conquer Ukraine, could have an extreme impact on the population and leaders, who can be very nationalistic.
Ofcourse Russia is 100% wrong in what they've done, but with peace talks we should negotiate that they completely withdraw from Ukraine but then lift sanctions put on them (if possible also the resignation of Putin) so that they don't fall into economic despair, like what happened in Germany after WW1.
Hopefully Russia would have learnt their lesson that they cannot attack a country that has the support of NATO (feel free to march eastward towards Arabia though
The way i read it is that it’s prisoners who were already in jail prior to the war not POWs.
The only objection I’d have is in regards to murderers being used because they could be psychopaths
Zelenskiy taking over from tuchel... I'm calling it first
presumably putin okd it or its polonolium tea for roman
Damn what an amazing throwback. Haven't heard those names in years.
No he doesn't. Until 2014 we were all on cooperative terms with Russia, no one saw them as an enemy but as a partner in many things. This is all of Putin's own making, the fact that NATO now is a threat to them as well, before that no NATO nation ever attempted any military aggression against Russia. Don't buy the Kremlin propaganda, the only thing Putin is worried about is that the democratic movements in Ukraine and Belarus are going to cost him his regime, that's why he attacked Ukraine, he can't have them be a democratic state, the NATO thing is a fecking excuse preying on old Cold War fears.
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You do remember the Arabs/Afghans obviously with the help of the West had them fleeing Afghanistan?Feel free to march eastward towards Arabia though
To follow on from that, Putin has committed so many crimes against Russia that if he loses his regime then he loses his life. He's the archetypal prisoner of power.
Capital punishment was abolished in 2000.
They sound like the exactly the kind of people who you’d want fighting in war ironically.
But that’s not what his latest statements are saying, and he is more unhinged sounding now
Yep. We have to make it clear to the Russians that there is a way out of all sanctions and that there is a way back to negotiations if a ceasefire is reached. But Putin must go.
You're conflating justification with a geopolitical reality and then ranting about a point not made.
NATO expansion is a valid security threat, the fact current NATO isn't a threat isn't relevant because its about what may happen in decades time. That's how all major players think in regards to non-allied forces (and Russia are pretending to be one at this stage).
Is it anything to do with this war? Very little. Is accepting it as valid remotely justifying Russian aggression? No
Never see The Dirty Dozen?
I think we should stop discussing whether NATO is a threat to Russia or not when Putin has explicitly explained what this war is about. It’s a topic for another discussion altogether.
Why would Ukraine request the presence of someone who has zero influence and no connections with Putin and Russian power? Weird.
Even if Putin views NATO expansion as a threat (and I actually sympathise with him on this one, but not much), this is a totally diplomatic issue and in no way allows him an excuse to invade a country. Twice.
The man has gone mad. That is the problem.
The man has gone mad. That is the problem.
Are people genuinely expecting this to calm down today? I'm not well versed as I don't have a deep enough understanding of the political background here but what are the chances of some sort agreement that will see an end to this?
An end... Unlikely ... A pause or de-escalation is likely if an agreement is reached
Now if it will be stuck to that's another question
And what happens if an agreement is not reached is a pretty horrible prospect
Yes, until the next time this issue is buried under the carpet and putin attacks.
A ceasefire today with talks ongoing between Russia and nato to come to a solution is the best outcome.
Again it all depends on Putin, how shocked he is with the worldwide reaction, how hard financially he has been hit and if he is surprised about the level of resistance he has faced. My guess he will negotiate but at the same time carry on the war. At the end of the day we haven’t seen anywhere near what Russia can do .
Quick question, if Russia agrees to a full withdrawal, would the sanctions be reversed?
Honest answer, none of us have a clue and none of us are likely any more educated on this than you either! What seems clear is everyone is hoping for a ceasefire.
Basically zero. Sounds more like Russia's tactics to justify heavier attacks, 'they don't want to negotiate'. They won't suddenly back down from 'fighting the Nazis'.
Thanks guys
Can they (literally) afford the damage this is doing to their economy though?
Didn't expect to now follow this through The Athletic now. Feels as if someone is very much trying to launder his reputation.
It is in regards to the start of the war i agree, it's a bit irrelevant and just causing misunderstandings. However the narrative is formed and used by Putin so countering it rather than denying it is required to show the Russian people that Putin is in the wrong. There's no doubt it will form part of the diplomacy going forward, a reasonable compromise with a new Russian leader such as Ukraine in NATO but no NATO missles or bases in Ukraine would be a win-win.
I actually think we have in terms of their ground forces. Fat soldiers, old equipment, terrible strategies...
We haven't seen their WMDs yet, but we already know what they will do anyway.