And what should we do when Iraola comes in and we keep on losing game after game? Because I would bet good money that's exactly what would happen. Almost guaranteed it would be.
Ruben Amorim - Manchester United Head Coach
- Thread starter sewey89
- Start date
And what should we do when Iraola comes in and we keep on losing game after game? Because I would bet good money that's exactly what would happen. Almost guaranteed it would be.
United will spend well over £150m, like they do every summer.
When Amad plays as a right wing back, we tend to do ok. When he plays as the #10, we are crap.
They knew about his tactics which is why they didn't want him as the squad was not built for his football, not sure it was built for anybodies football. ETH built a squad even he struggled to get a tune out of. They apparently interviewed loads of manager but couldn't find what they wanted or other turned them down. What the hell they do want I have no idea. Probably to spend as little money as possible. That is the mess ETH, Murtough and Co and now Ineos have left us in. I don't know what they promised Ruben, but they should have either got him in last summer and started overhauling the squad then, or let him come in next summer. They have made a right old dogs dinner of it.
Sporting was still poor in 2 out of the 4 and a half seasons with Amorim in charge (namely the 1st and 3rd seasons).
I still think Amorim is a good manager and can get Utd up there given enough time and budget, but the results so far have been way beyond bad.
It should have never gotten this bad, so the fans are starting to question him, rightfully so.
Probably the board is having doubts as well.
Maybe that's why we're half way through January and nobody has been signed yet to improve the squad.
Caveat: I really like Amorim and I am desperate for him to succeed. I like how he wants to play and I love his manner.
But...
We must be realistic here. Ratcliffe is not going to let him spend £200m+ building a new team if he can't at least get better results with these players. They are nowhere near title winning level, but they are top half at the very least.
Also, #10's and pure wingbacks are not players you commonly find nowadays, especially in the PL. If Amorim's system doesn't work in England we'll be stuck with another load of misfit players when he leaves.
An element of pragmatism must be needed here too? At the moment he's just mirroring Ange at Spurs, and look how that's going... elite managers are always very adaptable.
It would be better if he started off with whatever formation suited our best players, and then slowly adapted that to his preferred system. You could argue this 3-4-2-1 is tunnel vision and that's never a good thing.
But...
We must be realistic here. Ratcliffe is not going to let him spend £200m+ building a new team if he can't at least get better results with these players. They are nowhere near title winning level, but they are top half at the very least.
Also, #10's and pure wingbacks are not players you commonly find nowadays, especially in the PL. If Amorim's system doesn't work in England we'll be stuck with another load of misfit players when he leaves.
An element of pragmatism must be needed here too? At the moment he's just mirroring Ange at Spurs, and look how that's going... elite managers are always very adaptable.
It would be better if he started off with whatever formation suited our best players, and then slowly adapted that to his preferred system. You could argue this 3-4-2-1 is tunnel vision and that's never a good thing.
You’re absolutely off your tits if you think Pep would have ever started off this poorly.
Looks spectacularly out of his depth. Lucky to beat Soton and dominated today, Brighton probably should have scored more.
Really want it to work out for him, speaks well and looks the part but I’m struggling to see a single benefit or positive he’s brought up to now.
I know he wants to stick to his principles but we’ve got to concede less and score more, it’s not difficult, the current method/style isn’t working and his insistence to stick to it is making him look stupid.
Really want it to work out for him, speaks well and looks the part but I’m struggling to see a single benefit or positive he’s brought up to now.
I know he wants to stick to his principles but we’ve got to concede less and score more, it’s not difficult, the current method/style isn’t working and his insistence to stick to it is making him look stupid.
Optimistic . Can't see them spending money in the summer unless Garnacho and Mainoo get sold for a lot of money.
Amad was playing as a #10 when he scored.
He started as RWB but him and Antony changed positions at the end of the game.
I think we appointed the wrong man, we dont have the players to play his 1 way of playing and we cant sign him any players as we have no money so this just isnt going to work out.
I do not agree with his continued use of Dalot and Maz as wing backs, especially in games like today. It simply doesn’t work and is a hinderance.
I understand Amorim when he says over and over that it's going to take time. It makes good sense that we will have a period where we are going to get a little bit worse results while the players get to know his very different system and tactics and he gets to know the club and the league.
But it must never, ever be as bad as it is now. It is completely unheard of. We lose almost every game at Oldtrafford, we create no chances for the attackers and we are scored against in every game except against Everton.
We almost look like Southampton.
But it must never, ever be as bad as it is now. It is completely unheard of. We lose almost every game at Oldtrafford, we create no chances for the attackers and we are scored against in every game except against Everton.
We almost look like Southampton.
You really are. We have made great progress under Ruben. We lost today in a super tight game. Another of his wasteful signings ruined the game. Under ETH, we would be outplayed for 80 minutes for every game and you would continue to praise how brilliant we play during a 10-15min period. Pathetic!
Said it after Newcastle, Amorim's time was up. Two fortunate draws against Liverpool and Arsenal in the cup, in which we should have probably lost both, and limping past a Southampton team that is set to rival the worst Premier League teams of all time hasn't changed my mind and today has confirmed it. He's tactically inept, his plan A is so aesthetically woeful, he has no plan B and we're sat on one win (in normal time) in eight with no clue how to keep a clean sheet.
Ten Hag played in a way to suit them and we were still fecking shite.
But the problem now is Ruben's system...
Okay.
But the problem now is Ruben's system...
Okay.
Thanks for making me laugh
He has inherited a side that cannot concentrate consistently on the dual task of defence and attack for 90 mins. Till he has a pre season with them to be able to drill into them a new standard of mentality. Naught will change. We will remain the league goal Santa claus and tread water. Doing well one week flopping the next.
Large amount of people that watched the game vs Southampton expected this to be a tough game and more likely than not a defeat. Amorim is partly to blame but unless it gets worse he'll be safe. Liverpool away was most promising performance of his tenure so far and he has to make sure those kind of performances get repeated, at least from time to time.
Why was Liverpool draw lucky one? Arsenal was to some extent but most of their chances (except one) came after Dalot got sent off.
I still think this bloke has shown a lot more to be hopeful of. I can’t understand the ones who are saying he’s the wrong man already? It just seems like a mental opinion.
Were you living under a rock during Pep's LLLLLDL run this season? That was with some of the best players in the world at his disposal.
I think senior management need to step in now and set him a (private) ultimatum. 8 points minimum from the next five league games.
Fulham (a)
Palace (h)
Spurs (a)
Everton (a)
Ipswich (h)
Fulham (a)
Palace (h)
Spurs (a)
Everton (a)
Ipswich (h)
Of course someone may have done better so far but I assume he has been brought in to oversee wholesale change, which is exactly what we need. Anyone trying to to do that is going to struggle, it’s why every other manager reverted to pragmatism, counter attacking and defending deeper.
At some point you have to go back to the drawing board and start again, we’ve spent a long time playing a back 4 and not been very good but our fundamental problems extend way beyond the formation.
With consistently lower income due to not being in the CL, huge money wasted on terrible signings with no resale value and big money payoffs for disastrous managers, the ability to do that 'every summer' has gone.
We’ll see.
I’ve never known a manager to be so wedded to a system.
You look at that game today and think that any decent manager would have removed a defender to add another player into midfield to try and get control of the game.
I can’t see him surviving the season unless he learns to adapt. That doesn’t mean he has to abandon his principles either. It just means that he needs to be more willing to change things when they aren’t working.
Hmm. Not convinced by his system at all. We have become even worse than we were under ETH. One would think it would make us solid at the back even if our attack sucked yet we are still conceding 2-3 goals on the regular. Also, seems like people have convinced themselves that our squad is relegation quality and are completely absolving him of any blame.
He was brought in to get better performances and results than we had under ETH and he's completely failing at that. I'm not sure if he should be trusted with money unless he can start getting better performances from the current lot.
Number one thing any new coach should be doing is getting better performances from the players he has at his disposal. I'm not sure if even a single player has improved because of him or his system. Something has to give.
He was brought in to get better performances and results than we had under ETH and he's completely failing at that. I'm not sure if he should be trusted with money unless he can start getting better performances from the current lot.
Number one thing any new coach should be doing is getting better performances from the players he has at his disposal. I'm not sure if even a single player has improved because of him or his system. Something has to give.
Caveat: I really like Amorim and I am desperate for him to succeed. I like how he wants to play and I love his manner.
But...
We must be realistic here. Ratcliffe is not going to let him spend £200m+ building a new team if he can't at least get better results with these players. They are nowhere near title winning level, but they are top half at the very least.
Also, #10's and pure wingbacks are not players you commonly find nowadays, especially in the PL. If Amorim's system doesn't work in England we'll be stuck with another load of misfit players when he leaves.
An element of pragmatism must be needed here too? At the moment he's just mirroring Ange at Spurs, and look how that's going... elite managers are always very adaptable.
It would be better if he started off with whatever formation suited our best players, and then slowly adapted that to his preferred system. You could argue this 3-4-2-1 is tunnel vision and that's never a good thing.
I agree with this and I would not be surprised if Amorim is gone by July.
It feels clear that our exec team actually does not have a long term plan, or any real idea of how to make short term decisions that might produce short term positive results. As you point out, this is all leading to a decision where the club is either going to have to spend vast sums of money retooling the team or just accept the inevitible results that will come from trying to play Amorim's way without giving him the players for it.
Given how they've approached cost cutting, as well as the fact they only gave Amorim a 2 and a bit year contract, you can easily see INEOS deciding this has all been a mistake. Look at Nice. None of their coaches there have lasted very long. We shouldn't expect much different at United.
Wouldn't be surprised if Berrada and Wilcox follow Amorim out if we end up firing him. Sir Jim is going to blame anyone involved in the hiring if it comes to pot.
We are not making great progress
You won't find many here that would agree with you that we are "making great progress". We have picked up 4 points in our last 6 league games, the majority of which have been at Old Trafford.Forget Ten Hag for a second (even though we never hit a low in form with him quite like we are in now) - we should be doing a lot better than we are in these games.
Today we were lethargic, slow, scared to play, passive. It was the same in all the other games bar Liverpool and Arsenal. Mainoo and Garnacho also look like worse players now. Yorro looks shit. There's not a lot of positives at all. The only positive is that it should get better but that doesn't excuse his form right now.
It’s bonkers. Negative shite.
I’m open to this opinion but who is the right man? Is there a manager in world football that can get a tune out of this collection of players?
Can only see us beating Ipswich at home on current form. Fulham are better than us right now, Palace are improving. Everton have got a new manager in, and by the time we play Spurs they might have a new manager.
Do you think that a bad team gets better by using a system and formation that they can not play in?
I like him a hell of a lot more than ETH but it’s not working and it’s not working because he’s not accepting certain players can’t play in this set up.
The problem isn’t the system. It’s the players. But if he hasn’t figured out by now that
- Mazraoui and Dalot aren’t wing backs
- Mainoo cannot play in a two man midfield
Then he’s gonna find himself hanging onto his job sooner rather than later. As much as this season is a right off. We can’t just be not winning games.
The problem isn’t the system. It’s the players. But if he hasn’t figured out by now that
- Mazraoui and Dalot aren’t wing backs
- Mainoo cannot play in a two man midfield
Then he’s gonna find himself hanging onto his job sooner rather than later. As much as this season is a right off. We can’t just be not winning games.
Honest question, why do you think this is the case? He is achieving similar results to what ETH did, if I’m not mistaken. We were 14th when he was fired and that’s just about where we are now.
The squad is dire. Just awful. It’s filled with massive, massive problems. We have a goalkeeper that gives away goals, defenders that can’t defend, a midfield that can’t compete, no goalscorers, and no left footed back.
Fair to criticize Amorim for individual decisions, tactics, etc., but he is working with absolute dogshit. The narrative is that United can’t be 13th because it’s United. But are we really far off having the 13th best squad in the league? Without doing the individual assessment, I’d say there are probably 9-10 better starting XIs in the PL right now.
I fail to get they we haven't tried Antony and Amad at wing backs.
Well, yes, we need to see some improvement. Fast.
Yeah the whole point of a manager coming in mid season is to improve the results. Really we could have just kept Ten Hag for the rest of the season and hired Amorim next summer with a full pre season and his own players rather than what we’re doing now because the results are no different.
Or what we sack him?
Can’t believe we’ve got people who think he should be given the boot soon. Love to know what absolute idiot people would like to see replace him and try and serve something decent up with the slop he has to use.If they can't play well in their preferred system/formation what on earth are you talking about?