Think the problem has been less the defeats and more the nature of the losses. Continually losing games by multiple goals and being outclassed by teams United are supposed to be better than. It's all well and good to have faith in a playing style but results will genuinely need to improve soon or that isn't going to cut it.
Ruben Amorim - Manchester United Head Coach
- Thread starter sewey89
- Start date
Think the problem has been less the defeats and more the nature of the losses. Continually losing games by multiple goals and being outclassed by teams United are supposed to be better than. It's all well and good to have faith in a playing style but results will genuinely need to improve soon or that isn't going to cut it.
And still we have a clearer style of play than we ever had under Ten Hag.
Actually, no.
The same way, a PL team does not have to produce consistently dogshit football for months to pick up a new manager's style.
I agree, but I hope he manages to get some good results in the process. He is saying the right things and making some good decisions (with rashford mainly). He has his philosophy and he will get the chance to implement it, but he needs to figure out his best formation (short term) until he signs the players he needs. He needs to make the right tactical decisions. For example, he should not play Eriksen and Casemiro against Tonali, Joelinton and Guimaraes. That was none-sense to be honest.
I was ill yesterday, so couldn't watch the game, but any talk of sacking him is completely radio rental.
We'll suffer the next two games as well no doubt, but we were warned we'd get worse before we get better and now its happening people are losing their shit.
Stick with the guy and at least give him a chance. He'd rather have waited until the summer, those reasons are becoming clearer now.
He's handling the Rashford situation well and at least he isn't ETH and abandoning all principles after a couple of shit results.
We aren't getting relegated, so it doesn't really matter if we finish 10th or 17th.
See what happens in the summer and if we start next season still not performing then by all means get rid in November/December time, but anything before that is utterly crazy.
We'll suffer the next two games as well no doubt, but we were warned we'd get worse before we get better and now its happening people are losing their shit.
Stick with the guy and at least give him a chance. He'd rather have waited until the summer, those reasons are becoming clearer now.
He's handling the Rashford situation well and at least he isn't ETH and abandoning all principles after a couple of shit results.
We aren't getting relegated, so it doesn't really matter if we finish 10th or 17th.
See what happens in the summer and if we start next season still not performing then by all means get rid in November/December time, but anything before that is utterly crazy.
Hey, Dolly!
Fair points. We're basically in the same position we were in under ETH. Albeit, a better position in EL but out of the league cup. Not fussed about that.
I don’t understand this “stick with the manager no matter what” sentiment. People wanted ETH out all last season and we finished 8th. There’s some amount of mental gymnastics going on to convince themselves that anything above relegation is a win!!! Like WTF.
For me , the ONLY acceptable way he keeps ploughing on doing his thing (in spite of results) is if by feb things start to look better. Not because I will be saying he should be sacked but this is the real world. Results matter.
You can’t expect the INEOs to take a “this is fine” approach to United potentially going down cause literally no club does that. No matter how bad things got, we weren’t even in lower half of table , let alone potential relegation candidates. This isn’t a squad whose limit is battling relegation; so I don’t subscribe to the idea that Amorim can only do what he’s doing.
I want Amorim around next season, I don’t think we are seeing his best or what he can do. But I don’t think he will last the season if results don’t improve. I don’t think INEOs would be considered wise to keep him on , if the manager is still losing most games by March because football clubs don’t blindly follow managers to relegation.
He needs help. The club needs to make some signings. I think there might be some movement for him in January.
Shouldn’t be pairing those midfielders together after x weeks at the club. Needs to stay away from relegation til the summer. Needs to get rashers out and his influence over the squad asap. Needs at least one player in capable of playing his way ideally 2/3 in the next month.
sack watch.....Feb 2025
By the sounds of it you’d sack 3 managers a season
We keep trying to put the blame on one thing.
It is the players
It is the set up
It is the coach
It is the injuries
It is Inios
When the simple truth is that it is a bit of everything.
Amorim has been head hunted because of his success with Sporting.
And he has come here to implement that style of play.
But it is pretty clear that, with the current squad, that is not working.
He wants wingers and full backs to play wing back.
He wants to play with 3 at the back.
He wants to play with 2 in midfield.
Nothing wrong with that.... apart from one thing. He doesn't have the players to execute that.
As a consequence, we are conceding too many goals.
We are not scoring.
And the bottom line is we are really easy to beat. Really easy.
So he either persists hoping that it will come good.
Or he faces the reality that something needs to change.
In my very humble opinion, he ought to set us up making us much more difficult to beat.
Definitely 3 in midfield.
Possibly 4 at the back.
Maybe even a 442.
And gradually bringing in the right players to suit his system.
It is the players
It is the set up
It is the coach
It is the injuries
It is Inios
When the simple truth is that it is a bit of everything.
Amorim has been head hunted because of his success with Sporting.
And he has come here to implement that style of play.
But it is pretty clear that, with the current squad, that is not working.
He wants wingers and full backs to play wing back.
He wants to play with 3 at the back.
He wants to play with 2 in midfield.
Nothing wrong with that.... apart from one thing. He doesn't have the players to execute that.
As a consequence, we are conceding too many goals.
We are not scoring.
And the bottom line is we are really easy to beat. Really easy.
So he either persists hoping that it will come good.
Or he faces the reality that something needs to change.
In my very humble opinion, he ought to set us up making us much more difficult to beat.
Definitely 3 in midfield.
Possibly 4 at the back.
Maybe even a 442.
And gradually bringing in the right players to suit his system.
But we are now further away from the teams in the top 8 points wise, league position doesn't show the full picture.
When Amorim joined, the club was still in touching distance of the teams in the european places, we are now miles behind on points.
"Do you know who said that? Dolly Parton... And people say she's just a big pair of tits"
I fear Amorim is a quality coach , who has been brought to a club that simply isn’t ready for a quality coach.
I really hope he can figure out some way to do his thing and hang in until summer while not getting us into a relagation battle and maybe a bit of a run in Europe.
This is comfortably the worst we’ve looked, though. Even when Ruben came in he had wingers out wide and wanted to attack, this new idea of having Dalot and Maz out wide has made us a very poor team. Ten Hag damaged the club and built an average squad, but it is much better than we’re seeing now. It’s not really Amorim’s fault, this team doesn’t suit him, which makes you wonder why we brought him in half way through a season, knowing it will likely take another expensive rebuild to give him a team he can work with.
Sadly we aren’t, we were averaging a dog shit 52 point season pre-Amorim. Right now we’re averaging less than a point per game and possibly being pulled into a relegation battle.
He was brought mid season to save this season, he’s failed at that, so he needs to make sure he keeps his job and doesn’t end up in relegation trouble.
Yes that is very fair.
He did that the start, back 3 on the ball, 4-4-2 off it. Giving away very little in open play but we kept conceding stupid goals and set pieces though. The confidence has dropped since the Bournemouth game and we’ve been shocking since.
In recent games we have faced teams that are are playing to, or very close to, their absolute peak, in Forest, Bournemouth and Newcastle. Wolves was about 50/50 until Bruno got sent off. I don't think Amorims system was the reason for these losses. Remember some of the awful mistakes that led to the goals we conceded. Are they because of system?
He clearly has to work with what he has. We may, just may, be able to bring in a couple in Jan and get rid of some of the highly paid dross that we have in our squad.
But for me, his long term plan is to play his way. If he finishes 17th and learns that he can move forward with 3, 4 or 5 of these current players in his system and formation, than for me, then something has been achieved.
If he reverts to Ten Hags ad hoc football in a 433 / 4231 and finishes 8th, then what has he really learned?
In January and February, he may actually get some time on the training ground with them and we start to see a little improvement. Very hard to instill much when there are games every few days.
Top whatever always gets inserted when discussing United these days. We used to only talk about top 4. Then City came on the seen and had to be included. Then it became top 6 so we were not left out. Now we're finishing 6-8th in recent seasons so we stretch it even more? We were never going to finish in a European spot with the start we've had this season. When I say we're where we were under ETH, I'm referring to bottom half. That's our reality right now.
Still fully backing him, but there is a difference between sticking with a style of play and making the wrong team selections.
Starting a midfield of Casemiro and Eriksen against Newcastle was always going to end in disaster.
2-0 down and Dalot finishing the game instead of two attacking wingbacks was another strange one.
Feels like Martinez makes an error every game he plays, yet he still starts.
Starting a midfield of Casemiro and Eriksen against Newcastle was always going to end in disaster.
2-0 down and Dalot finishing the game instead of two attacking wingbacks was another strange one.
Feels like Martinez makes an error every game he plays, yet he still starts.
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If that was the case, why did they spend so much money in the summer to support a manager on borrowed time, and who mostly don't improve the team in this system. If they had waited until we had determined the new style we could have bought two wing backs instead of zirkzee and yoro or de ligt
The thinking on style of play also doesn't appear to be any deeper than looking at a hot managerial prospect and plumping for him
Coming up with a club model should have been ashworths job, now it's left with the overpromoted wilcox and a bunch of moneymen
The players are almost entirely different from those we had under Rangnick. Maguire and Dalot were the only players who started yesterday who played under him. We cannot keep suggesting that every set of players we purchase are somehow all “wrong uns”.
It’s on Amorim here to work with what he’s got and I trust that the players will do the best they can.
We’re desperate for points. I won’t mind finishing 10th this season aslong as we win the Europa league. CL football is crucial in helping us develop next season.
I would agree with this, the right coach at the absolute wrong time. I'm kind of pissed that we're putting a stain on his career when he's obviously not as bad as he looks right now, but it's a poor appointment given the state of the squad and it's specific needs.
Amorim is a top coach. Time for INEOS to get the cheque book out.
How many who are criticizing Amorim was ready to give it to ETH till end of this season and then let Amorim take over ?
Or any care taker till summer ?
Who else do we want ? Supposed greatest coach of all time is in even more dire situation than Amorim.
Or any care taker till summer ?
Who else do we want ? Supposed greatest coach of all time is in even more dire situation than Amorim.
I don't think he was brought in to save this season though - given he actually wanted to join in the summer to avoid a difficult mid-season handover like this. If that is true then his appointment is short sighted and the owners will be to blame for what happens from hereon because he's clearly come in with a long term plan, and has himself said that there will be initial suffering. If he was brought in to "save this season" then he wouldn't be operating under the assumption that short term pain is expected.
Short term pain for long term gain is clearly the approach here, and I believe that Amorim will die on his sword if it comes to that. The appetite for how much short term pain will be tolerated by the club will be tested, and we don't know what that appetite is.
Thank you. Well said.
He wasn’t, though. You’ve just made that up.
Natural ones too. So she says.
There’s absolutely nothing to suggest that he’s handling the Rashford situation well. That’s just seen as the case because Rashford is the poster boy on here for the team’s failings.
If you look at the position properly, he’s ostracised a player who scored 3 times in his first two league matches, for very confusing reasons. Since dropping Rashford from the starting 11 in the league, we have lost 6 out of 7 matches. We haven’t scored in the last 3 games, whilst looking no better defensively. His approach is also frankly tanking Rashford’s value, in circumstances where it appears we want to sell him asap.
Now, there may be behind the scenes issues we are unaware of. However, on the face of it Amorim made a huge decision (generating massive unneeded publicity) and, so far, it’s gone absolutely disastrously wrong.
I think it's 3 million quid for each position in the league. So 14th to 10th would be about 12m. Yes not peanuts I know, but in the grand scheme of things, it's more important to weed out the shit players now rather than trying to shithouse an extra 3 or 4 places higher in the league.
I wouldn’t say so at all.
Results wise yes it’s been poor and although I couldn’t watch last night I think we’ve had a better control of games in general but have been weak in both boxes.
If rashford ends up leaving in January Amorim will have handled that situation well.
Slot inherited a team of winners. They finished 3rd but gelled a new midfield
So Rashford who came out after being dropped and said he wants to leave would be in your squad? For all we know he might already be sold or be under a few Saudi bids. The culture is wrong not the manager, anybody that knows anything about change management knows many are resistant to change and therefore it takes some staff (players) longer than others. Amorim is doing it the hard way and that I’m afraid means we are not in a better place with a little sticking plaster over our very wide cracks. I’m convinced this guy is the real deal and convinced he needs time and a better character in his squad.
We’d be lucky to get one player I reckon
Is it bold to presume we are capable of getting 12+ points in the remaining 19 games? I don't think we will need much more, don't see both Wolves and Ipswich finishing on 35+. One of them, yeah, both I doubt.
Can anyone point me to the positives of Amorim's appointment since he came in?
He has strong english and excellent media management but aside from that I'm struggling.
- On a historic run of poor form.
- Managed to dry up what was already a pretty barren attack
- Demoted our highly sought after set piece coach, replaced him with his mate and served a disasterclass since
- Publicly denigrated the ability and quality of the squad
- Alienated our key attacking players this season (I know some of you like the Rashford treatment)
- Set/allowed expectations that Utd would lose games
He has strong english and excellent media management but aside from that I'm struggling.
- On a historic run of poor form.
- Managed to dry up what was already a pretty barren attack
- Demoted our highly sought after set piece coach, replaced him with his mate and served a disasterclass since
- Publicly denigrated the ability and quality of the squad
- Alienated our key attacking players this season (I know some of you like the Rashford treatment)
- Set/allowed expectations that Utd would lose games