Ruben Amorim - Manchester United Head Coach

[Robbie Boy]

Babe, @simonhch has dropped a long post!

 

[#07]

Saying Amorim could be sacked before the summer means nothing though. It’s stating the bleeding obvious. If we don’t win another game all season and he has a massive fall out with Jim then he will 100% be sacked. I can state this without any inside knowledge at all. We all knew it was possible he might not last the season long before Jamie Jackson got involved.

All true.

Doesn't change the fact the Manchester press pack have often refused to state the obvious, for fear of upsetting the club's comms department, and then acted wise after the event.

Usually goes from absolute denial to received wisdom after the fact. Jamie being willing to entertain the possibility, rather than talk up how Amorim is the club's man, is an interesting development.

 

[CM]

Whatever you think of him, Jamie's still a core part of the Manchester press pack. The fact he feels bold enough to come out and say Amorim could be gone by summer is significant, even if we don't entirely believe it.

These journalists trade in access. Their lifeblood is the club. If they get cut out they're worth little to nothing to their employers. I seriously doubt Jamie would be saying this stuff if he thought there would be massive blowback from within Man Utd for doing so. He does not want to be blacklisted. From that I think its an idea going around that, at the very least, his sources aren't warning him about giving air to.

Amorim being sacked is obviously a possibility if results continue as they are long-term but Jackson has consistently been chatting bollocks for ages now.

I haven't bothered to click the link or watch the video but from reading some of his previous articles, I feel confident in saying it won't be part of a researched story and will just be him pushing an opinion for a cheap headline grab. He doesn't have any integrity as a journalist.

 

[Garethw]

All true.

Doesn't change the fact the Manchester press pack have often refused to state the obvious, for fear of upsetting the club's comms department, and then acted wise after the event.

Usually goes from absolute denial to received wisdom after the fact. Jamie being willing to entertain the possibility, rather than talk up how Amorim is the club's man, is an interesting development.

If in February we have another month like December results wise I think he’ll be gone.

 

[dubplate warrior]

We have to give him time. First step is to build a “Chelsea level” squad within two years and after that we need be patient for another couple of years in order to be competitive for gold in PL.

All managerial changes delays our success. I think we would’ve been at a better place if example Rangnick was still in charge. ETH was an exception. Worst manager in United history. He had to leave. He left a messy squad.

100% agree.

Chelsea have shown the model we need to replicate. Get rid of the squad, including some popular players and building from the ground up again by aggressively going for anyone who looks good and is young for this specific style of play. You'd have hoped by the end of this we would be in a much better position.

The real question is how much can we actually spend? If the finances are as bad as they say, then the likes of Garnacho are important to sell.

 

[dubplate warrior]

Whatever you think of him, Jamie's still a core part of the Manchester press pack. The fact he feels bold enough to come out and say Amorim could be gone by summer is significant, even if we don't entirely believe it.

These journalists trade in access. Their lifeblood is the club. If they get cut out they're worth little to nothing to their employers. I seriously doubt Jamie would be saying this stuff if he thought there would be massive blowback from within Man Utd for doing so. He does not want to be blacklisted. From that I think its an idea going around that, at the very least, his sources aren't warning him about giving air to.

He is one of the least reliable journalists covering United out there, super surprising that he's employed at the guardian as the other hacks have far more reliable journos.

 

[soapythecat]

If in February we have another month like December results wise I think he’ll be gone.

I think it will depend on what happens below us. If Everton, Wolves and Ipswich start picking up more points then come another 3/4 defeats I think he’s in trouble. Like the rest of us, they will give him the season to finish, but if we get close lr to the bottom 3 with no improvements on the pitch (which we are yet to see) then he’s gone. This would be fecking disastrous for the club moving forward and would set us back years.

 

[Adisa]

I hate to be the bearer of bad news but I think he’s fecked. Much like others that have come before him but the job is impossible. We are fecked as a club for the foreseeable.

 

[DJ_21]

I hate to be the bearer of bad news but I think he’s fecked. Much like others that have come before him but the job is impossible. We are fecked as a club for the foreseeable.

I disagree. Amorim is completely different to the managers before him. He’s also still very young but he as a clear idea and will work very hard to make sure it works. Let’s not judge the guy until he gets a pre season, some signings of his own and a full season. Miracles don’t happen over night.

 

[DJ_21]

I think it will depend on what happens below us. If Everton, Wolves and Ipswich start picking up more points then come another 3/4 defeats I think he’s in trouble. Like the rest of us, they will give him the season to finish, but if we get close lr to the bottom 3 with no improvements on the pitch (which we are yet to see) then he’s gone. This would be fecking disastrous for the club moving forward and would set us back years.

I don’t think the club can afford to sack another manager. Especially with PSR. We made a mistake by keeper ETH longer and signing him to a longer contract.

 

[Cathy Ferguson]

I hate to be the bearer of bad news but I think he’s fecked. Much like others that have come before him but the job is impossible. We are fecked as a club for the foreseeable.

Most likely. We struggle for goals and are easy to score against. Our strikers and wingbacks are really poor. Difficult to move on players not good enough is also an issue.

 

[Adisa]

I disagree. Amorim is completely different to the managers before him. He’s also still very young but he as a clear idea and will work very hard to make sure it works. Let’s not judge the guy until he gets a pre season, some signings of his own and a full season. Miracles don’t happen over night.

I’m not judging him. He’s fecked because of so many things outside his control.

 

[VP89]

I hate to be the bearer of bad news but I think he’s fecked. Much like others that have come before him but the job is impossible. We are fecked as a club for the foreseeable.

I think this is a bit much. He hasn't had a summer window or even a pre season yet. He's still in 2 cups to play for this season too

 

[DJ_21]

I’m not judging him. He’s fecked because of so many things outside his control.

Agree with that.

 

[GiveItToGi...nowait]

Most likely. We struggle for goals and are easy to score against. Our strikers and wingbacks are really poor. Difficult to move on players not good enough is also an issue.

Three first eleven players (ST, WB, CM or LCB) and we will be top 8 again challenging for top four.

 

[peridigm]

I don’t think the club can afford to sack another manager. Especially with PSR. We made a mistake by keeper ETH longer and signing him to a longer contract.

Hopefully this point makes the club stick with him, back him, and let him bring success. I don’t care where we finish the season as long as we’re not relegated and that is not going to happen.

 

[Woziak]

I hate to be the bearer of bad news but I think he’s fecked. Much like others that have come before him but the job is impossible. We are fecked as a club for the foreseeable.

Ok I’m still sitting on the fence with Amorim just because he’s had very little PL experience and his system has only ever won the PL once and that was with Conte, who then tried it again at Spurs and it failed miserably. Coincidentally, Conte now plays 433 at Napoli and has had to adapt after being just as stubborn as Amorim.

The job is not impossible, people said the same to Fergie after we went 26 years from 1968 to 1994 without a title, Fergie was under pressure in 1989 and nearly got sacked. Amorim is still learning the job and hopefully, he succeeds, he definitely has an indomitable spirit and will however he must as he said himself, calm down which is difficult because of his Latin heritage, it was good seeing him speak to Fergie the other day and hopefully he’s learning, having said all of that the club must find him 2/3 players this window and 5/6 in the summer to really impose his will on the team.

We must buy an elite Goal Scorer, a quality left wing back at the very least in the next week to give him the best chance to succeed.

 

[macheda14]

Whatever you think of him, Jamie's still a core part of the Manchester press pack. The fact he feels bold enough to come out and say Amorim could be gone by summer is significant, even if we don't entirely believe it.

These journalists trade in access. Their lifeblood is the club. If they get cut out they're worth little to nothing to their employers. I seriously doubt Jamie would be saying this stuff if he thought there would be massive blowback from within Man Utd for doing so. He does not want to be blacklisted. From that I think its an idea going around that, at the very least, his sources aren't warning him about giving air to.

Jamie always says incendiary stuff often without any sources. His access is limited to press conferences. Just because he’s one of the louder voices doesn’t mean he is informed.

 

[Cathy Ferguson]

Three first eleven players (ST, WB, CM or LCB) and we will be top 8 again challenging for top four.

More top 8 than top 4, but do we have the money and can we scout players? 110m did not buy us even a decent striker. You reason like we are competent run club. We are not.

 

[Rusholme Ruffian]

The internet gives a voice to all types I suppose. In previous eras we were much more confined to hearing opinions that more closely reflected our own, because you would choose who to surround yourself with. If, for example, this was 20 years ago and someone I knew was saying we should sack Amorim after 15 games, well....it's such a ridiculously hyperbolic, knee jerk reaction, that they probably wouldn't be the sort of person I'd be hanging around with; because to make such a suggestions, with any element of seriousness, one probably has to have some fairly seriously defective character traits or thinking pathways. These days, however, with the internet, you get these crazy opinions thrown in your face from all corners, and you start to wonder if people have always been this mental or if the internet has brought it out in them. Are people more emboldened by the anonymity these forums provide, to spout such nonsense? Would they feel too foolish to say this out loud to people who actually knew them, for fear of rightful ridicule? Or are they as clueless and tone-deaf in real life as they are online?

Just the idea that we should terminate Amorim's contract after a difficult beginning, when he has a herculean task on his hands, and the thought that such a move would lead to a better outcome in the medium or long term, is truly baffling. I think, the intelligent people I've discussed this with on this forum, all recognise that the club has gotten itself into such a state over the last decade, that at some point results almost have to be shelved in pursuit of a complete cultural, technical, and tactical reset at the club. Short term pain for long term gain. Again, with these same people, the agreement seems to be that these first six months under Amorim will be very difficult, because of the change in approach, the retooling of the squad, the bad habits that have to be drilled out of the players, the financial restrictions, the low confidence, the broken, toxic culture that needs resetting; and of course the highly competitive and ruthless nature of the modern Premier League. It's bandage ripping off time. We need to take that pain, instead of trying to paper over the cracks, to build a brighter, more sustainable future.

And even though I know people can be reactionary, it's almost quaint that I can still be unpleasantly surprised by the sheer level of impatience, lack of situational awareness, absence of critical and strategic thinking, and hysteria that creeps into so many posts in threads like these. I do thank those that continue to fight the good fight, by being realistic, practical, patient, and erudite in their understanding of not only football, but also leadership as a whole; but sometimes this place feels like going on a Trump forum to extoll the virtues of vaccination or renewable energy. You just know you are going to be bombarded with mouth frothing, untethered, delusional fantasies. The type where the author points the finger, but never provides any tangible solutions that stand up to any level of reasonable scrutiny.

Christ.

Amen brother

 

[Blood Mage]

He is undeniably under pressure, I don't get what's controversial about that? If we get a win tomorrow it buys him some time but if it's another loss he'll be getting close to dead man walking territory, especially if teams like Wolves and Ipswich win.

 

[Woziak]

He is undeniably under pressure, I don't get what's controversial about that? If we get a win tomorrow it buys him some time but if it's another loss he'll be getting close to dead man walking territory, especially if teams like Wolves and Ipswich win.

I genuinely think SJR is the worst owner for any new Manager to agree to coach our team. Ruben will get to game 28 In the PL that’s 6 more games, if he has 5 or 6 points from the those 6 games he’ll be gone.

He started in charge at game 12 with United having 15 points from 11 PL games, if he has 32 points from 28 games he’s gone!

You can’t manage Man United for more than 15 PL games and average 1 point per game, you have to be sacked it’s that simple a decision, and Berrada should go with him!

 

[Skills]

100% agree.

Chelsea have shown the model we need to replicate. Get rid of the squad, including some popular players and building from the ground up again by aggressively going for anyone who looks good and is young for this specific style of play. You'd have hoped by the end of this we would be in a much better position.

The real question is how much can we actually spend? If the finances are as bad as they say, then the likes of Garnacho are important to sell.

Chelsea aren't going for players "for a specific style of play" - that's absolute bullshit.

Chelsea's strategy is just about getting their hands on young talent, and then hoping that the talent will eventually pay off. They've had 4 different managers under this new strategy, each with their own styles and requirements.

Their strategy is the same as Real Madrid, eventually talent will pay for itself. You'll just need to churn through enough managers to find one that can make it work with what you've got.

 

[Skills]

I wouldn't sack him, even for me that'd be too shortsighted. Unlike all of our previous managers, I actually can't see much value in the squad. The CBs, Amad , Ugarte, Mainoo all have a role in this system - and I'd argue they're our better players anyway.

The players worth keeping or have a long term future, actually can play a role in his system. The positions where we need investment (LB, ST) will need us spending money anyway.

The situation with Garnacho is interesting because I can't see why he's not playing at LWB, if we're willing to throw Amad at RWB.

My long term concern for him though is, managers eventually need to adapt. I hope he's not too dogmatic, to not adapt long term. But for now, I'm not too arsed.

 

[Moriarty]

Saying Amorim could be sacked before the summer means nothing though. It’s stating the bleeding obvious. If we don’t win another game all season and he has a massive fall out with Jim then he will 100% be sacked. I can state this without any inside knowledge at all. We all knew it was possible he might not last the season long before Jamie Jackson got involved.

Assume for a moment that Amorim is sacked. Berrada should go with him and whoever else insisted it was "now or never" for Ruben. Why should they get a free pass?

 

[Leftback99]

He isn't getting sacked any time soon nor should he be.

They obviously didn't want to sack Ten Hag because of the cost, and now we're having to sell players to cover it. We haven't got enough of those that anyone wants.

 

[Giggsy13]

If Amorim is sacked before the summer, Berrada will be gone as well. Let’s use some sense here, it’s not a credible report; Jamie Jackson described as a gutter journalist by a fellow member, is accurate; and lastly, the cafe remains as naive and short sighted as ever.

 

[Garethw]

If Amorim is sacked before the summer, Berrada will be gone as well. Let’s use some sense here, it’s not a credible report; Jamie Jackson as described as a gutter journalist by a fellow member, is accurate; and lastly, the cafe remains as naive and short sighted as ever.

If the terrible form continues then relegation is a very real possibility. They’ll sack him in a heart beat if things don’t improve soon. Relegation would be catastrophic for the club.

 

[Shark]

He isn't getting sacked any time soon nor should he be.

They obviously didn't want to sack Ten Hag because of the cost, and now we're having to sell players to cover it. We haven't got enough of those that anyone wants.

If we continue losing PL games until the end of the season, he'll be sacked, no doubt. Nobody wants that to happen of course but we have to be realistic.

 

[Garethw]

He isn't getting sacked any time soon nor should he be.

They obviously didn't want to sack Ten Hag because of the cost, and now we're having to sell players to cover it. We haven't got enough of those that anyone wants.

If the form doesn’t pick up soon he’ll be gone and rightly so.

The players are not on board with his system at all. It’s plain as day they don’t buy into it.

A few more defeats and we are in a relegation battle.

 

[HookedOnAPhelan]

If the form doesn’t pick up soon he’ll be gone and rightly so.

The players are not on board with his system at all. It’s plain as day they don’t buy into it.

A few more defeats and we are in a relegation battle.

What's plain is that they're not very good players.

 

[Leftback99]

If the form doesn’t pick up soon he’ll be gone and rightly so.

The players are not on board with his system at all. It’s plain as day they don’t buy into it.

A few more defeats and we are in a relegation battle.

These players Ten Hag left aren't good enough for top half.

 

[Remember the geese]

If the form doesn’t pick up soon he’ll be gone and rightly so.

The players are not on board with his system at all. It’s plain as day they don’t buy into it.

A few more defeats and we are in a relegation battle.

Think about what you're saying. The players don't buy into his system? feck them! Also, no matter how many defeats we have, we aren't getting into a relegation battle. Neither Leicester or Ipswich are hitting 30 points.

 

[dubplate warrior]

Chelsea aren't going for players "for a specific style of play" - that's absolute bullshit.

Chelsea's strategy is just about getting their hands on young talent, and then hoping that the talent will eventually pay off. They've had 4 different managers under this new strategy, each with their own styles and requirements.

Their strategy is the same as Real Madrid, eventually talent will pay for itself. You'll just need to churn through enough managers to find one that can make it work with what you've got.

Sorry, when I refer the Chelsea model I mean just ripping it up and buying the best young talent.

Probably didn't word it well but we should be doing that exact thing for what suits the style of football we want to play.

 

[RedRoach]

Saying Amorim could be sacked before the summer means nothing though. It’s stating the bleeding obvious. If we don’t win another game all season and he has a massive fall out with Jim then he will 100% be sacked. I can state this without any inside knowledge at all. We all knew it was possible he might not last the season long before Jamie Jackson got involved.

Would have to be a colossal fallout since he cost 21 million to hire and would cost another 20 million to replace. Club can’t afford to waste 40 million on coach turnover.

Whoever was most involved in picking him as the coach is more likely to be in the firing line.

 

[dubplate warrior]

If the form doesn’t pick up soon he’ll be gone and rightly so.

The players are not on board with his system at all. It’s plain as day they don’t buy into it.

A few more defeats and we are in a relegation battle.

No, I think they're just not suitable for it, and they weren't very good to begin with.

People have short memories on here. We were 13th when he took over. Amorim has a distinct way of playing which requires a very specific profile to provide width. We don't have that. So the system will continue to falter and look terrible until we buy wingbacks.

There's no question in my mind that the season has already been written off, let's focus on starting afresh and backing this new project.

The idea of sacking him, when we bought him at the worst possible time, haven't bought him any players, no pre season is mental.

 

[Moriarty]

If Amorim is sacked before the summer, Berrada will be gone as well. Let’s use some sense here, it’s not a credible report; Jamie Jackson as described as a gutter journalist by a fellow member, is accurate; and lastly, the cafe remains as naive and short sighted as ever.

If the Guardian didn't have an online presence and was just a broadsheet, Jackson would be working for Murdoch. He's that level.

 

[Giggsy13]

If the terrible form continues then relegation is a very real possibility. They’ll sack him in a heart beat if things don’t improve soon. Relegation would be catastrophic for the club.

We aren’t getting relegated FFS.

 

[dubplate warrior]

If the terrible form continues then relegation is a very real possibility. They’ll sack him in a heart beat if things don’t improve soon. Relegation would be catastrophic for the club.

We're not getting relegated.

 

[Guv77]

These players Ten Hag left aren't good enough for top half.

Excuses, excuses