Russian invasion of Ukraine | Fewer tweets, more discussion

JPRouve said:
Very early a french source said that France was skeptical about the invasion due to the absence of the fundamental fuel movements. If true they didn't move large amount of fuel and weren't ready.
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Interesting, thanks.
 
noodlehair said:
But it is day 3 of the war. Ukraine is a huge country with a 40+ million population. Even if Putin horribly miscalculated the level of resistance it is nonsense to think he or any advisor didn't expect this to be a bit of a drawn out slog.

The Ukrainian forces have no means to do anything other than defend. Putin clearly doesn't care about the human cost of his or the opposition forces so the casualty numbers won't be a game changer. It's just a case of hoping international attention forces him to care about the cost of civilian lives, but unfortunately if they are serious about taking Kyiv, which they will have to be, it's going to get a lot more ugly.

Don't particularly see the sense in your other comment either regarding people fleeing. This isn't ww2. People have families and are able to leave the area of conflict. It's questionable whether leaving your kids alone and potentially stranded in a warzone in order to die throwing a bottle at a tank in the name of patriotism is brave. Unless something changes significantly over the next few days lots and lots of people are going to die for little reason.
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A lot of families (women and children) are leaving the country. A country that will cease to exist if everyone fled and handed the keys to Vladimir Putin. You can't have a country if you're not willing to fight for it.
 
noodlehair said:
But it is day 3 of the war. Ukraine is a huge country with a 40+ million population. Even if Putin horribly miscalculated the level of resistance it is nonsense to think he or any advisor didn't expect this to be a bit of a drawn out slog.

The Ukrainian forces have no means to do anything other than defend. Putin clearly doesn't care about the human cost of his or the opposition forces so the casualty numbers won't be a game changer. It's just a case of hoping international attention forces him to care about the cost of civilian lives, but unfortunately if they are serious about taking Kyiv, which they will have to be, it's going to get a lot more ugly

You'd think it's longer term it will harm him because occupation or control of a hostile country that size after you murder potentially thousands of people is going to be a no win game.


Don't particularly see the sense in your other comment either regarding people fleeing. This isn't ww2. People have families and are able to leave the area of conflict. It's questionable whether leaving your kids alone and potentially stranded in a warzone in order to die throwing a bottle at a tank in the name of patriotism is brave. Unless something changes significantly over the next few days lots and lots of people are going to die for little reason.
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That's not clear. Even the Soviet leaders had to worry about public opinion to some degree.
 
noodlehair said:
But it is day 3 of the war. Ukraine is a huge country with a 40+ million population. Even if Putin horribly miscalculated the level of resistance it is nonsense to think he or any advisor didn't expect this to be a bit of a drawn out slog.

The Ukrainian forces have no means to do anything other than defend. Putin clearly doesn't care about the human cost of his or the opposition forces so the casualty numbers won't be a game changer. It's just a case of hoping international attention forces him to care about the cost of civilian lives, but unfortunately if they are serious about taking Kyiv, which they will have to be, it's going to get a lot more ugly.

Don't particularly see the sense in your other comment either regarding people fleeing. This isn't ww2. People have families and are able to leave the area of conflict. It's questionable whether leaving your kids alone and potentially stranded in a warzone in order to die throwing a bottle at a tank in the name of patriotism is brave. Unless something changes significantly over the next few days lots and lots of people are going to die for little reason.
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For now at least he clearly DOES care about the human cost in this arena. What we have seen so far may be horrific, but it is nothing compared to what we've seen him do in Syria and Chechnya.
 
ooeat0meoo said:
If you're watching MSNBC, CNN's reporter in Belgorod Frederik Pleitgen is reporting that Russian tanks are moving into forward positions from where he's located
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CNN keeps annoyingly switching to discuss the SCOTUS pick. MSNBC have been better about staying on Ukraine. They are talking about whether a Russian cyber attack on the US would trigger article 5.
 
nimic said:
That's not clear. Even the Soviet leaders had to worry about public opinion to some degree.
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Mainly because soviet leaders didn't lead alone, the Soviet Party was a much organized structure. Here Putin is allegedly all powerful, he doesn't answer to others. At least that's a distinction that I would make between Putin and anyone that has followed Stalin.
 
Priti Patel and the Home Office continuing to stumble over the very low bar of expectations.

 
VorZakone said:
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In case anyone doesn't know there is a reference here. "Welcome to Hell" was the last radio message sent to russian forces in the first Chechyen war as they were entering central Grozny, before they were wiped out.
 
TMDaines said:
Priti Patel and the Home Office continuing to stumble over the very low bar of expectations.

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I feel that Belarus and Russians are being punished and ostracized for something they don't want. Aren't we clearly aware of the fact that Belarus have been against Lukashenko for years including very vocal and long protests? The same applies to russians.

I actually fear that this is going to create anti-russian feelings among populations, you can already see it on social media.
 
jackal&hyde said:
Yeah I know. My country takes in refuges by the tens of 1000 but also people that want to fight and go the other way.

It is clear that it's a good vs evil but still, there are still many trash bags that want to pretend that the scum dictator is right, that there are reasons, etc. In this very thread there was a scum that was defending Putin just a few days ago. Blaming NATO and the UK and US and now people are killed. I have very little tolerance for cretinism when it comes to death. Sounds silly maybe but there was a lot of this in this thread. Until now of course. Now is real.
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Agrerd mate. I do think that US-led coalition did lots of bad stuff all across the world and I never supported that. They were the devils for me. This time around the ultimate evil is known, his cronies are known and I am flipping amazed to see how united all of us are. I am flipping grateful to presidents/heads of all countries supporting Ukraine. As I said a tad earlier, this could be a turning point in the history of Eurasian continent. Putin has no escape now. His economy is basically dead - fact. He has almost the whole world against him - fact. He is an aggressor - fact. He is against a country that is full of brave people, who are supported by countries that are much more rich and technologically advanced than Putin's Russia - fact. US and EU are supporting financially and militarily. It is crystal clear to me that the moment civilians start dying in large quantities, Russia will be hit by all economic means available. If it does not work, the military aid will grow into military action. Biden, Johnson, Macron and others would love to be the ones who defeated Russia under macho Putin. And they will. Mid- and long term, Russia is done.
 
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JPRouve said:
I feel that Belarus and Russians are being punished and ostracized for something they don't want. Aren't we clearly aware of the fact that Belarus have been against Lukashenko for years including very vocal and long protests? The same applies to russians.

I actually fear that this is going to create anti-russian feelings among populations, you can already see it on social media.
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This is Putin’s war. I think that’s pretty clear for most.
 
JPRouve said:
I feel that Belarus and Russians are being punished and ostracized for something they don't want. Aren't we clearly aware of the fact that Belarus have been against Lukashenko for years including very vocal and long protests? The same applies to russians.

I actually fear that this is going to create anti-russian feelings among populations, you can already see it on social media.
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I think people are smart enough to know this isn't something the Russian people want, as its being involuntarily crammed down their throats by their dictator.
 
Raoul said:
I think people are smart enough to know this isn't something the Russian want and are having it crammed down their throats by their dictator.
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At the same time banning all Russian teams and athletes (representing Russia) from competing in Europe is the right course of action in my book. Putin is a vain man, don't allow any ammunition for his vanity.
 
Raoul said:
I think people are smart enough to know this isn't something the Russian people want, as its being involuntarily crammed down their throats by their dictator.
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You know that many people aren't smart, Raoul. That's why we have the politicians that we have and why their messages convince a good chunk of society.
 
hellhunter said:
At the same time banning all Russian teams and athletes (representing Russia) from competing in Europe is the right course of action in my book. Putin is a vain man, don't allow any ammunition for his vanity.
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I'd agree with that. All of these actions create compounding pressure on his regime from within, the one place he can't tolerate dissent as it could quickly lead to his demise.
 
Ukrainian Air Force have used the Bayraktar drone. Hopefully Turkey sneaks in a couple more to Ukraine.
 
Water Melon said:
Agrerd mate. I do think that US-led coalition did lots of bad stuff all across the world and I never supported that. They were the devils for me. This time around the ultimate evil is known, his cronies are known and I am flipping amazed to see how united all of us are. I am flipping grateful to presidents/heads of all countries supporting Ukraine. As I said a tad earlier, this could be a turning point in the history of Eurasian continent. Putin has no escape now. His economy is basically dead - fact. He has almost the whole world against him - fact. He is an aggressor - fact. He is against a country that is full of brave people, who are supported by countries that are much more reach and technologically advanced than Putin's Russia - fact. US and EU are supporting financially and militarily. It is crystal clear to me that the moment civilians start dying in large quantities, Russia will be hit by all economic means available. If it does not work, the military aid will grow into military action. Biden, Johnson, Macron and others would love to be the ones who defeated Russia under macho Putin. And they will. Mid- and long term, Russia is done.
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True. Never have I seen not just NATO but the free World in general be as united against the murder that is hapenening.

Glory to Ukraine!
 
tomaldinho1 said:
Abramovic is stepping down (assume temporary) from ‘stewardship’ at Chelsea
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Chelsea owner Roman Abramovich says he is handing control of the club to the trustees of Chelsea's charitable foundation.

"During my nearly 20-year ownership of Chelsea FC, I have always viewed my role as a custodian of the club, whose job it is ensuring that we are as successful as we can be today, as well as build for the future, while also playing a positive role in our communities," he said in a statement.

"I have always taken decisions with the club’s best interest at heart. I remain committed to these values. That is why I am today giving trustees of Chelsea’s Charitable Foundation the stewardship and care of Chelsea FC.

"I believe that currently they are in the best position to look after the interests of the club, players, staff, and fans."
 
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