Those would be Prigozhin's own reports or reports based on that reports. I haven't seen anything concrete and reliable on the matter. A lot (basically everyone they've faced) haven't put up any fight but that's a bit different.
Russian invasion of Ukraine | Fewer tweets, more discussion
- Thread starter Wednesday at Stoke
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The 'plausible deniability' having a branch of Russian military as a PMC only goes so far. Nobody is under any illusion that any nukes in Belarus are Russian nukes and under their full control.
What is your take on this Wagner vs MoD story. Is there a narrative that you heard and makes sense?
Not sure I see the parallels and, in any case, “Whatever happened to, Evgeny Prigozhin…” doesn’t scan.
At the risk of going on a tangent, do we actually believe or know that anything that is meant to belong to the Russian Army is under their full control? The tweet about corrupiton on the previous page reminds me the completely ridiculous story of a russian mobster who tried to sell a soviet submarine to a cartel.
He really makes Putin look like some teenager that's getting advice from his father
I dont think Vlad would forget this.ffs will someone please off Putin.
Kramatorsk: Russian missile strike hits restaurants in Ukrainian city
A Russian missile strike has hit a crowded restaurant area in the eastern Ukrainian city of Kramatorsk, Ukrainian officials say.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-66031342
Kramatorsk: Russian missile strike hits restaurants in Ukrainian city
A Russian missile strike has hit a crowded restaurant area in the eastern Ukrainian city of Kramatorsk, Ukrainian officials say.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-66031342
Special good faith regards for RFK Jr
The whole thing was obviously inspired by MoD trying to shift Wagners out (or trying to take control of it, shifting Prigozhin out). I'm not sure that MoD were really losing that many men to Wagner, I think it's simply the idea of having a separate fighting unit kinda under your command (and kinda not) that was stressing Shoigu & the rest the most.
It makes sense.
Yeah the truth was probably the most rational explanation. RA did not attack because why would they? They weren't ordered to. Prigozhin realised he didn't have much/enough high ranking support (at least supporters that would actively show their cards) and so bailed out. No one looks good out of this apart from Lukaschenko.
Lukashenko's moment. Politics, bloody hell.
He must be laughing his ass off behind closed doors. "I told Putin what (not) to do".
Putin on the other hand must be furious about these statements.
There are so many leaks in the Kremlin that it would come out way sooner than the planned date to fire a wmd, and the media would be all over it and the plausible deniability would be gone. At that point the world would know the Russians are attempting this
I'm not sure Wagner would be able to use any nuclear weapons they just "stumbled over", and hence difficult to blame if something happened. I suppose also Russia has strict security measures to make sure only authorised persons can use them.
Exactly. Everyone knows Blackwater are American. Nobody is under any illusions about Wagner either.
30 more Bradleys.
Radiation as in radio - used to seek jammers and those big dishes I think. Not some anti nuke!
Ah, thank you.
If it's any help: there are actually non-state Russian units active in Ukraine. Big companies (like Gazprom) have set up their own armies consisting of employees, and then there are some militias as well. That's been growing, from what I read, and I would make sense if the Russian MoD would try to align and better coordinate their activities by putting them under central comment. Obviously, Wagner would have been the central target of that effort - but not the only one.
Theory #12. The drive to Moscow was a signal to Putin. Not primarily from Wagner, but from the RA. He, not Prigoshin, is on a short leash. Wagner drove Xkm towards the capital with impunity. Putin cowered. The intervention by Lukashenko was the idea of somebody else, thus the sense of him playing a role, and the phoney transparency. Putin does not control most of the armed forces any more. The Putin-loyal elements in the MOD are being isolated and pressured. For now, Putin can remain in place. But much diminished. For now, this arrangement suits his enemies better than a full-blown coup, confrontation, etc
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Am I the only one who find it funny how quickly Putin escaped the capital, as soon as there was some trouble. Some hero eh, at the first sight of domestic trouble he runs like a rabbit.
There were times, when it was hard, or better said harder to prove Russia/Putin is lying. It seems that he doesn't care at all about hiding his lies anymore.
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This is the man who amassed an army on the border and directly denied he was going to invade Ukraine. Nothing, I repeat, nothing he says should have any bearing on what people think is true or not. He can say whatever he wants, it is all just words now, an old bumbling man arguing with other old men whilst the young men of the country he professes to serve are slaughtered in the hundreds of thousands.
The quotes don’t make any sense given that Surovkin has already been removed from his role leading the Ukrainian campaign. The information could actually be legit and he did know about it given that there was a spike in communication between Wagner and MOD the night before the rebellion.
I'm not sure that's necessarily right. Why would anyone want to back what will ultimately be the losing side? If Putin's downfall has begun, siding with him puts you in a perilous position when whomever comes out on top looks to "clean house" of anyone he fears may not be on his side.
Self-interest for all involved will dictate who they back and what they do. The Chinese have walked a very careful line. They have not backed Putin in any meaningful sense. PR photos and rhetoric have not equalled military or political backing and have no positive impact on the front lines. China will do what is best for China and they'll happily cosy up to Putin's successor when the time comes if that's in their interests.,
Remvoing him even further would still be nice.
And yes it is well possible that he knew about it. Both Surovikin and Prigozhin were more or less sidelined by the MoD, so maybe they talked to each other about their frustration and possible actions?
Take it with a grain of salt, because it wouldn't be the first time twitter accounts prematurely announced arrests/dismissals of Russian generals:
But I wouldn't be surprised if Putin launched a cleansing. There have to be people in high positions backing Prigozhin, if he could have driven 700 km inside Russia without meaningful resistance. To be honest, Surovikin looked already like a prisoner, when he sat in front of that table and urged Wagner to stop their colum.
But I wouldn't be surprised if Putin launched a cleansing. There have to be people in high positions backing Prigozhin, if he could have driven 700 km inside Russia without meaningful resistance. To be honest, Surovikin looked already like a prisoner, when he sat in front of that table and urged Wagner to stop their colum.
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Lefortovo prison is no joke. Quite the history to it.
True. Also, Wagner is inherently an MOD funded operation so it stands to reason Prigozhin communicates with Generals he deems he can work with. Even more so if he sought tacit agreements from people at MOD if he came to Moscow.