I pretty much always stand with manager. Manager needs time. But he is one of few where I’m thinking this job is way over his head. What I can’t understand and what is the biggest problem is that he is so allergic to changing system. He is to stubborn and when you don’t have any flexibility it becomes problem.
Ruben Amorim - Manchester United Head Coach
- Thread starter sewey89
- Start date
Amorim "weakened" the squad himself though, so presumably he thought he'd improve things by letting players leave. Instead he's arsed it.
The players he removed need to go in the summer anyway.
I'm in the same boat mate. I don't trust any of them yet myself. And I still think Ten Hag had his finger prints all over last summers window. Though most them have been decent for us so far to be fair.
Antony is for me 90% on Ten Hag, Hojlund and Zirkzee who knows.
Pochettino, I really like him and think that he fits perfectly for what we need. In hindsight, should have replace Ten Hag in the summer. Still, isn’t available as you know.
Xavi, I know he won la Liga and a cup but let’s be honest it was a very underwhelming league campaign that year, even though he was a legend, fans wanted him gone and the environment was very toxic. Not exciting to watch either. I would like to see him more in the future, the United job is too soon for me.
Now Valverde is a good one actually, very intense and attacking. Proven over the years in Spain with different clubs, even with a top one like Barca. I’ll give you that one.
But as you can see it’s a very slim list, not many out there. That’s why we need to stick with Amorim. A couple of specific signings, not as much as people think, a good prea-season and we will be much better.
Again, it's all well and good coming in with a plan, but when you clearly don't have the players for the plan. Then clearly the bunch you have, you aim to get rid. So why is he still concerned on using the tactics. It's not working.
We have no scorer more than 6 in the team. Martinez and MDL have the same amount of goals has Hojlund (2). Zirkzee (3). Maybe come up with a plan that will somewhat help the team get through the Europa League and try win it. Gather up early to implement the new tactics in the summer and get the signings done early?
We have no scorer more than 6 in the team. Martinez and MDL have the same amount of goals has Hojlund (2). Zirkzee (3). Maybe come up with a plan that will somewhat help the team get through the Europa League and try win it. Gather up early to implement the new tactics in the summer and get the signings done early?
He is in a lose/lose, situation, but I am dissappointed that he has not gotten more out of this group of players. He is really not a pragmatic coach, inflexible in so many ways, which can be both a good and bad thing. When he saw that he isn't getting the backing, doesn't have the skilled players for his style, I really think he could have adopted a more 'half way approach' for this season. I am not talking about a 433, but going to a back 5 and playing on the counter when needed - I honestly think this would have had us top 6.
I honestly think that playing with a back 5 this year, with a more counter attacking style, would have allowed us to stay more than relevant in the league, as well as the cups - and European football next season. This would have given us a huge stepping stone to allow him to bring in new faces in the summer and further implement the attacking style he actually wants. As it stands, he has hardly done enough to show he should be allowed to rebuild the team as he wants them.
I am behind him, I like him the most of our recent manager - but it will only work if he actually gets the real backing he needs in the summer, which with this shower of owners, looks highly unlikely. I hate to say it, but he is the right manager with the wrong owners.
However, I really don't see an alternative.
I honestly think that playing with a back 5 this year, with a more counter attacking style, would have allowed us to stay more than relevant in the league, as well as the cups - and European football next season. This would have given us a huge stepping stone to allow him to bring in new faces in the summer and further implement the attacking style he actually wants. As it stands, he has hardly done enough to show he should be allowed to rebuild the team as he wants them.
I am behind him, I like him the most of our recent manager - but it will only work if he actually gets the real backing he needs in the summer, which with this shower of owners, looks highly unlikely. I hate to say it, but he is the right manager with the wrong owners.
However, I really don't see an alternative.
If you watched the game yesterday and you come out with the conclusion that our biggest problem is Dalot at LWB, especially in yesterday’s game, either football is not for you or your obsession with Dalot is reaching unhealthy levels.
Amorim played 16 PL games so far. His average is still below Ten Hag‘s 9 PL games.
Well I think the whole toxic environment and downing tools thing is overblown. These players are trying and I think they tried for Ten Hag as well. We're just siffering right now because of a lot of factors.
The culture in a squad is set by the manager so if it's bad then that's largely on the manager.
If this guy was a brick layer The Glazers would have given him a knife and fork to build a wall.
Hes not the problem the squad isn't good enough or fit enough.. he's had to go to the under 21s and play 17 18 19 yrs old boys .
If the club do not back him with players he needs in the summer he's in for a hiding again next season..
Hes not the problem the squad isn't good enough or fit enough.. he's had to go to the under 21s and play 17 18 19 yrs old boys .
If the club do not back him with players he needs in the summer he's in for a hiding again next season..
Well, we’ve seen enough now to make it clear that this is just a very, very poorly thought-out appointment. An unproven coach from a weaker league with a rigid system forced upon a squad that is as bad a fit as you can imagine. He doesn’t know how to fix it, and it is unlikely it even can be fixed. Anyone who knows ball will see that most of this squad will have to be replaced just to accommodate this style of play. Yet the club doesn’t have the funds to do this, and neither do the owners. The best that can be done is to look for cheap, young players that fit this system, but even then, it will take years to recruit everyone and has a low chance of success. Only clubs with a lot of experience and a successful recruitment history can find such players consistently, and United aren’t that sort of club, so the chances of building a proper team this way aren’t great. The struggle will be compounded by the lack of European competition for the foreseeable future. A specific system like that would also require continuity, with the next coach playing in the same or similar way, which would significantly limit the number of candidates.
I will indulge in some speculation, but I think it is quite clear where the issue comes from. Amorim would have slotted into City perfectly, and they must have had him marked as Guardiola’s eventual successor. Berrada must have thought that because they rated him there, he is good enough for United, but he horribly misjudged the situation. United don’t have City’s squad and club structure, or their financial strength, so what would have worked there wouldn’t work here. It seems the club should have gone the pragmatic way until the financial situation can be improved and the club can be steadied. I also think this is what caused friction with Ashworth, who recognized this and would have gone this way instead. He wanted Frank, who can work on a string budget and with what’s available, which now makes sense, and I myself will have to eat a crow as I was pretty despondent at that prospect, but I can see the wisdom in it now.
I like Amorim and I think he is good coach, and I appreciate him sticking to his philosophy, but for what it’s worth, I don’t think he will be manager next season. Club and manager are an extremely bad fit at this time and I think it is likely both sides will reach the same conclusion sooner rather than later. It seems Amorim is already aware of this, because otherwise it makes no sense to throw the players, bad as they are, under the bus publicly, considering he would be relying on this squad for the next two seasons at least.
The bigger issue however is that this exposes the INEOS group as just completely lost. They seem to have… good intentions but lack the knowledge, competency and resources for a project of this size. Something that many people suspected during the bidding process. I still think the situation with Ashworth was the biggest red flag you could possibly ask for. Dark days ahead.
I will indulge in some speculation, but I think it is quite clear where the issue comes from. Amorim would have slotted into City perfectly, and they must have had him marked as Guardiola’s eventual successor. Berrada must have thought that because they rated him there, he is good enough for United, but he horribly misjudged the situation. United don’t have City’s squad and club structure, or their financial strength, so what would have worked there wouldn’t work here. It seems the club should have gone the pragmatic way until the financial situation can be improved and the club can be steadied. I also think this is what caused friction with Ashworth, who recognized this and would have gone this way instead. He wanted Frank, who can work on a string budget and with what’s available, which now makes sense, and I myself will have to eat a crow as I was pretty despondent at that prospect, but I can see the wisdom in it now.
I like Amorim and I think he is good coach, and I appreciate him sticking to his philosophy, but for what it’s worth, I don’t think he will be manager next season. Club and manager are an extremely bad fit at this time and I think it is likely both sides will reach the same conclusion sooner rather than later. It seems Amorim is already aware of this, because otherwise it makes no sense to throw the players, bad as they are, under the bus publicly, considering he would be relying on this squad for the next two seasons at least.
The bigger issue however is that this exposes the INEOS group as just completely lost. They seem to have… good intentions but lack the knowledge, competency and resources for a project of this size. Something that many people suspected during the bidding process. I still think the situation with Ashworth was the biggest red flag you could possibly ask for. Dark days ahead.
The media are turning on him.
I would like to see Garnacho replacing one of the WBs.
I would like to see Garnacho replacing one of the WBs.
Only 5 of those players have played under multiple managers. The rest were signed within the last 2 seasons by Ten Hag.
Pretty depressing right? Amad’s injury has screwed us - although he didn’t play him at WB lately!
I'd really like the senior management to make a statement that no matter what, Amorim will be in charge at the end of next season, no matter what, and if you don't like it, poke it up your hole.
Be worth it to see all the snow flakes on here in tears
Be worth it to see all the snow flakes on here in tears
Shearer asked the rhetorical question today, where would United be without Bruno. I think that the answer is in the bottom three.
Im suprised he hasnt been sacked yet, he should've been relieved of his duties first thing this morning so we could have someone else in place in time for the game with Sociadad on Thursday
That kind of declarative statement would never happen, with any manager
Well the RA bubble didnt take long to burst, he's only been here a couple of months, if we start next season on similar fashion then fair enough, but at least give him a chance, this season went downhill early doors and the squad is the worst post SAF
Onana 10m
Rashford 40m
Antony 20m
IF they are prepared to take pay cuts, which is not a given.
Not easy to do a rebuild without any money. We are stuck in spot 10-15 for some time.
Can we afford to sack him? Our board is probably the worst in football but they will have to make a decision in May.
I'm not Bruno's biggest fan but Shearer ain't wrong.
Yup. The only tangible thing we can hope for, in this mess, is that Zirkzee develops an understanding with Garnacho, so these two can recreate the Martial-Rashford link-up on the left side. I think it happened once or twice yesterday. I can't see anything else in the final third with the available players (besides Bruno hitting balls in-behind to whoever decides to make a run).
Antony, Lindelof, Eriksen and Evans are end of bench players. Mount has never been a thing for United, Shaw hasn't been a thing in several years. In your list the only relevant players are Rashford, Onana and Martinez. We aren't actually in a rush to replace Onana even if it would be welcomed.
Your list isn't special either, in 2022 we lost:
Pereira
Garner
Pogba
Cavani
Matic
Lingard
Bailly
Telles
Ronaldo
Henderson
Which takes? Let’s discuss! I know some of our resident Dutch fans haven’t liked what I’ve had to say over the last 12 months or so, but I don’t see anything wrong in what I’ve said in the quoted post. If I have, let’s hear it.
Ten Hag got away with murder in practically every game it felt like last season. That’s why the stats had us as being around 14th place in the league. And guess what, he got a fit squad this season with an extra £200m in signings and had us in….*checks notes*…14th place! What a surprise. And how about the Europa League? Practically getting knocked out of a competition where it is set up to make it very difficult to get knocked out. Some achievement with his £600m team (plus all the inherited players and youngsters, who are better than all of his signings pretty much). Don’t talk to me about Ten Hag.
De Ligt and Mazraoui are as average as I expected them to be.
Do we know this for a fact on the Antony one? Or did the club push the deal through to save on £££.
There is no manager who can turn that around. Whoever you bring in needs a blank slate.
He wouldn't necessarily need to do that though - people need to get their head around the WBs being Wingers not Full backs, it's been shown on here enough times. This is Palace in possession, how does that position not suit Garnacho, it's his bread and butter?
You can see broadly similar with all 3 at the back coaches, including Amorim at Sporting:
Get him in either WB role, I would prefer RWB as he will shoot less, and just let him attack. We get countered all the time anyway, it's not like playing FBs as WBs has stopped that happening.
I see absolutely no world where Diogo Dalot isn’t an important player for this manager and his system. I imagine a lot of our fans will be in for a shock when he’s still starting next season.
It’s interesting really as, when he came in, all the journalists were telling him these players are crap, and he said he didn’t believe it and he thinks they are capable of playing better. I remember him saying we’ll see who is correct in time. None of this was a bad approach at the time given he had to work with these players and he likely knew there would be no investment in January, or very little.
But fast forward a few months and our struggles are suddenly all on him. Seems that the players are going to get away with it yet again. They might not be all the same players, but very little of them are good enough to play for Manchester United, that much is not clear. 2 (or more in some cases) coaches, 2 completely different approaches, and the same results. And yet the players are almost being excused by the fans.
But fast forward a few months and our struggles are suddenly all on him. Seems that the players are going to get away with it yet again. They might not be all the same players, but very little of them are good enough to play for Manchester United, that much is not clear. 2 (or more in some cases) coaches, 2 completely different approaches, and the same results. And yet the players are almost being excused by the fans.
Bring in someone like Allegri until tbe end of the season, we are now at the point where the Europa League is our last hope of qualifying for Europe and being able to spend in the summer so we need be doing whatever we can to give us the best chance of winning it including replacing the manager.
Amorim said that they were all his decisions (Rashford, Antony and Malacia loans) so I think he has to shoulder the blame.
I think the level and the intensity of the PL has scared the manager from playing wingers in wingback positions. Amad’s the only one he’s done and his general preference since joining has been to play fullbacks there.He wouldn't necessarily need to do that though - people need to get their head around the WBs being Wingers not Full backs, it's been shown on here enough times. This is Palace in possession, how does that position not suit Garnacho, it's his bread and butter?
You can see broadly similar with all 3 at the back coaches, including Amorim at Sporting:
Get him in either WB role, I would prefer RWB as he will shoot less, and just let him attack. We get countered all the time anyway, it's not like playing FBs as WBs has stopped that happening.
I realise this, i just want frozen snowflake tears before bedtime
Folk need to knuckle down and stop fecking whining
The 'blame' for letting 3 players go that 95% of fans wanted gone from the club... okay then
Unreal
All those WBs you mention get caught out, that's just the nature of being a WB, it's not like they have some unattainable level of fitness our players can only dream of. Garnacho does actually run a decent amount, I remember that was a big thing highlighted from 22/23 to 23/24 with him, that he actually was grafting on his flank. He's not lazy, just selfish, and given Ruben wants us to keep the ball and be quite boring that limits how much he'd have to be up and down in transition, which is the hard bit.
The reason you get the impression, which I thin is fair on this season, that he is a one trick pony is because that's all he's ever needed to do + the same happened with Rashford. United have played basic counter football for a while, the wide attackers try and get one on one and cut inside, we don't overlap full backs, we don't really do much crossing, it's just recycle the ball, feed a fast man and cross your fingers. I thikn he's young enough to improve his all round game and be a good player.
Our squad obviously isn't up to scratch, but what makes you so certain Amorim is good enough to manage Manchester United? Two things can be true at the same time, creating the mess we're currently in. We've hired two system managers simultaneously from much weaker leagues. Both hirings have been huge gambles.
Neither players are key for anything, they are end of bench options. I don't deny the idea the we will need to replace them one way or the other butt these type of squad players aren't key to a rebuild they are a dime a dozen and in many cases they should be replaced by youth players. Eriksen should be replaced by Collyer and Lindelof by someone like Heaven. Antony has basically been replaced by Dorgu while Sancho has been replaced by Amad last summer.
Now I agree with a term that you used, you mainly listed "bodies", it's not an unprecedented rebuild whether we are talking about numbers and even less if we are talking about quality.
Based on what? He’s signed a new LWB, and it looks like he wants Quenda. How do you see it going? Dalot is better than he’s showing and was possibly our best player last season. If he gets back to that level then I’d have no problems. But he isn’t going to be happy with his output this season.